# A little on the thin side



## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

So Bae is very, very active. And thus he needs a food that can keep up with him. He is thin as a rail at ~48lbs. 

Here are the facts:

-Husky mix
-TOTW Pacific Stream
-~45$ a bag
-4 cups a day
-360 kcals/cup

I know the recommended feeding is 2 and 1/3 cup for his size. What the buck! I'm looking to change to a higher calorie food where I can feed less and get more bang for my buck. Any suggestions?

Is there possibly a high calorie sport dog supplement that I could add to his food?


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Or mix in an egg daily.
Or save fatty meat scraps and add a little bit to his food daily. Very little - a 1/2" cube raised the fat content in Sassy's cooked food by several % points.
Or mix in canned in oil sardines.
Any of these might be cheaper than buying a special supplement. 

Or feed him more often. He is eating a lot of food, perhaps he would absorb the nutrients better if fed 3x a day. I tried to fatten Sassy up by feeding more and she just pooped it all out, never gained weight. Later I needed to feed her more often and she actually seemed a bit heavier but she didn't get weighed so not sure.
Or if he is an adolescent dog, less than 2 years old leave it alone as possibly he just needs to get more muscle.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

I'll be honest. My solution to this with Jack and Frost who are prone toward crazy thin and not being chowhounds is to buy this bulk package of bacon ends and pieces at my grocery store. I fry it up and mix the whole thing, including the grease, into their food. Not tons because of salt content, but it's super high calorie, good for their coats, and makes them want to eat more.

They're still 'visible ribs and hip bones' but their coat condition and muscle tone are crazy good. Heck, their shoulders and thighs are downright BULKY, so they're clearly not starving.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> So Bae is very, very active. And thus he needs a food that can keep up with him. He is thin as a rail at ~48lbs.
> 
> Here are the facts:
> 
> ...


Yes, Annamaet Impact is the best supplement for this purpose. Sled dog supplement.

I would switch from TOTW to Dr. Tim's Pursuit/Momentum, Annamaet Ultra or Red Paw 32.

Dr. Tim is a well known vet and husky racer and the top teams use his food. Top sporting dog kennels use his food. He is located on the UP in Michigan. If you can't find the food locally its on Mr. Chewy & Petflow in big bags, 44lbs.

Grain free foods are not the answer for a dog like this. The three foods I mentioned are the three best foods on the US market right now.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

He is under two but I would agree that a lot of it is just coming back out the other end. 

He's by no means starving or super hungry. He usually leaves a few kibbles in his bowl and makes me stand there whilst he eats. I'll stop by Costco and see if bacon bits or bulk eggs can make it in the budget. I know he'll eat fried bacon right up! Would I cook the egg first or lay it on there raw?

He's not emasculated or starving. Just pointy. I like him lean but it's a bit much! My dog is too active for my wallet 

Bumper: I'll look into it!

Thanks guys. If anyone else has something for me to try, my dog is probably willing to eat it. XD


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

RabbleFox said:


> He is under two but I would agree that a lot of it is just coming back out the other end.
> 
> He's by no means starving or super hungry. He usually leaves a few kibbles in his bowl and makes me stand there whilst he eats. I'll stop by Costco and see if bacon bits or bulk eggs can make it in the budget. I know he'll eat fried bacon right up! Would I cook the egg first or lay it on there raw?
> 
> He's not emasculated or starving. Just pointy. I like him lean but it's a bit much! My dog is too active for my wallet (((



Bacon ends and pieces - raw meat, don't buy actual bacon bits. They're expensive and just soy. You can also maybe just look for straight up lard. But I can get like 5 pounds of scrap bacon that didn't cut pretty for < 5.00, and Since I only use a few pieces and the grease at a time it'll last me easily a month. My two together weigh 45lbs, but it's still cheap.)


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Bacon ends and pieces... Got it! Not bits.

Inexpensive is the name of the game.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

Chicken hearts and gizzards run about $1/lb at Kroger. Nutritious and fairly high in fat. 1 raw chicken heart is (at least on average) 9 calories, 5 from fat. 1 ounce raw gizzards is 26 calories, 5 from fat. 

I add sardines, eggs, hearts and gizzards and cheap cheese (cheese as training treats) in small amounts to the food of the too-thin-on-arrival foster dogs. 

Professional Active Chicken and Rice is a nicely priced grain inclusive (corn, wheat and soy free) that is 30% protein, 20% fat, 376 kcal/cup.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Don't know that the dogs would get the crispy bits of bacon around here. That would about kill me to cook bacon and not eat any!

Raw or cooked egg has the same amount of calories and fat per egg, up to you to feed the way you are comfortable feeding him. My 38 and 18 pound dogs have been splitting two eggs a day for several weeks now and loving it. I am scrambling and microwaving them into an omelet to use as treats each day. They eat raw but I need lots of treats every day.

If his stool is huge or soft then perhaps he isn't getting all the good stuff out of all that food. Sassy's poop got really big and stayed reasonably firm but since she wasn't gaining weight I suspect the food agreed with her well enough but she just couldn't assimilate the extra calories in 2 meals a day. I'd cut back to the suggested feeding and if he loses weight try another meal a day. To gain weight try that bacon or egg in there. Most kibble is pretty low in fat, bet he needs more at least right now. The 15% fat by weight in TOTW is about 30% by calorie and that is what is suggested for humans on a diet.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

Shell said:


> Chicken hearts and gizzards run about $1/lb at Kroger. Nutritious and fairly high in fat. 1 raw chicken heart is (at least on average) 9 calories, 5 from fat. 1 ounce raw gizzards is 26 calories, 5 from fat.
> 
> I add sardines, eggs, hearts and gizzards and cheap cheese (cheese as training treats) in small amounts to the food of the too-thin-on-arrival foster dogs.
> 
> Professional Active Chicken and Rice is a nicely priced grain inclusive (corn, wheat and soy free) that is 30% protein, 20% fat, 376 kcal/cup.


Professional is one of the Diamond Brands.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

Bumper1 said:


> Professional is one of the Diamond Brands.


Yes, it is. Your point being? If OP is feeding TOTW already, it would be another option that is higher fat and cheaper which may suit his dog and wallet


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

Diamond Naturals Extreme Athlete has 470 kcals per cup, 32/25 protein/fat, and is fairly inexpensive. I've used it for my dogs when they were younger and had trouble keeping weight on in winter. I can say it definitely helps put/keep weight on!

And I agree about eggs and cheap fatty meat. Beef brisket is cheap (for beef) and very fatty. Some pork roasts are fatty as well and may not be as salty as bacon (mmm, bacon...).


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

Shell said:


> Yes, it is. Your point being? If OP is feeding TOTW already, it would be another option that is higher fat and cheaper which may suit his dog and wallet


Yes until the next massive recall or toxic contamination and the OP's vet bills are thousands of dollars or the dog dies.

It is not a question of if with Diamond only when and how bad.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Bumper1 said:


> Yes until the next massive recall or toxic contamination and the OP's vet bills are thousands of dollars or the dog dies.
> 
> It is not a question of if with Diamond only when and how bad.



The food she is feeding now is made by Diamond. That would imply she (like me) do not believe that for a second.

So!


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Yeah... And I don't have a problem with recalls. I just switch food. He's food flexible, you see. I know that recalls happen but bad things happen all the time. Gotta roll with the punches!

I'm definitely considering the Naturals Extreme Athlete. 

I like Diamond products and I like the price sooo...

I highly doubt my dog will die from contaminated food. Most recalls are voluntary. You just return your food (which is probably safe to eat) and work with something that isn't recalled.

Edit: Plus all the other food suggestions were like $70 a bag! Tight budget over here..,


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

4Health Performance (another Diamond product just so we're being clear about these things) is about $35 for a 35 lbs bag and is a 30/20 formula found at Tractor Supply. A little lower calories and fat than Naturals Extreme Athlete but still on the higher fat side of things. Just depends on what is simplest for you to find locally and what level of fat suits your dog.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Shell said:


> 4Health Performance (another Diamond product just so we're being clear about these things) is about $35 for a 35 lbs bag and is a 30/20 formula found at Tractor Supply. A little lower calories and fat than Naturals Extreme Athlete but still on the higher fat side of things. Just depends on what is simplest for you to find locally and what level of fat suits your dog.


Thanks Shell! I appreciate the low cost suggestion. The nearest Tractor Supply is about 40 miles away.  I think the Naturals Athele will be easier for me to find locally. 

Diamon sure is a popular manufacturer.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> Yeah... And I don't have a problem with recalls. I just switch food. He's food flexible, you see. I know that recalls happen but bad things happen all the time. Gotta roll with the punches!
> 
> I'm definitely considering the Naturals Extreme Athlete.
> 
> ...


Do you know what Aflatoxin is? Diamond generally makes cheap foods with very cheap ingredients, most notable cheap corn. It doesn't matter if corn is present or not in the food you choose, aflatoxin in the factory is very dangerous and Diamond has already had a massive aflatoxin problem already with thousands of deaths. It will happen again.

You don't know what you are talking about. Recalls now are directed by the FDA. The FDA forced the three P&G recalls this year after testing.

Pro Pac High Performance is a more budget friendly choice (5 Star Food) and made by a much better company in business for far longer than Diamond without ONE recall. You could also try Fromm Gold Puppy (ALS) it is in a pink bag. It can be fed to any age dog. The Gold line is actually Fromm's best line.

By the way, yes Dr. Tim's is about $65 a bag but that is for 44lbs.

Use Diamond products at your own risk.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> Thanks Shell! I appreciate the low cost suggestion. The nearest Tractor Supply is about 40 miles away.  I think the Naturals Athele will be easier for me to find locally.
> 
> Diamon sure is a popular manufacturer.


Yes and think about why. Bad ingredients + bad quality control equals lows prices.


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## stafinois (Jun 16, 2010)

If you are a grain free fan, I've been happy with Noutrisource. It costs about the same as TOTW and is higher in calories. And, not made by Diamond  

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Bumper1 said:


> Yes and think about why. Bad ingredients + bad quality control equals lows prices.


Not everybody in the club can afford to purchase a $65 bag of dog food. Even if it's bulk at 44lbs. I want to feed my dog to the best of my ability. I don't even have a job right now and we're living on the 30lb of Pacific Stream for bit before I decide to switch over or upgrade to something else. We've got time to think everything through. 

If I had unlimited funds he'd be eating raw. Not kibble. But I do have a budget. I also can't get Dr. Tim's locally at a pet store, which I prefer. If he doesn't like something, I can just return it to the pet store and try something else instantly. There is lag time when you order online. 

Dr. Tims looks like an awesome good and maybe when I get a new job, I'll be able to afford to feed it. For now I'll stick with my "dangerous", lower cost dog food.  Could you provide some links or studies that indicate that aflatoxin is indeed in all Diamond products and is indeed hurting my dog?

Now I feel like a crappy owner. 

Stafinois- Is there a specific formula that I should look for? Do they make a high protein/athlete specific food?


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Pro PAC is well priced but the second ingredient is corn. I would prefer to stay away from corn foods, even if they are high in protein. 

Fromm Puppy Gold seems to be an ok choice. It's protein content is at 27% which is better than his current 25%. I'll check my local pricing on it next week. 

Sorry to be so picky.


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## Gally (Jan 11, 2012)

What are you paying a month for dog food now?

It is feasible that you could feed raw for less than kibble. You might have to get a little creative with finding cheap sources but if you wanted help getting started there are lots of knowledgeable raw feeders here who could help.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> Not everybody in the club can afford to purchase a $65 bag of dog food. Even if it's bulk at 44lbs. I want to feed my dog to the best of my ability. I don't even have a job right now and we're living on the 30lb of Pacific Stream for bit before I decide to switch over or upgrade to something else. We've got time to think everything through.
> 
> If I had unlimited funds he'd be eating raw. Not kibble. But I do have a budget. I also can't get Dr. Tim's locally at a pet store, which I prefer. If he doesn't like something, I can just return it to the pet store and try something else instantly. There is lag time when you order online.
> 
> ...



Not sure what you are asking. Diamond had a massive recall because of aflatoxin tainted food a few years back, then a series of other recalls for salmonella and bad vitamins. It will happen again. Aflatoxin is deadly.

If economy is of paramount importance try Pro Pac High Performance 30/20. It is a far better food than a private label product that is made by Diamond.

It doesn't matter what the second ingredient is because the first is about 45% of the food, chicken meal. There is lower carbohydrate in Pro Pac HP than what you are feeding now. The order of the ingredients means very little unless you really understand ingredients and labeling rules. Pro Pac HP could have 4 protein ingredients split up and then corn would be 5th and the food would be exactly the same.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Gally said:


> What are you paying a month for dog food now?
> 
> It is feasible that you could feed raw for less than kibble. You might have to get a little creative with finding cheap sources but if you wanted help getting started there are lots of knowledgeable raw feeders here who could help.


If a bag lasts me a month, $45. I think that lasts a little longer than a month though. I'd love to do raw but it seems expensive and possibly complex. I don't want to mess up and malnourish him!

I'm comfortable spending $40-$50 a month on good if it's gonna be great.


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## stafinois (Jun 16, 2010)

RabbleFox said:


> Stafinois- Is there a specific formula that I should look for? Do they make a high protein/athlete specific food?


Not sure. I have both the chicken and the bison here. 

This is the chicken... 









This is the bison... 









EDIT: Here's the website: http://www.nutrisourcedogfood.com

I order through wag.com since I'm in the middle of nowhere.

Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Bumper1 said:


> Not sure what you are asking. Diamond had a massive recall because of aflatoxin tainted food a few years back, then a series of other recalls for salmonella and bad vitamins. It will happen again. Aflatoxin is deadly.
> 
> If economy is of paramount importance try Pro Pac High Performance 30/20. It is a far better food than a private label product that is made by Diamond.
> 
> It doesn't matter what the second ingredient is because the first is about 45% of the food, chicken meal. There is lower carbohydrate in Pro Pac HP than what you are feeding now. The order of the ingredients means very little unless you really understand ingredients and labeling rules. Pro Pac HP could have 4 protein ingredients split up and then corn would be 5th and the food would be exactly the same.


I get how labels work and wouldn't that mean a good portion of the rest of the bag would be corn? 45% is a good percentage of the food overall, thankfully! How come Pro PAC is so inexpensive? Would it not be because of the corn in it? I guess I get what I pay for. I suppose it'll be an option then. 

How do you figure out that Pro PAC is 45% chicken meal? I'm reading there website and can't find much on that!

I know it's happened before but I'm not entirely sure it'll happen again. Stuff like this happens to different companies at different times. Obviously dog food companies don't want to kill their clients. They wouldn't have anyone to sell to!


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

stafinois said:


> Not sure. I have both the chicken and the bison here.
> 
> This is the chicken...
> 
> ...


Thank you! I will look then over and take them into consideration.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> I get how labels work and wouldn't that mean a good portion of the rest of the bag would be corn? 45% is a good percentage of the food overall, thankfully! How come Pro PAC is so inexpensive? Would it not be because of the corn in it? I guess I get what I pay for. I suppose it'll be an option then.
> 
> How do you figure out that Pro PAC is 45% chicken meal? I'm reading there website and can't find much on that!
> 
> I know it's happened before but I'm not entirely sure it'll happen again. Stuff like this happens to different companies at different times. Obviously dog food companies don't want to kill their clients. They wouldn't have anyone to sell to!


Chicken is the primary protein in Pro Pac. 30%/65% is 46%. Corn is not a major supplier of protein in any pet food unless its Corn Gluten.

The Nutrisource food being discussed is far higher in carbs than Pro Pac HP but since its all Peas you think its better quality.

Why is Pro Pac cheap, well its in a paper bag and Midwestern Pet does not advertise it like it does Earthborn, but its a much better food.

I think Pro Pac HP is a 5 Star Food so even the Dog Food Advisor understands my point.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

I guess I'll have to give it a try. 

I wonder what Amazon's return policy is... I hate to be stub with a bag of food my dog won't eat or a brand I decide I don't like. XD


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

4Health also makes a "performance" formula (not sure what they call it but comparable to DN Extreme Athlete), costs maybe $5 more than DN. I heard somewhere that Diamond doesn't manufacture 4Health anymore. . .so if that makes you feel better it's an option.

ETA: haha, they call it "Performance" . But it only has 376 kcals per cup so I guess it wouldn't be much different than what he's getting now :/. http://www.tractorsupply.com/en/store/4healthtrade;-performance-formula-for-adult-dogs-35-lb-bag


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## Kudzu (Aug 15, 2013)

If he's super skinny on 4 cups a day, I'd be suspicious that he's not digesting the ingredients to get full use of the calories provided. I don't feed kibble myself, so I don't really have a suggestion other than to try other foods and keep weighing him to see progress.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

Kudzu said:


> If he's super skinny on 4 cups a day, I'd be suspicious that he's not digesting the ingredients to get full use of the calories provided. I don't feed kibble myself, so I don't really have a suggestion other than to try other foods and keep weighing him to see progress.


Calories are calculated on paper based on a general formula, not on any kind of lab test or feeding test. It is called the Modified Atwater Method. Calories are not calories when you compare protein, fat and carbs, or the way the food is made, or what the fiber is, or what the ingredients are. Calories on the bag are just a guide and in the field mean very little.

The better performance foods are field tested for years on thousands of dogs, tens of thousands. Most foods on the market are formulated by consultants and, at best, are tested for palatability.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

What about this food? It seems similar to Pro PAC but u can get it locally and for a very similar price per pound. 

http://www.nationaldogfood.com/comp.html


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> What about this food? It seems similar to Pro PAC but u can get it locally and for a very similar price per pound.
> 
> http://www.nationaldogfood.com/comp.html


National is a well known name in sledding, hunting and performance circuits. Most consumers wouldn't use it.

You can't get a better food than Dr. Tim's so I would go with that. Buy it online or a local store in Michigan. In 44lb bags its the same price as Pro Plan Performance which is also a very good food. I have used PPP in the past and its a great formula.

You can also look for PMI Exclusive, 30/20, Purple Bag. PMI is a steal and its a Land O Lakes brand. Good solid food. I would guess $1lb plus they give you free bags.


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## hueyeats (Apr 2, 2013)

Fatten up doggies???

I try fattening him up to by adding homecooked meals.
But if out "hunting"... I bring him home fried chicken, hamburgers, pizzas... which he love (once or twice a week no more).
Or add eggs, salmon, bacon, butter, PB, CC, more hamburger meats, chicken fatty side up (boiled)... etc.

He work out tons anyway freeroaming his property plus his 60ft run space if kept in.
Not to mentioned his daily walks and weekend excursions (at least 2 hours each time)... Soccer mom you know... fitness activities is important.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

RabbleFox said:


> What about this food? It seems similar to Pro PAC but u can get it locally and for a very similar price per pound.
> 
> http://www.nationaldogfood.com/comp.html


I like the high percent of protein coming from meat sources. I would feed it to my fosters that need a high calorie performance type food (many are both really active and underweight when they arrive). I'd pick one of the soy-free formulas.

For my own dog, he cannot eat pork and it looks like all of their formulas use either pork, pork fat and/or pork blood so my reasoning for not feeding it to him isn't because of something "bad" about the food. He also does better with oats, barley or rice as grains rather than corn and I have found that true for most of the dogs, but if your dog does fine with those ingredients, the product looks just fine.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

Shell said:


> I like the high percent of protein coming from meat sources. I would feed it to my fosters that need a high calorie performance type food (many are both really active and underweight when they arrive). I'd pick one of the soy-free formulas.
> 
> For my own dog, he cannot eat pork and it looks like all of their formulas use either pork, pork fat and/or pork blood so my reasoning for not feeding it to him isn't because of something "bad" about the food. He also does better with oats, barley or rice as grains rather than corn and I have found that true for most of the dogs, but if your dog does fine with those ingredients, the product looks just fine.


I can pretty much guaranty these foods have ethoxyquin and bha/bht in them. I would bet a good bottle of scotch. They do work well as I am told but they would be no where near the quality of ingredients of the other foods being discussed.

If price is of paramount importance along with results, try PMI, Pro Pac or SportMix. Sportmix by Midwestern Pet is an excellent choice and I would say a dominant food with midwestern hunters. The Black Bag with 20% fat is a beef and pork food that fuels many a hard charging pointer mile after mile.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Bumper1 said:


> I can pretty much guaranty these foods have ethoxyquin and bha/bht in them. I would bet a good bottle of scotch. They do work well as I am told but they would be no where near the quality of ingredients of the other foods being discussed.
> 
> If price is of paramount importance along with results, try PMI, Pro Pac or SportMix. Sportmix by Midwestern Pet is an excellent choice and I would say a dominant food with midwestern hunters. The Black Bag with 20% fat is a beef and pork food that fuels many a hard charging pointer mile after mile.


I'll email the company and see what they've to say. They didn't mentioned BHA or anything. What's PMI again? XD

Thanks for the breakdown She'll. Imma definitely consider it because of its availability.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

Bumper1 said:


> I can pretty much guaranty these foods have ethoxyquin and bha/bht in them. I would bet a good bottle of scotch. They do work well as I am told but they would be no where near the quality of ingredients of the other foods being discussed.
> 
> If price is of paramount importance along with results, try PMI, Pro Pac or SportMix. Sportmix by Midwestern Pet is an excellent choice and I would say a dominant food with midwestern hunters. The Black Bag with 20% fat is a beef and pork food that fuels many a hard charging pointer mile after mile.


Hmm, yeah, would avoid for long term use for the ethoxyquin. Would probably still feed a bag or two to fatten up a really skinny newbie if it was the food most affordable and easy to get. 

Why do you say Sportmix is an "excellent" choice when the formulas I looked at don't even name what animal their "meat meal" is coming from and do you have anything indicating their fish meal is ethoxyquin-free?


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

Shell said:


> Hmm, yeah, would avoid for long term use for the ethoxyquin. Would probably still feed a bag or two to fatten up a really skinny newbie if it was the food most affordable and easy to get.
> 
> Why do you say Sportmix is an "excellent" choice when the formulas I looked at don't even name what animal their "meat meal" is coming from and do you have anything indicating their fish meal is ethoxyquin-free?


The company is just following AAFCO rules to the extreme. It is a mixed product of beef and pork, thus "meat meal". The name does not indicate quality. Is all "Chicken Meal" good quality? No.

"Meat Meal" is 99.9999% of the time beef and pork meal. The trade name and AAFCO name for this mix is "meat meal". If you call Midwestern Pet which has never had a recall and is a highly thought of family company (it makes Earthborn and Pro Pac) they will tell you the same.

I have been with dozens of dogs that eat SportMix and they look great and run like the wind. The Red bag 26/18 is also very popular.

I am talking about the SportMix Premium line. You should be rightly skeptical of foods priced like this, but SportMix is a very good food.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> I'll email the company and see what they've to say. They didn't mentioned BHA or anything. What's PMI again? XD
> 
> Thanks for the breakdown She'll. Imma definitely consider it because of its availability.


PMI stands for Purina Mills (remember the red checker board at the feed store?). If you know anyone with horses or have had horses you know Omolene.

Purina Mills is not owned by Purina any longer, its part of Land O Lakes coop. Yes the butter company. PMI Exclusive is one of the dog food lines and its sold in feed stores. It is an excellent food and they have a free bag deal for every 10 bags. The formula is the old Pro Plan formula pre-Nestle. You want the purple bag.

It is an excellent food and its sold direct to feed stores to keep the price down.


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## luv mi pets (Feb 5, 2012)

I was always told to cook the egg for better protein levels for dogs. If fed raw only feed the yolk because the whites can cause a biotin deficiency in your dog. Since then I have learned that you could feed your dog the whole egg with the shell and your dog would benefit from it. The only time I have seen eggs do harm to a dog is when the dog ate 18 eggs at once. The dog was not feeling good for a couple of days and you did not want to be in the same room when he passed gas. When I had my own chickens it was not uncommon for me to give my dogs an egg on a daily basis. 

You could put oil on your dogs foods. With any oil you need to be careful about giving your poor pup a pancreatitis attack.

I typed in how to make a dog gain weight and satin ball recipes popped up here is a link http://www.holisticdog.org/Nutrition/Satinballs/satinballs2.html Something to look into and make. Some of the recipes do not look too expensive. If you make them let us know


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## Damon'sMom (Aug 2, 2011)

I was going to post about the Fat balls.  With Jasper working 4-5 hours of intense training some days his weight fluctuates depending on how much we do that week. If he starts to loose I will give him some of theses with dinner. My min Pin is also almost impossible to keep weight on, he is underweight at the moment so I will have to make up a new batch soon. I use the first recipe in the link that luv mi pets provided. 

I feed these kibbles to my dogs that are working and need to maintain or gain weight.

Native dog food. I feed level 4. I can get a 40 pound bag for $59.95 here. Little more then you were looking to spend but an amazing food!  

Victor dog food. I feed a few different ones from victor. Victor HI PRO active dog and puppy. Here. 40lbs for $53.95
Victor Grain Free Ultra PRO 42/22 30lbs for $58.95

Diamond Naturals Extreme Athlete. 40lbs for $31.00 I believe
Dr. Tim's Momentum Highly Athletic 35lbs for $64.99 
Dr. Tims Pursuit Active Dog 30lb for $49.00 (In the budget you set and free delivery from Chewy.com- my favorite to order from online.)

Remember that with these foods you will more then likely feed less then what you are of TOTW and they will last you longer. I was feeding Jasper 7 cups of TOTW Pacific Stream when we were only being active 3 hours a day and he was still loosing weight. I moved to these foods and feed less and he looks, and acts better now.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

^Thank God we aren't up to 7 cups a day.

What the heck does Jasper do!? I thought Bae and I were an active couple. XD

Thank you so much for the suggestions. I have to return his ill fitting sometime either this weekend or early next week. I'll let ya'll know how my browsing goes! Still have a lot of my TOTW Pacific Stream to get through. Any and all other feeding suggestions highly appreciated!


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## luv mi pets (Feb 5, 2012)

Here is a link to a page that will give you k/cals per cup of food. http://www.petfinder.com/dogs/dog-nutrition/dry-dog-food-calorie-count/

I find that buying a higher k/cal dog food I do not have to feed so many cups and thus save on dog food. My 12 pound MAS gets 2 cups a day while my 150 pound LGD dog get only 3 cups of food a day. Except for only one dog who has diet issues I can feed my dogs anything without a problem. At times I do get free food from work and that helps out quite a bit. I know EVO can be on the expensive side but I would buy a small bag and add it to my other dog food just to add some more calories to a cup of food. Hopefully in time your situation changes and you do not have to be so worried about maintaining such a tight budget. If you get to that point let me know how you did it and give me your pointers how you reached that goal.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Bad things happen when you have a minor mental breakdown and quit your job. Thankfully, I can babysit, serve for a caterer I know, and return the cans. Perhaps this isn't the ideal time for me to have a dog but I do. So we make do. Budget got a bit tighter since he has to have $60 worth of anti-anxiety medications per month. Yeah. That's gonna have to come down a bit. 

I absolutely love using high protein/expensive kibble as treats and additives. Bonus points if it's a fun protein combo or has freeze dried raw in it. We're making our way through a small bag of Nature's Variety Instinct with freeze dried raw pieces. It's fun, it's calorie-riffic, and is a good training treat. He gets about a cup if that everyday throughout the day when we do training.


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## Emmett (Feb 9, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> Budget got a bit tighter since he has to have $60 worth of anti-anxiety medications per month. Yeah. That's gonna have to come down a bit.


Have you looked into the cards/insurance that Walgreen's and CVS offer? I use the Walgreens program and it covers ANY and all pets. For an individual (human or animal) it's like $25 a year and to cover the whole family it would be $35 a year. Otis has been on REALLY expensive meds from time to time and that card has been a life saver. His cyclosporine went from $400+ dollars a month to $114 and his pred is something like 70% off. I know they listed a bunch of anxiety meds as covered so I would definitely look into it...for both you and Bae.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Emmett said:


> Have you looked into the cards/insurance that Walgreen's and CVS offer? I use the Walgreens program and it covers ANY and all pets. For an individual (human or animal) it's like $25 a year and to cover the whole family it would be $35 a year. Otis has been on REALLY expensive meds from time to time and that card has been a life saver. His cyclosporine went from $400+ dollars a month to $114 and his pred is something like 70% off. I know they listed a bunch of anxiety meds as covered so I would definitely look into it...for both you and Bae.


Wow! Thank you!!! I had never thought of pet insurance, though I've heard of it. I could really use a break as far as vet expenses go too. I'm going to look them up then call my vet to make sure they accept it.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

RabbleFox said:


> Wow! Thank you!!! I had never thought of pet insurance, though I've heard of it. I could really use a break as far as vet expenses go too. I'm going to look them up then call my vet to make sure they accept it.


I think he's talking about the prescription discount cards. Basically if the medicine your dog is taking is a human formula, the vet just calls the prescription into CVS or Walgreens (maybe Rite-Aid does it also) and the regular human pharmacy fills the script at the cash basis. My vet does this for antibiotics and such, I actually have a "Chester My Last Name" in the computers at CVS and cash price for 2 weeks of generic antibiotics was only $7 last time! That was regular cash price, the discount cards that have a fee give a variety of percent-off on different meds.

Pet insurance generally doesn't cover pre-existing conditions, although it is worth considering for the future in case of illness or injury and may or may not cover on-going anxiety meds.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Hmmm hmmm hmm. I'll have to stop in at a Walgreens and inquire. And see if my vet will do that for me! I'm sure it shan't be a problem.


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## luv mi pets (Feb 5, 2012)

You should not be afraid to call around for price quotes. In today's economy, more and more people are looking for ways to save. Some vets will charge a prescription charge to cover looking up your file and writing in it. So ask your vet if they do this. Some vet clinics charge as much as $25 for this. Even consider looking online for a price break. Just be careful where the scripts are coming from. It is not uncommon for me to call Walgreens, CVS or Walmart and have a script filled for a dog or a cat.


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## domika (Jul 1, 2012)

Yep, my Walmart even has signs up saying they will gladly fill your pets RX. I have never tried it and have never needed to but would certainly do that if the time came and it was an option.


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

Mine stopped eating TOTW, so I switched to back to basics pork ... but it got so expensive down here that I had to switch again, next time to NVI, but when THAT got to high, I switched to Merick. I feed the beef and sweet potato one (I have one dog that has to have grain free LOL) and they all love it, even super picky Bear dances and gets excited when I walk in with the bowls .

I know Merick has gotten some heat in the past for treat recalls, but since its made locally (the food, that is... not sure about their treats, since I have never fed them) I think the one I feed is 460 cals per cup, but you'd have to double check that ... I know its in the 400's somewhere. 

But even that isn't enough for Josefina, so I feed her satin balls with her food (like mixed in like you would do canned food) there are so many variations of this recipe that you'd have to Google it to find the best one for you here is a site with a lot of ideas : http://www.holisticdog.org/Nutrition/Satinballs/satinballs.html

But this is the one I use (because I didn't want to put too much in since they are rich LOL)

10 pounds hamburger meat the (cheapest kind you can get)
1 lg. box of Total cereal
1 lg box (or one cup) uncooked oatmeal (not the quick kind)
1 jar of wheat germ (you might have to adjust this accordingly, I use 6 tbs)
1 1/4 cup canola oil
10 raw eggs AND shells (I don't put the shells in ... Josefina doesn't like them LOL)
10 envelopes of unflavored gelatin

Mix all ingredients together, much like you would a meatloaf.
Divide into 10 quart freezer bags and freeze.
Thaw as needed and feed raw!

You can also half the recipe for the first time in case your dog doesn't like it, LOL. I know they also say not to mix it in with their food because the dog will make a mess of it trying to get the balls out, but I have never had a problem with that, I just mix them in like I would canned food (I feed her one a night) and she gobbles everything up. 

Hope this helps


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## Kayota (Aug 14, 2009)

hueyeats said:


> But if out "hunting"... I bring him home fried chicken, hamburgers, pizzas... which he love (once or twice a week no more).


Well that's just some wonderful advice! Let's predispose our dogs to pancreatitis, obesity and heart problems! Why not!


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> Hmmm hmmm hmm. I'll have to stop in at a Walgreens and inquire. And see if my vet will do that for me! I'm sure it shan't be a problem.


Nutrisource is what I was going to go with but here, Merick is cheaper for us (since its made locally with local ingredients) but if anything ever goes wrong with Merick for any reason, Nutrisource will be my next choice.

Can you post some pics of the dog in question? Some dogs are just thin, Josefina is like that. I do feed her one satin ball a night in the winter, but I have given up trying to make her "thick" through the middle ... I have come to terms with the fact that she is just a trim dog naturally. 

In reference to the human food ... please please don't follow that advice, please. Human food, esp the human food mentioned in that post isn't even good for humans, let alone dogs.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

The only human food he gets is meat! Raw or cooked without seasonings in such. I rarely have extra though. Usually gets the burnt or end bits in his bowl. Sometimes I'll sneak him a pepperoni. I eat pizza rarely so that's a really, really special treat!

Dog in question:

It's hard to tell because of his fur. I can easily feel allll of his ribs. Like 0 covering. His hips and chest bones are pokey outty. It's better now that he gets 4 cups of good but it's kind of an expensive venture, you know?

I'd rather feed 2 cups a higher protein, sporty dog food than 4 cups TOTW.

P.S. Thank you for the recipe! I'm going to cut it down to a single serving and see if he'll eat it with the egg shell. :3 Is that recipe pretty nutritionally competent? Doesn't seem to be missing anything to me!


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## luv mi pets (Feb 5, 2012)

Hard to tell if your dog is thin because of the fur but I will take your word that he is. My dogs did not like TOTW. 

Let me know your results with the satin balls. The internet is loaded with different recipes of satin balls. 

Another advice was giving raw eggs or adding flax oil to your dogs foods. Some mentioned flax oil or cannola oil.




BTW- I like your dog.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

luv mi pets said:


> Hard to tell if your dog is thin because of the fur but I will take your word that he is. My dogs did not like TOTW.
> 
> Let me know your results with the satin balls. The internet is loaded with different recipes of satin balls.
> 
> ...


The fur is deceiving. He isn't even really fluffy. But its black/red and covers up his ribs and pokey outty hips and shoulders.

I think I'm going to switch to a performance food and depending on how this winter goes (Skijoring 3-4 a week hopefully) I may have to add in the Satin Balls.

Thank you for the compliments. :3 He is a demonic entity wrapped in glossy fur.


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## Damon'sMom (Aug 2, 2011)

Such a handsome dog.  Have you decided which performance foods you will be trying? 



RabbleFox said:


> ^Thank God we aren't up to 7 cups a day.
> 
> What the heck does Jasper do!? I thought Bae and I were an active couple. XD
> 
> Thank you so much for the suggestions. I have to return his ill fitting sometime either this weekend or early next week. I'll let ya'll know how my browsing goes! Still have a lot of my TOTW Pacific Stream to get through. Any and all other feeding suggestions highly appreciated!


Yes, it was ridiculous having to feed him that much but he would lose weight if I lowered it any. I was barely keeping weight on him at that amount.

On a Typical day Jasper and I:

Run 1 hour in the AM before work.
Run 2 hours at noon (I work a sort of split shift)
1 hour herding practice and rounding up cattle
Depending on the day an hour of Flyball/ dockdogs/ tracking/ and other sports, etc.
30 mins to an hour of mental stimulation 

Thats 5.5 to 6 hours a day and then even more on weekends because I have more time off work.  I love to keep busy and he does too. The downfall is when I have to work 15hour shifts he hates me becasue we don't get to do much of anything.  lol


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

Josefina iss similar in coat to Jasper so its harder to tell that she is on the thin side but she is. she is just a naturally active typical herding / working type dog. I play with her an hour in the morning, and iun the evening or she will get into trouble pestering the other dogs to play or .... trying to escape the yard . 

I also do a good bit of mental work with her also, one good way to work them mentally is to throw the ball where they didn't see where it went and make them look for it. I make sure it rolls along the ground so they have a scent trail to follow (its scented with vanilla). I also like to put the ball under or in things so they have too figure out how to get it out. 

Now that its turned warm again (supposed to be 90 today with loads of humidity) I don't have to do as much with her, one play /mental workout session a day is enough for her when its hot, she hates the hot weather. But what has also really helped me is putting up a flirt pole (a horse jolly ball that I hung from an outlying tree branch that she can bop around and play with on her own). when she is frisky, she will use that thing until she is almost falling down exhausted, LOL, I try to run her down as much as I can but when its cool, its all I can do just to put a dent in her energy, so that's how she takes care of the rest.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Bae loves to play with his favorite tug in a tree. Put it on a springy thing and he has a ball all by himself! We are slowly getting to the end of the TOTW bag. He's eating a bit more because we've been Cani-cross training more.  Hungry hungry hippo dog. 3 mile run/walk. Walked a bit because it was hot for freaking October!


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

Josefina doesn't eat as much either when its hot (I am in south texas, where it was over 90 yesterday LOL and will be probably through November). I actually will have to get a new "tree tug" toy soon ... because that poor ole Jolly Ball has almost seen its last days LOL, the handle is torn in half and the only thing keeping it connected to the rope is that its tied reeeaaally tight on the one side.

Here is our tree toy 

This is Izze playing with it (these pics were taken back when it was new LOL)
 

Here is Josefina playing with it 
 

As you can see by the lack of grass under the toy, they had tons of fun with it xD


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

So.

I've decided to go with Pro PAC. I'm looking to order some online since NOBODY CARRIES IT AROUND HERE!!!! However, I really don't want to pay an extra $20 to have it shipped to me. I also don't want 2 month delivery window. >:|

Anybody know of an online retailer that can give me a fair shipping price?!


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> So.
> 
> I've decided to go with Pro PAC. I'm looking to order some online since NOBODY CARRIES IT AROUND HERE!!!! However, I really don't want to pay an extra $20 to have it shipped to me. I also don't want 2 month delivery window. >:|
> 
> Anybody know of an online retailer that can give me a fair shipping price?!


The food is made in Indiana you should be able to get it easy. If anyone sells Earthborn or Sportmix near you just ask them to order it, same company. This food is too inexpensive to ship, makes no sense. You can probably have it in 2 or 3 days.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Bumper1 said:


> The food is made in Indiana you should be able to get it easy. If anyone sells Earthborn or Sportmix near you just ask them to order it, same company. This food is too inexpensive to ship, makes no sense. You can probably have it in 2 or 3 days.


Its crazy stupid. My local pet store said SURE! We'll order it. No biggie. Except they sell it for $45 a bag. Kind of defeats the purpose really.

I may just go with National Competition Xtra Formula. Its available, inexpensive and offers 582 calories per cup.

Ingredients: Poultry Meal, Fish Meal, Kibbled Corn, Pork Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), Extruded Rice, Beet Pulp, Plain, Dried, Blood Meal, Sodium Bentonite, Corn Oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols), Cane Molasses, Feeding Oat Meal, Liver Digest, Flaxseed, Potassium Chloride, Vitamins and Minerals.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

$45 for 44lbs or $45 for 33lbs?

I would just get Pro Plan Sport 28/18 or 30/20 or Euk Premium 30/20 and go on with life 

National is nowhere near as good as PP or Euk Premium.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Bumper1 said:


> $45 for 44lbs or $45 for 33lbs?
> 
> I would just get Pro Plan Sport 28/18 or 30/20 or Euk Premium 30/20 and go on with life
> 
> National is nowhere near as good as PP or Euk Premium.


$45 for 33lbs. Which I think is over paying.

Pro Plan Sport is readily available via Amazon and my local pet store. Its over priced at the store though. Ughhhhh. I don't even know.

A lot of the dog foods recommended for sled dogs have very similar formulas to that of National... Research goes on.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> $45 for 33lbs. Which I think is over paying.
> 
> Pro Plan Sport is readily available via Amazon and my local pet store. Its over priced at the store though. Ughhhhh. I don't even know.
> 
> A lot of the dog foods recommended for sled dogs have very similar formulas to that of National... Research goes on.


PP Sport is $42.99 for 37.5lbs at Pet Supplies Plus and other places like Petco and Petsmart.


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> Its crazy stupid. My local pet store said SURE! We'll order it. No biggie. Except they sell it for $45 a bag. Kind of defeats the purpose really.
> 
> I may just go with National Competition Xtra Formula. Its available, inexpensive and offers 582 calories per cup.
> 
> Ingredients: Poultry Meal, Fish Meal, Kibbled Corn, Pork Fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), Extruded Rice, Beet Pulp, Plain, Dried, Blood Meal, Sodium Bentonite, Corn Oil (preserved with mixed tocopherols), Cane Molasses, Feeding Oat Meal, Liver Digest, Flaxseed, Potassium Chloride, Vitamins and Minerals.


Eww cane molasses is basically sugar. Esrthborn's primitive naturals is a good food (but only the PN... The others are crap) like I said I feed Merick beef/ sweet potato and supplement with satin balls (the cals per cup for Merick are 430 or something I think). It is also pretty cheap (at least down here) and good. 

There is also natures variety I think that is made somewhere up by you.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

Just take a deep breath, relax and buy a bag of food. See how your dog does on it. I think it is easier to add healthy calories with fresh food than finding a very high calorie kibble, but what works for a given dog is what works for that dog.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

asldfj;ovi nrdk!111!!eleventy!!

I'll take a chill pill. 

The nice thing about dog food's is that I can return bags he doesn't like or if he gets a runny stool. Thank goodness!

I absolutely love Nature's Variety but its like $70 a bag for the good stuff and about $60 for the Prairie. Pepper liked the Prairie a lot. I got it on super sale for $35 when the store was having a clearance sale and I had a coupon.


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

Agreed, castor and Pollux is a good food for the price. 

That's also what I do is add extra calories to the dog who needs them


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## Damon'sMom (Aug 2, 2011)

OwnedbyACDs said:


> Agreed, castor and Pollux is a good food for the price.
> 
> That's also what I do is add extra calories to the dog who needs them


Agreed Castor and Pollux is a good food for the price. Around $49.99 for 30 pounds around here and on chewy.com

I do agree with adding in fresh meats, and left overs too. You can also add in canned food, canned puppy food is high in calories. 

ETA: Here seems to be a list of canned foods with calories listed.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

By listening to all I will never understand how those 90% of trial retrievers eat Pro Plan (or "lesser') foods and manage to train and work in that 40 - 50 degree water all day and get through life.

Is it possible that they may be right?

I would just buy it use it for 3 months and you will see I am right. Worry about other things, things that are actually important.

Your dog is an animal, not a little person in a fur coat.


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

I have wondered that myself, because all the high performance dogs I have had needed a "higher grade", perhaps that add things to it?


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

My dog is a little person in person clothes, thank you very much. 

It's a very real possibility that I'll be adding another dog to the house in November. Probably another sibe mix because I'm insane. I'm off to our dog specialty food store to check out some PP prices and see if they could special order Pro pac for me at a reasonable price. 

Dog I'm looking at: http://www.petfinder.com/petdetail/26161892/


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> My dog is a little person in person clothes, thank you very much.
> 
> It's a very real possibility that I'll be adding another dog to the house in November. Probably another sibe mix because I'm insane. I'm off to our dog specialty food store to check out some PP prices and see if they could special order Pro pac for me at a reasonable price.
> 
> Dog I'm looking at: http://www.petfinder.com/petdetail/26161892/


Good luck shopping..and save the weight circles when you buy Pro Plan.


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## PureMutt (Feb 6, 2009)

Pro plan is awful. :/


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

PureMutt said:


> Pro plan is awful.
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


I am 10 years old. Pro Plan seems to keep me really healthy. I was weaned on it. No canned pumpkin, no probiotics, no coconut oil, no herbs or berries, just 4 cups a day during hunting season and 3 off season.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Store prices were crappy. I'll have to order online prolly. How do we feel about Eagle Pack Power Adult? 4 stars...*

PureMutt: Why do you feel this way about Pro Plan? Do you have a higher calorie food that is reasonably priced in mind? With the potential addition of a second dog, I can't rightly afford to go through a $70, 30lb bag of dog food every month!

*I know dog food advisor isn't the be all, end all but it's a good indicator usually.


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## Damon'sMom (Aug 2, 2011)

I like Eagle Pack its a pretty decent food. I can get it locally for $51.99 for 40lbs. OR Chewy.com has it for $50.99 for the 40lb bag. My boy Max is eating it right now, he loves it.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

Eagle Power is excellent food as is Pro Plan.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Awesome! He'll probably end up eating that for a bit and we will see how we do. If he starts to lose weight as we ramp up the running and biking, I'll add some satin balls in.


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## Bumper1 (Jul 14, 2013)

RabbleFox said:


> Awesome! He'll probably end up eating that for a bit and we will see how we do. If he starts to lose weight as we ramp up the running and biking, I'll add some satin balls in.


You should feed most if not all of his daily ration in the early evening. This can help with hard keeping dogs. The morning meal tends to move faster through the system.


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## sassafras (Jun 22, 2010)

I've just skimmed this thread but Native Performance is a decent food at usually a decent price and has several "levels" of varying calorie content that you can experiment with. 

Around here CostCo usually has the best pharmacy prices, except that Target has a list of medications that you can get for either $4 or $10 depending on the size/quantity - but you have to ask them and they do sneaky stuff like, tablets are on the 4/10 list but capsules aren't. So if you have a Target near you call the pharmacy and ask them if the medication is on the 4/10 list and what size/quantity qualifies.


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

Here it's backward ... Target here is very high :/ in everything. Here Walmart is the cheapest.


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## PureMutt (Feb 6, 2009)

It's still awful. 


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## sassafras (Jun 22, 2010)

OwnedbyACDs said:


> Here it's backward ... Target here is very high :/ in everything. Here Walmart is the cheapest.


It's very specific medications on the 4/10 list, and they don't volunteer the information - you have to point blank ask them "is this on the $4/$10 list?" In fact, most pharmacies will give a price break for certain quantities - say, a 90 day supply - but they almost never tell you that, the only way to find out is to ask.


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

sassafras said:


> It's very specific medications on the 4/10 list, and they don't volunteer the information - you have to point blank ask them "is this on the $4/$10 list?" In fact, most pharmacies will give a price break for certain quantities - say, a 90 day supply - but they almost never tell you that, the only way to find out is to ask.


Yeah god forbid we save any money on their watch xD


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

PureMutt said:


> It's still awful.
> 
> 
> Sent from Petguide.com Free App


I wish this comment was more constructive. What's awful? Pro Plan? Pro Pac? Eagle Pack? If you have a different food suggestion, I'd love to hear it. 

I'll definitely be checking Walgreens and Target to save some dough! I've been picking up odd jobs here and there but man... There isn't anything good out there right now! Thanks Sass.


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