# Questions about experience today with vet clinic



## Great Big Puppy (Dec 16, 2008)

So I went to the vet today to pick up some Heartguard for all three dogs and some mometamax for my one dogs ear. Now this is not the same vet that I originally got the mometamax from, but he is the one we usually use. So he hands me the 5ml bottle of mometamax and the first thing I notice is that there is white out on the side of the bottle, so I look and the Lot # and Expiration date have been whited out. I asked if it was expired and he said “NO, Wouldn’t matter if it was” The guy at the desk tells me if it were him, he wouldn’t use the mometamax because it is so expensive he would use this other stuff which he called Gentamicin (spelling?)but that's not what it really was as it was obviously other ingredients on the box. Buy the way, the stuff he tried to sell me was only 60 cents less than the mometamax. SO, I said NO, I’m going to wait. Then I ask for HEARTGUARD – Everyone has their own opinion about medications but I’ve always used this and never had a problem. So he says Ok, and walks over and pull out a box of Advantage – (may be a better product, I don’t know). I said, no, I use Heartguard. He tells me “We don’t carry it anymore” Heartguard won’t stand behind it. So I left with nothing, went to our NEW VET (as of today) and got both products, not expired and what I am used to using.

I was flabbergasted by this experience with our old vet and was wondering if someone could tell me 1) are there any guidelines for vets selling outdate product or product with lot # and expiration date concealed and 2) is he correct about Heartguard and should I be concerned about this product.


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## briteday (Feb 10, 2007)

As a medical biochemist I can tell you that several years ago the US army did an expiry study on most commonly used meds, a LOT of meds. The Army owns the largest stockpile of medication in the US...to the best of my knowledge. So they have a vested interest in this sort of thing. They discovered that "with a few exceptions" most meds are sufficiently active even 10 years after expiry if stored properly. Always check with a medical / vet professional before using any expired meds as there are exceptions to the rule.

That being said, vets probably get a bottle of Otomax in 100 ml units, for cost sake. And they mix it up, pouring off into "other" bottles for each patient's needs. So the bottle you looked at with white out may not have even been the original bottle. I too, would have no problem using Otomax, even if it was expired as long as you know the vet to be reputable...that they would store things appropriately.

Heartgard/ Heartguard went off patent protection at the end of 2008.Verbac then came up with a generic version of the product called Iverhart. Generally, once a drug (human or vet) goes off patent, the original maufacturer ceases any marketing or other effort to promote or support their product since a much cheaper generic alternative is available. It's a waste of time for Merial, the original makers of Heartgard. And in addition, the active ingredient is commonly known as ivermectin which anyone can easily purchase without a prescription at any feed store and figure out the dosing. It would cost about a dime per dose...It comes in HUGE tubes for cattle and horses...most of these products made by Merial. I buy it as goat SafeGuard and use it to de-worm my dogs and chickens...modifying the dose. It is also known as Panacur which vets routinely use to de-worm dogs.

I have used Advantix for fleas, but heartworm isn't an issue where we live so I don't have experience with Advantage. Our vet sells Interceptor by Novartis. It is a similar drug as ivermectin and if I had a collie I would ask a lot of questions since the two drugs are in the same chemical family (p-glyco protein substrates) and would want more info. But to my knowledge, anyone in my area who travels with their dogs to places with heartworm infections uses Interceptor.

From a customer service viewpoint, the first vet office should have told you up front why the bottle for Otomax was mis-marked. Most offices would scratch out the old expiration info and hand write inthe correct info. And they shouldn't have tried to sell you Advantage when you specifically asked for Heartgard.


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## wabanafcr (Jun 28, 2007)

briteday said:


> And in addition, the active ingredient is commonly known as ivermectin which anyone can easily purchase without a prescription at any feed store and figure out the dosing. It would cost about a dime per dose...It comes in HUGE tubes for cattle and horses...most of these products made by Merial. I buy it as goat SafeGuard and use it to de-worm my dogs and chickens...modifying the dose. It is also known as Panacur which vets routinely use to de-worm dogs.


Panacur is fenbendazole, not ivermectin.
http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_panacur.html


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## briteday (Feb 10, 2007)

wabanafcr said:


> Panacur is fenbendazole, not ivermectin.
> http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_panacur.html


Oh so right! My bad. Panacur and Safe Guard are fenbendazole.


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