# Food Aggression toward Other Dogs



## lisazartsi (Nov 30, 2021)

A couple months ago my boyfriend and I adopted a wonderful shepherd mix named Veera off the streets of Manitoba. We don't know much about her past, but based on my observations, it is quite evident that she used to have to fight other dogs for food while she lived on the streets. As she would've been quite small during this time, she likely lost most of her battles for food.

Veera lives at our home and she is the only dog here. She has no issues sharing her food with people and shows no aggression toward humans ever (so far). She LOVES other dogs. We often go to visit my mother and her three dogs for socialization and training practice. She gets along with them well, although the one sheltie doesn't like her much and has acted a bit aggressive toward her on a couple occasions.

Twice now during feeding time at my mother's house has Veera become aggressive and tried to attack the sheltie who she has less of a relationship with. The most recent time she grabbed him by the scruff of his neck and attempted to shake him. She didn't want to let him go... It was horrifying  

I am sure that this behaviour is triggered from Veera's past, and I know a solution would be to feed her and keep her food in a room separated from the other dogs, but I am wondering if there is a safe way to train her out of this behaviour? She is highly intelligent and eager to learn, but I don't want to put any other dogs at risk by working on this training. 

While I have grown up with many dogs my whole life and am an experienced dog owner, Veera is my first rescue and this is beyond my realm of expertise. I would love to hear what others have gone through and if anyone has any advice for me! <3


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## Khecha Wacipi (Oct 10, 2021)

Good for you for adopting a dog in need.

there may be a way in which Veera comes to accept that sheltie in the future. but you cannot make one dog like another any more than you can with people. Grabbing by the neck, shaking, and not wanting to let go means the dog is essentially telling the other dog "I want to kill you". It is to be taken very seriously.

I would completely keep these two dogs apart unless you are there, the owner of the sheltie is there, and both dogs are kept on leash, and keep those encounters to only when necessary. 

I don't know of any training you can or even should do at this point to change things. Part of the issue is that the dog is very new in your home and is still trying to adjust to the new and very different environment. she needs time to settle in, and during that time I think it would be best if she doesn't have to see a dog that she has taken a dislike to. I would just not take her over to your Mom's if I were you.

If for some reason it is necessary to take her over there, at the very least feed them in separate rooms with doors closed between them so they do not see each other. 

Once your dog has has another two to three months to settle in and relax a bit and feel at home, you could try having an on-leash meet with the sheltie. But I think ever into the future they will need to be completely separated at meal time.


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## Poppy14 (Apr 13, 2017)

Absolutely feed in a separate room and keep the food up as well.

This is largely a pick your battles type of situation - it is not a particularly difficult thing to do to give a dog solitude when eating, and many dogs absolutely appreciate it, whether they have shown severe resource guarding like this or not. 

Resource guarding is absolutely a serious issue, and a very scary one! I got my current dog at 8ish weeks old and he was also a very severe resource guarder towards other animals with food (or sometimes toys). I absolutely wanted it to just go away. But honestly, resource guarding is totally natural, just not usually that alarming. And just feeding my boy, who also had to compete for food in his previous home, separate from everyone else cut the guarding way down. He still mostly eats by himself and I pick the dish up when he's not eating, but he can now eat near another animal if he needed to and he will show warning signs when he is uncomfortable, which he never did before.


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## 3GSD4IPO (Jun 8, 2016)

I NEVER feed dogs next to each other unless they are in outdoor kennels where there isn't much choice. Then I feed them as far apart as possible.

It is unlikely this dog's past has anything to do with this behavior. 

When I had two dogs they were fed out of sight of each other EVERY feeding. Actually on separate floors and confined. 

There is no need to bother a dog when it's eating. Do not put hands in dishes or take food away. LEAVE DOGS ALONE WHEN EATING (I can still hear my Mother saying this in all caps and she was RIGHT).


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## DaySleepers (Apr 9, 2011)

You can work on improving resource guarding, but it's far more difficult to resolve dog-dog resource guarding than dog-human resource guarding. Additionally, your goal should NOT be to have these dogs eating together regularly - that is far too big of a risk to the sheltie's life. Instead, it would be more to mitigate a dangerous scenario where, for example, someone accidentally dropped a high-value food item while both dogs were loose together. Ideally you'll be managing them so that they're not loose together when people are eating or handling food, to prevent this from happening, but it's good to be prepared if something unexpected happens!

The book Mine! by Jean Donaldson is a good, solid resource for learning about resource guarding and how to work with it. It focuses mostly on resource guarding directed towards humans, but I still think there's lots of valuable information that could help you out. There's also the booklet Feeling Outnumbered? written by Karen London and Patricia McConnell, which focuses on troubleshooting issues in a multi-dog household. It might be less relevant for you since this is only an issue when you're visiting somewhere else, but I thought I'd throw it out there.

You can, of course, look for a behaviorist in your area who is experienced with resource guarding issues, and try to work with them. Just be picky about who you hire if you go this route - 'canine behaviorist' isn't a protected title, so anyone can legally call themselves that regardless of their education or experience. Look for someone with a third party certification from a reputable organization like the International Association of Animal Behaviorists or the Certification Council for Professional Dog Trainers. You want someone who's up to date on current research about dog behavior and uses force-free methods like counter conditioning to work on the issue, not fear, force, or intimidation. Run away from anyone making grand, too-good-to-be-true promises about 100% fixing the issue and the GSD and sheltie being able to eat from the same bowl after training - these kinds of trainers get dogs killed in the name of their sales pitch.


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## Khecha Wacipi (Oct 10, 2021)

3GSD4IPO said:


> I NEVER feed dogs next to each other unless they are in outdoor kennels where there isn't much choice. Then I feed them as far apart as possible.


I should have mentioned this myself.
No matter who my dogs are, how long they've lived together, how perfectly they get along, I always without fail make sure they are fed in separate places. Even if we are in a motel room, one gets fed in the bathroom and one in the main room. It's just more polite for the dogs and of course completely avoids any situation in which there would be a guarding response.


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## Toedtoes (Sep 25, 2021)

In this situation, I agree that your dog should be fed separately from your mom's dogs. It's very difficult to overcome any food aggression when she is "randomly" plopped into a living situation with other dogs. 

I would focus on lowering the resource guarding in general at home. @DaySleepers has provided some helpful books. While doing that, remove food from the scenario whenever you visit your mom. When there, I would ask a trainer or behaviorist to come and evaluate the dogs to determine how to proceed.

I don't think this is a "no way they can ever be together" scenario. I think it does need an in-person evaluation to determine the real issue. It may not be as difficult as suggested. The important thing is to get qualified help before trying to work it out. And don't assume that because the shepherd attacked that the shepherd was the instigator. The sheltie, or even one of the other dogs, may very easily have been the "problem" and the shepherd just "vented" on the sheltie. You need to have all the dogs evaluated as a group.

Until you get someone to help, I would absolutely use leashes and separation. Remove all food (including chews) from the situation. Learn to read the dog. There is an app called "dog decoder" (dogdecoder.com) that is a great way to learn how to read your dog, as well as other dogs. If you see any sign of distress (eg, anxiety, fear, anger, etc), separate the dogs. You may also want to give your dog an occasional time out throughout the day so she can recoup. It very likely is stressful for her to be suddenly in a small space with multiple dogs - so giving her a frequent break (have someone go with her so it isn't a "punishment" in her view) can be very therapeutic.

For me, the cost of a professional and the work involved would be well worth the not having to "not visit" or always keep the dogs separated.


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## 3GSD4IPO (Jun 8, 2016)

There is another option.. board your dog or get a pet sitter for your dog and not bring your dog on these visits.


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## Toedtoes (Sep 25, 2021)

True. In this case, I would do a pet sitter rather than boarding. If the dog is anxious in a mult-dog setting , a boarding facility could very easily make it worse. And while the dogs are (should under all circumstances) separate, often it is by a chain link fence - which allows the dogs to see each other which can again increase the anxiety, especially during feeding.


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## 3GSD4IPO (Jun 8, 2016)

A good boarding facility will have half height "fight barriers" along part of the kennel runs (usually the inside part of the run) so the dog can escape the multi fog kennel environment and eat food w/o seeing other dogs. 

Every puppy I get I board at a good kennel when they are 6 months old just to show them this. It gives the dog that experience should "something" happen (natural disaster, escape and picked up by animal control etc.) and they end up in that situation. Because I come get them at the end it also shows them I will be back.


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## Khecha Wacipi (Oct 10, 2021)

3GSD4IPO said:


> A good boarding facility will have half height "fight barriers" along part of the kennel runs (usually the inside part of the run) so the dog can escape the multi fog kennel environment and eat food w/o seeing other dogs.
> 
> Every puppy I get I board at a good kennel when they are 6 months old just to show them this. It gives the dog that experience should "something" happen (natural disaster, escape and picked up by animal control etc.) and they end up in that situation. Because I come get them at the end it also shows them I will be back.


I like your reasoning on this, but I also question it. This would work if the emergency came soon after the initial boarding and the dog was boarded in the same facility. But since dogs do not generalize well, if it were a different facility (something over which you might not have control) then I don't think it would make much difference. Or, if the dog were boarded at age one and then needed to be boarded again 7 years later, would the dog remember, even if it were in the same facility.
Do you have experience with these scenarios? I am only curious. As I say, the concept is good, just like exposing puppies to different things. But does it work in real life?


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## 3GSD4IPO (Jun 8, 2016)

Khecha Wacipi said:


> I like your reasoning on this, but I also question it. This would work if the emergency came soon after the initial boarding and the dog was boarded in the same facility. But since dogs do not generalize well, if it were a different facility (something over which you might not have control) then I don't think it would make much difference. Or, if the dog were boarded at age one and then needed to be boarded again 7 years later, would the dog remember, even if it were in the same facility.
> Do you have experience with these scenarios? I am only curious. As I say, the concept is good, just like exposing puppies to different things. But does it work in real life?


It has worked for me. There were two kennels I used. One was smaller than the other. The larger one had "fight barriers" or "privacy panels." The large place would take a bitch in heat (they bred and showed conformation in AKC). The smaller place also bred and had working Border Collies and sheep. 

A THIRD place was the breeder of my current dog.

All my dogs were at one of these for 3 days at around 6 months old. The net result is they were GREAT when they had to be boarded later in life for a variety of reasons. 

One dog was a very nervy Show Line GSD. One was a working line bitch who had a bit more defense drive than is ideal. The third was my current dog who is the poster child for confident and clear with a lot of drive, but in balance. 

When my current dog had to be boarded while I recovered from hip replacement he was at his breeder. She takes dogs out and walks them AND adds in some training. She sent videos. He had the best time (especially the protection work!). 

We have gone back there several times to train. He is always excited to be there. He recognizes his breeder. His littermates are also often there as well.. they all look at each other like "You look strangely familiar." A VERY good breeder and a very special place. 

That sums up my experience.


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## Toedtoes (Sep 25, 2021)

I definitely agree that a kennel stay or two as a puppy or young dog can set the groundwork for making future stays unstressful and a great socialization practice. But for dogs who have already developed anxiety issues, especially dog related ones, a kennel stay may very possibly make things far worse.


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## Jack Naylor (Dec 27, 2021)

I have the opposite problem, my dogs insist on eating out of the same bowls. When new dog arrived I put old dog bowl in the foyer and new dog in the kitchen ....new dog followed me into the kitchen, I put the bowl down,she sniffed and looked up to me as if saying "this doesn't look really exciting, let me go and see what old dog is eating." She ran off and was at old dog's bowl before I had finished standing up. Ran after expecting a potential broohaha and old dog just backed up a step and let new dog eat. New dog took a few sniffs as if "This is not my regular food" , went downstairs and laid down. So, I tried putting the 2 bowls 4 feet apart ...still, they both ate outta 1 ... finish it off by mid day (they are both grazers) and by about 3 pm,they start on bowl 2. back in the kitchen went the 2nd bowl, and at a bit over 2 weeks in and, they both finish the bowl in the foyer ... and later on they will work on the kitchen bowl. A lot of this comes from how old dog was raised

Old dog was under weight when we got her so food was always there .... often when we woke up, food was still there from previous day. So it's not a big thing for her....she knows she never goes w/o food. We never had a need her against resource guarding because she has the gentlest mouth if any dog we've owned. She's so cautious, it's hard to get here to take treats from your hand. You could put a steak in her mouth and take it away without resistance. Right from the getgo, after filling the bowl w/kibble we'd take away and add "toppings". And she was a very young dog about 19 months.

Lot of questions here as *we don't know the ages and relative size of the dogs*. The older a dog is the more resistant they are to training. This is something you might try. When I worked with security dogs, who were eventually going to share a confined space I did this and carried it over to my own pets and other families pets. With just 1 dog around .... put down a "light" (maybe 1/3 to1/2 what a daily amount is) bowl of food, when they finish (and this works even with dogs reactive to people too) pick up the empty bowl where there's nothing to guard and provide more food. Continue to do this until the dog walks away leaving a bit in the bowl. Pick it up, shake the bowl a bit put it back down. Teach the dog that food is a "renewable resources" and that there's no reason to guard. This will be tough w/ a dog that grew up fighting for food.

I'd start by continuing the visits with the dogs separated by a gate. I do this with doing behavior modification for prey drive with dogs and cats. Proceed no further until they have absolutely no reaction to each other while one or both are being fed, receiving attention or being fed. At some point, let the reactive dog eat their full such that he / she leaves some food in the bowl ...now bring the "We're friends but not at mealtime" dog into the picture.... and feed a "short" bowl with the 2 dogs separated by a gate, leashes or whatever suffices that both owners can kep the dogs apart and under ABSOLUTE full control. Let her finish; try soothing the reactive dog outside the gate if any negative behaviors appear, scold if it gets outta hand .... remove the new dog who just emptied the bowl from the immediate area, grab a scoop of dog food, let old dog in and fill the bowl. Rinse and repeat. Not as in over and over again in a single day .... continue the take away and give back with a topping or treat added when at home but repeat when dogs are together. 

Does it work ? Yes, I can say that it's had decent success level . Will it work every time ? with every breed ? with significant size differences ? with significant age differences ? Well, 1st thing I'd say, never tried it with dogs older than 3 years and going in I'd be very cautious about doing so. Also, my experience is anecdotal, it's a small number and limited to a small number of breeds and specific environments.

It worked with the security dogs, it worked with my Dobies, it worked with the labs and it worked with our 2 GSD / Huskies. One of the 1st instances was with a purebred husky when I was about 30, right after an ex got married. I had far better luck with the resource guarding at cat tolerance than I had with recall. But I have had failures too..... some it was obvious early ....others, we thought we were making progress but ultimately gave up.

It is my impression, that the key is, those very 1st steps while dog is young ... well before a 2nd dog was present. You don't have that opportinity here, and the dog may be too set in her behavoior patters to chage. Again, age is key here. When dogs were puppies, I never even bothered with waiting for them to finish before taking the bowl away ...never took it away w/o giving it right back. The above being said, they may never be a time that you can leave these dogs alone. My son's dog is selective reactive to other dogs. Over time, we have been able to make it work.

As silly as it is, our two dogs were eating out of the same bowls for several days when new dog walked by w/ a squeaky toy and old dog went all out hell hound. I opened their Xmas stockings that night and with 6-7 squeaky toys there was no 2nd occurence. The next night, old dog was out on the zip line and while I walked out new dog to mailbox to get the mail...taking is out of sight for about 2-3 minutes. When we walked back, she went into hell hound mode again and had new dog pinned in 2 seconds. Pulled her off and dragging her to the pen, scolding all the way. Made a not to point and speak firmly next day not to be a bad dog. Those incidents occurred between Dec 22 and 24. Today they are inseparable and you can see a video of them playing in a video in the Dog parks Yeay or Nay thread. We have 3 dog beds in the den (one for my son's dog who visits every other weekend) plus the bed in the crate and last night they were huddled together in same bed. 

I must REPEAT, the older a dog is, the harder it is to change behaviors....just like people. Various training techniques may work when they are younger but may never really take when older. Donot undertake any training / behavior modification methods that yu don't feel you can do with _cofsidence_. You must always maintain control of both dogs. While perseverance is important, you must also know when to give up. Every dog's susceptability to behavior modification is different ... every owner's ability to maintain the confidence level and authority is different. If you don't feel you are up to it DO NOT proceed. If you see no change in the dogs tolerance level while in the always on opposoite sdiesof the gate. DO NOT even try taking it further. You have a noble and admirabe goal which will make you and Mom happy if the dogs learn to get along and you allcan share time together. But remember it's not about the hoomans, it's about the dogs.


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## Khecha Wacipi (Oct 10, 2021)

Just a thought --- since the OP initially posted the question a month ago and has not even been back on this thread to reply to any posts, they may not even be reading this.


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