# Slight aggression toward my youngest child



## Nicole (Mar 25, 2007)

I have two children, ages 3 and 5. We recently adopted a 2 year old hound mix (about a month ago), and we are having some aggression issues toward my youngest daughter. And, we are new to dog ownership in general.

Overall, he's a very well behaved dog. He's housetrained, can follow basic commands, doesn't chew anything that doesn't belong to him, is learning to walk on a leash. He's never shown any sign of aggression toward me, my husband, or my oldest daughter. I'm guessing he sees my little one as the smallest of the pack, so he's trying to be dominant and sees her as the easiest target? She's always very gentle with him (the two weigh about the same), and most of the time, he's fine with her. Most of our issues are in the morning- the dog is not an early riser and doesn't like to be disturbed. Fair enough- I can keep my daughter away from him in the morning until the house is more awake. But, he has snapped lightly at her at other times during the day.

How do I make it very clear to him that even the littlest person in our house is above him?


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## GoodBullyLLC (Apr 1, 2007)

Nicole said:


> I have two children, ages 3 and 5. We recently adopted a 2 year old hound mix (about a month ago), and we are having some aggression issues toward my youngest daughter. And, we are new to dog ownership in general.
> 
> Overall, he's a very well behaved dog. He's housetrained, can follow basic commands, doesn't chew anything that doesn't belong to him, is learning to walk on a leash. He's never shown any sign of aggression toward me, my husband, or my oldest daughter. I'm guessing he sees my little one as the smallest of the pack, so he's trying to be dominant and sees her as the easiest target? She's always very gentle with him (the two weigh about the same), and most of the time, he's fine with her. Most of our issues are in the morning- the dog is not an early riser and doesn't like to be disturbed. Fair enough- I can keep my daughter away from him in the morning until the house is more awake. But, he has snapped lightly at her at other times during the day.
> 
> How do I make it very clear to him that even the littlest person in our house is above him?


First of all, it is important to understand that slight aggression will become dangerous aggression if not corrected.

You need to start involving your daughter in the care of this dog. Here is my list of suggestions for you. (I haven't met your daughter but I have worked with a ton of 3 and 4 year olds - all are different so you have to determine which of these your daughter is able to do).

1. Your daughter should join you on walks (get two leashes, one for you and one for her). Make sure the dog walks behind you or beside you.

2. Your daughter needs to stop giving unwarranted affection to the dog. When your daughter gets home tell her to ignore the dog (no talk, no touch, no eye contact) for 15 minutes or so. Also, she can't just pet the dog whenever the dog comes around, start showing her how to issue a "sit" command and tell her she needs to make the dog sit before she touches it.

3. When you prepare the dogs food, have the daughter rub her hands in it so her scent is on the food, along with yours. Give the bowl to your daughter and have your daughter make the dog sit and then set the bowl down.

4. Don't let the dog jump on your daughter, sit in her lap, put a paw up on her, etc - those are all domination tactics.

Start with those and wait one to two weeks. Update us with any other issues. This will also help teach your daughter about responsibility.


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## Nicole (Mar 25, 2007)

GoodBullyLLC said:


> First of all, it is important to understand that slight aggression will become dangerous aggression if not corrected.
> 
> You need to start involving your daughter in the care of this dog. Here is my list of suggestions for you. (I haven't met your daughter but I have worked with a ton of 3 and 4 year olds - all are different so you have to determine which of these your daughter is able to do).
> 
> ...


Thanks for the advice. Can I ask a few questions about your response?

1. Two leashes is a great idea. Thanks! But, he's still learning to walk on a leash. I don't move unless there is slack in the leash, but he still doesn't seem to have it down. He does stop and turn to me, but as soon as he sees something he's interested in, he's pulling again. So, we stop until there is slack. Walks take us a long time.  My question is- how do I teach him to walk beside me? I haven't been completely successful with teaching him not to pull. And, do I use two leashes while teaching him this or stick with one until we have that down, then add my 3 year old into the mix?
ETA: Nevermind on this one, I think. I read the sticky about leash training, and on our walk today, we tried the giving a treat every time he walked beside me thing. By the end of the walk, he was walking right beside me, looking at me every couple of steps. So, I think we'll get it down in no time. 

4. He doesn't jump on her, but he loves to lay his head in her lap (all of our laps). Should we not allow this at all?


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## Curbside Prophet (Apr 28, 2006)

A rank reduction program does not treat a singular problem like resource guarding, but if introduced, can have a sudden and devastating effect on the dog because it will suddenly change his life. For a dog on a rank reduction program, the vast majority of his day-to-day routines will change, resulting in expected rewards being denied to him. John Fisher would say, "If you remove an expected reward, you are in all aspects other than physical, punishing the dog." 

John O'Heare, author of The Canine Aggression Workbook says about dogs that aggress, "One of the primary tasks you will undertake in the rehabilitation of your aggressive dog will be for you to achieve a benevolent leadership role with your dog. Structure and consistency is all we are talking about here. This is NOT a rank reduction program." 

I cannot stress enough that if a dog has a behavioral problem, whether it be aggression or just something annoying, the specific problem must be addressed. There is no cure-all such as a rank reduction program, so forget pack rules and concentrate on the problem. 

There's always someone who will say rank reduction or dominance ploys work. But as John Fisher said, random punishment suppresses behavior any by denying the dog his daily rewards, the dog is being randomly punished. 

What needs to take place is to practice NILIF, continue to teach basic obedience, learn to read canine language, teach your dog to follow the rules of your house, and most importantly always supervise your dog's and child's interactions.


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## poodleholic (Mar 15, 2007)

Excellent advice, and very well said. 




Curbside Prophet said:


> A rank reduction program does not treat a singular problem like resource guarding, but if introduced, can have a sudden and devastating effect on the dog because it will suddenly change his life. For a dog on a rank reduction program, the vast majority of his day-to-day routines will change, resulting in expected rewards being denied to him. John Fisher would say, "If you remove an expected reward, you are in all aspects other than physical, punishing the dog."
> 
> John O'Heare, author of The Canine Aggression Workbook says about dogs that aggress, "One of the primary tasks you will undertake in the rehabilitation of your aggressive dog will be for you to achieve a benevolent leadership role with your dog. Structure and consistency is all we are talking about here. This is NOT a rank reduction program."
> 
> ...


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Please read 
http://www.doggonesafe.com/article library.htm
http://www.doggonesafe.com/dog bite prevention.htm

http://www.topdogtrainingsolutions.com/child-safety-around-dogs.html

Whatever you do, DO NOT punish the dog for growling, a growl is a warning. Teach your child to respect the warning and back off. 

Hereare a couple of good books about Children and dogs.

“Dogs And Children” by Barbara Sikes


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## GoodBullyLLC (Apr 1, 2007)

^^^ This is horrible advice, I'm sorry.

You are teaching the dog that unwarranted growling is good--and worse, that it works.


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## Captbob (Feb 2, 2007)

I am surprised that nobody suggested keeping the child and dog apart unless someone is there to supervise them, or did I miss something? ....


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## GoodBullyLLC (Apr 1, 2007)

Curbside Prophet said:


> A rank reduction program does not treat a singular problem like resource guarding, but if introduced, can have a sudden and devastating effect on the dog because it will suddenly change his life. For a dog on a rank reduction program, the vast majority of his day-to-day routines will change, resulting in expected rewards being denied to him. John Fisher would say, "If you remove an expected reward, you are in all aspects other than physical, punishing the dog."


Where did the OP say this was a resource guarding problem?



> John O'Heare, author of The Canine Aggression Workbook says about dogs that aggress, "One of the primary tasks you will undertake in the rehabilitation of your aggressive dog will be for you to achieve a benevolent leadership role with your dog. Structure and consistency is all we are talking about here. This is NOT a rank reduction program."


Dominance aggression is controlled with rank reduction. Leadership is dominance. You are confusing the OP.



> I cannot stress enough that if a dog has a behavioral problem, whether it be aggression or just something annoying, the specific problem must be addressed. There is no cure-all such as a rank reduction program, so forget pack rules and concentrate on the problem.


What? Forget the pack rules? You must understand that it is hard to fix singular problems when you don't have proper pack structure, right?



> There's always someone who will say rank reduction or dominance ploys work. But as John Fisher said, random punishment suppresses behavior any by denying the dog his daily rewards, the dog is being randomly punished.


This is liberalism in the dog world. Dogs don't associate like this. You are saying the dog has a complex mental and emotional structure that allows him to figure out he's not receiving something he normally gets, and then associating that with being punished. Dogs live in the moment. They don't say "gee, I got fed yesterday at 9 am, but today they didn't put my food down for me, I must have done something wrong."

It's ludacris.



> What needs to take place is to practice NILIF, continue to teach basic obedience, learn to read canine language, teach your dog to follow the rules of your house, and most importantly always supervise your dog's and child's interactions.


What? You just said rank reduction isn't the answer, and now you are proceeding to recommend Nothing in Life is Free? What do you think the NILIF program does? What do you think I already told the OP?

You just finished arguing that this wasn't the right thing to do, you said the actual problem must be addressed...then go proceed to advise the OP to do what you said didn't need to be done?

Amazing.



Nicole said:


> Thanks for the advice. Can I ask a few questions about your response?
> 
> 1. Two leashes is a great idea. Thanks! But, he's still learning to walk on a leash. I don't move unless there is slack in the leash, but he still doesn't seem to have it down. He does stop and turn to me, but as soon as he sees something he's interested in, he's pulling again. So, we stop until there is slack. Walks take us a long time.  My question is- how do I teach him to walk beside me? I haven't been completely successful with teaching him not to pull.


You can use a quick snap of the leash, called a leash correction, to snap him out of what he is focused on and get him back to your side. I would hire a trainer to come give you a private lesson on walking the dog properly because it is really something that needs to be taught hands on.

If you want to try a cheaper route, you can purchase a Gentle Leader, which will give you far more control over the dog. You can get these from your local pet store or my website--the mods probably don't want me advertising though.



> And, do I use two leashes while teaching him this or stick with one until we have that down, then add my 3 year old into the mix?


If it were me, I would take the dog once around the block by myself, correcting and getting the dog on track, and then I would swing back by and let my 3 year old join me; that way, the dog is tired and focused when the 3 year old joins in.



> 4. He doesn't jump on her, but he loves to lay his head in her lap (all of our laps). Should we not allow this at all?


When he is on you, it gives him the sensation of owning you. If he weren't aggressive toward your three year old I would say that this very minor act would probably be o.k. for you to allow, but with a 3 year old and a dominant aggressive dog I wouldn't take any chances.



Captbob said:


> I am surprised that nobody suggested keeping the child and dog apart unless someone is there to supervise them, or did I miss something? ....


It's something I assumed the OP was already doing...I thought I read him/her say that somewhere.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Try giving advice without insulting others GoodBully! Warning 2!


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## GoodBullyLLC (Apr 1, 2007)

cshellenberger said:


> Try giving advice without insulting others GoodBully! Warning 2!


Where was an insult? A challenge to what someone else says isn't an insult.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Check your PM's


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## Curbside Prophet (Apr 28, 2006)

This response if for the benefit of the OP to illustrate how "dominance" theories are not the solution.



GoodBullyLLC said:


> Where did the OP say this was a resource guarding problem?


The OP said there were no signs of aggression towards the other members of the family, except the child. The resource being guarded in this case is attention. You probably don't have any children, so you probably don't understand how much attention they require.



> Dominance aggression is controlled with rank reduction. Leadership is dominance. You are confusing the OP.


Leadership is not dominance. Leadership is controlling resources. As I stated previously, rank reduction only randomly punishes the dog. It's wasteful energy, and it's better to focus on the real problems. 



> What? Forget the pack rules? You must understand that it is hard to fix singular problems when you don't have proper pack structure, right?


Again, In your wolf theory fog, pack structure is linear. That's a misconception even among wolf packs. So yes, again, you're wasting time focusing on pack structure. 



> This is liberalism in the dog world. Dogs don't associate like this. You are saying the dog has a complex mental and emotional structure that allows him to figure out he's not receiving something he normally gets, and then associating that with being punished. Dogs live in the moment. They don't say "gee, I got fed yesterday at 9 am, but today they didn't put my food down for me, I must have done something wrong." It's ludacris.


I believe what's "ludacris" is your impression that I'm being only anthropomorphic, and that I don't have understanding. 

David Mech, a wolf behaviorist, says this about feeding orders, "If the kill were small, the breeders would eat first but if food were scarce, the pups would be fed first. If the kill were big enough all pack members, regardless of rank feed together."

What can understand from this is, a bitch has invested 50% of her genes in her pups. Her priority is to ensure their survival and she will go without food herself if necessary. Therefore it's not so much a question of "dominance" or being "Alpha", it's more a question of resources and survival of the young and therefore, survival of the species. 

If you're going to apply wolf theories, how about applying them more accurately.



> What? You just said rank reduction isn't the answer, and now you are proceeding to recommend Nothing in Life is Free? What do you think the NILIF program does? What do you think I already told the OP?
> 
> You just finished arguing that this wasn't the right thing to do, you said the actual problem must be addressed...then go proceed to advise the OP to do what you said didn't need to be done?
> 
> Amazing.


What's amazing is that you don't understand NILIF was developed by animal behaviorists that understood the fallacy of dominance theories. For the OP, this is NILIF.

Nothing in Life is Free


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

GoodBullyLLC said:


> ^^^ This is horrible advice, I'm sorry.
> 
> You are teaching the dog that unwarranted growling is good--and worse, that it works.



This is insulting, you are constantly challenging others and belittleing the advice given. 

Furthermore, punishing for giving a warning leads to bites WITHOUT warning, a VERY dangerous situation that I've seen too many dogs get euthinized for. 

However, the child should not be disturbing a dog that is sleeping in the first place. Also, if the dog is growling at the child when it's in the lap, the dog shold NOT be allowed in the lap. it's called controlling resources.


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## Nicole (Mar 25, 2007)

I'm so so confused. I'm not really familiar with a lot of the terms used here. What is resource guarding? I can guess at what it means by context, but I'm not clear on what it is the dog is guarding? Does he see my child as a threat, that she will take my attention from him?

I had not thought about the consequences of punishing him for growling. So, thanks so much for that perspective. I definitely do not want a bite without a warning, so I can see how important it is for me to teach my child to take his growl seriously.


What would qualify him as a dominant alpha dog? This one issue?

Thanks for the different viewpoints.  Hopefully, I can figure out what it all means so we can make sure our home is safe for both the dog and my child. He's a great dog, eager to please, so I'm sure that this is something we can work through.

Is it as simple as not allowing my child to disturb him when he's sleeping? I can certainly do that. I just don't want to use a "band-aid" if there is a larger issue that we need to address.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Read the child safety posts I made, and pick up the book, if you can't find it around town, you can get it on www.dogwise.com 

I'm sorry if you're confused. The basic summary is that thereare two different camps on how to train and handle behavior problems. One, is based on wolf pack theory, some of the beliefs have been dispelled through research that many of it's proponents have ignored. It uses forced dominance and physical punishment to establish leadership over the dog, which can, at times cause an insecure, sy or fearful dog to have more serious problems. 

The other is based on physcology 101, (Pavlov theory is part of it) and uses positive means to establish leadership for the dog(s), It uses non physical corrections and rewards for good behavior which allows the dog to choose the right way. Clicker training is a good example of this. Children can be involved in clickertraining too as it will establish them as leaders and help to work out some of what you're having problems with. You might also look at he Doggy Zen thread which can be the basis of a NILIF program in your home which will help your training and the dogs manners. 

Do closely supervise your young children at all times they are in contact with the dog. This is just safety 101. Teach them the safty protocols shown in the links and be sure they abide by them. It is just as important to train your kids as it is to train your dog.


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## Curbside Prophet (Apr 28, 2006)

A little something to also help your children understand.

Bouvier - For Children: How To Meet a Dog Coloring Page

And for something to work on with your kids.

Teach Your Dog to Be Gentle, Dog Training and Obedience Lessons


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