# I'm a little concerned about my puppy's bladder.



## Chikyuu (May 1, 2010)

My 8 (soon to be 10) week old puppy came home about 2 weeks ago. I put her in her crate at night and let her out every 3 hours every night to go pee. To be honest I can't tell if she went pee on her bedding in the crate or not because I tried before and I can't smell dog pee in a blanket even though apparently my mom can. I don't think she really cares if she pees in her crate either, and she won't wake me up to get out. One night I took the bedding out and even when letting her out every 3 hours at night she peed in her crate.

Anyway, during the day it's become apparent the puppy can't hold her bladder for even one hour. The whole add 1 to the months of age for hours of bladder control number seems to be totally bogus anyway, but if anything I would think maybe 2 hours, or 90 minutes. But one minute more than one hour and she has an accident. When I pick her up to try and stop the flow, she just keeps peeing and it ends up going in every direction instead of being in a concentrated spot. Should I be at all concerned?


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## Thracian (Dec 24, 2008)

I wouldn't be concerned, especially if she's a small dog. I always took my puppy out every hour when I first got him, and that worked best. Then, when that was mastered, I added time very slowly. Pups at that age have minimal bladder control--when they have to go, they have to go. That won't come until six months or so.


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## Finkie_Mom (Mar 2, 2010)

It couldn't hurt to take her to the vet to make sure she doesn't have a UTI, but everything you're describing sounds normal to me. My pup still has to go out about once an hour while she's awake and out with me, and sometimes more if we're playing (she's 5 months old). The whole "add an hour to the puppy's age in months" thing is if the pup is inactive - namely in her crate. Being awake and active cancels that out completely. And even then, it's not an exact science, but more of a guideline.

For your puppy, take her out then every 45 minutes, so that she won't have the chance to have accidents, and remember to take her out after eating/drinking, after playing, after she's been in the crate for a bit, etc. Don't pick her up while she's going, rather try to stop her in her tracks by saying "ah ah!" loud, clapping, making a loud noise, etc. Then pick her up, take her outside, let her finish, and then praise/treat (let her know she's amazing and did a great job).

And clean everything with an enzymatic cleaner (namely Nature's Miracle) so that she won't start going in the same spots. Keep her in your sights at all times when she's out, too.

Eventually, you can up the time from 45 minutes to 1 hour, then even more (as long as you're not playing with her and she hasn't just had something to eat/drink).

It's a lot of work, and can be frustrating, but as long as there are no medical problems, your hard work will pay off soon enough


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## Chikyuu (May 1, 2010)

Finkie_Mom said:


> It couldn't hurt to take her to the vet to make sure she doesn't have a UTI, but everything you're describing sounds normal to me. My pup still has to go out about once an hour while she's awake and out with me, and sometimes more if we're playing (she's 5 months old). The whole "add an hour to the puppy's age in months" thing is if the pup is inactive - namely in her crate. Being awake and active cancels that out completely. And even then, it's not an exact science, but more of a guideline.
> 
> For your puppy, take her out then every 45 minutes, so that she won't have the chance to have accidents, and remember to take her out after eating/drinking, after playing, after she's been in the crate for a bit, etc. Don't pick her up while she's going, rather try to stop her in her tracks by saying "ah ah!" loud, clapping, making a loud noise, etc. Then pick her up, take her outside, let her finish, and then praise/treat (let her know she's amazing and did a great job).
> 
> ...


Yeah ^^; my bottle of NM is almost gone and my parents are telling me I'm going to have to start smacking her for her accidents. I don't think that's the answer, I just gotta fine tune my supervision methinks. And of course I always go out with her... She can't go down the front steps anyway (but she can go up them?) and she's WAY too young and there are way too many things she can swallow... that, and there are night hawks. =/

I just keep seeing people say how potty training a puppy isn't hard and they can get it done in a week with 2 accidents and I'm like "What the hell..."


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## spotted nikes (Feb 7, 2008)

Absolutely DO NOT SMACK HER for accidents. That doesn't work on any age dog.


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## Finkie_Mom (Mar 2, 2010)

Chikyuu said:


> Yeah ^^; my bottle of NM is almost gone and my parents are telling me I'm going to have to start smacking her for her accidents. I don't think that's the answer, I just gotta fine tune my supervision methinks. And of course I always go out with her... She can't go down the front steps anyway (but she can go up them?) and she's WAY too young and there are way too many things she can swallow... that, and there are night hawks. =/
> 
> I just keep seeing people say how potty training a puppy isn't hard and they can get it done in a week with 2 accidents and I'm like "What the hell..."


OMG NEVER hit your dog!!! That's a HORRIBLE idea and a great way to create a fearful puppy, that could turn in to an aggressive one. DO NOT let them do that. EVER.

Tether her to you when she's out with you. Just leash her up and tie the other end to your belt loop, or even wrap it around your waist. And whenever you cannot pay attention to her 100%, she's in the crate. Make sure you condition her to be in there, however, so she learns to love being in there rather than hate it. Give her a Kong stuffed with treats (especially frozen peanut butter!), special "crate only" toys, and you can even feed her in the crate - anything so that she associates crate time with good things! You will find a lot more about crate training on this forum, so just look around for more info, especially about getting her accustomed to being in there for extended periods of time.

Pups that young aren't supposed to be able to go up and down steps. If she falls, she could really get hurt as her bones are still developing. My dog can also go up steps, and I only let her if I'm right behind her. I don't even let her go down them - I pick her up and bring her down. Too much to lose if she falls. 

And it's definitely difficult! Some pups seem to be easier than others, and it also probably helps if you've housebroken dogs before. I can tell you that my puppy took maybe a month (and definitely more than 2 accidents!!!) to really get everything down in that she wasn't having accidents in the crate or in the house, and she was barking at the door to let me know she had to go out (so she was 3 months then), and then maybe a week ago, she randomly had a couple accidents (at 4 1/2 months). It's an ongoing process, so I wouldn't take things like that to heart 

ETA - Not only can hitting her create a fear of people, but it may also make her think that going to the bathroom in general is a bad thing! She may start hiding it around the house, and when you take her out to watch her go, she may be too afraid to even go in front of you. So really you're just making it worse on yourself as far as the housebreaking process goes. (And I don't mean YOU you, it's just a general "you." No offense meant, unless you actually do hit her. Then A LOT of offense meant.)


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## Chikyuu (May 1, 2010)

Finkie_Mom said:


> Pups that young aren't supposed to be able to go up and down steps. If she falls, she could really get hurt as her bones are still developing. My dog can also go up steps, and I only let her if I'm right behind her. I don't even let her go down them - I pick her up and bring her down. Too much to lose if she falls.


So do you think I should carry her up AND down the front steps? I just wanted to get her accustomed to using them on her own and not spoiling her in that aspect.


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## Dog_Shrink (Sep 29, 2009)

First of all don't hit the dog for reasons already mentioned. Second if she's walking UP the steps then why carry her? Down is harder because puspdepth perception doesn't fully develop until closer to 20 months. 

Third, with potty training I go against the graina nd anyone here will tell you about my anti-crate rally for puppies (or any dog for that matter). Potty training is all about making the right choices, not compelling a dog to do something before they're physically able or tying yourself to a dog every waking moment because let's be serious here, is that really convenient (almost as convenient as waking up every 3 hours to let them out at night when you should be sleeping THEN you get to wean them off that shcedule and start the whole potty issue all over again when you do finally decide you need sleep)? BUT I'm not against the idea. I like to work smarter not harder.

Here's the solution of how people get their pups house broken in 2 weeks with minimal acidents. First don't use the crate use an x-pen. It gives the pup more room for much needed muscle development and it's large enough to include a potty area IN the x-pen (hence teaching the dog to make a CHOICE to do the right thing) 9 times out of 10 your pup really does want to please you and with proper direction can be paper trained (don't use pee pads, they're useless). This way if your pup HAS to go and you miss it or are sleeping he can go where he is suppose to. You've just established that there IS an acceptable potty area. Second benefit of paper training, you can take the soiled papers outside with you to mark the potty area. You should always leave at least 1 little pile of poo to attract the pup to the potty area. Encourage sniffing around and walking around maybe a little playing but not enough to distract from the task at hand. Movement stimulates bladder and bowel. HUGE praise and food rewards any time pup eliminates outside. This lets the pup know this pleases you. As the pup is in the priocess of pee'ing or poo'ing add the cue word "Go Potty/go pee/go poo" which ever you prefer. I like go potty as it encompasses the whole shebang. You want to add the cue words as the dog is in the process because THAT is what he will relate the cue to. Saying it when the dog has no clue really means nothing and might actually teach the dog to ignore the cue. 

Some of the biggest hurdles to overcome in potty training is... DON'T carry your pup to the door. Make her walk or she will not learn how to tell you she needs to go out. Most pups will start by sitting near the door that leads out to the potty area. Just about all mine have. Second, clean up any accident spots in the house with white vinegar/water solution (50/50) because white vinegar removes the biological element that draws pup back to accident spots. Lastly your pup can only hold her bladder for approximately 1 hour per month of age (example your dog is 3 months old she can hold it 3 hours). Larger breeds may be able to go a little longer, smaller breed might not be able to make it that long. 

Keep in mind that your pups bladder and urethral muscles aren't fully developed until 6 months of age so to expect complete training before then is only because you dog has learned what you want, not necessarly because they can hold it that long. Try to ignore accidents in the house as much as possible, of course interrupt those you catch in the act and scurry her outside asap but NEVER dicipline for potty accident. This will just teach the dog to hide it from you indoors and out and may have accidents from anxiety rather than bad training but you'd never know the difference, then you get into a correction cycle, dog pees, you dicipline, dogs anxiety levels raise so dog pees, you dicipline... see how it goes? EVERYTHING at this age HAS to be a positive experience. You wouldn't punish/hit a 2 year old child for being in diapers and not potty trained so why should we treat our pups any differently. Ask your mom about that one (sorry for the snarly but that one just really irritates me to no end. Beat the dog and they'll learn... yeah they'll learn alright, how to avoid and mis-trust you). 

Remember a good leader is firm but FAIR. You rarely ever see corporal punishment in the dog world and even when you do it is usually all show and display to diffuse the situation before it escalates to blows.


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## Chikyuu (May 1, 2010)

Shrink, I might have to get an x-pen, but to be honest my parents probably wouldn't listen to me if I had "heard from someone" an x-pen technique. There's no way for me to get to a feed store (since there really are no pet stores in my area) on my own, either.

And I'm kind of confused. Is the x-pen for when I can't watch her? And any other time she's allowed out of it? Does that mean she has to learn she can only pee on paper AND outside? That seems kind of a lot and confusing for a little puppy. What if she continues to do business off the paper even though it's right there for her to use? What if she's out n about outside the pen? Will she decide to go to the door to wanna go outside, or wanna go into her pen to go on the paper... I'm kind of confused at how you can do paper AND outside training at the same time.


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## lucidity (Nov 10, 2009)

Meh, my puppy never got confused on where he was allowed to pee. I gated my kitchen off and put his crate in there, along with pee pads in the corners. He only EVER peed on the pads (he was paper trained at the breeder's), and outside on the grass. You don't really need to get an x-pen. If you have an empty room that would work. Or a small area with tiled floors that you can gate off from the rest of your home.

From my experience, dogs like to pee on soft surfaces (paper, pads, carpet, grass). If you place the x-pen on tiled floor, she will most definitely go and pee on the pads instead of in her crate. Just put her crate in one corner of and pads in another. She will most likely decide to pee on the pads instead of in her crate or on the floor.

If you see her going to pee on the pads, immediately praise her and give her a treat. Don't close the crate door at all, I never did that except at night for a couple of months.


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## Chikyuu (May 1, 2010)

lucidity said:


> Meh, my puppy never got confused on where he was allowed to pee. I gated my kitchen off and put his crate in there, along with pee pads in the corners. He only EVER peed on the pads (he was paper trained at the breeder's), and outside on the grass. You don't really need to get an x-pen. If you have an empty room that would work. Or a small area with tiled floors that you can gate off from the rest of your home.
> 
> From my experience, dogs like to pee on soft surfaces (paper, pads, carpet, grass). If you place the x-pen on tiled floor, she will most definitely go and pee on the pads instead of in her crate. Just put her crate in one corner of and pads in another. She will most likely decide to pee on the pads instead of in her crate or on the floor.
> 
> If you see her going to pee on the pads, immediately praise her and give her a treat. Don't close the crate door at all, I never did that except at night for a couple of months.


I could try to gate-off the laundry room but it's really cut off from the rest of the house and a very lonely place, and the only other place besides that with tile is the bathroom, which is better, but that place gets a decent amount of people traffic during the day and whatnot.

And would pads be more enticing than newspaper? I got this housetraining spray that you spray on the place you want the puppy to doody on, I have no real idea if it does anything or not. Our original arrangement was to gate her off in the hallway that has doors to my room, the bathroom, and dad's computer room where he spends a decent amount of time, but that whole area (other than the bathroom) is carpeted. Does that mean it's more enticing to doody there? D:


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## lucidity (Nov 10, 2009)

I think that pads are better because they're more absorbent and the bottom is made out of plastic, so the pee doesn't seep through and dirty the floor as well.

The thing about crates/x pens is that they shd only be used when you're out/not able to watch your pup. So the laundry room is fine. Only put her there when you're busy or out, if its only for a couple of hours at a time, she shouldn't get too lonely. Puppies sleep a whole lot anyway!

When you're around and free, either watch her like a hawk while she's loose in the house, or tether her to you with a leash. If you see her starting to pee indoors, immediately interrupt her and bring her to the pee pads or outside to finish her business. Then give her a treat for pottying outside!


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## Robrowe (Jan 25, 2010)

My take on it is forget the paper and pads. training to go on paper or pads only prolongs housebreaking. This teaches pooch to go inside and next thing you know that newspaper that got left on the sofa will be soaked with urine. Puppy is far too young to hold it for several hours at a time. If she is going in the crate its simply too big. It should be just large enough for her to turn around in a lay down, no more. If you have too much room find something to block off the extra. The trick is to have her outside when she needs to go, not after she has gone. Within 30 minutes after eating, drinking, playing or waking up a natural colic reaction will trigger her to go so have her where she needs to be when its time to go. If she doesnt go put her in the crate and wait 10 minutes and do it again until she does go. For night time pick up food and water about 2 hours before bed time. Take her out right before bed time and be ready for at least one 2AM trip outside. If she doesnt wake you then you need to set your alarm and wake her to go out then put her back to bed. The crate method works great if implemented correctly. Dont leave her in the crate all the time. 3-4 hours max at a time. Murphy is quite fond of his crate after all the training was done and goes there to sleep or just get out from under foot when too many people are around. Its his safe haven and Den as dogs are Den animals. The door has long since been removed from the crate as its no longer needed.


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## Cracker (May 25, 2009)

As for the crate or no crate, I prefer crates for housetraining...but it is up to you what you think is best for your household. 

And ask your parents whether they ever hit you for accidents when you were an INFANT. What do they think diapers are for? It's because the baby CANNOT physically control his bladder and bowels and it is the same for puppies. Puppies do not come assembled and trained out of a box. (this rant is not at you, btw, but at your parents.)

That being said, any and all accidents that occur are a failure on the human's part, not the pup's. Supervision, management, adjustment of schedules and anticipation of the need to go are all key to housetraining a dog of any age. When in doubt, take em out. 

Keeping soft things out of the crate can help, puppies LIKE to pee on soft stuff. Limiting the amount of water before bed time (not removing ALL water, just watching how much they get) also helps. His bladder is likely no bigger than a shot glass and fills quickly, combine that with lack of muscular control and it's gotta pee RIGHT NOW! Keeping a chart of when they are fed, watered, when they pee and poo etc helps to anticipate the particular puppy's body schedule and allows you to figure out when is best for these things.


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## Dog_Shrink (Sep 29, 2009)

Robrowe said:


> My take on it is forget the paper and pads. training to go on paper or pads only prolongs housebreaking. This teaches pooch to go inside and next thing you know that newspaper that got left on the sofa will be soaked with urine.


This is inaccurate and if it is taking you longer to train a dog to go outside that was paper trained then you're not doing your job right. It's all about helping the dog make the proper choice since we as humans are lazy (well some are some are just too darm busy) and really don't keep the attention on our pups that we really need to,. I agree with lucidity and gating off a dog safe room (you explained that perfectly BTW Lucidity  ). I always confinement train all my pups and they are generally house broken by the time they are 4-5 months old. Generally papaers are only available to the dog during the times they are confined, other than that it is up to YOU to make sure you are taking dog out every time they eat, drink, wake up, play, exercise, chew on a toy (chewing stinulates bowel movements) and every 2 hours in between (if they're not sleeping. If sleeping let a sleeping dog lie). paper training does NOT teach the dog that it is ok to go in the house, it teaches dog that there is SPECIFIC acceptable areas that they can potty. Doesn't ANYONE remember how dogs wer house trained before the crate became so popular and misused. The whole premice behind it is skewed. It compells pup to hold it, because they don't like to mess where they sleep (Sorry but my a$$) that may bode true for a fully developed juvenile (6-8 mos old) or adult dog but not for pups. Remember the last thing they had for potty training was momma licking them to stimulate them to go so they went wherever they were. IT causes more psychological trauma than help because most people misuse their crates. Dogs should never really spend more than 5 hours (and that's even pushing it) in their crates and they have even been banned in many places thru out europe and the netherlands. We seriously should follow their lead. 

To the OP... THe best scent marke you can use for your pup is her own waste. Blot up pee or take a little poo and keep it on the paper. I usually soak up some pee with a paper towel and put it in between layers of the papers. They usually can hold bowel longer than bladder so I rarely ever had a poo on the paper in the house.


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## Chikyuu (May 1, 2010)

I let her out early this morning and she went, then I let her inside and she peed on the carpet about 15 minutes later. I clapped, yelled, said HEY! AH AH! And she just stared at me and then layed down, completely finishing on the carpet. There's no response from her with the vocal correction at all! She completely ignores it!


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## Dog_Shrink (Sep 29, 2009)

You have been told NOT TO CORRECT THE DOG! clapping and yelling are only going to teach the dog to FEAR you. She cowered down and likely finished pee'ing out of fear. You needed to take her BACK outside as she obviously hadn't completely finished her business. Of course she's going to completely ignroe it, she has no cluse what you're doing aside of going crazy and she responded totally appropriately "hey big mean loud person don't eat me, see I'll make myself as small as I can and Pee on top of it to show you that I'm nothing in this world. Please jsut leave me alone". Also if she's doing frequent small diluted pale yellow looking pee's then you absolutely need to have her checked for a UTI. What did she do in that 15 minutes between coming in from outside potty and the accident on the rug? Eat? Drink? Play? Run? What... You're not listening and you're going to make this harder than it needs to be.


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## Chikyuu (May 1, 2010)

Dog_Shrink said:


> You have been told NOT TO CORRECT THE DOG! clapping and yelling are only going to teach the dog to FEAR you. She cowered down and likely finished pee'ing out of fear. You needed to take her BACK outside as she obviously hadn't completely finished her business. Of course she's going to completely ignroe it, she has no cluse what you're doing aside of going crazy and she responded totally appropriately "hey big mean loud person don't eat me, see I'll make myself as small as I can and Pee on top of it to show you that I'm nothing in this world. Please jsut leave me alone". Also if she's doing frequent small diluted pale yellow looking pee's then you absolutely need to have her checked for a UTI. What did she do in that 15 minutes between coming in from outside potty and the accident on the rug? Eat? Drink? Play? Run? What... You're not listening and you're going to make this harder than it needs to be.


Sorry, I thought* vocal* correction was needed as opposed to *physical*. I've read from many places she needed a firm "ah ah" when she does something wrong like chew on a box or pee inside to distract her and tell her I don't want her to do something. 

I can't just immediately take her from the ground to the paper or outside, because then she just keeps peeing and there will be a long line of pee along the floor and by the time I get back it'll soak in and I won't be able to see it to clean it with cleaner. It happened one time while she was pooing as well, I picked her up and immediately went for the door and there was a long line of poop along the floor to clean. Also that means she finishes in the air in my hands and she doesn't finish where she's supposed to, so I can't treat her for finishing in the right place. That's one of the main problems.

And I can't see the color of her pee anyway because our rug is a darker color.


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## Chikyuu (May 1, 2010)

Finkie_Mom said:


> Don't pick her up while she's going, rather try to stop her in her tracks by saying "ah ah!" loud, clapping, making a loud noise, etc. Then pick her up, take her outside, let her finish, and then praise/treat (let her know she's amazing and did a great job).





redyrerottweilers said:


> 6) If you catch the puppy IN THE ACT of eliminating in your house, CLAP YOUR HANDS, say AH AH, OUTSIDE!! And immediately rush her outside. If she finishes there, do your usual food reward and praise


 This coming from the housetraining *sticky* on this forum.


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## Robrowe (Jan 25, 2010)

There are many methods and you will run across many opinions as well. 
Shrink I am against the pads and paper as it is training the pup, dog or any other animal that its OK to go inside on anything in the floor. If it works for you though I would say stick with it. When I tried it it took me longer and accidents were more often found on paper, bath mats, entry rugs etc. I used the crate with Murphy and it does speed things up but before crates it was a similar confinement in a small space until house broken. According to most professional trainers a dog is not considered house broken until 12 weeks with no accidents so if your dog is house broken at 5 months that means they didnt have any accidents from 8 weeks on and I find that phenominal. Murphy was fairly reliable after 12 weeks old with a month under his belt but still had an accident or two past that, mostly due to his still growing body and bladder. No paper or potty pads were used...Just a lot of time, patience and trips outside, he never once soiled his crate. Murphy made his 12 weeks with no accidents at 7 months so his last accident was around 4 months. He was still needing to go out in the middle of the night at that point but he was waking me up when he needed to go, would go out and do his business immidiately and right back in and back to bed.

If you take puppy out and she goes then comes in and goes again try staying out a little longer next time. Remember no play time until the work is done and give lots of praise. If you catch them in the act inside You should get their attention and whisk them back out the door but you dont want to scare them. Correcting them by startling them will eventually lead to puppy thinking its wrong to go in front of you and you will soon find puddles and puppy McNuggets behind your sofa and puppy not going when you take them out and are in sight of them.


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## Dog_Shrink (Sep 29, 2009)

Chikyuu said:


> This coming from the housetraining *sticky* on this forum.


That sticky is absolutely wrong. You CAN interupt a behavior such as chewing on inappropriate objects or getting into things like that because you do want that moment of suprise to break them from the behavior so you can redirect them but in potty training you DO NOT want to scare them because then and esp. at this age you could start a cycle of anxiety or submissive pee'ing if you scare them too much, plus interupt the building of trust and respect relationship. Maybe (and a big maybe) a realy soft ah ah could be used but I wouldn't yell. The best way to stop a pup from going when you pick them up is not to dangle them but to scoop them so they're actually kind of cradled. your one hand around their chest with their shoulder blades pressed agaisnt your chest, your other under their butt holding it upward (imagine sittniing a chair).


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## Chikyuu (May 1, 2010)

Robrowe said:


> There are many methods and you will run across many opinions as well.
> Shrink I am against the pads and paper as it is training the pup, dog or any other animal that its OK to go inside on anything in the floor. If it works for you though I would say stick with it. When I tried it it took me longer and accidents were more often found on paper, bath mats, entry rugs etc. I used the crate with Murphy and it does speed things up but before crates it was a similar confinement in a small space until house broken. According to most professional trainers a dog is not considered house broken until 12 weeks with no accidents so if your dog is house broken at 5 months that means they didnt have any accidents from 8 weeks on and I find that phenominal. Murphy was fairly reliable after 12 weeks old with a month under his belt but still had an accident or two past that, mostly due to his still growing body and bladder. No paper or potty pads were used...Just a lot of time, patience and trips outside, he never once soiled his crate. Murphy made his 12 weeks with no accidents at 7 months so his last accident was around 4 months. He was still needing to go out in the middle of the night at that point but he was waking me up when he needed to go, would go out and do his business immidiately and right back in and back to bed.
> 
> If you take puppy out and she goes then comes in and goes again try staying out a little longer next time. Remember no play time until the work is done and give lots of praise. If you catch them in the act inside You should get their attention and whisk them back out the door but you dont want to scare them. Correcting them by startling them will eventually lead to puppy thinking its wrong to go in front of you and you will soon find puddles and puppy McNuggets behind your sofa and puppy not going when you take them out and are in sight of them.


That's the thing though. I can't just pick her up and take her out in the act, pee will go EVERYWHERE and she will finish while I'm holding her, then when I set her outside she'll just stare at me.

And shrink, I'll try to cradle her next time and hope she doesn't pee all over herself. Here's hoping.

And you really gotta cut me some slack. I'm 16 years old and this is the first puppy I've had where it's basically all my own responsibility to raise and take care of it. It wasn't even really my idea if you read my first thread (I don't know if you did.) But my parents got this dog for me as a surprise. I still want to keep her, but it is a little confusing with all the different ways to pottytrain.


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## Cracker (May 25, 2009)

Chikyuu,
There is a lot of trial and error that goes into training and potty training. In MOST puppies of a CERTAIN age, a startle will stop the flow, but in ones that are still really young or in fearful or shy puppies the startle can have the opposite effect. 
If puppy is not "empty" (it doesn't take long to fill up the thimble bladder) it may be a good idea to let her roam a bit outside after her initial pee, to move whatever else is still there out. 
So, it looks like this:
It's time to take pup out for a pee.
You leash her and take her out, pick a spot and wait for a pee or poo and then reward it with a treat. 
THEN: go for a little walk, play with the pup a bit or just let her sniff around a bit at the end of the leash for a little while. She will most likely pee again, reward her AGAIN and then go inside with her. If you can spend some time again with her then, great. If not, then crate her or otherwise confine her with a chewy and do it all again the next time. 
It is not uncommon for people to get the one pee, go back inside, puppy is left loose and runs around a bit and then boom, more pee. Movement stimulates the bladder and bowels.


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## Crantastic (Feb 3, 2010)

I like Ian Dunbar's Errorless Housetraining. I used his method with my puppy and Casper has had maybe five accidents total in the five weeks I've had him (four of the accidents were just pee). All of those were my fault as I didn't follow the instructions perfectly and didn't take the pup out when I should have known he'd be due for a pee.


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## Samtastic13 (May 12, 2010)

I Wouldn't stress too much hun, I know it can be frustrating, Im going through it with my 12 week year old Cattle dog right now. Sometimes you want to just pull your hair out. Murphy Will go outside, spend ten minutes out there pee, poop. Come back inside and pee three more times. Ive spent hours on websites, reading this reading that, watching this youtube video and talking to countless people I know with dogs, who have potty trained them.

Ultimately, while it'll be frustrating for the time being, you need to figure out what works for YOUR dog. All these methods Im sure have worked, and could be useful, combinding them and what not, but your dog might need another, like Cracker said it's a lot of trial and error. My lab, Leia never had to be potty trained, and she's and indoor dog I got at eight weeks, seven years ago. She just doesn't,no one taught her, She has one spot in the yard and she sticks to that one spot. I had an 8 month Chihuahua for awhile who peed, and pooped everywhere, no matter what we tried She just couldn't get it, (or rather, I couldnt figure out how to get through to her) and Now Murphy, he pees everywhere, very rarely poops. He's only had one poop accident in the house and we've had him for about 3-4 weeks. So see, thats just three of my dogs and they were all at differant levels and different personalities. 

Don't take to much of it to heart. If snapping for fingers, Saying Ah-Ah No In the midsts of the pee works for your pup, do it, if it doesnt then don't. I did read on a website something you might want to try, When your dog pees, You go through the No No Ah Ah stuff, you then put them on their leash and make them watch you clean it up, theres no need to rub their nose in it or anything, just make sure their paying attention. Soak up the pee with a rag or paper towel, walk them outside on the leash, and place the item where you want them to potty, and praise them. 

Or you can try this method that seems very similar 
http://www.dogchatforum.com/toilet-training-puppy.htm

I hope it all works out for you, get to know your pup, and patience, Don't stress too much about it and don't let anyones opinion on your method get to you, as long as your not abusing your pup your fine, what works for you and your dog, is what works.


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## FKAPRSOA (May 5, 2010)

I correct with vocalisation _and_ with a water spray. I have successfully trained umpteen rescues and never had an issue with them becoming too scared to toilet in front of me. A dog, by it's very nature, will correct with force. Mum growls and will snap at her babies to correct, leaders will growl and snap at subordinates to correct. 

In my opinion, humans have just decided to take the positive training methods to extremes. We've done the same with human children, and now we are trying to do it with canines.

The only time enforcement will fail is when the forced correction outweighs the ratio of positive training. ie - you yell/correct more than you praise.


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## Dog_Shrink (Sep 29, 2009)

Using harsher methods with an older dog is totally different than disciplining a 10 week old puppy. An older dog is past their fear periods and correction isn't going to leave as much of an indelible mark. .


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## FKAPRSOA (May 5, 2010)

Yes, an adult is different to a 10 week old puppy...but not all rescues are adults.


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## Dog_Shrink (Sep 29, 2009)

FKAPRSOA said:


> Yes, an adult is different to a 10 week old puppy...but not all rescues are adults.


Well the topic was about a 10 week old puppy so I certainly hope you wouldn't use those methods on a dog that young.


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## FKAPRSOA (May 5, 2010)

Dog_Shrink said:


> Well the topic was about a 10 week old puppy so I certainly hope you wouldn't use those methods on a dog that young.


I wouldn't have a 10 week old pup wandering freely in my home so the toileting would not be issue. However, yes, I use vocalisation and water spray to train my dogs, regardless of age. 

Obviously though age does play a part in the equation, as does any physical or emotional need of the dog I am training. My methods are adjusted with each individual case, however it is safe to say that I believe enforcement methods work when combined with positive training methods.

Interestingly, most people can determine what works best for them and their situation without resorting to abuse.


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## pottypuppy (Jul 27, 2011)

This is a wonderful piece of how to potty train a puppy work, that I really enjoy and something that I've learnt a great deal from. I am going to do my best to spread this great work to as many people as possible.


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