# Nutro Venison vs. Nature's Recipe Venison



## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

I have been changing my mixed breed English Pointer's food from Canidae after he develoepd major stomach problems. Parasites and worms were ruled out and he did 2 weeks on Flagyl with the vet's prescribed gentle canned food but going back to Canidae just didn't work so we figure he has developed intolerance to cetain ingredients or IBS. First I tried Taste of the Wild's Salmon (fish based) grain free food but that didn't work. My sister's Cairn Terrier has IBS and eats Prescription Royal Canine Venison Kibble but I can't affford that (and my dog is 70 pounds---5 pounds too much but eats more than a tiny Cairn plus I have another 40 pound medium sized lab mix who can eat anything). I bought a small bag of Nutro's Sensitive Stomach and Skin Venison based Kibble and I think he is improving (might be too soon to tell). I see that Nature's Recipe also has a Venison based kibble that costs a bit less. Is there a big difference in the quality of these foods (I know Nutro was part of that horrible recall years back). I know there are "better" brands but money is VERY tight here (I became disabled after being widowed, have a teenage daughter, and we are applying for food stamps ourselves). I just want to do the best I can by my dog so he doesn't have gas and diarrhea. If Nature's Recipe agrees with him like the Nutro and costs almsot $10 less for a 30 pound bag, is it a good switch? I don't know how to calculate the calories to know if he would need to eat more of one brand or the other. He was a self feeder before which is how he packed on some extra pounds (1st dog of many who overate like that and he gets exercise-walks). Honestly I worry because with measuring I have no idea how much he should be eating. Help!! And Thank you.


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

Honestly there is no difference besides the Nature's Recipe is going to have a little more carbs... Other than that they are practically the same. Are you buying these foods at petsmart?? Have you seen their Simply Nourish line because its super similar...? Very excellent food for the price.... Id even put it on par with the regular blue buffalo line but it doesn't cost an arm and a leg... It's also cheaper than both Nutro and Natures Recipe but not so carb heavy like they are and how blue is... They also don't use pea or potato proteins like I believe Nutro and Natures Recipe do so they are actually putting more meat and quality into their food versus just adding plant protein. Maybe something to look at?


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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

I will look into it. Dog's tummy still not great on the NUtro but its still early in switching over. At least he is not gassy.


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

Simply Nourish also has a grain free one that's nice if you wanted to go that route... I'm surprised canidae bothered her.... Maybe you should try something that's completely grain free?? 


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

And trust me you wouldn't want that so called "prescription diet".... The ingredients are horrid and you might as well be buying Iams :lol: those prescription diets are the biggest rip off out there... Probably do further damage than to actually fix anything.... 


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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

I've been feeding Canidae for 15 yeats and had very long lived dogs. This isa whole new area for me--a dog possibly with IBS or some other odd food intolerance. He didn't do well on a SAlmon based food


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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

Well the Nutro Venison hasn't been working out so well. It wasn't grainfree. I went to Pet Goods and there was a sales rep from Blue Buffalllo who convinced me that their grain free would be good for my dog. WOW that stuff is pricy but I noticed more of the protein comes from animal and it is 7% fiber where most other dog foods are 3-4% fiber. I will transtion him slowly. Tonights poop was promising! My dog is now eating healthier than me and costing more too. I was trying to avoid going over a certain budget on dog food but I guess we do what we have to do. I don't know. We fed Kennel Ration Burger to my dog growing up. It is now considered crap but that dog lived to 16 1/2. Why do so many dogs have food problems these days?


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

If your gonna spend the money on grain free I definitely wouldn't bother with blue buffalo... They are 1 of 4 companies who don't release where they source their ingredients so they could be getting their stuff from china and you wouldn't know it. Plus I think right now they are heading for a recall. There's been a sky rocket of complaints come up in march on consumer affairs... And not for something little like salmonella.... Complaints are similar to their recall that happened in 2010 where it was causing kidney failure in some dogs.... Their food is also one of the more carb heavy ones out there because they use a lot of potatoes... Over priced shady and over rated.... For those reasons I will not touch them with a ten foot pole.... Salmonella is one thing.... Something that was causing kidney failure is another.... Simply Nourish makes a grain free that is similar in price but better quality. There's also Wellness Core, Innova Prime or Evo, Taste of the wild... Various ones.... Taste of the wild is a definite good bang for your buck.... EVO and Prime being the best out of those... They don't use potatoes and for that reason they are bout the lowest carb you can buy.... Don't let those blue buffalo reps get you... I would take it back :lol: 


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## xxxxdogdragoness (Jul 22, 2010)

A good place to start is www.dogfoodadvisor.com I personally don't feed any food under 4 stars


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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

I SO wanted to feed Taste of the Wild and tried the salmon grain free. That may have been my mistake becuase not only did my dogs not like it; but the one with the problem still had tummy trouble. I think they make another grain free line (forget what the main meat is) so I could consider that. Meanwhile, he did really well last night and this morning after I mixed 25% Blue Buffalo with the Nutru Venison. I think its higher fiber content (7%) is helping. I don't particualrly KNOW that I need to go grain free but it does seem at this point that I might as well eliminate anything that could be a problem. This is the first time I have heard anything negative about Blue Buffalo. Years ago I fed Innova but had a friend whose dog got very sick from alphatoxins (mold) in the bag. It took her forever to prove it butshe did! This was in the days before all these recalls. It was a good food but I ended up switching to Canidae and staying with it all these years. Yikes what is a person to do!


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

Lippylulu said:


> I SO wanted to feed Taste of the Wild and tried the salmon grain free. That may have been my mistake becuase not only did my dogs not like it; but the one with the problem still had tummy trouble. I think they make another grain free line (forget what the main meat is) so I could consider that. Meanwhile, he did really well last night and this morning after I mixed 25% Blue Buffalo with the Nutru Venison. I think its higher fiber content (7%) is helping. I don't particualrly KNOW that I need to go grain free but it does seem at this point that I might as well eliminate anything that could be a problem. This is the first time I have heard anything negative about Blue Buffalo. Years ago I fed Innova but had a friend whose dog got very sick from alphatoxins (mold) in the bag. It took her forever to prove it butshe did! This was in the days before all these recalls. It was a good food but I ended up switching to Canidae and staying with it all these years. Yikes what is a person to do!


I'm apart of a cat forum also and almost everyone there won't touch blue buffalo either.... If you don't release where you source your ingredients then no way in heck will I touch you... Not even without the other problems yet..... I know something is going on because I personally had a customer come in and say she had been feeding blue for years and recently she thought it was making her poodle vomit.. She fed a different canned one weekend and her dog had no problem. Went back to the blue and her dog vomited..... I told her what I know and she was appalled and ended up buying Castor and Pollux. That would be another you could try... Blue buffalo is the last one I would pick for a dog with stomach issues... I think I would feed that bogus Science Diet Ideal Balance before I touched blue... :lol: and that's sad because I HATE science diet... Haha there's so much better foods for your money... 


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

Like I said those Blue Buffalo reps will get you.... If its one thing blue is good for its marketing... Irks me to no end because they DO NOT deserve the customer base they have... Another one that's on par with Evo as far as carbs go js Pinnacle Peak Protein.... And they've never had a recall as far as I know... Forgot about that one... 


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

Oh and most the problems with the food contributing to kidney failure and other damage in Blues 2010 recall lied within their Wilderness line so I would be super super SUPER wary of it if your going to continue to feed it or otherwise take that bag back and run madly the other direction!!! :lol: haha you just never know its safe with that company like I said... 


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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

Its not from the Wilderness Line. Its called Blue Basics--No grain Sensitive Stomach formula and is turkey based with no chicken. I like that it has 7% fiber. The only other foods that have that much fiber (or more) are weight loss formulas and packed with fillers. Last night and this mornign he did so well. I guess I will se how today goes and then decide what to do. I don't want to kill my dog while trying to make him better. I also don't want to keep him sick switching around if I find something he does well on. grrrrrr


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

Oh well Wellness makes a food like that is called Wellness Simple I think. Normally those foods are used with a dog that's allergic to a certain protein like chicken. They are a bit carb heavy too.... I was thinking for the stomach issues. Castor and Pollux might be a good choice for you because they add probiotics to their food and that always helps digestive upsets! I forget they do that. I usually recommend that food a lot to people throughout the day... 

http://www.chewy.com/dog/castor-pollux-organix-chicken-peas/dp/40078

They have the Organix Grain Free and the Natural Ultramix Duck and Sweet Potato that's grain free... You can find them both at petsmart... Any of their food though I would recommend over blue.... People have also said their dogs really like the taste of it too. 


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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

Some people I know personally and on facebook have also suggested various forms of pumpkin supplements for fiber like Nummy Tum Tum 100% Pumpkin and Honest Kitchen Perfect Form. I will definitely check out the probiotic foods---that will surely help.


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

I've used Honest Kitchen Perfect form before. Have some on hand now actually. That's a great supplement.... But yea defiantly take a look at Castor and Pollux! It's a very nice food. The Ultramix line has freeze dried fruits and veggies throughout the kibble so that might be partially why they like the taste :lol: 


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## xxxxdogdragoness (Jul 22, 2010)

I have ever liked the "rare" protein sources. Because even the good ones have the "rare" meat not in meal form & they are usually followed by something more common in meal form like salmon or something like that ... I don't like the "rare" protein because its IMHO a waste of money.


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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

What is a "rare" protein source? Sorry for my ignorance.


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## xxxxdogdragoness (Jul 22, 2010)

What about cooking for your dogs? It can be very affordable & you can totally control every ingredient that goes into their bodies  I am on my phone Ruth now but a simple google or search engine search will turn up wealth of Info, I just search for "home made dog food recipes"


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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

I added some 100% pumpkin to his food last night and this morning and definitely see improvement. He is still on the Nutro Venison for Sensitive Stoamchs. I may stay with it for a while and then consider switching to Taste of the Wild which has a Venison based bood and costs a bit less. The Blue Buffallo Basic with Turkey was not a good pick for him. He must have a poultry problem. After a month of struggling, I was so happy to see his healthy poop today (even if it was slightly pumpkin colored lol).


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## xxxxdogdragoness (Jul 22, 2010)

"rare" or unusual is like anything other then the usual suspects normally used in the making of dog foods:
chicken
beef
turkey
duck
lamb

there are foods who use "rare" or unusual protien sources they can be as follows:
bison
quail
pheasent
rabbit
kangaroo

I dont know the brand off hand who use those but a quick search on google might turn up some results.


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

Taste of the Wild has a bison and venison one. They also have one that uses wild boar... I think only a couple of theirs have chicken... 


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## xxxxdogdragoness (Jul 22, 2010)

TOTW is a good food on paper but its made at/by diamond so i tend to not trust them ... also when they did their last formula change, my dogs stopped eating it. i dont know what they added or took away ... but my dogs became very "meh" about it & I tend to take them at their word, since they are the ones who have to eat it ... i want them to enjoy it xD


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

dogdragoness said:


> TOTW is a good food on paper but its made at/by diamond so i tend to not trust them ... also when they did their last formula change, my dogs stopped eating it. i dont know what they added or took away ... but my dogs became very "meh" about it & I tend to take them at their word, since they are the ones who have to eat it ... i want them to enjoy it xD


If you don't like Taste of the Wild because its made by Diamond check out Eathborn Holistics. Very nice quality for the money especially the Primitive Natural formula. They don't use pea protein in that one. 

http://www.chewy.com/dog/earthborn-holistic-primitive-natural/dp/28999



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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

I know a small pet store owner who ONLY sells Earthborn Holistics. He stays on top of which companies get bought out by larger corporations which is when they run into trouble becuase they end up getting some ingredients from the same place which is why some recalls include such an range of low end and high end food. I am going to try the TOTW with bison and venison but I am pretty sure it had chicken meal in it and I am concerned he may have a poulty problem. He is doing pretty well on Nutro Venison with brown rice for senstiive stomachs but I've been adding pumpkin. I got some Perfect Form yesterday and can see why it works---he hated it and for the first time didn't empty his bowl (Nutro Basic Venison for sensitive stomachs) but I am going to keep trying it--maybe just use less. I wish that my finances weren't as bad as they are. There was a time when I would spare no expense to give the best of everything but my life took a very dramatic turn for the worse with my own health and finances this past year. Its sad that it is harder and harder to feed safe, healthy food not only for our pets buit for ourselves too. I certainly undersatnd why people cook for their dogs..it just doesn't fit my lifestyle right now. I have a 2nd dog and am so lucky she has a grest digestive system. She gets to get to eat all the rejects my dog with the tummy trouble can't eat. BTW, the Blue Buffalo Basic (turkey based grain free) I tried a while back? A) It didn't work for tummy trouble dog at all and b) neither dog likes it. My easy feeder dog will eat it if I mix in some canned food. I can't afford to waste money so she will finish the bag. I wish I could go back to plain ol' Canidae All Life Stages and just add the pumpkin or Perfect Form but we have made progress and I don't want to mess it all up now.


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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

Just to follow up for anyone who might have a similar problem. My dog really started improving when I added Healthy Kitchen's Perfect Form and some canned pumpkin to his Nutro Venison. Due to a delivery mix up, I ran out of Nutro so yesterday he had a mix of Nutro Venison with some TOTW Seafood n the morning and all TOTW (always with Perfect Form and Pumpkin). He did great. He hates Perfect Form so eventually I would like to phase it out but I think I am on the right tract for now---avoiding poultry based foods and maybe switching to grainfree. There is a TOTW with Bison and Venison that has some chicken meal in it which I haven't tried yet . TOTW will cost me less than Nutro for the big bags and money is a big concern so I will be very happy if this works out.At some point I may consider trying Earthborn Holistics but right now I am just so happy he is healthy. Luckily #2 dog can eat anything and has been eating the TOTW with Salmon since she was eating everything that didn't work out for tummy trouble dog. She tends to get some dandruff that never really bothered me or her but I do think I see an improvement with her on TOTW too.Thank you everyone for the advice.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

I don't know about the other ingredients in Perfect Form but the slippery elm bark probably shouldn't be a permanent part of the diet as it works by keeping mucous going and some nutrients may not be well absorbed. I have it and it has helped Max a couple of times with a stomach ache and gas. I used it and it helped with gas but not as well as something like GasX. Glad you are trying to get him off the stuff but also glad it is helping! Here is webMD's info on the stuff.
http://www.webmd.com/vitamins-supplements/ingredientmono-978-SLIPPERY%20ELM.aspx?activeIngredientId=978&activeIngredientName=SLIPPERY%20ELM

Have you tried a probiotic? Dropping fat content and feeding numerous small meals worked better than probiotics for me but many people report they work wonders. 

When the dogs had an actual food borne illness canned pumpkin was a miracle worker, fixed Sassy's poop in a day after the acute diarrhea was gone and the chicken and rice poop was just a bit off. Delicious too!


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## Lippylulu (Nov 11, 2012)

Yes I saw slippery elm in the ingredient list. I know people who take that for IBS and one of the possible diagnoses for my dog is/was IBS. I have already lowered the amount by a tiny bit of Perfect Form that I am giving him. I don't know if giving slippery elm uin Perfect Form is such a terrible thing on a long term basis but certainly I would like to cut it out eventually if I can since he doesn't like it. Also, I wouldn't know how much probiotic to give him.


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## Zilla (May 11, 2013)

Lippylulu said:


> Yes I saw slippery elm in the ingredient list. I know people who take that for IBS and one of the possible diagnoses for my dog is/was IBS. I have already lowered the amount by a tiny bit of Perfect Form that I am giving him. I don't know if giving slippery elm uin Perfect Form is such a terrible thing on a long term basis but certainly I would like to cut it out eventually if I can since he doesn't like it. Also, I wouldn't know how much probiotic to give him.


These are the ones my vet recommended to me. It's just one capsule sprinkled on food once a day for dogs up to 40 lbs. If they are over that then it's 2 capsules. 
http://www.vetdepot.com/vetri-mega-probiotic-120-capsules.html


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