# Canidae Changing formula?



## Sonn84 (Mar 29, 2008)

I have read multiple places and on the Canidae website that they are changing their formula and that Diamond has bought Canidae (that is not on their website it is word of mouth I tried to call but their phones were flooded). What are your thoughts on the new formulas and the change to Diamond if it is true?

New formulas: http://www.canidae.com/new-formulas.html 

Sorry if this has already been discussed I couldn't find it


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## zannie (Mar 12, 2008)

i have not heard anything about diamond but they did change the lamb&rice formula


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## allab (Oct 6, 2007)

zannie said:


> i have not heard anything about diamond but they did change the lamb&rice formula


They have actually changed all their formulas.I had posted it about Lamb/rice formula last week,since than Canidae has updated their website and it looks like all the formulas got improved.
Have not heard anything about Diamond.
And the new formulas looks good to me.


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## heidiann (Feb 3, 2008)

Does anyone know if they also changed the canned formulas? I want to give my mom a heads up, since she feeds her dog canidae canned.


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## Sonn84 (Mar 29, 2008)

I am not 100% about the Diamond thing it is just something I have seen circulating on the net and haven't been able to contact Canidae so resorted to sending an email earlier.


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## kenRC51 (Mar 7, 2008)

I hear that Diamond made alot of food tat was recalled. Correct me if im wrong.


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## heidiann (Feb 3, 2008)

Diamond had a recall in 2006. I don't know if they were involved in the 2007 recall or not...probably, seems most everyone was. 

We lost two cats due to the 2006 recall, so personally, I'd never trust a Diamond product again. I hope Canidae has nothing to do with them.


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## zannie (Mar 12, 2008)

i only remember diamond own food being recalled a few years ago due to corn,they do make alot of foods like taste of the wild and solid gold..


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## BoxMeIn21 (Apr 10, 2007)

allab said:


> They have actually changed all their formulas.I had posted it about Lamb/rice formula last week,since than Canidae has updated their website and it looks like all the formulas got improved.
> Have not heard anything about Diamond.
> And the new formulas looks good to me.


I would call it FAR from an improvement...looks like they have changed a lot of stuff... They have removed "chicken" altogether from the new formula. They replaced herring meal with ocean fish meal. They added rice bran, peas, potatoes, oatmeal, cracked pearled barley, millet, tomato pomace. 

Old Formula:

All Natural Ingredients
Chicken Meal, Turkey Meal, 
Brown Rice, White Rice, Lamb Meal,
Chicken Fat (preserved with Mixed Tocopherols), Herring Meal, Flax Seed, Sun Cured Alfalfa Meal, Sunflower Oil, Chicken, Lecithin, Monocalcium Phosphate, Potassium Chloride, Choline Chloride, Linoleic Acid, Rosemary Extract, Sage Extract, Dried Enterococcus Faecium, Dried Lactobacillus Acidophilus Fermentation Product, Dried Aspergillus Oryzae Fermentation Extract, Dried Bacillus Subtilis Fermentation Extract, Inulin (from Chicory root), Saccharomyces Cerevisiae Fermentation Solubles, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Mixed Tocopherols (source of Vitamin E), Zinc Amino Acid Chelate, Manganese Amino Acid Chelate, Iron Amino Acid Chelate, Copper Amino Acid Chelate, Cobalt Amino Acid Chelate, Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D3 Supplement, Ascorbic Acid (source of Vitamin C), Niacin, Thiamine Mononitrate (Vitamin B1), Riboflavin (source of B2), Beta Carotene, Calcium Pantothenate, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride (Vitamin B6), Calcium Iodate, Folic Acid, D-Biotin, Sodium Selenite, Papaya, Vitamin B12 Supplement.

New Formula:

All Natural Ingredients
Chicken meal, turkey meal, 
lamb meal, brown rice, white rice,
rice bran, peas, potatoes, oatmeal, cracked pearled barley, 
chicken fat (preserved with mixed tocopherols), millet, tomato pomace, natural flavor, flaxseed meal, ocean fish meal, 
choline chloride, sun cured alfalfa meal, inulin (from chicory root), lecithin, sage extract, cranberries, beta carotene, rosemary extract, sunflower oil, yucca schidigera extract, dried enterococcus faecium, dried lactobacillus acidophilus fermentation product, dried aspergillus oryzae fermentation extract, dried bacillus subtilis fermentation extract, saccharomyces cerevisiae fermentation solubles, vitamin E supplement, iron proteinate, zinc proteinate, copper proteinate, ferrous sulfate, zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide, thiamine mononitrate, manganese proteinate, manganous oxide, ascorbic acid, vitamin A supplement, biotin, calcium pantothenate, manganese sulfate, sodium selenite, pyridoxine hydrochloride (vitamin B6), vitamin B12 supplement, riboflavin, vitamin D supplement, folic acid, cobalt proteinate, organic selenium, papaya, pineapple.



So in essence they have taken out a main meat source, replacing a named fish meal with completely generic one, added another grain(barley), added birdseed(millet), added more questionable fillers(rice bran,oatmeal, tomato pumice) and then are upping the price....Not so much an improvement really.


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## ohrats9 (Dec 19, 2007)

*Canidae has let me down...*

I have been feeding Jim and Tabitha Canidae and I just bought a bag of the "reformulated" food and I am NOT happy. Their stool was loose and I thought they might be getting used to it but it has stayed that way. Jim has dandruff which has never been an issue before this. I don't want to see what else happens so I am looking for a better food.

I'm now going to post a thread about which kibble is good. I'm getting ready for raw but I am nervous about cost and of course, doing it right. Although with what the kibble is producing these days I can't help but wonder if just giving them table scraps would be an improvement. Seriously.


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## wishiwas (Mar 3, 2008)

*Re: Canidae has let me down...*

They didn't remove chicken from the food.. it's still the first ingredient.  But I am very concerned about how this change will effect my allergy-prone Cockers.


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## BoxMeIn21 (Apr 10, 2007)

*Re: Canidae has let me down...*



wishiwas said:


> They didn't remove chicken from the food.. it's still the first ingredient.  But I am very concerned about how this change will effect my allergy-prone Cockers.


I am not talking about chicken meal, I am talking about CHICKEN...review the ingredients list.


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## wishiwas (Mar 3, 2008)

*Re: Canidae has let me down...*

Ah, sorry about that.. that "chicken" is so far down the list that it seems insignificant to me. I didn't even notice it, and wouldn't consider it even close to a main protein source. But I see what you meant now.


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## Sugar Daddy Otis (Jan 9, 2008)

It was confirmed in an email from Canidae that they *ARE* outsourcing additional production to Diamond Foods...and that they are "very happy with this relationship."
What now? Trust Diamond or switch from this food that Otis is doing so well on?? I am thinking we will be switching...what do you all think?


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## InverseLogic (Jun 1, 2008)

I'm also exploring other options SDO. They love Canidae, but I want what's best for them.

It's either going to be raw or Innova for me.


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## ohrats9 (Dec 19, 2007)

I have all ready switched to Innova. I am not willing to do anything that involves Diamond after the recall.


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## heidiann (Feb 3, 2008)

Sugar Daddy Otis said:


> It was confirmed in an email from Canidae that they *ARE* outsourcing additional production to Diamond Foods...and that they are "very happy with this relationship."
> What now? Trust Diamond or switch from this food that Otis is doing so well on?? I am thinking we will be switching...what do you all think?


Yep, I emailed and they confirmed it. Personally, I'd be switching. I just don't trust Diamond.


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## zannie (Mar 12, 2008)

i think if your dogs do good on the new formula then don't switch.diamond is not a bad company it had a very bad situation with corn a few years ago and if ya dig far enough back you would find other companies has simular issues,it happens in people food as well and in medicene too its terrble but after all we are humane and nobody or no product is always going to be perfect..i bet alot of people are feeding diamond made foods for years and never knew it..just my opion


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## 4dogs3cats (Dec 21, 2007)

::sigh::

I am a little worried about the new formula. I wonder if I should switch or trust it... So many decisions. My SO just bought a brand new 40 lb bag today!


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## MyCharlie (Nov 4, 2007)

Not trying to dis Canidae or anything - but I opened a new bag Sunday morning and it was rotten - well, moldy. Eww. Charlie hadn't been eating well for quite a few days so I tried the new bag and when I saw that, figured maybe the smell had seeped into the old bag (they were sitting next to each other in the pantry). 

Anyway, it makes me leery of Canidae. I took the bag back to the store and they let me switch it out for a bag of California Natural (which he has been on before and done better on, actually). The guy at the store was going to call Canidae the next day and give them the lot number. He said it looked like they didn't dry the food all the way before bagging it. 

So personally I think I'll be sticking with the Cali Nat.


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## Sonn84 (Mar 29, 2008)

I have stopped feeding Canidae but not because of the Diamond thing I still feed Diamond products like Taste of the Wild. I quit using it because I just went through 8 out of 11 dogs refusing to eat and having massive diarrhea. I know a few people who are still feeding it and had no change in their dog at all. So I guess whatever works just works.


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## Sugar Daddy Otis (Jan 9, 2008)

Well, this is Otis' third day on his first bag of the new formula, and he is passing gas like never before--which was said to be a possible side-effect to the new formula...I am going to be switching for the next bag--I just have to find something around here--Canidae was hard enough to find...the search is on.......


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## InverseLogic (Jun 1, 2008)

Sugar Daddy Otis said:


> Well, this is Otis' third day on his first bag of the new formula, and he is passing gas like never before--which was said to be a possible side-effect to the new formula...I am going to be switching for the next bag--I just have to find something around here--Canidae was hard enough to find...the search is on.......


Haha, that happened to Ringo too after he was on the new formula.

Their bag is almost empty though, I can buy a bag of something else next month until I am able to switch to raw.


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## DobManiac (Aug 12, 2007)

Wow!

I just put my sisters's dog on Canidea a few months ago, and he was doing great on it. I think I will tell her to go ahead and switch though because it doesn't sound like any dogs are improving on the new forumula. Now I have to go through another dog food search. Yeah.


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## Mary22 (Mar 7, 2007)

Does anyone know when this happened? My dog has been on it since she was a puppy and recently has had some diarrhea. It took me forever to decide to go with Canidae, now I'm not sure what to go with. I know there was a listing not too long ago on the top dog foods, anyone know what they are (in order if possible)?


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## Trixie (Feb 27, 2008)

Good god -- the food issue already did my head in. I can't switch, not now. Not while she had been doing so well on Canidae. We just got a new bag, and she DID have diarrhea the other day, but that seems to have subsided. (with this dog, the diarrhea could have been caused by a host of things)

I'm taking my chances that she'll do OK on whatever new formula they have. My boyfriend would have a stroke if we needed to switch again. He already thinks I'm mental with regard to feeding our pup.


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## 4dogs3cats (Dec 21, 2007)

Sugar Daddy Otis said:


> Well, this is Otis' third day on his first bag of the new formula, and he is passing gas like never before--which was said to be a possible side-effect to the new formula...I am going to be switching for the next bag--I just have to find something around here--Canidae was hard enough to find...the search is on.......


Yup. When you have a german shepherd laying next to you, with his BUTT close to you, you find out the new formula DOES make them gassy.

It also doesnt look the same. Im not too pleased with it. Luckilly SO only bought a 20 lb bag, which is almost half gone, so I am going to find something on Tuesday to start switching them to. I have become very picky with what my dogs eat, and I want the best for them. Does anyone LIKE the new formula?


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## dane&cockermom (Oct 16, 2007)

when did the new formula start? cause gwen has actually had less gas than normal. it's still harder than hell to get her to eat. but it's always been like that, and i'm not sure that's ever going to change. *sigh*


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## lmitch6 (Nov 16, 2007)

Our 8 year old Lhasa was having vomiting issues a few weeks back that the vet suspected could be a food allergy. We'd been feeding Canidae for the past year with great success, and I was bummed to switch (went with Natural Balance). I suspect now it had something to do with this formula change - glad I found this thread to confirm!


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## Mac'N'Roe (Feb 15, 2008)

I was going to ask about thsi same thing. Mac and Gabi are on Canidae, and I'm kind of unhappy with it. I forgot about the change, and was surprised the last trip to the store with the smaller bag (35 lb) and $7 increase . 

The kibble is bigger, but seems lighter or not as dense...which means they require more of it. That's not scientifically proven, just my visual opinion. Anyway, Roe is on California Natural puppy, and it's time to switch her too since she's coming up on a year. 

I'm considering raw. As those that have switched, you probably understand my hesitation..it's a big step it seems. It's hard for me to choose a kibble when raw is an option. The only kibble that I found appealing was evo...

taste of the wild looked okay, but I just noticed they are diamond. It's a hard decision.


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## Flak (Jul 29, 2008)

The old formula came in the 5/20/40lb bags... the new formula comes in the 5/15/35/44lb bags. Just mentioning that to clear up the air a bit as I see listed here and else where that people are seeing changes in their dogs well still using a 40lb bag, hence the old formula still. The pet supply place I go to still has full stock of the "old" formula and still receives the old formula whenever they place orders. I have been trying to find a place that sells the new formula to see what effect it may have on my dogs.


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## BullieCrazy (Feb 11, 2008)

I personally feel that the "improvement" was a lowering of the quality and nutrition of Canidae. I don't care for Diamond (but am presently using a inbetween finding a new food for my dog costco brand (manufactered by Diamond)) With the Canidae "improvement" you now end up getting 5 pounds less for the same price. Talk about a rip off!


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## Mycathinks hesadog (Mar 4, 2008)

Hello all,

Welp I just found out the hard way that Canidae switched formulas as I came home to 3 POO-SPLOSIONS this week, and am now up at 4 am to let the dogs out to pee out of thier bung holes. I will be returning this new bag of food today (only 3 days worth eaten) and switching to Innova. 

And for some stupid reason I thought it was the RMB's I got from the butcher on Tuesday.

ARGH. What ever happened to the adage, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it!"

PS. Glad to be back on DF, I knew I'd find some answers here.


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## Renoman (Mar 20, 2007)

I know this thread is about Canidae changing forumulas and outsourcing their production to Diamond, but I thought I'd give those of you looking at switching foods a heads up.

Natural Balance has also outsourced their production to Diamond. My guys have been eating the NB Fish and Sweet Potato formula for some time and done quite well on it (I have an allergy dog and a colitis dog and this food worked wonders for both of them.). 

With the last bag I bought the boys started experiencing problems. Buck, my colitis dog who never had allergy problems, started showing classic signs of food allergies; red skin, biting his feet raw and almost constant scratching. Chazz, my allergy dog was scratching, biting himself constantly among other things. I emailed the company asking whether they changed their formula and asking them to confirm their switch to a Diamond facility. They confirmed their outsourcing and... they told me they've made no changes to the forumla, and they have QC personnel and QC checks and testing throughout the process. Usual PR verbage.

Whether it is in fact a formula change or cross contamination with other foods produced at the Diamond facility.... my boys were telling me something was different.

The boys have been off NB now for about 2 weeks.. the issues are starting to subside, and since everything else in their diet/surroundings has remained the same, it seems it is the food.

Why can't they leave well enough alone......*sigh*.....

Sorry, for hijacking, but I did want to let you know about NB in case anyone was thinking of trying it.


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## dre2142 (Mar 10, 2008)

Interesting....I was wondering about this, as the bag sizes had changed. 

looks like I may be phasing out canidae.


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## texylady (Aug 22, 2008)

I found this info....

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080706060234AAT9oW3

For 4 years now I've fed my dog and cat Solid Gold. I am soooo disappointed to hear that they have sold out to Diamond....CRAP FOODS! I will write Solid Gold and let them know I will no longer be buying their food for my babies. I am headed to check out the FLINT RIVER RANCH website. My cousins feed their dogs Flint River and swear by it. Free Shipping and no tax &...Diamond doesn't own it!!!!!! I have to drive to Houston, TX to get the Solid Gold. That'll save on gas and time!

TEXY


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## HersheyPup (May 22, 2008)

texylady said:


> I found this info....
> 
> http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080706060234AAT9oW3
> 
> ...


I feed Flint River Ranch (along with Timberwolf Organics in rotation) and I am really happy with it! I highly recommend it!


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## flipgirl (Oct 5, 2007)

It bothers me that dog food manufacturers change a formula without giving customers ample notice. why not post a notice on bags a couple of months before the change so that owners can prepare their dogs for the change? For example, they could buy enough of the old formula and switch their dog to the new formula just like you would switch to a new food? I would think the companies would know dogs well enough to know that they have to be slowly switched over so why not do their customers a favour and give them a heads up? That way, they just might keep some customers....


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## rosemaryninja (Sep 28, 2007)

Mac'N'Roe said:


> I'm considering raw. As those that have switched, you probably understand my hesitation..it's a big step it seems. It's hard for me to choose a kibble when raw is an option. The only kibble that I found appealing was evo...


To be honest, I think you'll find it easier than you currently imagine. I was really freaked out at first but the basics are really easy to pick up. I researched the raw diet for about a month before starting and kept putting it off because I thought it'd take too much effort, something would go wrong, etc. After I actually got started on it, I wondered why I had ever thought it hard.



Renoman said:


> The boys have been off NB now for about 2 weeks.. the issues are starting to subside, and since everything else in their diet/surroundings has remained the same, it seems it is the food.


Reno, what did you end up going with in the end?


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## tehmina11 (Sep 8, 2008)

Yes this is true. I don't personally use it but it was a food I would recommend as a mid grade quality food. However, so far it is only affecting the Lamb and Rice formula. There is a possibility (from a rep) that they will change over all of their foods. It states this change and the lower quality ingredients on their website. It is really a shame, because on a lot of dog forums, peoples dogs are having negative effects to the "new" formula. To much low quality grain.

They may also sell the company, which would put them very low on the quality list. They are already having a lot of quality control issues with finding corn in the dogs wet food in a product that contains "No Corn". I would consider looking into other foods, it will get worse before it ever gets better.


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## dre2142 (Mar 10, 2008)

tehmina11 said:


> Yes this is true. I don't personally use it but it was a food I would recommend as a mid grade quality food. However, so far it is only affecting the Lamb and Rice formula. There is a possibility (from a rep) that they will change over all of their foods. It states this change and the lower quality ingredients on their website. It is really a shame, because on a lot of dog forums, peoples dogs are having negative effects to the "new" formula. To much low quality grain.
> 
> They may also sell the company, which would put them very low on the quality list. They are already having a lot of quality control issues with finding corn in the dogs wet food in a product that contains "No Corn". I would consider looking into other foods, it will get worse before it ever gets better.



Im going to compare the ingredients on the old bag of ALS, and the new bag of ALS. I was under the impression that chicken was taken out of the ALS formula. 
My dog hasnt had any effects from the switch.


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## Renoman (Mar 20, 2007)

> Reno, what did you end up going with in the end?



RMN, California Natural Herring and Sweet Potato. Unfortunately, that did not work out. It didn't seem to agree with either of the boys. 

So, the quest continues...........


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## marc515 (Nov 27, 2007)

*My dog had no problem changing over.....*

However, all the comments here have me concerned about quality and Diamond.

What are your thoughts on Innova?

marc


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## TwoSweetBabies (Apr 28, 2008)

*Re: My dog had no problem changing over.....*



marc515 said:


> However, all the comments here have me concerned about quality and Diamond.
> 
> What are your thoughts on Innova?
> 
> marc


I have fed Innova for about a month now. I had to switch after the Canidae formula change, I gave it the benefit of the doubt and it just did not agree with them
Innova has done them well, perfect stools since the day we started


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## Pupsbegood (Sep 12, 2008)

*Re: My dog had no problem changing over.....*

I'm still new to this, but my cousin is in vet school so I turned to him for insight on the formula change thats been going on. He said that most of the issues people (well, their pets) are having are because they aren't doing a proper switch from the old to new formula. You have to very gradually mix in the new stuff, and that will help your dog adjust more easily.


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## flipgirl (Oct 5, 2007)

*Re: My dog had no problem changing over.....*



Pupsbegood said:


> I'm still new to this, but my cousin is in vet school so I turned to him for insight on the formula change thats been going on. He said that most of the issues people (well, their pets) are having are because they aren't doing a proper switch from the old to new formula. You have to very gradually mix in the new stuff, and that will help your dog adjust more easily.


Yes this is true but my problem with the company changing the formula is the lack of forewarning so as to allow its customers to slowly change their dogs from the old to the new formula. Or to at least give them a chance to see if their dogs can tolerate it. This is the same issue that screwed Timberwolf Organics (now just called Timberwolf) and many customers stopped feeding their food. I think the reason is the company doesn't want to admit they are adding cheaper ingredients or that they have not put the correct ingredients list (as in the case of Timberwolf). Even if they had put some BS message on their packages saying they're making so and so changes as of whatever date, their customers could make up their own minds as to whether they want to continue. But no, they allow their customers to discover the changes from their dogs diarrhea or whatever. I would imagine that one of the first things that would come to mind is that the food was contaminated.


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## French Ring (Mar 29, 2008)

I feed raw, but if I'm on vacation somewhere with dogs. I usually take kibble and I really like Ziwi Peak's products. I have used their treats for training.
http://www.ziwipeak.com/Products/

If people are considering raw but aren't comfortable with making their switch, they might want to start with Natural Variety's raw. http://www.naturesvariety.com/


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## Pupsbegood (Sep 12, 2008)

*Re: My dog had no problem changing over.....*



flipgirl said:


> Yes this is true but my problem with the company changing the formula is the lack of forewarning so as to allow its customers to slowly change their dogs from the old to the new formula. Or to at least give them a chance to see if their dogs can tolerate it. This is the same issue that screwed Timberwolf Organics (now just called Timberwolf) and many customers stopped feeding their food. I think the reason is the company doesn't want to admit they are adding cheaper ingredients or that they have not put the correct ingredients list (as in the case of Timberwolf). Even if they had put some BS message on their packages saying they're making so and so changes as of whatever date, their customers could make up their own minds as to whether they want to continue. But no, they allow their customers to discover the changes from their dogs diarrhea or whatever. I would imagine that one of the first things that would come to mind is that the food was contaminated.


I actually saw Canidae bags with decent-sized stickers on them in the store this week. It explained how to switch gradually, what the differences in ingredients are, and all of that info. Have the stores near you not had those stickers on the bags?


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## omalik (Aug 2, 2008)

heidiann said:


> Does anyone know if they also changed the canned formulas? I want to give my mom a heads up, since she feeds her dog canidae canned.


I'd like to know also.


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## flipgirl (Oct 5, 2007)

*Re: My dog had no problem changing over.....*



Pupsbegood said:


> I actually saw Canidae bags with decent-sized stickers on them in the store this week. It explained how to switch gradually, what the differences in ingredients are, and all of that info. Have the stores near you not had those stickers on the bags?


I haven't seen any stickers on Canidae bags but I live in Canada so maybe the new formula isn't here yet. Does the sticker say when the change will/would take place?


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## dre2142 (Mar 10, 2008)

*Re: My dog had no problem changing over.....*



flipgirl said:


> I haven't seen any stickers on Canidae bags but I live in Canada so maybe the new formula isn't here yet. Does the sticker say when the change will/would take place?


What size bags are at the store? They changed the weight of the bags.....


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