# Best resources to learn about NADAC agility?



## Canyx (Jul 1, 2011)

I know there will be mixed feelings on this, but I'm slated to teach some agility courses a few months down the line. I work in a privately funded shelter so our budget is small (read: nonexistent) though we already have a nice small set of equipment (one tunnel, one iffy frame, one set of 8 weave poles, a few jumps, a few hoops). This is geared purely toward people who want to try something fun with their dog. There is a more performance/sport oriented training organization in town who we have a great relationship with and although we never try to turn people away from our courses, we do make it known that they have more agility and more of a competition approach when it comes to teaching it. Here, we strive to make our courses affordable and accessible. 

With that in mind, the previous instructor was someone who competed in NADAC since she was a wee girl and is seriously impressive with her border collie. I know distance is the thing in NADAC and when she demoed with her dog she pretty much stood in the same place and directed her dog through the entire course. Really cool. She wrote the course for the shelter. Beginner Agility here is pretty straightforward... Learn about different obstacles and turns. Alright, I can do that. Apparently we also want to offer Agility II. The previous instructor also wrote a course for that which I need to hunt down. But the conversation pretty much went with me saying "I guess I need to learn about NADAC!" And my boss saying, "I guess you should!" 
I have taken 1.5 agility courses ~8 years ago with Soro and it was AKC. I know some turns and can have Soro run a full course with pretty fair confidence. But I would like to better myself before jumping into teaching it and I have a few months to do so. Having seen the course taught, I do want to change a couple of things going into it. I know I have written about this in the past but in a nutshell, I want dogs offleash and I want people to not have lures dangling from their hands the entire time. 

Looking for resources that are simple and sufficient. Thanks in advance!


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

I don't know that there's an easy comprehensive overview out there. 

http://www.nadac.com/ and http://nadacforum.com/ are pretty good for answering questions - I will say there is a habit to change things frequently and often the handbook isn't always updated on time. 

I will say that the differences are a wee bit pervasive and give you what I've got.

NADAC weave base is 2". Contacts cannot be slatted and must be rubberized and they only allow 2 suppliers/materials for the surfacing if you're in a sanctioned event). No wings on jumps. There is no chute, tire, or teeter - or double or broad jumps, actually. There are no backsides; dog always takes the obstacle from the direction of their path. So you'll have serps but no treadles or any kind of wraps to backsides. Hoops. Barrels. Hoops ON barrels (either side - sometimes you hit both, sometimes just one, missing one is the same as a dropped bar). Barrels are sometimes bidirectional (take your pick) and must sometimes be done one direction or the other. No tugging into, out of, or within 10 feet of the ring. You can carry food into the ring in your pocket but not indicate to the dog that you have it or feed within 10 feet of the ring.

And the games are just nutty, but fun.

(And distance IS big, as is speed - those are NADACs emphasis, BUT you do not have to be running bonus box stuff (staying in one place) on most courses or to be successful - however Chances IS a distance game and IS required for NATCH)


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Oh and maybe actually useful for teaching:

Discriminations are enormous. They are present on almost every course at every level, usually in the form of a contact obstacle (dog walk or a-frame) with a tunnel. If you can't get those you're going NOWHERE.


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## Canyx (Jul 1, 2011)

Thanks a ton CptJack! Gotta say, reading your first post is kind of like reading a different language right now. I am thankful I have some time to learn a bit. Seeing if there are any trials near me that I can attend and such...


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Finding a trial to attend is a good idea. That will give you lots and lots of insight. It is pretty danged different, and is definitely it's own 'language' so to speak. 

I think I, and Lola's owner, are the only two people who compete in NADAC on DF. I think Laurelin might have done some, but I'm not sure.


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## Canyx (Jul 1, 2011)

Shoot, and here I thought everyone on DF did! What does Skye's person do then? Maybe she'll chime in too


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

I think she does AKC and CPE!


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Oh wait, Sibe! Sibe does NADAC!


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## kadylady (Sep 23, 2010)

Canyx said:


> Shoot, and here I thought everyone on DF did! What does Skye's person do then? Maybe she'll chime in too


Haha yeah sorry, no NADAC help from me! I have only done AKC and CPE. I do teach agility classes, both for competition and just for fun. In my just for fun classes I use the CPE games classes on the last class of my sessions as a fun last night, put all your skills into practice and play some games type of class. It's fun and everyone enjoys it. Sorry I can't be more helpful in the NADAC department! But I will second going to a trial. You learn sooooo much watching trials.


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## Kyllobernese (Feb 5, 2008)

I have always thought that NADAC looked interesting but the only trials held in it are on Vancouver Island which means an expensive ferry ride plus a six hour drive to and from the ferry. I just compete in AAC with Remmy but may try CKC as well with Kris as she is registered with them whereas Remmy isn't as he would have to be neutered and don't wish to do that as it is no problem competing with him in AAC as he is.

Our first trial of the year is this coming weekend. Have Remmy entered in Steeplechase for the first time, plus Advanced Snooker, and Master Jumpers and Master Standard. Three classes each day. Decided not to take Kris as we will be staying in a Motel and it is an indoor trial. Much easier with the two dogs at the rest of the trials which are outdoors and we camp in our RV.


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## elrohwen (Nov 10, 2011)

This is not what you were asking for, but I don't think you need to worry that much. Agility fundamentals are agility fundamentals. Training contacts and teeter skills and front/rear crosses is going to be the same.

ETA: Whoops, my brain was thinking USDAA.

I found this and it has some good info. http://www.chronofhorse.com/forum/s...PE-vs-NADAC-vs-AKC-help-for-an-agility-newbie


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

There is no table in NADAC at all. 

There isn't a teeter, tire, chute, wings on jumps, broad jumps, or wall jumps either. 

There are barrels and hoops with performance criteria - and those obstacles don't exist anywhere else. 

NADAC requires you do distance work to get a NATCH, something AKC doesn't. 

NADAC doesn't require backsides, ever. 

NADAC doesn't require/judge the up contact, just the down one.

That said, the very basic foundations are the same and our actual classes through intermediate are universal for AKC or NADAC. We introduce the obstacles (across both venues), teach the sends, the crosses are MOSTLY the same but there's much more emphasis on tandem turns, and it's pretty much good to go.


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## elrohwen (Nov 10, 2011)

CptJack said:


> There is no table in NADAC at all.
> 
> There isn't a teeter, tire, chute, wings on jumps, broad jumps, or wall jumps either.
> 
> ...


I know, read my edit. I'm having a bad day and my brain is not working. I was thinking USDAA.

ETA: I still think that for basic level classes, especially "for fun" type classes, it really doesn't matter that much.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

elrohwen said:


> I know, read my edit. I'm having a bad day and my brain is not working. I was thinking USDAA.


Whoops, sorry!

You're not wrong about the foundations/basics, though. You still need down contact criteria, sends, and the basic crosses across both!


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## elrohwen (Nov 10, 2011)

CptJack said:


> Whoops, sorry!
> 
> You're not wrong about the foundations/basics, though. You still need down contact criteria, sends, and the basic crosses across both!


Yeah, crappy morning. My brain was like "Oh, 5 letter acronym!" and then completely stopped reading. LOL


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## elrohwen (Nov 10, 2011)

So NADAC doesn't include a teeter either? I saw that while poking around online. Not sure if we really have NADAC around here, but maybe that would be an option for Watson in the future. 

Still, if I were teaching a basics class I would include some teeter foundations too, and possibly a table just because it's a nice easy thing to shape and train for beginners with less risk for green dogs than the other contact obstacles (it's the first obstacle we did in Hazel's class, and I think the only one in 6 weeks of beginner classes). If people do want to go on to compete they may not stick with NADAC.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

elrohwen said:


> So NADAC doesn't include a teeter either? I saw that while poking around online. Not sure if we really have NADAC around here, but maybe that would be an option for Watson in the future.
> 
> Still, if I were teaching a basics class I would include some teeter foundations too, and possibly a table just because it's a nice easy thing to shape and train for beginners with less risk for green dogs than the other contact obstacles (it's the first obstacle we did in Hazel's class, and I think the only one in 6 weeks of beginner classes). If people do want to go on to compete they may not stick with NADAC.


Nope, no teeter. Definitely an option for dogs who don't like it. 

Our classes absolutely taught the teether/tire/chute, as well as using barrels for sends and distance and hoops for ground work. It meant the dogs coming out of those classes were familiar with everything and could go anywhere. I am pretty sure Kylie could, with refreshing on obstacles she hasn't seen since class, go play AKC without too much trouble. That's a good thing.

NADAC's a lot of fun. I know a ton of people hate it for a lot of reasons (teaching the dogs to run in full extension, not being able to tug out of the ring (or in it), weird equipment, not seeing it as technical enough, hating the YPS requirements or distance challenges or difficult discriminations - just reasons). I also know a lot of clubs don't offer it because it requires different equipment (not just in the stuff they have that AKC doesn't - hoops and barrels are cheap as chips, but the weave base and contact surfacing are different too), but I like it. 

I also like that you can run a course of nothing but jumps, or nothing but tunnels, or a course without any weaves at all, in their various games. It's just fun.


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## Canyx (Jul 1, 2011)

Looking at what's offered around here, it seems like all NADAC all the time!
Thanks for your input everyone!


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