# Saying "No" with puppy training



## chrissy71 (Jul 21, 2008)

I am currently going to puppy training classes with my dog and the trainer said that you should never tell a dog "No" that they don't understand it and should never use the dogs name when correcting it. What do you guys think about this?


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## ohrats9 (Dec 19, 2007)

When regarding the correction and name together I think she is spot on. If you use a pups name and then use a punishment directly behind or after it, the pup's name starts to mean a negative thing which is not good. Your pups name should be a wonderful thing and it can't be when you link it to something dreary like a correction. It's a tough one to remember, but if you want a pup that always responds to it's name you have to stick with it. We taught Tabitha her name with treats. We started by just saying it and giving her something super tasty. I even repeated it while the treat was being enjoyed by her. Once she responded to her name, my BF and I took it the next step by taking a handful of treats into a different room. We would each take turns calling her name and treating her when she came running. I continue to do it with both dogs when I think of it. Jimmy is 10 and very familiar with his name, but I still like to back up his name with something positive. lol.

I taught them the meaning of no and we use it when they are doing something they need to stop doing. So yes, she's right, dogs don't know what no means. I taught it when they were young and caught doing something atrocious. I would say it with a very low guttural tone (think growl). I don't know if I lucked out, but that always stopped them in their tracks and it has kept with them. 

Thing is, once there were other commands to use, no was used less and less and now it isn't used all that frequently.


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## Macky (Feb 12, 2007)

Harry (5 months old) is in training right now and when I would say his name (Huey) he would look pitiful and walk the other way so the trainer had me change his name. We rescued him so God only knows what kind of treatment he had in his first 4 months. Instead of the word no I use a sound, "et et". It's hard to spell the sound but you know what I mean. It's a sound I never use other than when he is getting into trouble. It's more spontanious without using his name with it.


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## kelliope (Apr 4, 2008)

I don't usually tell my dogs no. It doesn't mean anything because dogs do much better if you tell them what you want them to do rather than just saying no. If I do have to use no to get them to stop something (like chasing something) then I immediately follow up with a postive command, like come here or sit where they can receive praise.

No doesn't tell the dog what TO do and redirecting your dog is the best way to teach it appropriate behavior.


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## TooneyDogs (Aug 6, 2007)

I hate to speculate about the intentions of other trainers but, I suspect the trainer is thinking of "NO!" in the traditonal way that it is used....hard/sharp/shocking/forceful and loud. Not what you want in a puppy class or linked with a puppy's name. There are many other ways to teach a correction.


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## ohrats9 (Dec 19, 2007)

*Oops*

I totally forgot to mention the most important part of no! When/If the dogs are told no, they are immediately shown the correct thing to do and praised. It's super helpful with puppies and chewing. 

See them chewing something they shouldn't ---> NO ----> Put something they are allowed to chew in their mouth ----> GOOD!!! Yay! Who's the smartest dog ever? YAY!

lol


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## Dogstar (May 11, 2007)

*Re: Oops*

I don't use no with a puppy's name initially- but by the time my guys are five months old? They've gotten LOTS of positive associations with their name, and we've started playing the sort of 'simon says' game in which I tell one dog to sit and the other two to down and only the dogs who do the right things get cookies.  At that point, I start using no and a name to address a specific dog who is being bad.  (If I need to. Usually I'll call and ask for a hand touch or some other reasonably rewarding behavior and redirect them to something else.) 

I *do* think it's silly to say you should never say "No!" to your puppy. A loud verbal correction can be VERY effective used properly- but it's not a substitute for proper management, either. I know some trainers recommend using 'Ehh!" or another sound but really! The dog doesn't know what "No!" means.  It's just a sound! And it's a LOT easier to get EVERYONE on board with "No!" which is pretty intuitive for most folks.


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## Allie3985 (Jul 19, 2008)

kelliope said:


> I don't usually tell my dogs no. It doesn't mean anything because dogs do much better if you tell them what you want them to do rather than just saying no. If I do have to use no to get them to stop something (like chasing something) then I immediately follow up with a postive command, like come here or sit where they can receive praise.
> 
> No doesn't tell the dog what TO do and redirecting your dog is the best way to teach it appropriate behavior.


I think this is spot on! It is hard to learn not to expect your dog to learn the same way that you and I do. It is also hard to break old habits or not to yell at your dog the way that you hear so many people do. My dogs respond very well to any quick, attention grabbing sound when they're doing something naughty, (not a loud noise, sometimes I gasp, snap my fingers, say "ey!". . .) and after I have their attention I immediately give a correction by saying "come lay down" or just "come" or whatever, and then of course "good girl! What a good girl! you're so good!. . ."


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## Toby4Life (Jun 2, 2008)

This may be a bit different, but when we began Agiltiy Training we were told not to use "no" when he did something wrong, or didn't do what we wanted during agility training. It wasn't that we were told never to say the word to our dogs, just not while at training. The idea was that we never wanted any part of the agility training to be negative - even when the dog (actually it was usually the human) did something wrong. I'm not sure if this is the case here or not.

Of course dogs don't understand what "no" means. It's all about what you associate the word with. For example - you don't need to use the word "sit" when teaching your dog to sit, you could use "purple" or any word if you wanted to. The idea is that you get your dog to associate that word with the desired behavior. I'm assuming your instructor doesn't want you using "no" as a generic term. Yet you'll probably learn, drop, leave it, off, ect. which essentially is "no" in a more specific form.

At home I use "no", but for me it substitutes "leave it". If there is a plate of food on the floor and Toby walks over to it, I tell him "no" and he leaves it alone. I really don't think it should be about the word used, but about the behavior your are teaching your dog to associate with that word. If "no" doesn't mean anything specific, just a general no as we understand it, than I agree it shouldn't be used.

ps - sorry, this post ended up being much longer than expected!!


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## chrissy71 (Jul 21, 2008)

The trainer also says to use "et et", but sometimes "no" slips out and then I have to correct myself and say the correct term. It seems that sometimes she does not respond to the "et et" and when I say "no" she does. I think the hardest one is her bitting hands. She starts out playing with her toys and then thinks it is okay to chew on us. Thats when I usually say no, and put a chew toy in her mouth.


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## poodleholic (Mar 15, 2007)

chrissy71 said:


> I am currently going to puppy training classes with my dog and the trainer said that you should never tell a dog "No" that they don't understand it and should never use the dogs name when correcting it. What do you guys think about this?



I would agree. When you call your dog (use his name), you want your dog to associate only good things. Saying "no," really isn't teaching your dog anything (picture parents who are constantly saying/yelling NO to their toddlers, who, of course, keep on doing what they were doing). What usually happens with a puppy/dog when one yells NO, is the puppy just gets rowdier. Rather than thinking in terms of what you *don't* want your puppy to do, think of what you _*want*_ him to do instead. For example, if he's jumping up and mouthing/nipping, saying NO and/or pushing him away is just going to stimulate him further, and he's not going to stop. So, ask him to do something else - something he already knows how to do, like sit. Praise and treat the minute he sits. Ignore unwanted behavior, distract, redirect, then follow up with praise and reward.



> =chrissy71;337878]The trainer also says to use "et et", but sometimes "no" slips out and then I have to correct myself and say the correct term. It seems that sometimes she does not respond to the "et et" and when I say "no" she does.


You'll get the hang of it. I use EH EH when I need my dogs to stop, and will also use body blocks to control them. It's easy for me now, and my dogs immediately respond. When I first started, I wasn't as effective because it was new to me. 



> I think the hardest one is her bitting hands. She starts out playing with her toys and then thinks it is okay to chew on us. Thats when I usually say no, and put a chew toy in her mouth.


I stop the game immediately and leave. Then return a short time later to try again. Dogs learn through association, and your puppy will learn that when she chews on you, she loses her greatest resource - you (provider of all good things: attention, affection, food, toys, play, etc.). I used the word "WRONG," said calmly, and walked away. EH EH is good, because the sound will usually get their attention, and will pause long enough for you to redirect him to something else.


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