# My puppy is viscous as hell.



## Jaegur (Dec 8, 2013)

Ok, so I'm not new to owning dogs. My wife and I rescued two adults, a Lab and a GSD. However, we always had this dream dog of ours, and after buying a house, we arranged to get a puppy. It's a Vlcak. 

So, we brought him home at around 7 weeks. I know, but the breeder was leaving town on a cruise, and then going to mexico so she was having to let them go a week early. 

Ever since we brought him home he's hated being lifted or carried, and already showed signs of food aggression and possessiveness with things he shouldn't have, like socks/underwear he managed to find. 

We've handled the food aggression by hand feeding him every meal, and he's gotten a little better with dropping things. However, he snarls and snaps like a wild animal sometimes, especially if he's chewing on something he's not supposed to and you're trying to take it from him. 

He's not a very affection-seeking dog. He wags his tail, looks all happy, but every time we try to pet him he just wants to mouth, which is fine he's a puppy and we try to correct it with a cloth we got from our trainer. But, it's like we can't even bring him on the bed with us to play because he snaps at our faces and such. I push him away and the little thing literally snarls, bares his teeth, just generally acts like Kujo reborn. 

He only had one other litter mate, so I figure it's a dominance thing. 

Any suggestions? I mean, I know dogs aren't born mean, but it's like no matter what we're doing he's got this streak in him that worries me some.


----------



## chimunga (Aug 29, 2014)

How old is he now, and what breed is he?

The mouthing/snapping thing sounds pretty normal. My pup was like that when he was a baby. It's not a "dominance" thing. Since he only had one littler-mate, and he was left his mom a little earlier than is ideal, he may just have worse manners than the average puppy. When he snaps in your face, he's probably trying to initiate play. What do you do when he snaps at you? Because if you're doing anything other than ignoring, redirecting, or putting him in time out, you're just enforcing his mouthing. Any noise, or wiggling, or scolding or pushing is just going to make him think that you're playing with him. Time-outs were the most effective way for me to get my puppy to stop mouthing. If he put his teeth on me, I'd either remove myself from the room, or put him up for about a minute. No touch, no talk, no eye contact. Then I'd come back, and if he did it again, I'd rinse & repeat. You feel silly leaving the room constantly, or putting him in time-out all the time, but they do get it . It probably took me three days to see small progress, and a month to eliminate it (mostly) completely. 

It's quite a bit harder to get a puppy to stop attacking your face. Honestly, it's mostly just something they grow out of. My dog is nine months old now, and even with consistent work, he didn't stop attacking my face till probably 6-7 months. But the easiest solution is to just not let them have access to your face until they're mature enough. I actually had a thread on it when my pup was going through that phase: http://www.dogforums.com/dog-training-forum/333890-getting-puppy-not-attack.html

And as for the recourse guarding, here's a good video to help with that: 







Just don't assume he's viscous. All puppies are different. That sweet little dog in my signature? He was a holy terror for the first two months I had him. And six months later, I still have scars on my ankles. But with consistency and effort, he turned into a great dog.


----------



## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

I agree, my puppy is a piranha LOL the only thing that makes it bearable is that he has good bite inhibition ... but he is always using his mouth on me, the only reason I allow it is because he doesnt hurt me. The thing that is annoying is EVERYTHING goes into his mouth :/


----------



## Tyler_X (Aug 30, 2014)

My GSD is 7 months old and he still bites me extremely hard, it is cringe worthy painful, (yesterday I was sitting on my couch and he bit my face and gave me a swollen lip)... if you are not able to redirect him or find a constructive way to channel his impulses I would suggest finding a good trainer. Make it get better before it gets worse. Don't get into a pissing contest with your pup, don't give him any reason to harass you further, don't push, hit (not saying you did hit your pup just saying) kick slap etc. I'd keep him tethered throughout the house.


----------



## Jaegur (Dec 8, 2013)

He's a Vlcak, and about 13 weeks old now. Whenever he does anything more than just put his mouth over any part of my skin I say "No Bite" and take myself away from him. He just does what I equate to a shrug and walks away to find something worth destroying, lol. But he is like the only dog I've seen who doesn't like being petted! Even when I was feeding him this morning I stopped and just started trying to pet him, but he just wanted to groan/growl and bite. So then I had my wife pet him while I fed him a few pieces at a time. 

He isn't as bad at this as he was, but when we pick him up he used to snap at our faces, even got my wife good one night. (lots of blood) but he's gotten a little better in that regard. What sucks is I'm gone for the better part of 4 days out of a week, so I'm not sure exactly what happens when I'm not here, though I trust my wife. Maybe we'll try putting him in his kennel for a minute or so at a time when he snarls/bites?


----------



## petpeeve (Jun 10, 2010)

This dog is a wolf hybrid, aka Czechoslovakian Wolfdog. 

Honestly, I don't think anyone here has the experience to advise you safely. And it seems apparent that you can't go it alone. If your breeder is out of town, I would strongly suggest you contact someone else who has extensive knowledge and expertise in the behavioural aspects of raising a hybrid, specifically.


----------



## Tyler_X (Aug 30, 2014)

petpeeve said:


> This dog is a wolf hybrid, aka Czechoslovakian Wolfdog.
> 
> Honestly, I don't think anyone here has the experience to advise you safely. And it seems apparent that you can't go it alone. If your breeder is out of town, I would strongly suggest you contact someone else who has extensive knowledge and expertise in the behavioural aspects of raising a hybrid, specifically.


I don't want to make assumptions but I read that they can be aggressive and are mostly made for guarding purposes...


----------



## Jaegur (Dec 8, 2013)

Oh no, these aren't hybrid dogs. In the 50's they were created using Carpathian wolves and GSDs, but since then the actual wolf content is so low that it isn't considered. They are an AKC recognized breed, and our dog's specific pedigree last had a F5 content in it sometime in the early 90s. 

There aren't many in America, but those in actual service are mostly used for S&R. In the states they are just pets, though they are starting to show up more in the showing circuit. As for aggression, we read up on them for three years before we were able to get one, and I've never heard of one being just aggressive for the sake of being aggressive, which is why my pup worries me a little.


----------



## Tyler_X (Aug 30, 2014)

Your pup is only going to get bigger and stronger, and based on what you said, i think you should find a trainer and nip this in the bud now.


----------



## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

Jaegur said:


> Oh no, these aren't hybrid dogs. In the 50's they were created using Carpathian wolves and GSDs, but since then the actual wolf content is so low that it isn't considered. They are an AKC recognized breed, and our dog's specific pedigree last had a F5 content in it sometime in the early 90s.
> 
> There aren't many in America, but those in actual service are mostly used for S&R. In the states they are just pets, though they are starting to show up more in the showing circuit. As for aggression, we read up on them for three years before we were able to get one, and I've never heard of one being just aggressive for the sake of being aggressive, which is why my pup worries me a little.


pushing is never a good thing on any animal, it illicit s fighting more then it teaches retreating.. "that I would reconsider in how your handling things" don't back an animal,, bring them forward and pass you to change what is going on.. Think of bull fighter move... .. Not sure what your using the rag you mentioned for. 

They did say the breed wasn't a barker that they growl and grunt to communicate.. Your breeder going on a cruise before the puppy had the best start doesn't say much positive about the breeding program she is running. Agree a mentioned above to find a community that works with the breed and hear their experiences in raising this breed from puppy hood.. Beautiful dog, do hope everything works out...


----------



## petpeeve (Jun 10, 2010)

You say you already have a trainer. If your trainer can't cut it I would look for one who can.

Safe to say I know absolutely nothing about Vlcak as a breed. Although, I would think they'll respond better to R+ training than anything else. I certainly would NOT use dominance methods and punishment as a starting point. My limited understanding is that they are an intense working dog who needs a LOT of motivation. Personally, I'd ditch the entire dominance mindset, the cloth (whatever that is?) and try more conventional methods like those typically used to help you counter the current RGing and such. From the sounds of it I'd probably ditch the trainer too, like I said, but that's just me.


----------



## Jaegur (Dec 8, 2013)

I think we're going to try the time out method next. The rag was mainly for when he's trying bite you take your hand away and offer the cloth.

Thanks for all the advice!


----------



## sassafras (Jun 22, 2010)

Some breeds are mouthy and clacky/snappy. With GSD in the mix I'm not surprised he's a little landshark. 

Trade for things he has instead of taking them away, and work on a LOT of impulse control, "leave it," and "drop." Search for "It's Yer Choice" on YouTube for a great impulse control game. The video linked above is good for resource guarding.

In the meantime, get in the habit of carrying around a tug or something else he CAN bite for when he gets snappy, especially for times you know he is likely to get crazy. Interrupt, redirect. It will take time, a lot of time. But he's not being vicious necessarily, he's just doing what his brain is programmed to do. I can empathize, I have a malinois puppy and I was prepared ahead of time for the mouthiness but... holy cow, SO mouthy.


----------



## Tyler_X (Aug 30, 2014)

From my experience timeout doesn't work once your pup reaches a certain size, I can't put my pup in timeout like I used to when he would bite me, and thats what the trainer told me to do. I know dogs are different sizes but mine is tall enough to hop over the gates as he pleases, even when I enforced it as a boundary.


----------



## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Tyler_X said:


> From my experience timeout doesn't work once your pup reaches a certain size, I can't put my pup in timeout like I used to when he would bite me, and thats what the trainer told me to do. I know dogs are different sizes but mine is tall enough to hop over the gates as he pleases, even when I enforced it as a boundary.


Bathroom or bedroom. Close a door. 

No, it won't work for all days but it's my default when Thud was a jerk. Well, that or using his crate. Babygates never worked for that dog.


----------



## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

Jaegur said:


> I think we're going to try the time out method next. The rag was mainly for when he's trying bite you take your hand away and offer the cloth.
> 
> Thanks for all the advice!


do feel that is the best first approach when your starting with an easily excitable, or easily defensive aggravated animal ,, you work towards not escalating, don't engage in any activities that get them riled up. (this is not a forever don't touch or play with your puppy) it's about right now working towards teaching calming still interaction. Puppy don't like to be picked up put on the bed.. Don't do it for right now .. Be a boring person for right now to get you pup to follow the environment structure.. Once you get through this rough start, and make the opportunity for the pup to learn calm interaction with you and around you in a calm environment.. You being calm unexciting person, and your environment being a calm unexciting place to live.. the pup has nothing to react to, to calm down and learn by doing and living calm. Takes time to undo what they have developed.. stick with it. focus on daily routine of needs.. that is all the pup needs to learn right now.


----------



## Tyler_X (Aug 30, 2014)

CptJack said:


> Bathroom or bedroom. Close a door.
> 
> No, it won't work for all days but it's my default when Thud was a jerk. Well, that or using his crate. Babygates never worked for that dog.


my dog knows how to open my living room door and the bathroom door,lol he jumps up and when his paws go down it turns the handle downard and he pushes it open


----------



## Jaegur (Dec 8, 2013)

Yeah, we were prepared for the mouthyness and him destroying things (he seems to have teeth for feet) but it's just the snarling and such that we weren't expecting. Our GSD just turned two and we've had her since October, so the mouthiness we expected. I'll work to not do anything that gets him riled up. He did manage to follow me into the bathroom and grab something out of the trash can. I didn't have anything to redirect, so I just grabbed it and growled at him >> He let go, but I'm guessing that probably wasn't the right way to do it, lol.


----------



## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

Jaegur said:


> Yeah, we were prepared for the mouthyness and him destroying things (he seems to have teeth for feet) but it's just the snarling and such that we weren't expecting. Our GSD just turned two and we've had her since October, so the mouthiness we expected. I'll work to not do anything that gets him riled up. He did manage to follow me into the bathroom and grab something out of the trash can. I didn't have anything to redirect, so I just grabbed it and growled at him >> He let go, but I'm guessing that probably wasn't the right way to do it, lol.


your right... not the best to grab things out of there mouth it teaches them to dig deeper in to holding on to any object for the future expecting you to fight to get it from them... If you don't have anything to trade or redirect... (if its not going to kill them instantly) let them keep it... have them follow you to the location that you know you have something you can bargain with... Arka was really intense for food an resource guarding.. I did the "hey" come with me...... for him to follow me to the kitchen for me to open the fridge and look for something... pull out the block of cheese get a knife to cut a slice... (all that time the pup is calm and calming down) so much easier to win in your favor when they are at a level to really receive your interaction. 2 years later that come with me that we learned as a pup has evolved into so many other things... it helped with his recall , helped for getting him to let go of an intense situation like him walking his ownself out of any dog on dog escalation he was stuck. in. everything about those words and me walking away for him to follow calms him because of the learning over time of us doing t with a positive calm end to it... takes time

adding the other fun word that the sound really snaps him out of his own head .. is (Chic -Ken) chicken.. totally cheat as much as you need to but never forget to pay out big for cheating.. main thing is you want them to learn the mechanics, body motions, 
letting go of a direction,,,, releasing,,,,,, and most of all going from a very strong harden stance to a softer stance that is more willing and aware to work with you...


----------



## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

Mine tend to bring undesirable objects to me LOL, or if I tell them to drop it, they will. Until they can, they are on leash so I can pull them away from anything I think might hurt them LOL.


----------



## goldengirl11 (Mar 3, 2015)

petpeeve said:


> This dog is a wolf hybrid, aka Czechoslovakian Wolfdog.
> 
> Honestly, I don't think anyone here has the experience to advise you safely. And it seems apparent that you can't go it alone. If your breeder is out of town, I would strongly suggest you contact someone else who has extensive knowledge and expertise in the behavioural aspects of raising a hybrid, specifically.


I would agree with this. I would also recommend finding out as much as you can about how he was handled by the breeder. Hopefully you got the chance to spend time with at least the mother dog if not both parents to get an idea of temperament, and see how the breeder handled adults of that breed. From the little I know about wolf hybrids, you definitely want to be seeking advice from someone with breed specific knowledge and experience!!


----------



## sandgrubber (May 21, 2014)

Good luck with your puppy . . . others have given you some good advice.

I sure hope people thinking about getting a puppy and selecting a breed are reading this thread . . . and the many "my puppy bites me!!!!" threads. 

Do look critical of breed temperament descriptions. Words like "fearless, courageous, suspicious" are not good indicators for someone who has not had a lot of dog experience or wants a relatively problem free companion. And when the run-or-the-mill descriptions (as below) indicate owners need to show proper authority, I'd say problems are likely. Here's the breed description from http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/czechoslovakianwolfdog.htm
I've italicized phrases that I read as warning signs.


The Czechoslovak Wolfdog is lively, _very active_, capable of endurance, docile with _quick reactions_. It is _fearless, courageous, suspicious_, yet does not attack without cause. It shows tremendous loyalty towards its master. Resistant to weather conditions. Versatile in his use. The Czechoslovakian Wolfdog is very playful. _Without proper leadership it can be temperamental_. It learns easily. We can admire its all-around qualities rather than its specialization. However, we should not expect it should train spontaneously; the behavior of the CsV is strictly purposeful—it is necessary to find motivation for training. _The most frequent cause of failure is usually the fact that the human is not as strong-minded as the dog_, lacking leadership and/or the dog is tired out with long, useless repetitions of the same exercise, which results in the loss of motivation. These dogs have admirable senses and are very good at following trails. They are really independent and can cooperate in the pack with a special purposefulness. If required, they can easily shift their activity to the night hours. The independent work of the pack without the necessary control of a man was the reason for their use in the army. Sometimes problems can occur during their training when barking is required. Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs have a much wider range of means of expressing themselves and in some situations barking is unnatural for them; they try to communicate with their masters in other ways. _Generally, to teach CsVs stable and reliable performance takes a bit more time than it does to teach traditional specialized breeds. The Czechoslovakian Wolfdog can be a bit dog aggressive if the humans are not displaying the proper authority_. It is _not generally trustworthy with other pets_. It is usually good with children, but s_uspicious and watchful with strangers._


----------



## Tyler_X (Aug 30, 2014)

i wouldnt growl at your pup just saying.


----------



## wvasko (Dec 15, 2007)

Yes I have mentioned this before, breed descriptions can definitely be misleading, late 50s early 60s (memory fails me a tad what year) when done reading the Weimaraner breeding program I thought the Weimies could walk on water. Just take everything written with a proverbial grain/sack of salt.


----------



## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

wvasko said:


> Yes I have mentioned this before, breed descriptions can definitely be misleading, late 50s early 60s (memory fails me a tad what year) when done reading the Weimeraner breeding program I thought the Weimies could walk on water. Just take everything written with a proverbial grain/sack of salt.


LOL, Wvasko. I dont think some breeds can walk on water any more, I just prefer some breeds over others nowadays, and as I get older what I want / need in a dog is changing as well.


----------



## sandgrubber (May 21, 2014)

wvasko said:


> Yes I have mentioned this before, breed descriptions can definitely be misleading, late 50s early 60s (memory fails me a tad what year) when done reading the Weimeraner breeding program I thought the Weimies could walk on water. Just take everything written with a proverbial grain/sack of salt.


I disagree. In my experience, there's often some truth in breed stereotypes. o.k. Don't take anything as 100% true and without exceptions. But neither should you assume those temperament problems aren't going ot affect me and my relationship to my dog. It's reasonable to expect certain temperaments to go with certain breeds. some people get romanced by the lore and overlook the harder parts of reality. Eg., huskies are beautiful dogs, and attractive from a sort of call of the wild, natural dog point of view. But read breed descriptions and you will find that they are generally described as independent and hard to train (at least for anything other than pulling), and prone to escaping / wandering. Talk to husky rescue folks. They'll tell you that a lot of their rescues come from people buy into the beauty of the breed, but don't fully appreciate the breed characteristics and have a hard time living with the dog they admired from afar.

...ok, take it with a grain of salt . . . but take everything with a grain of salt. . . including all the advice given about diet, training, etc.


----------



## MrsBoats (May 20, 2010)

Vlcaks are actually one of breeds that intrigue me and I toy with the idea of working one some day. They are an actual breed and they are not considered wolf hybrids - http://www.czechoslovakianvlcak.org/ They are also in the AKC Foundation Stock Service Program - http://www.akc.org/dog-breeds/czechoslovakian-vlcak/ 

They are not a common breed in the states if that's where you are. I would reach out to your breeder first for input on how to handle your new puppy...reputable breeders should be a new puppy owner's first stop for questions on the puppy they just brought home. I talk with my boys' breeder at least once a week on anything (not just issues or problems) with my rotties. We've become good friends. Good breeders are there for the puppy the entire life of that puppy. If your breeder is not approachable, reach out to the Vlcak club which is the first link I posted. Even better, join the club yourself...and they will be a wonderful resource on living with a Vlcak. They can be mentors and help guide you to people who are trainers and familiar with the breed. 

Good luck.


----------



## Remaru (Mar 16, 2014)

I very much wanted a Vlcak before my health became a bigger issue in my choice of dogs. I am skeptical about most AKC breed descriptions, at least to a point. 

OP, if you are not having luck with your breeder there is a user on Tumbler Little Wolf Dog, she is not in the US but she has a Vlcak and is very involved in the showing/sport/breeding community with her dog. It might be worth getting in contact with her. I don't know how much help she can be from a distance but probably at least equal to what any of us can give you over the internet.


----------



## wvasko (Dec 15, 2007)

> Yes I have mentioned this before, breed descriptions can definitely be misleading, late 50s early 60s (memory fails me a tad what year) when done reading the Weimaraner breeding program I thought the Weimies could walk on water. Just take everything written with a proverbial grain/sack of salt.





> I disagree. In my experience, there's often some truth in breed stereotypes. o.k. Don't take anything as 100% true and without exceptions. But neither should you assume those temperament problems aren't going ot affect me and my relationship to my dog.


I was not assuming anything about your dog's temperament or your relationship with your dog. I do not know you or your dog and would never attempt to have a personal opinion on your problems.

I was just explaining my experience reading a many years old Weimie breed description.


----------



## parus (Apr 10, 2014)

I am not normally the grammar police, but the "viscous" typo in the title is pretty good. A viscous puppy _would_ be a serious problem.

Could be totally wrong without seeing the actual dog, but honestly, snappiness isn't abnormal for a pup from a feisty breed. Of course you want to start training it out right away, but it's not necessarily indicative of a dog with what you'd call _issues_. I'd seek out an experienced trainer who uses primarily positive rewards based methods, and enroll in pup classes...it's not just about getting the dog taught, it's also about learning how to handle these behaviors yourself.


----------



## hanksimon (Mar 18, 2009)

I agree with parus, and a very young puppy of any breed can be snappy. Puppies are babies, and they do anything to try to get what they want, so they'll growl and snap, if you do something they don't like. Their littermates or early owner training teaches them that the inappropriate behavior doesn't get what they want. 

I agree Not to jerk something out of his mouth, but I like the idea of growling back at him. Also, ignoring him ... or withdrawing attention. I don't know your breed, so I default to GSDs and to Ian Dunbar's Bite Inhibition methods [Google "Bite Inhibition" or search the Forum]

Biting your hand or face may be inappropriate playing, rather than aggression ... that's how puppies play, and you have to be careful. 6 Mos puppies are bigger and can reach up from the ground to bite with painful consequences. My dog is a Lab mix, and used to do these behaviors. I used Bite Inhibition methods to communicate with him that I didn't like that type of play. 

Most pups don't like to be picked up; they have to learn to tolerate it. Some pups need to be taught how to play. And, your pup may have only experienced physical contact as play, so he may think that petting is an invitation to play, so he nips. If you are patient and persistent, eventually, he may learn that scratching and belly rubs feel good.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

petpeeve said:


> This dog is a wolf hybrid, aka Czechoslovakian Wolfdog.
> 
> Honestly, I don't think anyone here has the experience to advise you safely. And it seems apparent that you can't go it alone. If your breeder is out of town, I would strongly suggest you contact someone else who has extensive knowledge and expertise in the behavioural aspects of raising a hybrid, specifically.


A wolf hybrid is not a Czechoslovakian Wolfdog. A Czechoslovakian Wolfdog is a breed in its own. Wolf hybrids are really just called wolfdogs these days and are totally different then a Czeck wolfdog, the Czeck wolfdog was made using gsd's and Carpathian wolves. The wolf hybrid, aka wolfdog aka US wolfdog have recent wolf content in them unlike Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs and were made using gray wolves.

These are my wolfdogs.

















And this here is a Czechoslovakian wolfdog. As you see they look nothing alike. My dogs looks almost like pure wolves, unlike the Czechoslovakian, who has not had pure wolf blood added into there lines in a very long time.


----------

