# Is the gentle leader dangerous?



## Tai_Shan (Apr 21, 2008)

Hi, all.

I should start by saying that I can't walk my seven month old Chocolate Lap pup Hershey without his gentle leader. He weighs almost fifty pounds and could easily drag me, a five foot tall woman, down the street if not for the leader. I have never had a problem with it before, but something happened this morning when I went to take Hershey for a walk, and now I'm wondering how safe the gentle leader is.

Now Hershey is a very sociable dog, so whenever I walk him past a house that a dog lives in (Hershey knows where all the dogs live on our walking route) he gets excited and starts barking and jumping and trying to run up to the house to play with the dag who lives in the house. This morning I put Hershey's leader,which I have fitted correctly thanks to my dog trainer, on and started our walk as usual. When we started approaching the first house where a dog lives Hershey started going into his excited mode. I did what I normally do, just stay calm and keep walking. Now I'm not even sure what happened, but suddenly Hershey started crying loudly like something hurt, and the leader looked like it was caught on his mouth somehow. My guess is that it somehow got twisted up or pulled out of place when he was jumping. I released the buckle on the back of the head strap and took the leader off, and all was OK after that. Hershey wasn't hurt, but it was defiantly a frightening experience, probably more so for me that for him. I can't walk Hershey without the leader, but now I'm scared to use the leader again. I would go with a prong collar, but Hershey is very strong willed and I'm not sure that even the prong collar could deter him from jumping when he sees another dog and wants to play.

Has anyone else had a similar problem with the gentle leader? Like I said the leader is fit properly and I didn't do anything different that what I normally do, so it must have gotten caught or pulled out of place when Hershey was jumping. Has anyone had a similar experience to mine, and should I be afraid to use the gentle leader again?


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## InverseLogic (Jun 1, 2008)

I don't have any advice on the leader problem, but have you considered taking you dog on a different route? That is what I did, mostly because I didn't want to walk past barking dogs, I hate that. Ringo is surprisingly calm about dogs on the other side of a fence, but I can't say the same for them.

I planned out my entire route for both morning/afternoon/night, each of them are different to correspond with who's dogs are out in the yard, or who doesn't have dogs at all. Sometimes the schedule will be off, but you can always veer off into another street.


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## Toby4Life (Jun 2, 2008)

I don't have advice about the leader either (you're not getting much help in that department), but I know all about small women walking larger dogs and my advice is training. I would enroll in a puppy class to help you teach him to walk better on a leash and to get more socialization with other dogs so he isn't so excited when he sees them. You say you have a trainer - does s/he not address this other than with special equipment? I would think it would be addressed with the dog's attitude/temperment, not with a special walking harness.

My 70+ lb dog can easily be walked by my <100 lb wife but not at first. I had to spend quite a bit of time teaching him not to pull on the lead when walking and now she has no problem with him. My friend has a 140+ lb mastiff that his 8 year old daughter can walk because he has been trained not to pull. Lab's are smart and quick learners and you should have no problem teaching him the right way to walk on a leash so that you don't need anything more than a buckle collar. Good Luck!!


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## Tai_Shan (Apr 21, 2008)

Thanks for the replys, everyone. I have Hershey in obedience class now (he graduates this comming Sunday) and am in the process of teaching him not to pull, but like I said Hershey is an extremly scoicable dog, and other dogs are the one temptation he simply can't resist.

Every Sunday my local Petco has something called puppy playtime where puppy/dog owners bring they're dogs to play with each other. I've been taking Hershey to puppy playtime since he was ten or eleven weks old, so he is well scoialized. Prehaps a little too well scoialized? Whenever he sees another dog he goes right in to play mode, and I nothing I have done has really helped to change that.


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## melgrj7 (Sep 21, 2007)

Maybe you should try a no pull harness instead?


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## wvasko (Dec 15, 2007)

I don't understand the graduating Obed class and can't walk dog. What are they teaching in Obed classes now.


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## Kotone (Apr 20, 2008)

I use the Gentle Leader as well, and I love it...I haven't had any problems with it, but I guess if your dog is really going nuts then anything could've happen. The leader itself is safe, but of course anything used incorrectly can be unsafe. I'm sure Hershey is fine, and will be okay with the leader, I would just watch him closely when he goes into his fits. It's possible that he messed it up with his paw or something and got caught. I wouldn't worry too much, though.


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## French Ring (Mar 29, 2008)

wvasko said:


> I don't understand the graduating Obed class and can't walk dog. What are they teaching in Obed classes now.


 No idea, but I think I know what you are thinking... 

Some people want to blame on "bad" training or lousy trainers, but I don't think it is the issue.


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## gingersmom (Jun 2, 2008)

I haven't used a gentle leader so I can't answer your specific question.

I am surprised to hear that a 50-pound dog could pull you over though. Surely, you weigh at least twice as much as the dog? If so, I would simply step on the leash. If the dog is pulling against something that low, it will have no leverage, and will not be able to pull you around. If you use this "make like a tree" technique, then your walks will be slowed down considerably, but you won't have to be worried about getting pulled over.

When you are in puppy playtime, I would encourage you not to just let your dog "go play". Here's a great article about how to use playtime as a training opportunity:

http://www.dogstardaily.com/training/training-dog-park

If your dog learns to pay attention to you even when he is playing, then he will be unlikely to become uncontrollable just because he sees or hears another dog with whom he wants to play.



wvasko said:


> I don't understand the graduating Obed class and can't walk dog. What are they teaching in Obed classes now?


I suspect they are teaching owners that if they just spend enough money on the right training equipment (how much does a gentle leader cost?) then their dog will suddenly become obedient....


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## Kotone (Apr 20, 2008)

gingersmom said:


> I suspect they are teaching owners that if they just spend enough money on the right training equipment (how much does a gentle leader cost?) then their dog will suddenly become obedient....


The Gentle Leader is about $20. Not too expensive and extremely helpful, IMO. If you're like me, you consider the GL a tool, and I very much plan to eventually take my dog off of it and use a flat buckle collar for walking. Until he gets to that point(he's improving), I'd like to spare my arm and shoulder a little pain and use the Gentle Leader. I'm sure for many people they won't do this, but I don't see it as a bad thing if they plan to use it all the time, as they would a normal collar(for walks only of course, though). If they don't want to take the time to correctly train their dog to walk on a flat buckle collar, then the GL is a good alternative, and saves some people a lot of stress.


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## Tai_Shan (Apr 21, 2008)

wvasko said:


> I don't understand the graduating Obed class and can't walk dog. What are they teaching in Obed classes now.


Hershey CAN walk on a leash, but training is a process. He isn't going to become perfect at it in the duration of a six week obedience class. He still has to work on not jumping and pulling when he sees a dog, and that is what I need help with. But if I'm going to be criticized for no reason I guess I'll just go elsewhere from now on.


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## Kotone (Apr 20, 2008)

Tai_Shan said:


> Hershey CAN walk on a leash, but training is a process. He isn't going to become perfect at it in the duration of a six week obedience class. He still has to work on not jumping and pulling when he sees a dog, and that is what I need help with. But if I'm going to be criticized for no reason I guess I'll just go elsewhere from now on.


I think that criticism was more towards trainers than you personally. Honestly there are lots of trainers that just aren't that great. If this is a class where you're doing most of the work, then it makes more sense. Perhaps wvasko was thinking of more traditional classes where the trainer does more work than the owner...?


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## Lonewolfblue (Oct 28, 2007)

wvasko said:


> I don't understand the graduating Obed class and can't walk dog. What are they teaching in Obed classes now.


Could be that dogs don't generalize. The pup might be able to heel and walk properly at class, but if you get them out into another environment, it's like you need to start over. My Betty is the same way, in class she's near perfect at heeling, both on and off leash, but on walks in town or at the trail, she wants to pull and tries to charge at other dogs. Just issues we have to work on.

But as for the Gentle Leader, it doesn't hurt the dog at all if used properly, as you should with any tool. Just never snap the head back. If the dog is headed for another dog, you can use it to turn the dog around and go the opposite direction, just don't snap the head around, you could possibly hurt the neck.


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## leesuh (Mar 2, 2008)

I use the gentle leader on Domino and haven't ever had any problem. My guess would be it was just a fluke, the strap got twisted or some of Hershey's hair got got in the buckle or something.

You may want to try some advice I got recently. Instead of walking past what's making Hershey crazy, make him sit and/or lay down in front of the other dog's house. Basically you're teaching him to be calm even where he wants to be crazy. It's something I'm slowly working on with Domino and I think we're making progress.


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## wvasko (Dec 15, 2007)

Tai_Shan said:


> Hershey CAN walk on a leash, but training is a process. He isn't going to become perfect at it in the duration of a six week obedience class. He still has to work on not jumping and pulling when he sees a dog, and that is what I need help with. But if I'm going to be criticized for no reason I guess I'll just go elsewhere from now on.


There was absolutely no critisicm aimed at you at all. Unless you are in charge of the class. I know you are not, because you would not need any help then. Please understand we are texting not talking, it's hard to get feeling while texting. I was more interested in what modern Obed classes entail as one of if not the biggest problems people have is walking their dogs. I am always curious about trainers/schools/classes etc. This is how we all learn about good/bad practises. Sorry for the misunderstanding. There are other people here that will help you with your problems.



French Ring said:


> No idea, but I think I know what you are thinking...
> 
> Some people want to blame on "bad" training or lousy trainers, but I don't think it is the issue.


Yes you did know what I was thinking, that's scary you can read my mind from a long distance. Back at ya.


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