# Dog growling at reflection on the oven



## Veronis (Oct 30, 2010)

Our oven is black and is somewhat reflective on the front of the door. Nero (5 month old catahoula/beagle/harrier/german shepherd mix) has lived with us for two months now and just yesterday has started growling at his reflection in it. He also growled at his reflection in the glass door of the entertainment center a few times.

We try to redirect him away from it, and it generally works, but I don't know if this is the right approach. He hasn't done so at all yet today, but did it quite a bit yesterday. He even growled in his sleep when he went to bed, probably dreaming about his reflection. 

He isn't aggressive (he loves meeting other dogs and people) and only barks/growls at things out the window that he perceives as a threat (e.g. other dogs, people he perceives as unknown/shady). We go check it out and say "I got it", then redirect him, and praise him after the redirect, for letting us know there was something going on outside.

He does seem to be getting territorial/protective of his turf (the barking/growling at things outside started about a month ago), which is the catahoula and I suppose the shepherd in him.

Is this something to be concerned about?


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## sassafras (Jun 22, 2010)

Pip does that sometimes if he sees his reflection in a glass door or something. I usually casually walk over to the door and calmly hang out there for a minute, touch it a couple of times, and walk away without making a huge deal about it. Now that he knows "touch" as a command, I can also follow up with having him touch my hand near the surface. He seems to forget about it pretty quickly, it's mostly if it takes him by surprise, I think.

I don't know that it will be a problem in general. I've never been that worried about it.


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## RedyreRottweilers (Dec 17, 2006)

smear peanut butter on both things for a couple days and let him lick it off. Lots of dogs are disconcerted by reflections.


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

> Lots of dogs are disconcerted by reflections.


This  Dogs do not have a "sense of self" like we do, meaning the dog does not realize that he's looking at himself, and not some strange dog.


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## KBLover (Sep 9, 2008)

I wonder why Wally doesn't bark at his reflection? He doesn't give it the time of day.

I actually want to see him do it. He'll bark at dogs on tv and dogs on youtube and on my monitor, but the reflection? Nothing.

Wonder why?

One time, I swear he was looking at MY reflection like he was looking at me. That would be a bit freaky.


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## Stephie (Apr 29, 2010)

My Rocky does the same thing, except with the fireplace at my parent's house. It is a gas fireplace with the glass covering. Between the crackling he hears as it heats up and the fact that he sees "a dog in the fireplace", he goes crazy sometimes when we turn it on. However, Rocky (while I love him dearly, and wouldn't trade him for the world) is my neurotic dog, and barks at pretty much everything that moves, so it's not just in this situation.

Dakota, on the other hand, will bark at people/animals outside the house. He has grown very protective with age. I do believe that it is breed characteristic for some, just monitor for aggression because you don't want it to get out of hand.

I think you're doing a good job with the distraction idea. Good luck!


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## tweet12 (Jan 8, 2011)

It is natural for dogs to bark at strangers or noises outside but with the reflection, you should redirect him without looking him in the eye and give a solid 'No'. If it doesn't bother you then it really isn't a big deal unless he starts getting aggressive. If you do want to stop him from barking then don't praise him once he comes to you and has stopped barking, he takes that as you praising him for barking and he's going to keep doing it. If you don't tell him what he can't do then he won't know what to do. Positive reinforcement works occasionally but you need to take control.


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## TStafford (Dec 23, 2009)

Xeph said:


> This  Dogs do not have a "sense of self" like we do, meaning the dog does not realize that he's looking at himself, and not some strange dog.


Not only that, but it's also another dog that he can't smell to get a feel for it.


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## kafkabeetle (Dec 4, 2009)

tweet12 said:


> It is natural for dogs to bark at strangers or noises outside but with the reflection, you should redirect him without looking him in the eye and give a solid 'No'. If it doesn't bother you then it really isn't a big deal unless he starts getting aggressive. If you do want to stop him from barking then don't praise him and you tell him to stop and he stops. He takes that as okay she's praising me because I took care of the house and I'm gonna keep doing it.


I don't think saying no would be helpful, since it's anxiety at his reflection that he's reacting to, not "misbehavior". Plus I don't really like no commands anyway--you should emphasize what you want your dog to *do* not what he shouldn't do. Finally, teaching a dog not to growl even when they feel they should is a bad idea because it takes away part of their communication to you and can lead to an unpredictable dog. Growling it itself is not really an issue, just a part of the dog vocabulary indicating anxiety, fear, aggression, discomfort etc, depending on the circumstance.

Like other people have said, just showing him there's nothing to worry about by acting calm and touching the surface should work fine, no firm corrections necessary, IMO.


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## tweet12 (Jan 8, 2011)

kafkabeetle said:


> I don't think saying no would be helpful, since it's anxiety at his reflection that he's reacting to, not "misbehavior". Plus I don't really like no commands anyway--you should emphasize what you want your dog to *do* not what he shouldn't do. Finally, teaching a dog not to growl even when they feel they should is a bad idea because it takes away part of their communication to you and can lead to an unpredictable dog. Growling it itself is not really an issue, just a part of the dog vocabulary indicating anxiety, fear, aggression, discomfort etc, depending on the circumstance.
> 
> Like other people have said, just showing him there's nothing to worry about by acting calm and touching the surface should work fine, no firm corrections necessary, IMO.



You seem to be one of the positive reinforcement people, and look I do that too but they need to know that they are dogs and you are a person.


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## RedyreRottweilers (Dec 17, 2006)

tweet12 said:


> You seem to be one of the positive reinforcement people, and look I do that too but they need to know that they are dogs and you are a person. They are not your baby they are part of your pack and if you don't show the dog that, then he is going to be emotionally unstable for as long as you have him. No matter how many cuddles you give him or treats and pretty clothes for him he is going to be unhappy and it's you making him that way. He needs commands and to know that you are the pack leader and you're going to take care of him instead of him having the pressure of being the leader by himself. Once you learn to step up and accept that your dog is unhappy and start showing him that you're controlling the show you will finally have a happy and balanced dog. Good Luck.


This is ridiculous. You have watched way too much Cesar Milan. I breed, train, and exhibit large working breed dogs. Force and punishment is not necessary. In particular, force and NR in an anxiety situation will often cause it to worsen or escalate.

Dogs quickly learn to work to get their rewards, same as they work to avoid PUNISHMENT, except it makes for a lot happier and more trusting relationship.


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## KBLover (Sep 9, 2008)

tweet12 said:


> You seem to be one of the positive reinforcement people, and look I do that too but they need to know that they are dogs and you are a person. They are not your baby they are part of your pack and if you don't show the dog that, then he is going to be emotionally unstable for as long as you have him. No matter how many cuddles you give him or treats and pretty clothes for him he is going to be unhappy and it's you making him that way. He needs commands and to know that you are the pack leader and you're going to take care of him instead of him having the pressure of being the leader by himself. Once you learn to step up and accept that your dog is unhappy and start showing him that you're controlling the show you will finally have a happy and balanced dog. Good Luck.



It really depends on why the dog is barking at the reflection. If it's an operant choice (i.e. the dog is making a rational decision on the situation and then choosing a behavior) then a command will be effective for the issue. You'd be teaching the dog to choose a new behavior. 

If it's an emotional response to a trigger (such as in a reactive or fearful dog), then that's not going to be completely effective. Yes, you'll redirect the behavior (assuming the dog is not overthreshold to where any rational thought is overwhelmed by the intensity of the emotional state), but in this case, the behavior is just outward sign of an internal emotional state. To change the emotional state, commands don't do it. 

Using classical conditioning will help with an emotional trigger. 

After all, being a good leader is more than just barking out commands. Even in packs, the leader isn't barking at the other dogs at what to do, he leads by being CALM in an anxious situation. Since he's the most stable energy, the others will be drawn to him because they are seeking stability. If the leader isn't worried, why would the followers be worried? 

You might look down on being calm in situations that make dogs anxious, but I know it helped my dog get over his fear issues. Sure, I gave him behavior I'd want him to do for his own safety and to allow me to full focus on assessing the situation instead of worrying about what he's getting into, but I also was calm and stable in the situation. The command also didn't make him not be scared of whatever situation we were in, it just kept him from bolting or attacking in defense. To correct the true issue, I needed to work on the emotional association, not just his operant choices.

It has nothing to do with "being one of those positive reinforcement people", it's separating emotional energy from rational choice and working on each individually.


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## kafkabeetle (Dec 4, 2009)

Tweet, I really don't even know how to respond to such an uninformed opinion. I just suggest you read the two above posts. Those folks know what they're talking about, and they have results to back them up, not just outdated dog rhetoric. I find the fact that you compared my suggestion to dressing a dog up pretty insulting, actually. Not even related to my statements at all, lmao.


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