# First Time Dog Owner/Wants "Masculine Dog"!



## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

Sup everybody?

Basically my situation is like this: I have a huge interest in dogs from either the molossers breeds, bulldog breeds or bull terrier breeds and I need help searching for the ones that will best suit a first time owner like me as I know most of these dogs are rather dfficult to manage and I just can't pick out one from the blue.

So yeh. I also live in an apartment that needs to be taken into account.

Thanks in advance!


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## Inga (Jun 16, 2007)

I think your biggest hurdle might be having a dog that is not restricted from most apartments. Have you spoken to your landlord to find out if there are any restrictions? What exercise requirements are you comfortable dealing with? Training? Are you going to be taking your dog to training classes and making the commitment to work with the dog daily? Socializing? All of these things must be taken into consideration when looking into breeds. Grooming is another consideration. What are your thoughts on all of these things?


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## TooneyDogs (Aug 6, 2007)

Plus the extra costs to maintain the larger breeds.....everything from crates, food, vet care, medications.


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## Marsh Muppet (Nov 29, 2008)

As a first time dog owner, there is a great deal to consider about getting a dog who is strong enough to hurt someone. And I'm not talking about viscous dogs. I'm talking about a dog jumping on an elderly woman's back to hump her, and breaking her hip. 

There's nothing masculine about having a rough looking dog you can't control. Especially when there are 12 year old girls who can get a big dog hoppin' and poppin'.

Dogs don't really work as fashion accessories.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

> Dogs don't really work as fashion accessories.


I agree. Getting a dog because it looks masculine is about the worst reason to get one. It's right up there with choosing which dog would look best in your purse....


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## Rowdy (Sep 2, 2007)

One of most masculine men I've met in a while was this big, burly, Harley-dude who had the cutest little Yorkie. The dog had a little helmet and would ride on the gas tank of the bike. The guy's cool factor for having that little dog was right through the roof, much more than if he'd had a pitbull or some giant breed. (Plus he was a nice guy, but that's another topic...) The point is, it's what's inside you that determines "masculinity" not what's on the other end of the leash.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Rowdy said:


> One of most masculine men I've met in a while was this big, burly, Harley-dude who had the cutest little Yorkie. The dog had a little helmet and would ride on the gas tank of the bike. The guy's cool factor for having that little dog was right through the roof, much more than if he'd had a pitbull or some giant breed. (Plus he was a nice guy, but that's another topic...) The point is, it's what's inside you that determines "masculinity" not what's on the other end of the leash.


 *Biker* *Dogs* Motorcycle Club Member - *Bandit* 
Similar story, but with a Boston. Bandit rode in a specially built pillion seat behind his owner for many years, unfortunately "Bandit The Biker dog" died recently of Lymphoma. I know several other bikers that have small dogs that ride with them, breeds that include Pomerania's, Yorkie's and Chihuahuas, I'd dare anyone to tell the owners they aren't 'masculine' (a couple I know are actually members of outlaw clubs).

http://www.bikerdogsmc.org/


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

Inga said:


> I think your biggest hurdle might be having a dog that is not restricted from most apartments. Have you spoken to your landlord to find out if there are any restrictions? What exercise requirements are you comfortable dealing with? Training? Are you going to be taking your dog to training classes and making the commitment to work with the dog daily? Socializing? All of these things must be taken into consideration when looking into breeds. Grooming is another consideration. What are your thoughts on all of these things?


Yes, yes and yes. I know all about all this, trust me. Ive been doing research for days now and plan on continuing for a couple of months before I go ahead and actually get the dog(my current situation isnt the best also).

And what's wrong with choosing a breed because I like its physical charactheristics? Its not like Im only taking that into account, hence why I made this thread.. Damn, I hoped Id at least have one suggestion by the time I logged back in and not just guys telling me about how you can still look cool with a chiuaua. Those are not my choices because I can look cool with them but because I just simply like them. And most of them just happen to look very masculine.

I concur that my title made me look a bit like a poser tough lol, so yeh, please advise me if you believe none of these like 20 dogs are adequate for first time owners but just dont bash my reasons unjustifiably.


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## FilleBelle (Aug 1, 2007)

Perhaps if you told us what you are looking for in a dog besides a masculine appearance, we could recommend a breed for you. What is it that you like about the bully breeds?


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

What size dog do you want?

Does it need to be a bullie breed or would you go for a working breed dog that may be easier to train?

What breed restrictions are there in your town?

What breed or weight restrictions in your apartment complex?

Yes, your phrasing did make you look like a 'poser' actually it's how many trolls like to start on our forum.


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

Like I said, Im just looking for easiest ones to manage really. As for sizing, medium is preferable.

Im really liking the bull terrier and boxer at the moment.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Both are great dogs and both are VERY high energy. 

Are you looking to rescue or get one from a breeder?


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## Reptyle (Aug 9, 2009)

I always like the quote, "Forget the dog, beware of the owner!"

I own two American Bulldogs, which I guess you could say is a "tough" breed, but I consider them companions, and an early warning system, more than I do a status symbol. I hail from Texas, where everyone owns a gun, so if people come around with the evil on their minds, then another quote comes to mind:

”Be not afraid of any man no matter what his size; when danger threatens, call on me, and I will equalize.” (Inscribed on the 1873 Colt Peacemaker)

My point, in a round about sort of way, is that even a little dog can sound the alarm if someone approaches...It is my opinion that little dogs often sound off before the big ones do...Maybe it's a nervous thing on their part.


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## canteloupe (Apr 30, 2009)

Can you describe how much time you can put into exercising the dog each day? And what types of activities you would do during this time? (eg, walking, running, biking, playing fetch, etc.) I think this is the most important factor in matching a dog to a person.


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

Hellenbegger Im definitely going to check out my local shelters first and see whatsup.

Canteloupe As of right im just in the researching stage. But in a couple of months to a year, when I plan on getting the dog, Ill be able to provide him with all the time he needs.

So yeh, besides the boxer and bull terrier, what else do u guys would recomand?


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## skelaki (Nov 9, 2006)

You still have not answered some questions meant to assist in advising on breeds:
1. Are there any breed restrictions where you live? This would include things such as breed bans (city, county, state and apartment).
2. How much exercise are you willing and able to give the dog?
3. How much grooming do you want to do?
Many of the breed-types you like are not recommended for first time dog owners.


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## d9v1f4c (Sep 6, 2009)

You need to reply to the other members questions. They will help you tremendously, regardless of the questions thought, I strongly recommend as a first time dog owner that you do not get a known aggressive breed or large breed unless you have an extensive amount of experience with them, they are very difficult to handle/train and etc as a first time dog owner. There are several other breeds out there that have a"masculine" look but are not typically aggressive.


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

skelaki said:


> You still have not answered some questions meant to assist in advising on breeds:
> 1. Are there any breed restrictions where you live? This would include things such as breed bans (city, county, state and apartment).
> 2. How much exercise are you willing and able to give the dog?
> 3. How much grooming do you want to do?
> Many of the breed-types you like are not recommended for first time dog owners.


Im sorry.

1.Yes, pitbulls and their crossbreeds. Does that include pitbulls lookalikes like SBTs?

2.2-4 hours depending on the day. However I cant really be sure right now.

3.Average I guess.

4.I know, hence my thread .



d9v1f4c said:


> You need to reply to the other members questions. They will help you tremendously, regardless of the questions thought, I strongly recommend as a first time dog owner that you do not get a known aggressive breed or large breed unless you have an extensive amount of experience with them, they are very difficult to handle/train and etc as a first time dog owner. There are several other breeds out there that have a"masculine" look but are not typically aggressive.


Like?

And Id like to know how bull terriers are, DA tendencies aside. Like as far trainning and everything else goes?


Thank you.


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## d9v1f4c (Sep 6, 2009)

1. Boxer - VERY Energetic fun dogs, must be able to exercise daily.

2. Mastiff - Awesome dogs but not recommended for you because of the large breed, and is a gentle giant but if not trained/handled correctly could become aggressive.

3. Siberian Husky - Don't know too much about them.

4. Doberman Pinscher -Don't know too much about them, could also become aggressive.

Note: Any dog can become aggressive, it's just some breeds naturally tend to become aggressive, which is the reason some of them were bred, to be aggressive (i.e. pit bull) 

Regardless, whatever you do chose, make sure you do a lot of research on the particular breeds you are considering, it will help you considerably in the long run.


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## Martiniz (Jul 12, 2009)

TheGame said:


> Im sorry.
> 
> 1.Yes, pitbulls and their crossbreeds. Does that include pitbulls lookalikes like SBTs?
> 
> ...


So you want a masculine dog?

I suggest the Cane Corso. Very muscular. This dog may look masculine, but he does not have a "fighting mentality" like pitbulls. So he will not go out looking for a fight. So you do not need to worry about aggression, but you have to train and socialize them well when they are pups. Also, this dog is very smart and very trainable. And another quality I like about this dog is, they don't wonder away from home. They stay close to their owners. Cane Corso makes good watch/guard dogs. They have a very stable temperament and very good with children. These dogs are gentle giants. 

Bull terriers were once bred to fight, but not anymore. They will protect you when you're really in trouble but they weren't orginally bred to be guard dogs. You have to spend a lot of time with this breed because they do not like to be left alone. They become attached to you. This breed enjoys doing something with the family. You have to socialize them while they are young or they will turn out very agressive. I don't suggest this breed for first time owners because this breed is difficult to train. 

Hope that helped.


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## skelaki (Nov 9, 2006)

If there is a breed ban for Pits and mixes, you'll probably find that it includes any dog that even remotely resembles a Pit, and that the decision as to whether or not it is a banned breed/mix will be up to someone who can't tell a Boxer from a Komondor (slight exaggeration there I hope). This basically means that most, if not all the breeds that appeal to you might be off limits as long as you live where you do unless you can fight and get the BSL repealed.

It sounds as if you'll have enough time for exercise and training so that's a positive. I would say for grooming, stick to short-haired breeds. You might check into Smooth Fox Terriers, Boston Terriers, miniature Bull terriers (check the BSL on this one), or possibly even well-bred Pugs.


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## Marsh Muppet (Nov 29, 2008)

TG: don't take offense at my answer. I just get a little nervous when I hear people who want a dog primarily for the way it looks. Back in the 1980s, black and white were the designated colors for haute coture, and Dalmatians were suddenly all the rage in certain neighborhoods of NYC. If you know Dalmatians, you know they are among the worst apartment dogs. They rarely work out well for first time owners, but these people buying them weren't even dog people. They just wanted a "thing" to go with their outfits. Granted, that level of cluelessness is not normally seen outside of certain precincts.

More typical would be the retired couple I knew who just couldn't live without a Bearded Collie. That's a great, fun dog for the right family, but they had no inkling what they were stepping into. They were not idiots, either. The good news was: they had the time and resources to do the right thing, and they eventually took the dog to classes and had a 1-on-1 trainer come in 5 days per week. It turned out to be a happy ending, but they thought the pup was demonically possessed for most of that first year.

So, that's why my radar lights up when I read a question like yours.


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

I just called my city's animal protection society and apprently bull terriers are banned too. That puts my research back to step zero(i basically only wanted that)..Im propably just gonna end up adpoting a random breed.

Im open for any recomandations now tough .

Edit: Marsh, none taken. I understand ur concern tough I think ive made it pretty clear that Im looking deeper than that.

Edit: I like work dogs.


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## Marsh Muppet (Nov 29, 2008)

How about Bull Mastiffs? Or is anything with "Bull" in the name covered? English Bull Mastiffs tend to be somewhat low key, but their temperaments run from "mush" through "menace". Any dog with that kind of physical strength has to be socialized to within an inch of its life. An excessively shy one can be quite dangerous. There is also the "drool factor" to be considered. They are not at the top of the list of trainable dogs, but if you have the time to put in, you can beat the odds.


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

Well, the girl on the phone basically said to me anything that ressembles a pitbull. Which basically eliminates 3/4 of the molossers and bull/terriers.

But im looking into mastiffs right now thank you.

Ok. After another searching and analizing session, Ive come up with those breeds that I think satisfy my needs both physhically and personality wise.

Plz take a look and gimme ur suggestions:

Olde Boston Bulldogge http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/oldebostonbulldogge.htm
Boxer http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/boxer.htm
Banter Bulldog http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/banterbulldogge.htm
Ole English Bulldogge http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/oldeenglishbulldogge.htm
American Bulldog http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/americanbulldog.htm
and Catahoula Bulldog http://www.dogbreedinfo.com/catahoulabulldog.htm

Ranking them from 1-6 would be nice too thx.


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## pugmom (Sep 10, 2008)

off the top of my head .....your going to have a hard time w/bsl if you go with the Banter(I have never heard of them before or seen one)....very bully looking to the average joe

Catahoula bulldog is not a breed...its just a mix so its hard to say what you would get


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## FilleBelle (Aug 1, 2007)

If you can't have anything resembling a pitty, I'm guessing they won't let you have an Am Bully or Am Bully mix. Half the dogs on your list are going to be near impossible to find because they aren't AKC breeds....or breeds at all, as far as I can tell.

A Boxer wouldn't be a bad idea, if you can give it pleeeenty of exercise. They are generally pretty compliant and friendly animals, but they are ALWAYS full of go-go-go.

The same could be said of a Lab, actually. A nice, big dog...generally friendly and willing to please, but with high exercise requirements. They shed a lot, too.

Seems like a shelter dog that you clicked with would fit you well.


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## winniec777 (Apr 20, 2008)

Laurelin said:


> I agree. Getting a dog because it looks masculine is about the worst reason to get one. It's right up there with choosing which dog would look best in your purse....


I think Poca looks good in my purse. The part of her that fits, anyway.


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## Marsh Muppet (Nov 29, 2008)

I always chuckle to myself when I hear that somebody wants a "manly" dog. I could introduce you to a 14 lb. Jack Russell Terrier who has not yet met the carbon-based lifeform that can intimidate him. He certainly doesn't want for attitude.


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## Equinox (Nov 11, 2008)

I think coming on a dog forum and looking for advice is a good start. Doing research is what a lot of dog owners don't do. I can honestly tell you I picked the German shepherd partially based on their appearance. I also can tell you the reason I'm not a fan of toy breeds is also based on their size, appearance, and general association with frilly, girly things (yes, I'm a girl). Of course, there's also other traits in the toy breeds I don't especially like, and I did choose a German shepherd based more on their temperament and trainability and less on their physical appearance. 

It's not a sin for appearance to play a role in choosing a dog, as long as to look tough isn't the big factor. 




Rowdy said:


> One of most masculine men I've met in a while was this big, burly, Harley-dude who had the cutest little Yorkie. The dog had a little helmet and would ride on the gas tank of the bike. The guy's cool factor for having that little dog was right through the roof, much more than if he'd had a pitbull or some giant breed. (Plus he was a nice guy, but that's another topic...) The point is, it's what's inside you that determines "masculinity" not what's on the other end of the leash.


haha, that reminds me of the time I walked Trent through Home Depot. This big tough looking guy with a leather jacket came up to me and asked to pet Trent. Trent loved him, and then the guy proceeded to tell me about his own dog, a tiny rat terrier puppy. He was showing me all these pictures of his terrier on his cellphone and telling me how much he loved dogs and all the cute dogs he's had. What a great guy! Not a doubt about his masculinity either.

There is another tough looking guy who walks his Pomeranian down the block. HUGE girl magnet.


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## chriley58 (Mar 9, 2009)

Go to your local shelter and look at black dogs. There are tons of them in shelters as many think that black dogs are intimidating looking! Go for a big, black dog and you have masculing and intimidating.


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## canteloupe (Apr 30, 2009)

Based on everything the OP has said, I think a boxer would be the best choice. Some of the other dogs that have been suggested aren't great first dogs. He said he could devote 2-4 hours a day to exercising the dog, so I think a boxer would work.

I see boxers and boxer mixes at the shelters pretty often, so you should check it out.

I recommend reading up on dog behavior and training before you get the dog. There are a lot of basic mistakes you could make at the beginning that would have far-reaching repercussions.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Cane Corso is NOT. A bred I'd reccomend for a first time dog owner. They are a 'hard'. Astiff and have a strong gaurdiqn instinct making them prone to aggression problems. 

SBT's are considered 'Pit Bull' types and are often included in pit bans as are most of the 'Bull terriers'.


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## Inga (Jun 16, 2007)

cshellenberger said:


> Cane Corso is NOT. A bred I'd reccomend for a first time dog owner. They are a 'hard'. Astiff and have a strong gaurdiqn instinct making them prone to aggression problems.
> 
> SBT's are considered 'Pit Bull' types and are often included in pit bans as are most of the 'Bull terriers'.


I agree completely! What about a German Shepherd dog? They will still require a lot of socialization and training but I think they are quite adaptable and easier to train then some of the other "guard type" dogs.


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## canteloupe (Apr 30, 2009)

cshellenberger said:


> Cane Corso is NOT. A bred I'd reccomend for a first time dog owner. They are a 'hard'


That's the breed I was the most concerned about when I said I thought some of the breeds being recommended were not good first-timers.


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## Mr Pooch (Jan 28, 2008)

Inga i wouldnt recommend a GSD either.
SBT are easy to train but like Carla said they will fall into the "pit bull type" when it comes to BSL and are prone to DA like the APBT,something i cant see somebody who wants a dog for its looks dealing with.

Carla how about English bulldogs?


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## Inga (Jun 16, 2007)

Really Pooch? From a BSL standpoint or other. Most of the GSD's I know (quite a few) have been really pretty easy to deal with. From a training standpoint. They are more "willing" then some of the other breeds. Hair is the biggest thing that keeps me from owning one. I think they are great dogs otherwise. Xeph would shoot me if I got one and then kept is shaved. ha ha

I don't think GSD's are as commonly targeted as the Bullies anymore. 

English are great dogs but I doubt you will ever find one in a shelter. They are not as often in rescues either. Buying one from a breeder will set you back at least $1,500.


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## zimandtakandgrrandmimi (May 8, 2008)

whoa....some wacky generalizations made about ppits here...


anyways....

OP...

you are really best off hopping on down to the shelter and spending some time volunteering and *getting to know the dogs there.* Volunteer to be a dogwalker. that way you get a chance to actually interact with dogs, see their personalities AND get an idea of what its like to care for each individual dog and what their issues are if any. 

if you were going to a breeder I would suggest talking to a quality breeder of hunting curs about a retired dog that needs a home.


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## Martiniz (Jul 12, 2009)

cshellenberger said:


> Cane Corso is NOT. A bred I'd reccomend for a first time dog owner. They are a 'hard'. Astiff and have a strong gaurdiqn instinct making them prone to aggression problems.
> 
> SBT's are considered 'Pit Bull' types and are often included in pit bans as are most of the 'Bull terriers'.


It says on dogbreedinfo.com that they are very trainable and smart. I'm guessing if they are very trainable, a first time dog owner could handle it...


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## Marsh Muppet (Nov 29, 2008)

Martiniz said:


> It says on dogbreedinfo.com that they are very trainable and smart. I'm guessing if they are very trainable, a first time dog owner could handle it...


Labs are among the kings and queens of trainability, but many first time owners have to be put on suicide watch after bringing home their little bundle of crazy. That goes double for Border Collies. "Trainable" does not necessarily equal "easy".


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## canteloupe (Apr 30, 2009)

Marsh Muppet said:


> Labs are among the kings and queens of trainability, but many first time owners have to be put on suicide watch after bringing home their little bundle of crazy. That goes double for Border Collies. "Trainable" does not necessarily equal "easy".


Ha! I know one such new lab puppy owner right now... Maybe I'd better give her a call...


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## MissMutt (Aug 8, 2008)

If you have BSL in your area, that will definitely include American Pit Bull Terriers, American Staffordshire Terriers, Staffordshire Bull Terriers, [English] Bull Terriers, and their crosses. Fact is, the BSL people LIST the breeds, but it really comes down to apprearance.. you know, they have "experts" on this kind of stuff 

I wouldn't recommend a Cane Corso either, or a Fila, or a Presa, or a Dogo, or any comparable mastiff breed.. Carla is right, they are NOT for first time owners at all..

Honestly, before you make any decisions, I'd call up and ask about whatever specific breed you're thinking of. I'd think American Bulldog would fall under BSL restrictions, and you may have a problem with some of the other bulldog breeds you mentioned as well.

To me, Boxer seems like the best choice, as long as you can meet its energy requirements. I do, honestly, feel like you're going into this somewhat blindly though. No offense.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

Boxer or even a boston terrier are the best options listed so far. Many mastiffs, Am Bullies, GSDs, dobes, etc are hard to rent with too. I know, I am in an apartment and I really wanted a GSD but you just can't rent with them. Stay away from anything that looks 'pittie' because most people can't tell the difference. I'm not sure what would happen if you had registration papers saying it wasn't a pit bull, but I wouldn't risk it. 

Boxers are great dogs and typically have less of a stigma attached to them.

Corsos in my opinion are a terrible choice as are presas, tosas, filas, boerboels, etc. Definitely not for a first time owner or a renter. Renting agencies I've noticed are really cracking down on these breeds as they're becoming more popular. I have a horrible fear they might be the next 'pit bull' and villainized and popularized by the media. Then I think we'll see many more issues than we do with pit bulls. Pits are so much easier than these breeds.


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## canteloupe (Apr 30, 2009)

Laurelin said:


> Corsos in my opinion are a terrible choice as are presas, tosas, filas, boerboels, etc. Definitely not for a first time owner or a renter. Renting agencies I've noticed are really cracking down on these breeds as they're becoming more popular. I have a horrible fear they might be the next 'pit bull' and villainized and popularized by the media. Then I think we'll see many more issues than we do with pit bulls. Pits are so much easier than these breeds.


I completely agree. I was just thinking the other day that I've noticed an increase in their popularity -- and an increase in reports of problems. And I totally agree that molossers in wrong hands would be a much bigger problem than pits in the wrong hands.


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## ChrisS (Aug 19, 2009)

Marsh Muppet said:


> Labs are among the kings and queens of trainability, but many first time owners have to be put on suicide watch after bringing home their little bundle of crazy. That goes double for Border Collies. "Trainable" does not necessarily equal "easy".


LOL, this is so true. My "little bundle of crazy" has me almost to that point. Actually, my husband more than me. He keeps threatening to take Riley out back and shoot him (He's not serious and would never harm a dog just venting his frustration). We're both 1st time dog owners and the last three weeks with our lab have been a lesson in patience for sure. We knew going in that he'd be a handful but even after years of thinking about getting a dog (but waiting until the situation was right for one), months of research, and reading every dog training book at our library I'm still not sure we knew what we were getting into. And this is an "easily trainable" breed from a smart trainable field line.


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## Billiie (Jan 16, 2008)

Yep, agree on the no-Corso... def. not a first time dog. I wanted one, and still do, but decided on an AB for right now. I have a lot of learning to do, and I really couldn't find that right breeder in my area that I could trust getting a CC from.

Anyway, I think a Boxer would be a fine choice  I had a Boxer, and he was the best dog I ever had. And some are a lot less energetic that others. My boy would gladly lay on the couch all day if I left him.. or in a minute he would be up ready for a long walk. And you wont have that BSL problem with a Boxer (for the most part) because people are more and more recognizing them.

I also have a AB.. and if you did decide on an american bulldog, go for a more bully/Johnson looking one. There are two types (well, more like 5, but these two are most popular) - the Johnson, which looks more like an oversized Boxer, or the Scott's/standard, which more looks like a Pit. My boy, is more standard/hybrid, meaning he is combination of the Johnson/Scott's. I personally like the more bully look, but I opted for a hybrid because I found a breeder I trusted and he had great dogs. So if you decide you might want to look into the AB, stick with a breeder who works with the bully lines.. that way at least you might be safe with all the Pit bans.

Or you want something even smaller, a Boston Terrier is a great choice! I have a 4 year old BT, and he is more dog that my Boxer and AB put together LOL. He is spunky, happy, and still has that "bully" look. Plus, he fits in apartments and loves to laze around.

Hope I helped a little.

Here are two pics of the diff. types of AB's.

Johnson









Scotts









Mind you though, most AB's now-a-days are more hybrid than anything else.. but still, some hybrids might take on the scott's look, or the johnson's look.. like my boy, who looks more pit/standard:


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Martiniz said:


> It says on dogbreedinfo.com that they are very trainable and smart. I'm guessing if they are very trainable, a first time dog owner could handle it...


 
Dogbreedinfo is wrong about a TON of things. It's really not a good resource. Trust me, a Cane' is no dog for a first timer nor is a Neo, Presa or Fila. 

Mastiff, I'd go with an English or BullMastiff, you're probably not going to find a lot of them in the shelters, but there are many breed rescues you can go to. 

Bullies, English Bull dogs are alot of fun, but the health issues can be off putting to a first time dog owner. That and the fact that Bullies are very independent thinkers, which can make them harder to train (you really haver to find what motivates them and even then, it takes a bit longer). However most have a wonderful temperment and LOVE people. OEB have fewer health issues, but they are a breed that is being revived, the stud books are still open in the breed so you'll have to be VERY careful where you get one. YOu will find VERY few in rescue and nearly NONE in the shelters. 

Dobes, again you can find some wonderful example in rescue, they're are VERY easy to train and LOVE to be with their people. Much the same can be said for GSD and Rottie (though you could run into BSL issues with all three breeds) Rotties are the most friendly to strangers of the three. 

I'd also encourage you to look at Standard Schnauzers, they are excellent dogs, very smart and trainable, quite masculine in appearance and I've seen VERY little BSL against them. They have a slightly lower energy level than a Boxer (I also think a Boxer could be the dog for you).

What ever breed you decide on, you WIL need to get your new dogs, adult or puppy into a training class ASAP. I highly suggest a good operant trainer rather than a dominance based trainer. Operant conditioning is proven, effective and easy to do.


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## Kayota (Aug 14, 2009)

Reptyle said:


> My point, in a round about sort of way, is that even a little dog can sound the alarm if someone approaches...It is my opinion that little dogs often sound off before the big ones do...Maybe it's a nervous thing on their part.


This is true... Not too long ago tonight Mollie (dachshund) started barking long before either of the big dogs (Shar Pei mix and Malamute/Pei x) did.


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## Elana55 (Jan 7, 2008)

I have thought about this sort of thing long and hard.. and you know.. there is no really easy dog for apartment living IMO. Not a breed of dog anyway. 

What I WOULD suggest is that the OP take a look at Senior dogs. Sometimes you can find an absolutely wonderful dog that is a bit lower energy and that would fit in with an apartment quite nicely and is already house trained etc. Not all senior dogs (like any 'group' of dogs) would fit. 

Just an idea. A dog over the age of 8 often has a lot to offer, several years of good living and life left and is a great way to be introduced to dog ownership. Some of these dogs are avaialble because their owners died or had some other malady and they could not keep a dog anymore but the dog is a good dog. 

Just a wild idea..


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

FilleBelle said:


> If you can't have anything resembling a pitty, I'm guessing they won't let you have an Am Bully or Am Bully mix. Half the dogs on your list are going to be near impossible to find because they aren't AKC breeds....or breeds at all, as far as I can tell.
> 
> A Boxer wouldn't be a bad idea, if you can give it pleeeenty of exercise. They are generally pretty compliant and friendly animals, but they are ALWAYS full of go-go-go.
> 
> ...


I see. Btw Im canadian so its CKC for me.

And guys, just leave the small dogs away plz im not rly interested in them. The smallest I was willing to go was the olde boston bulldogge but apparently even that I couldnt handle...

Inga the GSD is already on my list, that and now the boxer. The others are just possible entries that im pitching out.

That being said, I got one last dog in mind that was suggested to me but that I loverlooked; the bullmastiff. Opinions?(im done after that, i think)



Elana55 said:


> I have thought about this sort of thing long and hard.. and you know.. there is no really easy dog for apartment living IMO. Not a breed of dog anyway.
> 
> What I WOULD suggest is that the OP take a look at Senior dogs. Sometimes you can find an absolutely wonderful dog that is a bit lower energy and that would fit in with an apartment quite nicely and is already house trained etc. Not all senior dogs (like any 'group' of dogs) would fit.
> 
> ...


I tought about that too, thats why I said Im not getting it now.


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## skelaki (Nov 9, 2006)

Bullmastiffs are great dogs but not generally recomended for first time owners. They also might be included on BSL lists. Also, if you live in an apartment, a Bullmastiff is very likely to not meet size/weight limits.

If you want to get a reasonably accurate and unbiased pros and cons of various breeds (AKC breeds only unfortunately) Google "(name of breed) what's good about 'em, what's bad about 'em" without the quotes and no parenthses around the breed name.


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

Martiniz said:


> So you want a masculine dog?
> 
> I suggest the Cane Corso. Very muscular. This dog may look masculine, but he does not have a "fighting mentality" like pitbulls. So he will not go out looking for a fight. So you do not need to worry about aggression, but you have to train and socialize them well when they are pups. Also, this dog is very smart and very trainable. And another quality I like about this dog is, they don't wonder away from home. They stay close to their owners. Cane Corso makes good watch/guard dogs. They have a very stable temperament and very good with children. These dogs are gentle giants.


Have u actually owned one? And do u guys agree?


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## zimandtakandgrrandmimi (May 8, 2008)

TheGame said:


> Have u actually owned one? And do u guys agree?


The person on these boards who owns a Corso also owns quite a number of pit bulls and an Ovcharka and has a lifetime's worth of experience in serious dog fancy. why don't you send Spicy a pm? though I have a feeling she will tell you something *similar* to what the others have been telling you.


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

Meh, fck that. Im just getting me a boxer or whatever bulldog-like dog the shelter'll have.

Thanks for the help everybody, sincerely.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

TheGame said:


> Have u actually owned one? And do u guys agree?


I haven't owned one, But I know many Cane resceurs and everyone will tell you that it's NOT a first time owners type of dog. They also tend to havre BSL issues due to their size and temperament in the 'wrong' hands. 


I honestly think the Boxer would work fine for you, there are oftne boxers in shelters and rescue. Do be sure to get into a good training class, theyare smart and that can sometimes get them into trouble.


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## MissMutt (Aug 8, 2008)

TheGame said:


> Meh, fck that. Im just getting me a boxer or whatever bulldog-like dog the shelter'll have.
> 
> Thanks for the help everybody, sincerely.


And _this_, precisely, is why I said you're going into this blindly.. dozens of people are offering you help and their experiences, and you're just blowing them off.

I truly hope that you don't make the wrong decision. Good luck.


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## jesirose (Mar 27, 2008)

Wow. Direct messaging another user to ask for an opinion was too much work, and yet you think you're prepared for a bully breed or a boxer? HA. 

Sad.


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## canteloupe (Apr 30, 2009)

TheGame said:


> Have u actually owned one? And do u guys agree?


God, have you actually read any of the advice that people took the time to give you on this thread? That is the one breed that a bunch of people specifically said that you _shouldn't_ get.



Elana55 said:


> I have thought about this sort of thing long and hard.. and you know.. there is no really easy dog for apartment living IMO. Not a breed of dog anyway.


I disagree. Of course, I've only lived in apartments (since I graduated high school) so I suppose I'm biased. But I think virtually every dog breed is just great in an apartment, provided they get enough exercise. Dogs really don't care how big your house is.


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

cshellenberger said:


> I haven't owned one, But I know many Cane resceurs and everyone will tell you that it's NOT a first time owners type of dog. They also tend to havre BSL issues due to their size and temperament in the 'wrong' hands.


Ok. I only asked cause that guy that I quoted sent me a pm suggesting the breed again so I figured why not ask everybody on them specifically.



MissMutt said:


> And _this_, precisely, is why I said you're going into this blindly.. dozens of people are offering you help and their experiences, and you're just blowing them off.
> 
> I truly hope that you don't make the wrong decision. Good luck.


Look at my first choices then look at my last ones and tell me i didnt take anybodys advise.

I wasnt saying "fck that" to the thread and help I got but to me constantly trying to find other breeds when I had a perfect one in my hands.



jesirose said:


> Wow. Direct messaging another user to ask for an opinion was too much work, and yet you think you're prepared for a bully breed or a boxer? HA.
> 
> Sad.


Lol your seriously saying that I couldnt handle a dog that everybody proposed me cuz instead of pming one person for one opinion I made a noob thread in a forum dedicated to noob questions?(that seems to only get u irritaded)

Wow, ok then.


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## zimandtakandgrrandmimi (May 8, 2008)

Hey Op..

saying stuff like **** that here will kind of put people off of talking to you in most cases..there are young kids who come here to read about dogs...I showed my little cousin who is 10 years old this forum this weekend. she was extatic..which kind of made me reevaluate some of the things I've almost posted since then. 

just a thought..


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## louise_674 (Jun 24, 2009)

I would avoid a boxer, they are not very easy to manage and so high energy. Bull terrier are still high energy but a little less than boxers. They do have a tendency for DA but i can see you are already well aware of this. They are actually pretty trainable but with all the breeds you seem to like you are going to have to work hard to train them. Regular classes for at least the first yr or so. 

You are obviously someone who cares about what dog they are getting and you should not be put off by the fact that these are seen as 'bad rep' dogs. You can find a lovely bull terrier (one of my friends actually has the sweetest dog) his only vice is barking at other dogs through the fence. 

Just socialise like mad! (your dog that is  ) I would also be VERY wary about breeders. Avoid puppy mills , farms and pet shops at all costs. Find a breeder that will let you spend time with the parents and get a feel for if you could manage one. Then put your name down on a puppy list and wait it out. A breeder should not be pushy and tell you things like you must take the pup today etc. There are a lot of them out there! Take your time and find a dog that suits you and your lifestyle and start as you mean to go on. Buy a book on bull terriers now and get reading !


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Louise, the OP has Breed Specific Legislation where he is that bans most of the Bull Terrier breeds as Pitbulls.


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## TheGame (Sep 5, 2009)

Yep, otherwise it was my first choice. Thanks for trying to help tough.

I think im set with the boxer.


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## SupaSweet777 (Aug 22, 2009)

Martiniz said:


> So you want a masculine dog?
> 
> I suggest the Cane Corso. Very muscular. This dog may look masculine, but he does not have a "fighting mentality" like pitbulls. So he will not go out looking for a fight. So you do not need to worry about aggression, but you have to train and socialize them well when they are pups. Also, this dog is very smart and very trainable. And another quality I like about this dog is, they don't wonder away from home. They stay close to their owners. Cane Corso makes good watch/guard dogs. They have a very stable temperament and very good with children. These dogs are gentle giants.
> 
> ...


Corsos are very powerful dogs. i would never suggest one for a first time dog owner.


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## Siye (Sep 8, 2009)

I think one of the biggest concerns is handling a dog (first time owner) that is not only large but HEAVY. All the breeds you mention here have been at some point bred to be aggressive dogs, and their size and stature only enforce this even more. I suggest you stay away from any breed that is a big and heavy set, because handling aggression can not only be difficult but in the worst case scenario, dangerous. 

I think along the lines you want a boxer or English bulldog is possible, but it will definitely not be the easiest route. You'll need to invest alot of time, effort and patience, but make it happen.


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

> Xeph would shoot me if I got one and then kept is shaved


I would not! I'd only string you up by your toes! Lord knows the worst Carsten would do to hinder me would be to try to lick me to death xD


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## Ayanla (Jun 11, 2009)

I know you said to leave small dogs off the list, but I would consider a Boston Terrier.

They are very bright dogs in my experience and masculine enough that I have to keep reminding people that mine is a female. They're good apartment dogs and very friendly (I seriously have never seen a dog as people friendly as my Kira) Yes, they're small, but they're not dainty froo-froo dogs by any stretch of the imagination. They fart and belch and snore and make all sorts of many noises 

I've heard that they can be tough to housebreak, but I have not had any issues with her. Kira is more challenging to train in general than Odo (my maltese/poodle mix) but only because she's stubborn and wants to make sure you're serious before she'll listen.


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## Rayne01 (Aug 31, 2009)

SO many people in this thread have used pit bulls in bad context. They are not bad dogs. 
Bully breeds in general have a bad rep. If I had to recommend a bully breed for apartment life, Id have to say a Boston Terrier. One of the most masculine fellas that I know has one. If you want a bigger dog I'd say an Old English Bulldog. My friend has 2 in an apartment and they do really well.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Rayne,
I don;'t think people here are putting pits in a bad contexted, we are merely saying the OP (and anyone else looking to get a pit) has to watch for BSL when choosing a dog, especially when he lives in an apartment complex. 

Many that have answered in theis thread have breeds that are banned someplace. I have a Dobe, which are also targeted in BSL legisltion. The fact is BSL is here and unfortunately it's something that has to be considered when looking to find a pet. Most educated dog people know that BSL isn't the answer, but a knee jerk reaction to bad (irresponsible) ownership and criminals who are involved in dog fighting.


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## Rayne01 (Aug 31, 2009)

cshellenberger said:


> Rayne,
> I don;'t think people here are putting pits in a bad contexted, we are merely saying the OP (and anyone else looking to get a pit) has to watch for BSL when choosing a dog, especially when he lives in an apartment complex.
> 
> Many that have answered in theis thread have breeds that are banned someplace. I have a Dobe, which are also targeted in BSL legisltion. The fact is BSL is here and unfortunately it's something that has to be considered when looking to find a pet. Most educated dog people know that BSL isn't the answer, but a knee jerk reaction to bad (irresponsible) ownership and criminals who are involved in dog fighting.


Im a bit... defensive, when it comes to using pit bulls as an example of a bad breed I guess. I have a pit bull, and a doberman/rottie mix. I hate it when I'm walking the pit and someone tells their kid not to go near him because he could be vicious. It just bothers me to see them down talked I guess. BSL does have a big part in choosing a dog breed. Its sad, really. Where I live you have to have a permit to own a pit bull, and you have to buy liability insurance.


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## Marsh Muppet (Nov 29, 2008)

Rayne01 said:


> Im a bit... defensive, when it comes to using pit bulls as an example of a bad breed I guess.


None of the breeds mentioned are inherently bad--except for irresponsibly bred individuals and lines. But that doesn't mean they are a good choice for a first time dog owner. A high drive Rottweiler can be the source of great joy, but you'd better understand what you're buying into beforehand.


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## jesirose (Mar 27, 2008)

Rayne01 said:


> If I had to recommend a bully breed for apartment life, Id have to say a Boston Terrier


I have never heard of a Boston being a bully breed...


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Marsh Muppet said:


> None of the breeds mentioned are inherently bad--except for irresponsibly bred individuals and lines. But that doesn't mean they are a good choice for a first time dog owner. A high drive Rottweiler can be the source of great joy, but you'd better understand what you're buying into beforehand.


 
Exactly! Breeds that have been bred for the purpose of combat (be it against humans or other animals) are not dogs I'd reccomend for MOST first time owners. They can have problems even with socialization and training. It doesn't mean we're saying the breeds are bad, just that they aren't dogs for those with no dog experience. I also don't reccomend high drive herding or hunting breeds as they tend to get bored and run into another certain set of behavioral problems. In fact there are very few breeds I think do well with first timers, most of those breeds are companion bred from the start or are very laid back by nature.



jesirose said:


> I have never heard of a Boston being a bully breed...


Yes, they are on the Bully side of the Bull Terriers. People don't realize that modern pugs also have Bully in the background.


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## SandyPuppy (Aug 8, 2009)

Just wondering if you have checked with your apartment manager and made sure there isn't a weight limit? Where I live we can only have dogs that weigh 25 pounds or less. And it is enforced.


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## HARLEYS MOM (Sep 8, 2009)

Go with a Bullmastiff, I've seen all different sizes, my girl just turned a year and she's only about 80#, but she only comes to right above my knee. She is so laid back and well behaved, she is really built but the sweetest wimp. I know people say they are chewers, but she only was a chewer through her puppy stages. Look up the breed info, this is what sold me on the Bullmastiffs!! Good Luck!!


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## RRM_Mom08 (May 5, 2008)

Bostons are considered a bully breed in body type,backround ect...Actually I get alot of guys that come to me for a smaller breed of dog that yet still has that manly appearance with a great personality.

Bostons can and are be the best of both worlds


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## jesirose (Mar 27, 2008)

Are bostons bully breeds in that they "bully" - prone to DA?


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## zimandtakandgrrandmimi (May 8, 2008)

jesirose said:


> Are bostons bully breeds in that they "bully" - prone to DA?


no its because they are a bred down companion version of the old Boston Bulldog, a pit fighting animal descended from the exact same stock as the American Pit Bull Terrier


this is an artist's representation of the original boston bulldog


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## BoxMeIn21 (Apr 10, 2007)

louise_674 said:


> I would avoid a boxer, they are not very easy to manage and so high energy. Bull terrier are still high energy but a little less than boxers.


I'm not quite sure what you're basing your opinion on, but boxers are really not that hard to manage. They are easy to train and as long as you give them the opportunity to exercise their mind and body each day, they are quite a joy to own.


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## Rayne01 (Aug 31, 2009)

Its clearly visible that Boston's are a bully breed. I love Bostons! They have such great personalities. Most of the ones I've met are really high strung. I love them.


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## MafiaPrincess (Jul 1, 2009)

Do you live in Ontario? BSL here does suck large. Number of even obvious (to people who know breeds) boxer mixes getting pulled from people by AC as 'pitties' and being slated for pts.

On the other hand I run across pretty obvious non grandfathered staffies and other dogs that likely don't belong due to BSL and somehow some of them get away with it.

Are you sure your apartment complex has no weight restrictions? I had to sign paperwork when I lived in my last one that my pup wouldn't be larger than 16" at the withers and any heavier than 25 pounds.


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## ValtheAussie (Apr 19, 2009)

May have already been posted, but Mickey Rourke, of the movie "The Wrestler" was terribly bereaved when his Chihuahua Loki passed away last year after 17 wonderful years.

*so much for manly dogs*


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## Rayne01 (Aug 31, 2009)

My fiance is actually quite partial to our mini schnauzer. He won't let her wear pink, but he walks her and everything.


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## SandyPuppy (Aug 8, 2009)

Rayne01 said:


> My fiance is actually quite partial to our mini schnauzer. He won't let her wear pink, but he walks her and everything.


oooh mini schnauzers are very masculine.


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## SupaSweet777 (Aug 22, 2009)

Rayne01 said:


> My fiance is actually quite partial to our mini schnauzer. He won't let her wear pink, but he walks her and everything.


LOL

My ex-fiance wouldn't let me put anything pink on Jhazmyn (our AB). But now she has a pink collar and harness cuz I am sick of people saying "Oh he is so handsome, what's his name??" Even after I tell them Jhazmyn they still call her a him.


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