# Are antibiotics making her feel sick?



## Eyssa (Jul 28, 2008)

I have an elderly Sheltie at the age of 14, named Callie. I'm concerned about her health, as she has several problems that sneaked up on her due to old age. Basically, I'm wondering if the antibiotics she's being given plus the condition of her sore eye is making her lethargic.

But before I tell you about that, I'll give you a little background info:
-Callie was diagnosed with kidney failure almost two years ago. She's maintained a steady weight of 14-15lbs., which seems to fluctuate between those two numbers. She is currently being fed Purina Kidney Function dry and canned food. Additionally, she has heart murmer, but according to the vet it isn't bad enough to medicate. She does have some mild arthritis, for which she takes cosequin for, and she is practically deaf and at the same time loosing her sight.

So here comes the problem:
-In August is when we noticed her sight deteriorating quite rapidly, as she began to bump into things around the house, and about a month and a half ago we noticed that her right eye had started to fill with blood. We gave her an antibiotic applied directly to the eye (the vet also gave her something in the office too) and continued giving that to her up until a week ago. She was also given some sort of steroid pill, and for a while her eye seemed to be okay, but then started to refill with blood. Since then there hasn't been any direct problems with her eye itself, but several days ago we noticed that her right eye (the same one) was very watery and she was holding both eyes closed, probably cause she couldn't keep her good eye open. Anyway, once again we took her to the vet (who said it was an infection of the eyelid) and we were given oral antibiotics and told to apply a hot compress to her eye. The second day afterwards her eye started to swell alarmingly and she slept and was noticeably lethargic all day. After that she started to get better, but she still hasn't been her same plucky self. She sleeps all day, although she doesn't have a problem with getting up or going outside, but she doesn't eat her food readily. I had to apply peanut butter to her regular food to get her to eat some of it, and the other day I gave her some beef fat, which she enjoyed fully. But she seems only interested in food like that... beef, peanut butter, etc., and it happened so suddenly too. She's been eating her regular food for the past two years with no problems, but now all of a sudden she doesn't want it.

Could this all be a result of the problem with her eye? And could the antibiotics be making her feel sick on the stomach? Everything was okay until she started to have problems with her eye...

I also feel the need to disclose the fact that she doesn't walk on the leash like she used to. She used to keep up, and could easily walk with us on our 1-2 mile walks, but now she walks behind us clear at the end of the leash (this was since the eye problem started, and about a week before her eyelid got the infection). I thought it was just her stubborn streak, but she just doesn't want to walk. If she had it her way, she'd stop in the middle of the road and just stand there.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

My 15 year old dog with chronic renal insufficiency had a similar progression in August. She had been fine eating for 15 months and went to the vet for a checkup in July came home with antibiotics and steriods for UTI and hot spots and her appetite left. It got worse when she had to take a really strong antibiotic. 

Her blood tests showed the kidney function was falling off. I put her on Pepcid for nausea, that probiotic stuff to help digestion and chose to start subcutaneous fluids. Antibiotics mess up the appetite as the GI tract fauna all get killed off.

At the least ask the vet about probiotics and Pepcid for nausea. You may have to step up treatment to help out your old girl.

You are right to worry about the walking. Sassy lags if she isn't feeling well. The day after I gave her subcutaneous fluids she was running and hitting the end of the flexilead, I was so happy she was being so silly!

I had to change from cooking once a week to daily to make her happy. If I boil the food together she isn't as happy as when I pan brown her meat. Warming it up makes it taste better too. So much for all the work I did when she was younger to keep her from being a picky eater!

Check food you are adding to the kidney diet food for phosphorus. If you have to don't worry about the phosphorus content but try to add food low in phosphorus. Peanut butter is high, fat is low. Try low sodium broth, try adding some dark chicken you brown in a pan and then deglaze the pan with some water or broth to get the browned good stuff. 

Check dogaware.com for LOADS of ideas to keep her happy and feeling better.


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## Eyssa (Jul 28, 2008)

I just fed Callie some boiled green beans and ham, and I soaked up a piece of white bread in the broth, and she ate all of it... she was so hungry! I also read that section on dogaware about loss of appetite, as well. That'll be certainly helpful... I didn't realize there was so much more you can do about dogs with kidney failure. : ) I'm just still a little frustrated by the fact that she doesn't seem to want to walk on her leash or get up much and move around.

Right now I'm giving her some Alternagel to help ease her stomach, but is that the right thing to give her? As opposed to Pepcid? Despite the fact that she's had kidney failure for two years, our vet has never told us any of this before, and I never found anything like that through the research I've done.

So you say that your dog did better on subcutaneous fluids? I'll have to ask my vet about that next time we go to get her tested, which will probably be very soon. Thank you very much for your insights.


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## Eyssa (Jul 28, 2008)

Oh, I have another question... What if the dog hasn't lost any weight? I don't think I specified that. Can a dog's blood still be off without loosing weight?


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

No idea! Sassy's tongue sticks out, she has accidents in the house, her tail goes straight down and she lags behind on walks when she isn't feeling well. She drinks water and eats slower. Sometimes I notice her third eyelid more too. If I really blow it and she doesn't get enough water [only happened once but it was scary] she pees and pees and is really uncomfortable. Her weight has gone up and down depending on how much fat I am feeding her. Then I get scared she is going to go pancreatic on me and cut the fat.

If the stuff you are giving helps the appetite then it is the right stuff to give! My vet told me kidney dogs get ulcers and mouth sores so pepcid is good to give them. So far it is all my dog needs to keep feeling well. I am sure she is going to need more medication in the future!


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## robotcrankit (Aug 21, 2008)

Keep in mind that antibiotics kill ALL bacteria in the body, even the good kind that aide in digestion. If she is taking a lot of antibiotics, make sure you are supplementing her diet with pre/probiotics to help her with digesting her food.

My dog was on a lot of antibiotics this summer as she was overcoming a severe skin/ear infection. She wasn't eating much and seemed to have a hard time passing stools. I started giving her a little bit of yogurt with her food, and it seemed to help a lot. My dog is about 13 years old.

Good luck!


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## wydene (May 26, 2009)

My dog Robbie (a 12 year old border collie) may have died from Antibiotic poisoning, he had an infected heamatobia (blood blister) about a size of a clenched fist on his front. (which they previously diagnosed as a abscess) 

He was subscribed a course of them and it did bring down the swelling after several days of treatment. He was off them for over a week and the swelling returned as big as before. 

The vet then gave him a stronger type, which after about 5 days his health deteriorated quite rapidly,
He had the runs, and he was off his food and had no energy,

I took him back to the same Vets, and a different person this time said the antibiotics aren’t doing him any good and they seemed to be making him staggering around as he was walking and he has an infected heamatobia not a abscess!!

So I took him strait off them, but he didn’t recover, the next morning he had difficulty of getting up from his bed he had a very bad stroke, probably during the night, he now had trouble standing and couldn’t walk hardly at all and would raise one front paw high at each step and collapse on to the floor.

Back to the vets, another person this time, looks like he’s had a stroke, checked his heart (a slight murmur detected) could have had a heart attack (he subscribed tablets for that and gave him a antibiotics injection) he said his prognoses isn’t good. He said to bring him back in 3 days if no improvement.

Next day Robbie is thrashing about having fits lasting only a minute. By now I phoned a herbal practitioner I had herd about and he thought he may be having a bad reaction to the antibiotics, could be antibiotic poisoning, he subscribed a herbal tincture and that stopped the fits and he went it a very restful sleep. But by now the damage was done and he was having pains in he abdomen and wasn’t recovering, the next day I took him to the Vet for the final time, She said that his blood was pooling at his rear end as he had swollen up there and he appears to have a ruptured spleen, how could this had happened, strokes send the body haywire. Could it have been the blood blister, no it wouldn’t have done that. “Well Mr Martin, there is only one thing we can do now”.

At least he did look very restful in his box as he was given his final injections, it took 3 to put him down, the vet said he was a strong dog, that one he didn’t want to go, the reason was that there was hardly any blood flowing in his veins and so it would take a long time for the dose to reach the heart.

Conclusion.
I only wished I had taken him to the Herbal practitioner sooner he may have saved him. Thanks to Robbie I now go to him and my heath has greatly improved, having had high blood pressure (170/100)
High cholesterol (6.4) now (150/85) and (5.5) and falling. (the doctors failed to bring it down, it would mean taking subscribed drugs that are known to have bad side effects such as kidney damage and worse)

All though vets do have their uses such as vaccinations and castrations etc, (although I cannot blame them for the quality of the dog food that could contribute to his eventual demise, best to feed them some vegetables in perhaps some cheap stewing steak and some good bones (not cooked) to chew on from your local butcher, should be a lot better than any dog food, apart from pet plan) but for all other cases I’m inclined to consult with the herbal practitioner


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

You did the right thing by taking him to the vet, the vet made a mistake, they're human and it happens. Had the dog had a severe infection and you took him to the herbal practitioner, you could have still ended up with a dead dog and blaming the herbal practitioner instead. 

I'd say to find a vet that combines both Holistic and western medicine. They are out there and the are usually pretty good.


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## HORSEandHOUND (May 28, 2009)

a few things raise suspicion for me in your post. 
1. oral antibiotics do absolutely ZERO for eye infections of any kind. to treat an eye you must apply a drop or ointment several times daily to fix it. the blood you were seeing without seeing a picture was probably a blood collection around an ulcer of the orb. it's what the body does to fix the problem, is normal and to be expected. BUT if you are not applying an ointment or drop to the eyeball daily it will progress and get worse quickly.
<i've had more experience with eye injury than i care to ever remember>

2. oral antibiotics are very hard on the stomach and digestive system. if your dog is vomiting you need to contact your vet immediately. based on #1 you need a new vet ASAP


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