# The Mushing Thread



## RabbleFox

I don't think there is a thread pertaining to the mushing sports so I thought I'd start one!

Post your training ideas, equipment recommendations, mushing vacations, photos, videos, tips, and questions!

Canicross, skijoring, bikejoring, kick sledding, sledding, scooter ing, rig running accepted. If your dog is pulling you on it, then it counts!


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## Kyllobernese

Went to our Dog Sled Races today. It was windy and snowing so did not get many pictures.


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## Kyllobernese

The picture of the team is owned and run by our Vet. She has an 8 dog team.


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## SDRRanger

With my back I haven't had a chance to get Ranger out to the Sunday meet up to try him with a sled (we only had a few good days for actual sledding), but am hoping by the next good snow (we had 44cm last week followed by biting cold and now it's in the positives and the 50mm of rain washed all the snow away). 

I've been using Gee and Haw with Ranger when I am walking him around the block. I've been bringing him on a slightly longer lead to give him some freedom so he's usually ahead of me and seems to be grasping it (or the coincidence is outstanding). I've also had him in his harness with the line attached to the stair railing to work on Line Out.


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## RabbleFox

Wolfy (my aunt's black lab that I borrow to mush) and I went out for our first skijore run last Sunday. He was fantastic! Since then it got bitterly cold and then it rained? Hopefully we will get more snow because we both love to get out there. Wolfy literally screams and "tap dances" when he sees me bring out the harness and lines. He _loves_ running. 









Kb, those are some sweet photos! I love seeing a bunch of dogs getting out there and doing what they love.


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## Lappdog

Kb and Rabblefox, cool photos! I've always thought dog sleds (I never knew about any of the other mushing sports, and still know very little) were the coolest things ever. I actually just on a whim bought a harness for my 32 pound Finnish Spitz (it was half price and fit perfectly, how could I say no?). She's perfectly fine getting in and out of it, and I think she'd enjoy some type of mush sport. Is there a particular sport which a dog of her size could do? I'm not looking to win anything, just play around with her, burn some energy and have some fun.


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## packetsmom

I'm going to be following this thread with some interest! I'm seriously considering buying Sam a small sled for next season. We have (as you might imagine) a pretty active musher's community up here and I'm thinking it might be an easier thing to try than skijor since my skiing skills aren't awesome yet.


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## RabbleFox

I highly suggest Cani cross or skijoring for first timers! Cani cross is very popular in the UK and can be done anywhere there is a clear trail. The dog runs ahead of you, musher style, and pulls you along. Those of us with snow right now could try skijoring if you've a pair of skis and some balance. Skijoring is much more of a workout for the dog as the most I do is pole. Wolfy does a lot of pulling during skijoring and minimal pulling for canicross. 

Packetsmom, I'm in the middle of building a rachet kicksled as we speak. It's her to do when my family is reluctant to let me use power tools! >.<


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## Lappdog

RabbleFox said:


> I highly suggest Cani cross or skijoring for first timers! Cani cross is very popular in the UK and can be done anywhere there is a clear trail. The dog runs ahead of you, musher style, and pulls you along.


Just looked up Cani cross and it looks perfect! I'd never heard of it, thanks for the suggestion!


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## RabbleFox

Lappdog said:


> Just looked up Cani cross and it looks perfect! I'd never heard of it, thanks for the suggestion!


Cani cross is a super good work out for both dog and human! I think the best part about Cani cross is that it sets the "ground work" for later mushing sports. I taught Wolfy and Bae their mushing commands using canicross them transferred it up. Bae got to run the bike and Wolfy is running my skis. I find it's easier to control and teach a dog when my feet are on the ground!


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## sassafras

And you don't really HAVE to run/jog to canicross. You can walk or hike (what I sometimes call cani-hiking aheh) with them in harness and attached to your belt.


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## RabbleFox

Very good point, Sass. 

Looks like Michigan will be getting some snow tomorrow! Colder temperatures have been promised to me by the weather channel!!! Hopefully Wolfy and I can get out on the snow again this week.


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## Lappdog

That really looks perfect, versatile and translating well into other sports, not to mention fun and good exercise!


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## malamutelove

yay a mushing post! let me see if I have any pictures of maggie actually pulling me. Im kinda clumsy so me taking pictures the same time as bikejoring/ skijoring is not a good idea.


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## sassafras

malamutelove said:


> yay a mushing post! let me see if I have any pictures of maggie actually pulling me. Im kinda clumsy so me taking pictures the same time as bikejoring/ skijoring is not a good idea.


You need a GoPro!


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## malamutelove

I do!! I asked for one for christmas, and no one got it for me. Boo!


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## MusherChic

I haven't been on this forum in so long I feel like I need to re introduce myself. lol 

Anyways, I randomly decided to check in on what was happening on here and I came across this thread. I thought I'd post some pics of my crew. 

I currently have 9 dogs, 7 of which are sled dogs and the other two are couch potatoes. I've been in the sport for about 8 years and racing for 4. I just made the decision this year to retire. 


This is a training run from 2 years ago. 









This is probably my absolute favorite picture of my team ever. This was at a race in 2014. I believe we came in either 5th or 4th place in this one...









This was the same race, second day, finish line. 









My main leader, Salsa (left) and insano leader in training, Sydney (right). 









My team at a race last year. This was our 3rd win and 2nd time in a row wining his particular race. (The fist time there was only me and one other person in our class but who's counting?  )









This was the same race, second day. This was Sydney's first time leading in a race and she rocked it!









I also run my German Shepherd occasionally. When I first got into the sport, she was my first "sled dog". I trained her to lead and ran with her and my mom's Aussie for about 3-4 years before I got my first Alaskans. She ran on my 3-dog team at my very first race before I retired her and let the Alaskans do the work. She likes to run but she doesn't like to go fast. lol


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## MusherChic

Annnnd a video. This is just a little something I put together last year at the beginning of racing season...


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## marsha=whitie

Musherchic, your pics are lovely!

I dabbled in canicross last year before my son became sick. Now that he's better, my boxer/lab and I can get back to it! I don't have any photos, so once I do I'll post.  Until then, I will be following.


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## Sibe

Mostly I do bikejoring, but get some skijoring in too when we go to Colorado. We'll be moving back there next year is the plan, so much more skiing is in the future.









Tied up during lunch break









The "Woah, woWOAHWOAAAAAAA!!!" *faceplant* part









I do really love having a bright reflective vest. This one I got at Petco, $15 iirc.


















(Foster boxer dog was absolutely AWESOME at mushing!)









Post-mush faces are the best.


















Olympic Training Center right by our house has nice trails.









Bring water...


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## tuffycuddles

Crazy! I raced there this season!! Too cool.


Kyllobernese said:


> Went to our Dog Sled Races today. It was windy and snowing so did not get many pictures.


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## tuffycuddles

I have been mushing for five years now, I got my start recreationally with my own pets. I now own five sled dogs. Two years ago I started working for a dog sled tour company, guiding tours and working in the kennel full time. Just this year I began racing, I competed in the four and six dog limited class sprint racing and one cani-cross fun run. I love sledding, carting and running cani-cross. And I have tried bikejoring and skijoring, I prefer my three wheeled(articrigs.com) cart to a bike, and I still have a lot of learning to do on skis before I let my crazy hounds pull me around on them. I am on the "runners" for at least 10-40km nearly every day.
.....i will post some pictures in a min. I have to go find them.


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## Hector4

Started cani cross this week. No serious running just walking both dogs around town.

http://youtu.be/ZMxuxde9TJI


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## RabbleFox

Hector4 said:


> Started cani cross this week. No serious running just walking both dogs around town.
> 
> http://youtu.be/ZMxuxde9TJI


That's the best way to start! Nice and easy.

Unless you start with dogs like the ones I always seem to start with who have no concept of "stop!!!". Eheheh. I'm probably lucky I was never pulled over onto my butt.

Tuffy, love that last photo. Both human and dog look so happy. I never look that cute when running.


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## SDRRanger

Just put the downpayment on my scooter which will arrive in the next two weeks. Can't wait to get some steady work into Ranger.


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## malamutelove

Some pictures for everyone


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## Sibe

Lookin' good!

I've been teaching my friend's husky to mush. He's run twice now. First time was just having her call him across the parking lot
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10100228340994899&set=vb.28800024&type=3&theater

and I hooked him up briefly with Kaytu, this is his first run with his girlfriend!
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=10100228319473029&set=vb.28800024&type=3&permPage=1

Last week Kaytu had a hurt back and Denali flat out refused to run (I haven't had her run without Kaytu in soooo long I think she was thrown off by my asking her to be out front with Bear behind since she's never actually done that) so I had my friend walk Denali while I took Bear on his own. I think he did fantasic for his first run!! 2 mile loop.





Some screenshots from the video



























Look at his glorious tail plumage









Haw!









I dismounted to get through the sand, really need to dog to pull strong nonstop to get through and he's a bit spazzy.









Other friend









The group









Post mush


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## SDRRanger

Those were awesome! He looks like he had a blast in the video. How many times had you been out with him...was he going as fast as it seems in the video? I'll be starting up scootering with Ranger and I'm wondering about how fast things might go. Do you keep the breaks on a bit sometimes?


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## Sibe

That was his second time EVER being in harness. I had him out once the week before, those first two vid links. He's a natural. He was flying for parts of that. I'm often braking, when it's flat or downhill. Momentum of the bike/scooter keeps going forward so to keep the line tight and keep yourself from gaining on the dog, brake slightly.


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## Sibe

Typically with Kaytu I do this 2 mile loop twice in half an hour.. 4 miles in 30 mins = average of 8 mph. Joggers often keep pace with us or even pass us. I don't know what the top speed is when she is in burst mode  That time includes stops for potty and drinks, we usually have to stop once for poop and 2-3x for a drink depending on the weather.


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## Sibe

Kaytu is feelin' good and got to run with Bear. Started with her in front of him, then switched to side-by-side which worked great for them. Definitely be doing side by side from now on with them.

On by! Bear is quickly learning he can't stop and sniff everything, even horse poop.


















Can't say hi to people either, which is tough for Bear.









Friend behind us with two of her three fluffybutts- the 3rd got hip dysplasia at 8 months old, he had surgery, is 3 yrs old now and doing great but will never be mushing.


















He did awesome helping to pull me through the sand today, which I did not attempt last week. Kaytu really kept him on track (note they are side by side now)









Bear couldn't help himself, we passed many people today and this lady was the only one he just had to say hi to


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## SDRRanger

Looking at your photos makes me so excited to get started!


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## Sibe

Video took hooooooooooooours all night to upload. I uploaded the whole thing so Bear's owner can see.


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## Hector4

Need some advice on canicross gear. I have a skijoring belt from howling dog alaska and I use that for letting my dogs pull me. I am wondering if it is better to have one main line with a bungee section built in and connect that to a leash coupler that connects to their harnesses OR have a main line with not shock absorbing feature and connect that to a bungee coupler onto their harnesses OR have individual bungee ganglines? My dogs are 126 lbs and 82 lbs.


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## sassafras

Personally I don't think it matters where the bungee is, as long as it's there. 

I will say that in general I don't like individual ganglines for each dog because it's super easy for them to get tangled up in my experience.


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## Keechak

Didn't get out with the sled this past winter because it was SOOOOO cold. But we've been out with the bike a few times wince the snow melted.
Here are some vids.














And a blooper video


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## Hector4

sassafras said:


> Personally I don't think it matters where the bungee is, as long as it's there.
> 
> I will say that in general I don't like individual ganglines for each dog because it's super easy for them to get tangled up in my experience.


True, I experienced that today and am just wondering if one main bungee line is strong enough to withstand both dogs.


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## Sibe

I vote in favor of bungee, shock absorption is a good thing. I don't think it matters much if there is only a section of bungee or the whole thing, but depends on the dogs. As to having their own lines or a coupler, that's preference and depends on a lot. If it's awkward with their height difference, separate lines may be better. If you want/need them staying together, coupler.


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## SDRRanger

Keechak said:


> And a blooper video


This is how I think all my videos are going to end up....


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## Sibe

I have only wiped out twice ever. Lots of close calls! First time was when Nali was still learning, she took a turn really tight and my tires slipped off the sidewalk then bounced flat against the edge of it which popped me back onto the sidewalk in a mad fishtail, and I hit a tree. Sliced my thumb on the tree, right calf got all cut up from the gears. Not a bad crash at all. Second time was just a couple months ago or so, riding at night and Kaytu made a fast scoot to the left which I didn't have time to follow so I bailed and threw myself off the bike rather than slide into the ditch I knew was there. Wide path that suddenly narrows. Knee got scraped up and ripped a hole in my pants and scuffed my hands a little. I have a much better light on my bike now.


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## Hector4

Today -

http://youtu.be/j6Q8UUoSUgE


From the other day


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## Sibe

Aw cuties!!! Lots of stopping and sniffing in the video... Are you ok with them stopping and sniffing like that, or do you want them to focus on running? Or was it just so you could get a video and normally they don't stop and sniff so much?


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## SDRRanger

Hector4 said:


> View attachment 149129
> 
> From the other day
> 
> View attachment 149145


This guy's wrinkles are the best.


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## Hector4

Sibe said:


> Aw cuties!!! Lots of stopping and sniffing in the video... Are you ok with them stopping and sniffing like that, or do you want them to focus on running? Or was it just so you could get a video and normally they don't stop and sniff so much?


Yeah they always do this and I just let them. They are not really driven runners, especially the mastiff. The mastiff won't run if it's just me and him and he'll keep stopping to look back and he ends up tripping me or we don't go anywhere. The shepherd's energy keeps the mastiff going, but the shepherd's main problem is that he is an intense marker. My goal is for them to have fun and pull me to build some muscle. I would have to actually run and push them to run in order to keep them running.


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## Hector4

SDRRanger said:


> This guy's wrinkles are the best.


He is concentrating .


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## Hector4

Okay my lower back is starting to hurt. I already wear the belt on my hip almost on the buttocks, but back is hurting. Any suggestions? Should I wear the belt higher up? Also, does anyone use supplements? I use this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0051WKRPA/ref=oh_details_o01_s01_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

just because my mastiff doesn't do too well in the heat and this product has helped both the dogs recover way faster than without and they do not seem to mind the taste. Are there any cheaper electrolytes to use? Can I use no-sugar pedialyte?


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## GoldenLove

I love all your photos and videos. Amazing ! 


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## sassafras

Hector4 said:


> Okay my lower back is starting to hurt. I already wear the belt on my hip almost on the buttocks, but back is hurting. Any suggestions? Should I wear the belt higher up? Also, does anyone use supplements? I use this: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0051WKRPA/ref=oh_details_o01_s01_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> 
> just because my mastiff doesn't do too well in the heat and this product has helped both the dogs recover way faster than without and they do not seem to mind the taste. Are there any cheaper electrolytes to use? Can I use no-sugar pedialyte?


Don't move the belt up, keep it really low on your hips. If you wear it higher up/around your waist it will put more stress on your back, not less.

One thing I have a bad habit of doing while canicrossing or early in the skijor season is leaning forward too much at my hips which always gives me a sore back. Be aware of your posture. If you try that and it doesn't help, get a line with a LOT of bungee in it. Like one of the skijor now skijoring lines that are almost all bungee from end to end. With dogs who stop and start a lot, it's often jarring when they do get moving again and get out to the end of the line. The other thing you can do is when you can see they are going to run out to the end of the line, just grab the line maybe a half a foot or foot away from your body so you can mitigate some of the force. 

I personally don't use supplements, I just take water break about halfway through a longer run and give them more water and a few snacks after they've cooled off. But I'm not exactly running the Iditarod.


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## sassafras

Oh, I suppose I should post some mushing stuff, too. 

This is from our first outing on a new trail I found this spring that I'm very, very happy about. Squash is a little distracted by the new environment but as usual, Maisy keeps him in line.





And some recent pictures:


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## SDRRanger

Just got the call, my scooter is in....picking it up after lunch


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## Sibe

sass, they look great!! Ranger, I'm super excited for you


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## sassafras

SDRRanger said:


> Just got the call, my scooter is in....picking it up after lunch


Ahhheee!!!


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## Hector4

sassafras said:


> Don't move the belt up, keep it really low on your hips. If you wear it higher up/around your waist it will put more stress on your back, not less.
> 
> One thing I have a bad habit of doing while canicrossing or early in the skijor season is leaning forward too much at my hips which always gives me a sore back. Be aware of your posture. If you try that and it doesn't help, get a line with a LOT of bungee in it. Like one of the skijor now skijoring lines that are almost all bungee from end to end. With dogs who stop and start a lot, it's often jarring when they do get moving again and get out to the end of the line. The other thing you can do is when you can see they are going to run out to the end of the line, just grab the line maybe a half a foot or foot away from your body so you can mitigate some of the force.
> 
> I personally don't use supplements, I just take water break about halfway through a longer run and give them more water and a few snacks after they've cooled off. But I'm not exactly running the Iditarod.


Yeah - I have the belt positioned low and I don't lean forward. 200+ lbs of dogs is nothing to lean forward about. I will think about the full bungee line or 2, maybe I just have a weak back or too much dog? I can't run that much nor can my dogs, we all lack stamina hahahaa.


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## Hector4

Awesome trail! So jealous!


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## SDRRanger

And it's here. I should be getting the attachment and line for Ranger this week and then it's time to crash and burn!!!!


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## Hector4

SDRRanger said:


> And it's here. I should be getting the attachment and line for Ranger this week and then it's time to crash and burn!!!!


OMG so jealous!! I am excited for you!!!


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## Remaru

I have a sort of canicross related question. Hubby has been jogging with Remus. He wants to step it up, thinking about running in a 5k with him soon. I don't know that he is actually going to have Remus pulling him but he would like to go hands free. Where is the best place to buy gear? He will need a belt and line, maybe a harness if Remus is actually going to be pulling at all.


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## sassafras

I use my skijor belt from Skijor Now year round for hands-free walking because I already have it, but it is fairly pricey. Also it's a bit warm & sweaty in warm weather since it's meant for skijoring. If I didn't skijor or if I just wanted something for hands free walking for a dog who didn't pull it wouldn't be my first choice.

Nordkyn (http://www.nordkyn.com/) has a nice, more affordable canicross package and a couple of options for what they call a "hiker's belt" which is basically just a belt with some D-loops on it. I have one of their hiking belts and I use that one for walking Pip hands-free since it's smaller and he doesn't pull, so that might be a good option for your husband. 

As far as a lead... when I'm just hiking/walking hands-free, I use a double-ended leash. You can either just buy a clip at the hardware store and loop it through the handle end of any nylon leash, or you can purchase double ended leashes. I like Karma collars myself, they will make a double-ended in any length.


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## Hector4

Remaru said:


> I have a sort of canicross related question. Hubby has been jogging with Remus. He wants to step it up, thinking about running in a 5k with him soon. I don't know that he is actually going to have Remus pulling him but he would like to go hands free. Where is the best place to buy gear? He will need a belt and line, maybe a harness if Remus is actually going to be pulling at all.


First I ordered this belt, but it was too big so I let my bf use it and he doesn't have any complain of back problems from using it.
http://www.alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=98

then I ordered this one for me

http://www.alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=98

my back did start hurting and I don't know if I have too much dog pulling me or if I got bad posture or a weak back. The thing I don't really like about it is if the dogs are really pulling - you will feel it in the crotch area because the center strap is pretty much a crotch strap.

I ordered a harness from howling dog for my mastiff, but I don't really like it because of the plastic buckle, so I ordered this one from etsy and see how it will turn out

http://howlingdogalaska.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=24&products_id=94

https://www.etsy.com/listing/122790160/xlarge-no-pull-dual-walker-dog-harness?ref=shop_home_active_3

It says no pull, but it's pretty much the common roman design used for the pulling/walking and it can be customized with padding and metal buckles. I had a custom gang line made from an etsy seller, but I did order a bungee coupler from here

http://www.genuinedoggear.com/GDL-BGCP-LG.html


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## Remaru

Thanks so much for the links, I will check them all out. I think he will need a lead with at least some give as Remus has a pulling problem, it isn't nearly as bad when they jog and he is getting better all of the time but not guarantees he won't lunge forward. Definitely don't want something that will be too hot as it is hot here most of the time. They try to keep their running to night and most races are in the morning but it is still pretty warm.


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## Sibe

Person in one of the facebook mushing groups has books for sale:
Letting go of all my sled dog books in perfect condition (have never been read) for $5 each book (plus shipping if you want me to ship them to you). If you buy them all I will throw in for free "Sled Dogs of Denali" and "Teach Your Dog to Pull"
Available books
Mush! Sierra Nevada Dog Drivers
Dog Driver - a guide for the serious musher (hardcover)
The Speed Mushing Manual
The Joy of Running Sled Dogs
Ski Spot Run

Message Donna https://www.facebook.com/donna.marks.5?fref=nf


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## Greater Swiss

I've got what might be a dumb question, actually, a couple (I don't think it has been covered, though I could have missed it). 
At what point do you feel you can go from practicing, trying for giving directions (right, left, Ha, Gee, leave it/carry on etc) to actually hooking up and giving it a go? Also, how good on a bike or scooter do you feel you need to be before giving it a go?

DH had Caeda pull him on the bike one day, it went alright, I haven't gotten the guts to do it yet (not the best on a bike...its been a while and my balance is awful! lol). I've just been itching to do something other than walks (and of course play etc, and training), and this keeps coming to mind and I just keep telling myself we're not ready for it...though it may be me chickening out lol.


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## sassafras

Well, this is not very scientific but... at some point you just have to do it. For me, it was when I felt like my dogs consistently at least looked in the right direction for gee/haw on walks and had a reasonable WHOA and ON BY.

Try to do it at as slow of a time as you can so there aren't a lot of people around, and give it a try. It's not going to be perfect at first, but there's only so much you can do on foot before they have to start practicing in front of the bike/scooter. 

Remember... you have brakes!


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## Sibe

I've been teaching more dogs recently. About 5-10 minutes I'm on the bike. I start by holding the line and having the dog to its owner(s) several times, making sure the dog is pulling, then I hook the dog up to the bike and keep doing that several more times, then we just.. go. Teach commands while going. 

Definately what sass said too, you have brakes! Use them. Make sure to be heavy on the back brakes and light on the front, you can flip if you slam just the front brakes.


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## Greater Swiss

Thanks both of you....I had a feeling it would pretty much come down to this:



sassafras said:


> Well, this is not very scientific but... at some point you just have to do it.


So I gotta stop chickening out and give it a go. Caeda's got an excellent "carry on" command, and she has an ok "easy" command and generally if she is in motion and I say Stay, she'll stop after a step or so....so I think we're at least good for a reasonable test run/bike (with me this time...not DH).


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## SDRRanger

I've been waiting for Ranger's toe to heal (he split it on an off leash hike last Saturday) with no patience lol. 

Today I harnessed him up and walked him through the wood trail while I pushed the scooter. Sometimes he's weird with noises so I figured this would be a good start. He did great staying our ahead of us and on the way back I hooked him up and we did a little trot back (with some stops). He wants to zigzag a little but he seemed to get it. 

I bought him a set of boots (mainly because I needed one for that front foot while it heals) and he doesn't seem to mind it. Can I use them when I will be going slowly on asphalt? I want to keep him off as much as possible, but it won't always be available.


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## sassafras

Yea, there's no reason not to use them that I can think of.


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## SDRRanger

GreaterSwiss: Make sure you have a helmet and just do it lol. I was really nervous of finally getting Ranger to pull, but it's actually not that terrifying...I chose a very quiet trail that he was used to and did little bits (it's straight so not too difficult). I tell you though, the first time you feel them pull against the tension and trot off is amazing.


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## RabbleFox

SDRRanger said:


> GreaterSwiss: Make sure you have a helmet and just do it lol. I was really nervous of finally getting Ranger to pull, but it's actually not that terrifying...I chose a very quiet trail that he was used to and did little bits (it's straight so not too difficult). I tell you though, the first time you feel them pull against the tension and trot off is amazing.


This. Sometimes you just have to have a little faith. XD

I suggest going at an off time so there aren't too many people or other dogs. For me, as long as the dog has a good "on-by" and a sense of direction, we are ok. Maybe take a dog-less bike ride first? It'll all come back pretty soon after that. 

Other than that, let them be free!

Bae Dog's first time on the bike was really, really fun. I ran him canicriss for a good whole before biking so the bike actually provided less resistance. Man, we were flying! It's a really cool feeling.


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## malamutelove

Eek I am so excited thought I would share. Well we are getting a house next febuary because we can't break our lease but I am rescuing a second mal then. The mal will be already harness trained and already work from a team. This is who I am getting it from. She is a well known musher and she takes in other mals from people that can't mush any more. yippee. 
http://www.pagosadogsled.com/#!the-resuce/c1znp


And some more pictures for you all! 

















maybe you guys can tell but she is talking to me. She is getting mad we stopped to take a picture. lol


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## marsha=whitie

@Hector: When we first started canicross, I had back pain as well. After altering my belt to sit lower on my hips/butt, it eased, but didn't entirely disappear. The next thing that I started to work on was my form while running. I noticed that I would heal strike while running canicross, in an attempt to slow down a bit. I started working with my dog to keep a little more slack in the line, and she now keeps with my pace. Its made it easier for me to focus on my running form. I'm now striking midfoot, and my back no longer hurts. It might be something to work on. Oh, and we use a bungee as well. I just went to the hardware store and bought 1' of the strongest bungee cord, then presto, diy shock absorber. Its currently connected to her harness, but I'm considering putting it on the belt end of the line instead. Eventually I'll invest in a proper xback. lol


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## Hector4

marsha=whitie said:


> @Hector: When we first started canicross, I had back pain as well. After altering my belt to sit lower on my hips/butt, it eased, but didn't entirely disappear. The next thing that I started to work on was my form while running. I noticed that I would heal strike while running canicross, in an attempt to slow down a bit. I started working with my dog to keep a little more slack in the line, and she now keeps with my pace. Its made it easier for me to focus on my running form. I'm now striking midfoot, and my back no longer hurts. It might be something to work on. Oh, and we use a bungee as well. I just went to the hardware store and bought 1' of the strongest bungee cord, then presto, diy shock absorber. Its currently connected to her harness, but I'm considering putting it on the belt end of the line instead. Eventually I'll invest in a proper xback. lol
> View attachment 151026


Thank you for the tips. I don't think I will be doing canicross too often. The back pain seemed to lessen if I situated the belt around my butt like literally around the butt. I found that doing canicross in town was too much excitement for my mastiff. He became so aroused that he became dog reactive. I guess I'll go back to structured walks and short sprints on the leash as he runs very well by me on leash with no canicross setup. I will keep those tips in mind!!


----------



## marsha=whitie

Hector4 said:


> Thank you for the tips. I don't think I will be doing canicross too often. The back pain seemed to lessen if I situated the belt around my butt like literally around the butt. I found that doing canicross in town was too much excitement for my mastiff. He became so aroused that he became dog reactive. I guess I'll go back to structured walks and short sprints on the leash as he runs very well by me on leash with no canicross setup. I will keep those tips in mind!!


We had the same problem with overexcitement too. If we go out on the streets, its at night when no one is out. Otherwise, most of our adventures are on trails. Good luck!


----------



## Remaru

I finally ordered hubby this http://www.julius-k9.us/joggingbeltandaccessories-p-5.html He liked the look of it best. We spent quite a while looking through different belt and leashing options before deciding on this one. I was going to buy Remus a Julius K9 harness for hiking and normal wear but decided on a webmaster that is also on the way. I don't know if he will use it for running or if they will use his other harness (it is a no pull but it is really just a normal harness with two connection points so it can be clipped just on the back). Right now hubby plans to just jog and eventually run with him, no pulling. If they work up to actual pulling I may look at an xback harness. I'm also considering looking into carting. Duke used a type of carting harness to pull a wagon when he was younger (his obviously won't fit Remus) can a dog pull a cart (like a wagon) in an xback or do they need a carting harness?


----------



## Kyllobernese

I was at a Garage Sale last Saturday and came across two x-back harnesses. I bought them both as they only wanted $10.00 for the two of them. One is pink and the other is blue. The pink one looks great on Kris. Thought even if I did not end up using them, I could find someone interested in them. We have a good trail that goes around the two lakes nearby if I get brave enough to try something with Kris.


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## Hector4

A great article on different types of wheels (skates, scooters, bikes, etc.)

http://www.littledoginabigcity.com/chapter 14.htm


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## Remaru

The new harness and jogging belt came in!!!! Remus was a little freaked out by the harness at first. He sort of walked around all hunched up and skittering


only thing worse than a new harness is having your pic taken in a new harness. I'm glad I went with the small, it looked like it might be too small based on measurements but it actually has a good bit of adjusting room. 

He actually loves it now that he is used to it and I am loving it. He is doing so much better on his LLW that I can walk him in this, no need for the no pull harness at all. If he does get reactive I can grab the handle (yay for handles) but really we haven't needed it. It is going to be great for hiking (love him being able to pull me up over rocks). 

Hubby took him out for a run with the jogging belt and he said it was great, they could go so much easier. However Remus doubled back on him and tripped him. Not a leash issue as this has happened before with leash in hand, just something they need to work on.


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## SDRRanger

Took Ranger for a little scooter on our trail. He had zero interest in pulling on the way out, but on the way home picked up the slack and trotted. He can be a big wimp with some things and I think the noise of the wheels bothers him a little. Hoping this weekend to either go to the meet up where he can see other dogs and have someone to follow or I'm getting the BF to jog in front with him


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## Hector4

Remaru said:


> The new harness and jogging belt came in!!!! Remus was a little freaked out by the harness at first. He sort of walked around all hunched up and skittering
> 
> 
> only thing worse than a new harness is having your pic taken in a new harness. I'm glad I went with the small, it looked like it might be too small based on measurements but it actually has a good bit of adjusting room.
> 
> He actually loves it now that he is used to it and I am loving it. He is doing so much better on his LLW that I can walk him in this, no need for the no pull harness at all. If he does get reactive I can grab the handle (yay for handles) but really we haven't needed it. It is going to be great for hiking (love him being able to pull me up over rocks).
> 
> Hubby took him out for a run with the jogging belt and he said it was great, they could go so much easier. However Remus doubled back on him and tripped him. Not a leash issue as this has happened before with leash in hand, just something they need to work on.


Looking good!



SDRRanger said:


> Took Ranger for a little scooter on our trail. He had zero interest in pulling on the way out, but on the way home picked up the slack and trotted. He can be a big wimp with some things and I think the noise of the wheels bothers him a little. Hoping this weekend to either go to the meet up where he can see other dogs and have someone to follow or I'm getting the BF to jog in front with him


He will be pulling like a pro in no time!


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## sassafras

SDRRanger said:


> Took Ranger for a little scooter on our trail. He had zero interest in pulling on the way out, but on the way home picked up the slack and trotted. He can be a big wimp with some things and I think the noise of the wheels bothers him a little. Hoping this weekend to either go to the meet up where he can see other dogs and have someone to follow or I'm getting the BF to jog in front with him


Just wait until the first time a deer or something crosses your path.


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## SDRRanger

sassafras said:


> Just wait until the first time a deer or something crosses your path.


I think I need more safety gear...


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## sassafras

No, no, I mean then he'll get to pulling! 

Just this morning I went for a deer ride. It will go from scary to exhilarating soon enough. ;-)


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## Hector4

SDRRanger said:


> I think I need more safety gear...


well this is always a good idea


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## SDRRanger

something like this...


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## sassafras

Aheheheheh.


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## sassafras

I happened to catch some pictures of what I call the "Maisy Bump" today. She's always just done this on her own, I never trained her to do it (nor would I even begin to know how to train such a thing).

Step One: Squash gets distracted by something off to the left. You can see her line is already slack, getting ready for what she knows she must do.


Step Two: While he tries to plow by her, she digs in and body blocks him. The maneuver ends with her shoulder-checking him.


Step Three: She shoves him back over, and we keep going.



Honestly, I don't even know why he tries anymore. She never, ever allows it. My Enforcer. <3


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## Sibe

Good girl Maisy. I think it must stem from the idea we teach them that you can't stop. Kaytu does the same thing. She'll keep plowing forward, pushing other dogs (or people) out of the way.


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## sassafras

Yes, once she is in harness there is practically nothing that is going to stop her. She very, very rarely gets distracted herself, she just wants to go and go some more, and darn if she's going to let him mess that up. She's like the Terminator.


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## Sibe

This is the ultimate mushing song. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pDMjgckNlz0&feature=kp


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## Hector4

sassafras said:


> I happened to catch some pictures of what I call the "Maisy Bump" today. She's always just done this on her own, I never trained her to do it (nor would I even begin to know how to train such a thing).
> 
> Step One: Squash gets distracted by something off to the left. You can see her line is already slack, getting ready for what she knows she must do.
> 
> 
> Step Two: While he tries to plow by her, she digs in and body blocks him. The maneuver ends with her shoulder-checking him.
> 
> 
> Step Three: She shoves him back over, and we keep going.
> 
> 
> 
> Honestly, I don't even know why he tries anymore. She never, ever allows it. My Enforcer. <3


This is awesome.


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## Sibe

Kaytu impatiently waiting to run tonight, we did a quick 4 miles.









ETA: Husband made this, Bear is Kaytu's boyfriend sitting next to her there









So friend did this









I'm dying.


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## sassafras

There were a couple of owls yelling back and forth at each other towards the end of our run today, you can't hear it on the video because the wheel is SO LOUD, but you can see how fascinated the dogs were.

And this, ladies and gentleman, is what a neckline is for.


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## Sibe

Hahahhahahahahaha!! He's like "But.. but.. but..." and she's like "NOPE NOPE NOPE."


Kaytu and her boyfriend Bear.


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## sassafras

Unnnggghhhh red huskies *swoon*


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## Remaru

Have I ever mentioned how much I love red dogs? That Home Alone pic that your friend made is hilarious. 

I love all of the pictures and videos. I am just a little jealous, but I am terrible on a bike (I kind of know how but it feels very unnatural). I've been sort of watching CL for one of the trikes. Hubby teases me but I feel more stable that way.


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## marsha=whitie

sassafras said:


> There were a couple of owls yelling back and forth at each other towards the end of our run today, you can't hear it on the video because the wheel is SO LOUD, but you can see how fascinated the dogs were.
> 
> And this, ladies and gentleman, is what a neckline is for.


Gosh, I really envy your trails/paths. The only trails even close to being as wide as yours are all paved. YUCK. Damn living in a hilly area. -_-


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## Eeyore

Since I broke my leg this winter I can't run (getting the metal plate removed in the coming autumn) but that only means we've stepped up from canicross to bikejoring. I own a scooter as well, but I'm lending it to my sister who has bigger dogs with higher drive, and lives closer to good tracks. I have to bike 5k before getting to something else that asphalt, during which Eeyore trots beside me, on grass if there is any. 

Anyway, I wonder if you run your dogs when it's hot outside?
Right now we have a ridiculous heatwave, meaning 30 C (86 F) in the shadow for a week. I'm scared of overheating him, but since Eeyore has a really short coat and handles heat well in general, we still do short slow runs, maybe 3k instead of 10, in the evening when it gets below 25 C. But I can't wait for some cool weather that allows us to go out for a couple of hours! It's impossible to motivate him in the morning, he wants to sleep until maybe 10 AM otherwise we would go in the morning.


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## Eeyore

Oh, I found an old youtube clip (I hope I manage to put it here, I usually mess up codes somehow) from when I used the scooter. I had to walk over some parts that my current bike would have handled without a problem, otherwise I really like the feeling of scootering:

[video=youtube;v=FeLaEeJhJMM]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v=FeLaEeJhJMM[/video]

I really like how he carries his tail, he loves it and it shows! If you find the clip long and dull: at 4:20 he switches to gallop, I love to watch dogs running at full speed so if you're like me just skip to the fun part.


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## RabbleFox

In the summer I've run the dogs at night. If you want to keep condition despite the heat, you can break longer runs into two segments. One in the morning and one in the evening. Remember to being water and to monitor your dogs condition through out runs!

Eeyore is such a cutie when he runs.


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## sassafras

A lot of mushers use the rule of thumb if heat + %humidity = over 100F, don't run the dogs. 

Personally, I think the humidity is more of a factor than the heat. If the humidity feels uncomfortable to me, I generally don't run the dogs regardless of the air temperature. I try to only go out before 8 am in the summer in any case, but I don't strictly speaking have a temperature I won't run them at. It depends on a lot of factors. For example, this summer has been unusually cool for us with highs rarely getting above 80-85F so the dogs are not conditioned to any kind of heat at all. Also, our trails have been partially to completely flooded until just in the last week or so, so their conditioning isn't great right now generally. So THIS summer I probably wouldn't run them once the air temperature got over 80F while in past years that wouldn't phase me at all. 

So I guess my answer is "maybe, it depends."


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## Hector4

Updating us and canicross. I have noticed twice now that my mastiff ends up with limpies every time I take him out for a little pull (2x now). I guess some dogs just can't do this kind of activity. I guess we'll be happy just running on a flexi. Less stress on my back and his joints.


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## JTurner

I may have missed it already earlier in the thread, so i apologize if that is the case...I am really interested to start CaniX with my dog! As soon as I put on his agility harness he wants to pull & he is SO into it, but when i walk him with his collar & leash he doesn't pull. As some of you already know, I trail run with my dog - but there has been an increase in housing development & highway construction in my area boooo, so i often feel uncomfortable having him offleash anymore. My ultimate goal is to move out west . Unfortunately, this sport is not too popular in the USA, so i am having a hard time finding resources such as a store to purchase equipment. If somebody could help me out i would really appreciate it! Thanks! I live in NJ/DE area.


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## Sibe

JTurner, sorry your question seems overlooked! Alpine Outfitters has a CaniX belt, honestly I'm not sure what belts are often recommended. http://www.alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=24

First run of the season!! Finally down to 70*, overcast and windy. Quick 2 miles around the neighborhood.


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## JTurner

Sibe said:


> JTurner, sorry your question seems overlooked! Alpine Outfitters has a CaniX belt, honestly I'm not sure what belts are often recommended. http://www.alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodList.asp?idCategory=24
> 
> First run of the season!! Finally down to 70*, overcast and windy. Quick 2 miles around the neighborhood.



LOL no problem, thanks for the response! I wasnt expecting one too soon because it seems to be a far less common dog sport. What a nice looking harness! I have read some good and bad reviews with alpine, but i guess that goes for any company. As far as commands go, when we go for walks or runs I say either left or right and in theory eventually he will figure it out?


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## Eeyore

Right now we're taking a break from the dryland mushing, and working on general speed and stamina with off leash forest walks, and strength through drag weight. Also, I get more of a workout from running if we're using dw instead of canicrossing... 

JTurner: I only know European stores, but basically you want a belt with leg loops (otherwise it rides up and can hurt your back), a bungee line and a harness which leaves the dogs airways and shoulders free (I'm not a fan of buggy harnesses for mushing). I recently got a howling dog second skin harness that I really like and I could definitely see using only that one for canicross, we already have an x-back as well but there's no such thing as too much dog stuff 

As for commands, I've done what you said, with praise when the dog gets it right. I never used any other reward, as I don't want the dog to turn back to me, other than stop where I go forward to the dog and reward him. I know people who do elaborate set ups to teach directional commands but I never found it necessary


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## sassafras

I just use my skijor belt for canicross, too. The belt is meant to protect your back as well as attach you to the dog, so whatever you use or DIY should be wide, be designed to sit at your hips, and have some bungee or other shock absorption built into it.

For the dogs I just use their regular x-backs or I also have the Urban Trails harness from AO which I like a lot. The line is nothing special as long as there is bungee in your belt, sometimes I even just use a plain old double-ended leash. 

We're taking a break from pretty much everything right now anyway, Maisy tore her cruciate and had surgery last week so she can't do anything at all for at least another week or so and then PT and leash walks only for another 8-9 weeks. Squash isn't an awesome puller on the scooter without her so we are sticking to canicross for now and just working on fundamentals.

I taught direction commands just by association as well. The pulling/movement is its own reward, really. I started marking (YES!) as soon as they would turn their heads in the correct direction. One thing I'll say is that once they kind of get it, be sure to give your directional command far enough before a turn so they have time to register and follow through. One mistake I made a lot early on was to give the command too close to the turn.


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## Jamie-Kay

I am just starting out. My dogs and I are loving this. Working on cues till we get our new harnesses


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## Eeyore

Sooo... we're taking a break from our break. When the puppy arrives (tuesday omg!) we'll probably get back to not doing much of this, but as for now it's fun to get back into it.

Thursday we did some bikejoring, and then I unelashed him while I tried my hands at a singletrack for the first time (I'm a coward, so that was a lot fo standing still and leading the bike past obstacles). It seems like the work we've done while not mushing is paying off, because he actually worked nicely all the way uphill, where he usually would just trot with a slack line. 

I put together a (kind o long) YT clip, he's not very focused at the beginning but in the second bikejoring part (after the singletrack) he's lovely! Also the text is in swedish because I didn't think about sharing it here, but that won't stop anyone from admiring my dog, or laughing at me 






Friday we did some canicross. A new dog sports acquaintance wanted to get some tips on how to get started with dryland mushing. Eeyore got some practice on being in the lead, he's usually alona or chasing someone so it was good training to him. It was a bit strange, especially since he was curious about the other dog, but then he got into working mode and just kept going  The other dog already does wp, so she has no trouble pulling, but like a lot of obedience trained dogs she seemed confused by the getting ahead of her owner part of it. I'm trying to get someone to join me for scootering and/or bikejoring, and I might just have found them!


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## SDRRanger

sassafras said:


> One thing I'll say is that once they kind of get it, be sure to give your directional command far enough before a turn so they have time to register and follow through. One mistake I made a lot early on was to give the command too close to the turn.


I learned this in agility lol...too close and your dog can't focus since they're already powering through lol


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## Sibe

Took the girls to the vet today for a routine checkup (the works: heartworm test, fecal, blood panel, parvo and distemper titers- passed on the rabies titer as that was $147 each). My dogs gained TEN POUNDS over this long hot summer. Had a vet visit today. Normally both dogs are 40 lbs. Nali was 50 and Kay is 47. Ugh!!!! Last week was mid-80s, the week before was upper 90s and breaking 100. Seems to finally be cooling off, I started our husky meetup.com group mushing back up last week. Can't wait to get my girls back in shape. This photo makes her look chunkier than she really is, which is why I'm sharing it


----------



## Quin Sweeney

Heey... Urban/Dryland Musher here. I've been mushing with Alpine Outfitters equipment for about six months now. I rarely do it, because I only have pavement and gravel to bike on, but my pup loves it. She's not great with stamina, but she makes up for it with drive.

This is an old video of us bikejoring, she doesn't usually strain that much out of the gate, but if I'd pedaled any, we'd of gone too fast and ran right out of frame. She's a little rocket.

She's my four year old high prey drive, dog reactive, lab x tolling retriever. I adore her.


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## sassafras

Ummm.... legs.


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## SDRRanger

sassafras said:


> Ummm.... legs.


LOVE IT! Do you find he paces or trots more?


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## sassafras

He tends to be a pacer, especially when he's tired. He'll trot more when he's fresher.


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## Sibe

Kaytu with boyfriend Bear at lead, Nali behind. This was a pause for water.









And a short video https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10101831698902703&set=vb.19228523&type=3&theater


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## SDRRanger

It's cold here now so we're ready to start scooter training again (yes, I could have gone earlier in the year (and earlier in the day) but I am lazy lol). 

I think part of Ranger's worry about scootering is the noise the TugNTow makes as it unwinds so we've attached it to the bannister and are working on line outs in the the house for now until he's more comfortable and then we'll be heading out.


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## Sibe

Hooked foster dog Cleo up by herself this morning to see how she'd do. She's great! Can't believe she's supposed to be running, she's like "What? Really?! Wow!!" I got some good speed out of her on the dirt section. She's a bit spazzy, leaping back and forth when running as all green dogs are but she's VERY responsive to my kissy sound and the way the line pulls so we had no trouble turning corners. (Edit: Was going to take her tomorrow to run for real with Kaytu and the husky group but it's a costume run. Might be a bit much for her.)
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10101850474251753


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## Sibe

Any idea where these harnesses are from? I'm really wanting to get open back harnesses. Also, what is this style of harness called? (Photo credit to Sheri Weatherbie-Blair)


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## Damon'sMom

Its not quiet the same but I came across these.


----------



## Foxes&Hounds

I scoot with my lurcher - he's born to run, loves absolutely nothing more!
VERY temped to add another similarly sized lurcher to my gang... we could scoot at the speed of light lol
Just run with my SFT boy too 

No pics on the go, but here's an old one of them in their harnesses


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## Canyx

I put the harness on Sor these least few days and made an absolute fool of myself tossing raw meat ahead and pretty much shouting at him the entire time. Poor dog. You know when everything you know about dog training is blaring in your head, "This is not the right way to do it." And the forefront of your brain is like "NO I WILL MAKE IT WORK THIS WAY!!!" Yeah. I'm embarrassed at myself.

The good news is, he is FANTASTIC going home, just -zero- drive to move forward going any direction away from home. And he is a natural non-puller and non-runner. So maybe I need to readjust my standards... We can make going out a walk, and going home a pull. 
(not truly mushing, just running ahead of me and keeping a tight leash. Looking to do some VERY casual skijoring this winter, since I currently live in a place with like 5 months of winter.)


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## Sibe

Pic I posted, the woman I "stole" the pic from makes them. The Howling Dog Second Skin harness came up in another discussion, but I'm not sure of the fit and how it'd do with a higher attachment point. My guy is saying Kaytu would run better in an open back like the Zero DC Faster, or the pic I posted.


----------



## sassafras

Skijor now makes an open backed harness, they call it a fastback. A lot of the skijorers around here are really ga-ga over them, but a lot of the skijorers around here know the guy who owns Skijor Now so I usually take it with a grain of salt.


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## Sibe

Yeeeah but those are like $80-90.


----------



## Remaru

Is it ok if I ask about a carting harness in here?


----------



## Sibe

Or course! All harness/pulling sports and activities welcome.


----------



## Remaru

My son would like to try out carting with his dog Magic, she's a medium sized mix very muscular. I've been looking at harnesses and I'm trying to figure out what type of harness would be better for their needs, a draft/carting harness, a basic pulling harness or the x-back harness. I don't want to go too overboard on this in case they don't really love it (don't want to spend $100 on a custom harness and have them hate it) I will be happy to put the money into it later if they get into it or if they move on to weight pull or something. So for starting out when she will mostly be getting used to the harness and pulling lighter things what would be a good start? He is hoping she can pull his wagon around the yard, that sort of thing. She is a bit oddly shaped, short but with a big chest and tiny waist.


----------



## Sibe

You would want (and need) a harness designed for carting. The design is very different from an x-back. Here's an example








http://www.fidogear.com/store/carting-harness-p-34.html

















http://k9carting.com/?page_id=85


----------



## Remaru

Thank you that is what I thought but the x-back at alpine outfitters listed carting as a use. I'm not sure if I want a siwash or another style seems a lot depends on what style of cart you will be using but since we plan to convert a wagon it is up to personal preference and ease of use.


----------



## Remaru

Ok so, 

http://www.stillwaterkennelsupply.com/harnesses.htm
the pulling harness here, not the weight pull but the pulling one. I like it because it is leather, super adjustable and comes with traces. Not set up for carting exactly though, just really nice and I love their stuff (totally tempted to get her one of the padded harnesses cause OMG fuzzy!!!!)

http://www.theworkingk9.com/cartingequipment.html
Looks like it is totally set up with everything I need to get started other than carting shafts which I can make myself. I like how customizable it is. 

http://nordkyn.com/product/pulkshort-bodied-harness-4/ 
not sure if this will work or not. I like the price better but I want her to be safe obviously. Looks like it is set up for carting but I think I would need to buy/make traces (I can do that). 

I really think I like the look/ease of on off of the parade style harness but haven't found one I like yet.


----------



## sassafras

Sibe said:


> Yeeeah but those are like $80-90.


Yea that's the main reason I haven't ever tried them, since I really have no complaints about my x-backs.


----------



## Kyllobernese

I picked up a couple of X-back harnesses for a few dollars at a Garage Sale. I bought both of them because one was a little bigger than the other and it was not sure which one would fit Kris. I have a little wagon that I intend to put shafts on and think it will work great. Thought I could train her to pull a sled with my garbage cans down to the gate and back in the winter time. I trained my Rhodesian Ridgeback and my Greyhound to work in harness years ago so have a good idea what to do. My winter project.


----------



## Eeyore

So, a couple of days ago I put the puppy in a backpack and went scootering. Both me and Eeyore have been seriously missing this since getting Tippex, it was awesome! Little T got to run next to us for really short sessions (E in a slow trot), basically only to practice not to bite the line, and as a side effect he passed other people without even looking their way! Though next time I'm getting someone to watch the pup, I realised I don't trust my balance that much so we kept it slow. Also it'll probably be a while because E seems to have pulled a muscle in ob training (play reward). Once that's back to normal I'm pretty confident we'll have too much ice and snow to get a good grip with the wheels.


----------



## Sibe

Enjoying what will hopefully be my last few days with Cleopatra. She meets adopters this weekend!









Video
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10101872856871803

This video shows the scenery really well
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10101872850779013


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## RabbleFox

First snow of the season today. Just a half inch or so but I'm excited to get Wolf back into shape. We will start running when I move home and switch to skis when SE Michigan gets enough snow.


----------



## SDRRanger

sassafras said:


> Yea that's the main reason I haven't ever tried them, since I really have no complaints about my x-backs.


I love my xback. We have a local business who makes them specifically for your dog (comes out and measures them all up) and then you choose the colours. Fits Ranger great and was only $40.


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## Sibe

My open back harnesses (called "Diamond Back" by this maker) are shipped. So excited to try them out! Total cost was $50. Each harness was $20, +$10 shipping from Canada.

Another pic from her FB page https://www.facebook.com/groups/639253266122575/


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## Sibe

New harnesses!!!!!





































Quick vid of Kaytu running here https://www.facebook.com/groups/639253266122575/permalink/768597909854776


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## Remaru

Sibe said:


> My open back harnesses (called "Diamond Back" by this maker) are shipped. So excited to try them out! Total cost was $50. Each harness was $20, +$10 shipping from Canada.
> 
> Another pic from her FB page https://www.facebook.com/groups/639253266122575/


I wound up contacting her and she was able to make a Siwash style carting harness for Magic for Christmas. I haven't been able to get it on her and try it out yet (weather hasn't been great and I need to make some training shafts for her). I am really excited for them to get started though as the weather has been improving and I think they are really going to enjoy it.

ETA: was thinking I may get a couple of x-backs for Magic and Freyja to try out as well. Was thinking they might enjoy pulling a simple travios in the yard or perhaps running with bikes.


----------



## PatriciafromCO

love this thread with every ones awesome dogs.... <3


----------



## Sibe

Remaru said:


> I wound up contacting her and she was able to make a Siwash style carting harness for Magic for Christmas. I haven't been able to get it on her and try it out yet (weather hasn't been great and I need to make some training shafts for her). I am really excited for them to get started though as the weather has been improving and I think they are really going to enjoy it.
> 
> ETA: was thinking I may get a couple of x-backs for Magic and Freyja to try out as well. Was thinking they might enjoy pulling a simple travios in the yard or perhaps running with bikes.


 Oh cool!! I had to look up that type of harness, not as familiar with carting styles.


----------



## Kyllobernese

I bought a couple of x-back harnesses at a Garage Sale last summer. Only paid $10 for the two of them and took both as I wanted to make sure one would fit Kris. So far, haven't done anything with them but she just turned two years so lots of time yet. The one that fit her is a really pretty bright pink, the other one is a little bigger and is blue.


----------



## Remaru

Sibe said:


> Oh cool!! I had to look up that type of harness, not as familiar with carting styles.


She was really great about it, had never made one before but was able to get it done in time for Christmas and at a super reasonable price ($20 plus $10 shipped). It is super complicated looking, a little intimidating actually so I may have to look at pictures while putting it on but I am really looking forward to getting out and letting my son start training with her. I really think she is going to love it. I originally wanted a formal parade style harness, I see them all of the time on the Great Pyrenees when they do rescue events here but I was reading that for training and on dogs that might have escape issues they aren't recommended so we are starting with this. If we ever want to do something really fancy I will see about getting one made for her.


----------



## Cathartica

So far my poor kaylee has had to content herself with basically draft work, ie she is hitched to a log, tire or sled while I walk her beside me, so she hasn't gotten to really run at all. She pulls my son around in his wooden toboggan, but for safety I have a leash on her and walk beside her. I would love to get a kick sled, last year I was pregnant and thought it was maybe a bit dangerous, and this year I'm a working mom and just haven't gotten around to it. She is only 40 lbs, so limited in what she can do on her own.


----------



## Foxes&Hounds

I've just entered my first race! :O
Me and Frodo, 4km next weekend. Eeep!


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## Sibe

Foxes&Hounds said:


> I've just entered my first race! :O
> Me and Frodo, 4km next weekend. Eeep!


 Let us know how you do! So exciting.


----------



## Cathartica

the littlest musher getting ready to take kaylee out for a sled ride!


----------



## Silly Dog

I'd like to get a scooter and try this out. Do you guys have any recommendations? The trails in my area are a mix of paved and dirt with potholes, washouts, and drainage swales. I don't plan on doing any trails that have much vertical or significant rocks or drops.


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## Sibe

Diggler is a good brand of scooters. I prefer a bike because I like to be able to pedal.


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## Silly Dog

Sibe said:


> Diggler is a good brand of scooters. I prefer a bike because I like to be able to pedal.



Yes, I have hooked her up to my bike in the past but it's a road bike so we can't do a lot of the less crowded trails. Plus I'd get more exercise on a scooter.

Looking at the Digglers...I see the $250 scooter will not support me, and the next step up is $500. Yikes. Not try it and see if we like it prices. They look like nice scooters though.


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## Sibe

Silly Dog said:


> Yes, I have hooked her up to my bike in the past but it's a road bike so we can't do a lot of the less crowded trails. Plus I'd get more exercise on a scooter.
> 
> Looking at the Digglers...I see the $250 scooter will not support me, and the next step up is $500. Yikes. Not try it and see if we like it prices. They look like nice scooters though.


 Check craigslist, join local dog sport/mushing groups, you can find a secondhand scooter.


----------



## parus

Anyone following the Iditarod this year? The start was moved to Fairbanks due to lack of ground cover in Anchorage, so I got to watch it, which was fun.


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## Sibe

I've been following it https://www.facebook.com/groups/142536262513007/


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## sassafras

Only peripherally through posting on some FB mushing groups I'm in. Once Brent Sass DQ'd I sort of lost interest.


----------



## Sibe

Kaytu with her boyfriend, Bear.


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## Sibe

More fun with Bear and Kaytu!
https://www.facebook.com/beyondblond/videos/vb.19228523/10102148243958873/?type=2&theater


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## Sibe

Beef.Cake.









Smirk face


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## Sibe

First ride down the trail that will probably be our regular trail here. Kaytu hurt her leg over a week ago, close to 2 weeks ago. Best as I could tell she pulled a groin/inner thigh muscle. She'd let me manipulate and move her leg and stretch it every which way, and was only tender and unhappy when I was pressing on her inner thigh. She was leashed inside most of the time, made to walk slowly up stairs (she was so limpy the first ~2 days that I carried her up and down), not allowed to run at all. For over a week. She was going nuts! The last 3 days she's been fine, no limping, allowed to run and play again, and not showing any signs of tenderness, pain, or limping, so we hit the new trail here. She ran SO FAST and had such a good time! We kept it fairly short, 1.8 miles down then back. She has to get used to the altitude too!


----------



## sassafras

I've started taking the three dogs out together for some short runs. Maisy was very fascinated by a kayaker on the river.


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## luv mi pets

Sibe- why do you have the leash thru the tube on your bike I was just wondering if it had a purpose and the reasoning behind it. When I look at others who do the bike it is tied directly to the bike and goes straight out to the dog. Thanks in advance

Sass so jealous of your crew. They are looking good.


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## Sibe

luv mi pets said:


> Sibe- why do you have the leash thru the tube on your bike I was just wondering if it had a purpose and the reasoning behind it. When I look at others who do the bike it is tied directly to the bike and goes straight out to the dog. Thanks in advance


Where are you seeing this?


----------



## Sibe

I have the line from Alpine Outfitters. The connector bit goes around the head tube and out from there. I currently don't have a line protector/scooter noodle on, as shown in this pic.









ETA


----------



## Zilla

I never knew this was so popular. Just saw this thread. Always been fascinated with sled pulling but pulling bikes and scooters?! That's awesome!! Makes me want a husky just to do this. How fun. I think my guy would be more equipped for slow cart pulling haha


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## luv mi pets

Sibe said:


> Where are you seeing this?


Hahaha from past pictures it just looked like you had the tube connected solid to the bike but these pictures show it to be more mobile. and also I see how it is connected to the bike I just never saw anyone run it thru a pvc pipe before. is that to protect the rope from rubbing against the tire? just curious. thanks for replying


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## sassafras

Yup, it's to keep the line from tangling up in the front tire if there is any slack.


----------



## luv mi pets

sassafras said:


> Yup, it's to keep the line from tangling up in the front tire if there is any slack.



Thanks for clarifying that.


----------



## Sibe

Yep! Just to protect the line from rubbing on the tire. When the line has any slack in it, it can hit the tire. Leads to frayed and damaged lines.


----------



## Sibe

My double scooter line from Alpine Outfitters is starting to fray. Needs replace asap. Do I order another (I'd go with the reflective blue cord this time) or does anyone have other suggestions? Must be reflective.

_Edit: Got the reflective one from AO_


----------



## Foxes&Hounds

Frodo has utterly lost his oomph after the little altercation at his race. Just doesn't want to do it any more 
Gwen is a beast, beginning to really listen to her commands well. We've another race end of September so it might just be her going!












Here's a dodgy phone video of her doing her thang
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONZmwMpsLpw


----------



## Remaru

Zilla said:


> I never knew this was so popular. Just saw this thread. Always been fascinated with sled pulling but pulling bikes and scooters?! That's awesome!! Makes me want a husky just to do this. How fun. I think my guy would be more equipped for slow cart pulling haha


This is what I'm working with Magic on. I think she would enjoy running with a bike and even canicross but I don't trust her not to bolt after small furry things and hurt some one so cart pulling is more her speed. No one in the family really rides bikes anyway, I've never been good at it and hubby stopped a long time ago. My boys are more into skates. My son is hoping she can actually pull him in a cart like Duke used to. I would love to progress to weight pulling with her (more gear to buy). I think she would enjoy it. I may try cart pulling with Lad as well when he is older. Freyja jogs but again, since no one rides bikes no bike pulling.


----------



## Foxes&Hounds

Zilla said:


> I never knew this was so popular. Just saw this thread. Always been fascinated with sled pulling but pulling bikes and scooters?! That's awesome!! Makes me want a husky just to do this. How fun. I think my guy would be more equipped for slow cart pulling haha


Huskies not necessary!


----------



## Sibe

I've personally done it with a boxer, a pointer/pit mix, a malinois, a viszla... you don't need a Nordic breed!


----------



## jade5280

We recently moved to a rural location and there is an awesome state park right across the street from our house and I think it would be great for joring. Would you recommend a scooter or bike? Does anyone have any links for how to start training for joring? How do you keep the dog from stopping and sniffing things?


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## sassafras

I will respond in more detail later, but bike vs scooter is really just a personal preference. The dogs are doing more work with the scooter, you are helping more with the bike. I personally find bikejoring very intimidating because I can get off the scooter very quickly and easily if I need/want to which I don't feel like is as true with a bike. Plus until now I haven't had a vehicle I can transport a bike in.  Now that I do, I may give it a whirl.


----------



## Sibe

jade5280 said:


> We recently moved to a rural location and there is an awesome state park right across the street from our house and I think it would be great for joring. Would you recommend a scooter or bike? Does anyone have any links for how to start training for joring? How do you keep the dog from stopping and sniffing things?


 1. Scooter vs Bike.
Personal preference, and depends on the terrain and dog's abilities too. Scooters are safer for you. If you're unsteady on a bike, get a scooter. I much, much prefer a mountain bike as I like being able to pedal up hills and when my dog is tiring out. Scooter you'd be pushing with one leg and that's not something I find enjoyable. I also like that I can take my mountain bike out without a dog. Scooters are more limited- but again, scooters are safer.

2. To be honest, I do most training on the go. Even a dog that has NEVER done anything like it in their life I just hook up and go, and see what happens. We go slow to start, USE YOUR BRAKES. I can't emphasize that enough. Brakes, brakes, brakes. Give happy, enthusiastic encouragement, quite constant at first (ultimately you'll be keeping your mouth shut most of the time, chatter is not good, but when starting give a lot of praise so the dog gains confidence that they are doing the right thing).

Here is a foster dog's very first time ever mushing. Notice how slow we're going. Brakes, brakes, brakes! Slow is safe, start safe. (PLEASE run on dirt, this is a short concrete section outside our block that takes us to the dirt. Some concrete, no problem, mostly/all concrete is quite damaging to their joints and paw pads.
https://www.facebook.com/beyondblond/videos/vb.19228523/10101850474251753/?type=3

Compare to second time ever... she's so bouncy lol. Notice here that I don't care much about a tight line. I just want her running, to keep moving. Some people require a tight line from the first moment and never want any slack for any reason. There is no right or wrong answer for that. Personal preference, and personal ways of training dogs.
https://www.facebook.com/beyondblond/videos/vb.19228523/10101853225807613/?type=3

And after a few runs I understood her well enough, switched harnesses, and she was a pro.
https://www.facebook.com/beyondblond/videos/vb.19228523/10101872856871803/?type=3

Any time we come up to a turn, I brake while giving the cue. Does the dog know what it means? Of course not. But I brake, make kissy noises, start turning and encouraging them, and when they commit to the turn, TONS of praise. Don't let them miss a turn, if they're not getting it I will completely stop, guide them, then TONS of praise as we keep going.

3. Stopping and sniffing.
Um, I don't stop. At a trotting speed and faster, usually dogs won't stop because whatever smell they get has gone by in an instant anyway. But especially when starting, since you'll be going slow, wanting to stop and sniff, and lunging back and forth across the trail, is pretty common. I just don't stop. If the dog is weaving around or looking interested in pursuing a smell I pick up my encouragement and give an "on by" cue. So as dog is leaning in to something I will say like, "on by on by, let's go c'mon on by on by on by!!!" and encourage them to pick up the pace to go by- if they do, awesome! TONS of praise, "woohooo!!! good on byyyy!!!" If they do stop... I don't. This does NOT mean I'm yanking them off their feet, but I will pass them *slowly* while still encouraging them to keep going, to the point that I will let the line get tight to pull them along- not yanking, jerking, but gentle even pressure (usually I am barely moving by this point and have a foot down on the ground, as I don't want my bike ripped out from under me). No matter what, as soon as the dog commits to going on by something it wanted, TONS of praise. They usually learn very quickly not to stop. (See next paragraph if dog is a marker).

*DO* let your dog stop to potty. Some dogs need to poop almost immediately after they start running. Some need to pee a few times. You'll learn your dog's patterns, and when you know then you can plan and offer potty stops *before* they randomly slam their brakes. If you have a dog that likes to mark, mushing is tough at first for them. Give heavy, excited encouragement to keep going if they look interested in marking. If they pass the spot they wanted, hooray! Praise, praise, praise, and find a nice spot ahead to slow down and give them a "go potty" cue. Don't ever let your dog randomly mark- it may happen at first a couple times but really do your best to keep them moving and not allow it.

Sassafras will add lots of good tips too I'm sure! Mushing is so personal, everybody does it a little differently and for many things there is no one right way. The biggest thing is to KEEP IT FUN because if you frustrated and stressed your dog picks up on that and won't want to pull or do anything. It's sadly easy to shut dogs down with this sport. Stay positive. If you're getting pissed, get off your bike/scooter and walk (or stop completely) until you've calmed down.


----------



## jade5280

Thanks so much for the input! You've given tons of helpful info. When starting out, how do you teach the dog to go. I was thinking having another person in front to show the dog to go forwards would help, or do you think that's unnecessary? Do you use treats when teaching? Also I don't have a bike...or a scooter. Any recommendations on brands?


----------



## Sibe

jade5280 said:


> Thanks so much for the input! You've given tons of helpful info. When starting out, how do you teach the dog to go. I was thinking having another person in front to show the dog to go forwards would help, or do you think that's unnecessary? Do you use treats when teaching? Also I don't have a bike...or a scooter. Any recommendations on brands?


 Most dogs will naturally just start to go, and you praise and encourage that. You can have someone for the dog to chase, but that can become a necessity for the dog to go at all. I want the dog to be self-motivated as much as possible. I don't use treats, because I don't want the dog stopping and turning back to me while running.

Diggler for scooters
My bike is a basic Trek mountain bike I spent about $500 on.

If you do get a bike, make sure it is a mountain bike. You do not want a road bike or a cruiser. Also make sure it has space on the head tube to put the post connector (the bit that wraps around to connect a line to). Many mountain bikes have the frame come together so much at the front that there isn't a good way to attach the post connector.


----------



## sassafras

If you have to invest in a new bike, consider a fat tire bike. A couple of local jorers LOVE theirs, apparently they are fantastic on a wider variety of surfaces including loose sand, mud, etc. (and snow!).

A lot of dogs will just pull. The pulling and the movement becomes self-rewarding. 

For passing by things... I start on foot/walks. Basically if your dog has a decent "leave it" you can teach them to keep moving past stuff. I use a LOT of premack - for example, once you successfully go by that squirrel tree, you're released to the squirrel tree - and it seems to really drive it home. Eventually when the running becomes self rewarding they will be less and less inclined to investigate other stuff.

And I agree, DON'T FORGET YOU HAVE BRAKES.


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## jade5280

Thanks guys! Ahhh too many choices! I'm still not sure if I'm going to try a bike or scooter first, I'll have to think about it. I think Ryker will do pretty well because he's been running with me for a while and has got it down that when we're running we don't stop until I say. Gypsy is going to be a piece of work, she's all over the place. I'm assuming you would wait until they are both successfully pulling by themselves before putting them together.

I skimmed through the rest of this thread, but didn't read all the posts. When training the commands like left and right, go, stop, etc. Do you just yell them out and show the dog what you want to do so the dog eventually catches on?

Do you buy all your gear from Alpine Outfitters?


----------



## sassafras

I started directional commands on walks, yea. Just called them out before we reached an intersection, and once they sorta seemed to have an association then I would start verbally marking a head turn in the correct direction - continuing to walk is the reward for a dog who likes to be out front and pull, so a treat shouldn't be needed. Once one dog gets it, that dog can help teach the other dog.

I started with one dog at a time but honestly I pretty quickly just threw them together. If they're going to be running as a team, might as well start that early. 

I get a lot of my gear from AO, but I've also gotten stuff from Nordkyn. I like AO a lot and I prefer their x-backs to other ones I've tried, but one warning for you is that during the busy season (like, October-ish through spring) it takes FOREVER to get stuff. Order on the off season! A lot of skjorers and some bikejorers around here prefer Skijor Now's fastback harness, but I haven't tried it. My scooter is a Diggler and I ordered it directly through them, I also get replacement lines through them sometimes.


----------



## jade5280

What kind of terrain can you go on? Would grass be okay or is that too soft? When you're mushing, does the snow have to be hard packed?


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## sassafras

Grass is fine if your tires can handle it. Most mountain bikes and fat tire bikes are going to be fine. My scooter can do grass, too, it's just a little harder for the dogs to pull across that type of surface. Most of what I run my dogs on is packed dirt trails, with some pavement. The only surface I really, really recommend staying away from is gravel. It's hard on their feet and it's not very safe, very easy to skid out.

You can skijor anywhere you can ski but is much, much easier on groomed trails. Breaking trail is really hard work. I have skate skis so I much prefer a trails that are groomed flat rather than as tracks (most of the time around here, track groomed trails are designated for skiers only and flat groomed trails are multiuse anyway).


----------



## jade5280

After doing some research I decided that I'm going to start with a scooter since the general consensus is that it's the 'safer' option. I think our neighbors have snowmobiles and they are really nice people so I was going to talk to them about using a snowmobile to pack trails down in the winter. Wooo I'm so excited!!!!


----------



## gray

Wow, love all the mushing photos! It looks like so much fun, and I'm definitely interested in bikejoring. Both of my dogs are trained for loose-leash walking, though - how much harder is it going to be to get them out in front and pull after they've been conditioned to do exactly the opposite?


----------



## Sibe

gray said:


> Wow, love all the mushing photos! It looks like so much fun, and I'm definitely interested in bikejoring. Both of my dogs are trained for loose-leash walking, though - how much harder is it going to be to get them out in front and pull after they've been conditioned to do exactly the opposite?


 Totally different activities with totally different equipment and cues. They can absolutely do both! Denali I worked really hard on leash walking and she's great on leash. She's not a huge fan of dryland mushing but LOVES skijoring and pulls pulls pulls. Kaytu came to me as an untrained, boundry-less 1 1/2 year old with zero leash manners and as a crazy insane puller. She's a natural at mushing, and while I do leash work with her she's the type that wears a Freedom harness and head collar on walks because she doesn't really enjoy walking speed so we don't work at it too much. Not a skill I need her to master so we have it to a reasonable, manageable level and I just let her mush


----------



## Kyllobernese

I bought a couple of x-back harnesses at a garage sale really cheap so may try them this winter with Kris. We have some nice hard packed dirt trails around our two lakes which would work really well, mostly flat with only a couple of slight hills.


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## gray

Awesome - I was hoping that's what the answer would be! Definitely going to start adding the commands to our walks. They're going to be the oddest team, a beagle and a lanky 50lb mutt. I really think they'll both enjoy it, though.


----------



## sydneynicole

I bought one of these

https://www.etsy.com/listing/226310...lid=COCzvLDf9McCFchffgodlKEA-w&kpid=226310631

for canicross. Seems like it will hold up very well, only had it for a few months though. I had to have it totally custom made for my dog because her body is just so oddly proportioned and this was by far the cheapest. Plus now she has a matching set, harness, collar and leash.


----------



## sydneynicole

gray said:


> Awesome - I was hoping that's what the answer would be! Definitely going to start adding the commands to our walks. They're going to be the oddest team, a beagle and a lanky 50lb mutt. I really think they'll both enjoy it, though.


A lot of people use collar for loose leash walking, and a harness for pulling, so the dogs know that when the harness goes on they are going to pull and when the collar is on it is just a walk. My dog walks in a harness and pulls in a different harness - not much of a difference, but she's intuitive enough to know what's going on. Once she hears that 'hike!' she's off.


----------



## Foxes&Hounds

Race this weekend!!
Camping over both days... Gwen and Hiccup are coming but it's just Gwen doing the racing. Two 3.5km trails each day. I'm excited.


----------



## Sibe

Phoenix Run on Saturday, fundraiser day with fun casual events to support mushers in Alaska affected by the Willow fire.

Lining up with Kaytu. BFF holding Amaze-Bobb.


















Hike hike hike!









I've never noticed the harness cutting under her ribs like it looks like it's doing here :/









My little kangaroo









Finishing


----------



## gray

Awesome pics Sibe! Really gorgeous scenery too. 

I took my awkward team for their first mushing experience today - and they loved it! Right now they're just in store harnesses because I haven't decided what to get for Orange Dog and Brown Dog has some growing to do. Besides, I really just had them up in front so that there was no slack in the leash, not actually pulling, just to get them used to being up there and still listening. Orange Dog can be very leash reactive but we passed a dog on the other side of the street, she looked once, heard "on by," and kept going without a second thought - incredible!

Here's a pic of them up there in their makeshift gear.









On another note, since I'm looking for gear - what do you all recommend? I saw a thread on this earlier but can't find it again. Alpine Outfitter's x-back seems like a popular choice, and I really like the idea of the custom fit since my beagle mix is such a strange shape. Still definitely open to opinions.


----------



## sassafras

Sunny, dry, 50s? Sounds like fall training weather to me!


----------



## Sibe

sassafras said:


> Sunny, dry, 50s? Sounds like fall training weather to me!


 They look good!


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## sassafras

Thanks! Toast is really a natural, and he and Maisy together are a dream.


----------



## Sibe

They do seem to run very evenly together. I need to stalk through your posts to learn more about Toast. How is Squashy doing?


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## sassafras

Squash is doing well, mushing isn't his favorite thing to do but he's much more enthusiastic when he's teamed with Toast vs Maisy - I think because they are almost exactly the same height so he doesn't have to adjust his pace at all. Squash is a little bit of a bad influence on Toast, but Toast is a little bit of a good influence on Squash, so it works out.


----------



## gray

So - took my two for their first run on the trails today! Kept it short to see how they'd do, and because Reina's (beagle, left) harness is absolute crap. New one should be coming tomorrow. 
They looooved it. Never thought I'd have to use the brakes as much as I did! Unfortunately the GoPro was out of batteries but I did take some short videos with my phone.
Here's keeping them quiet to start/testing the brakes:





And them sprinting - pure joy! Pardon the amount of "easy," lol - have to admit they caught me a little off guard with their enthusiasm, and I wouldn't put it above Reina's beagle brain to see a squirrel and drag the bike out from under me!


----------



## Sibe

They look like naturals! Good job keeping on the brakes, with mine I brake almost constantly unless we're going uphill and I'm pedaling.

Do you have a line coming with your harness too? You'll have to post pics of Reina in her harness!


----------



## gray

Thanks! I have them on the double bikejor/scooterjor line from Alpine Outfitters. Right now the harnesses are temporary and lower-quality, because I wanted to make sure it was something they'd both be interested in before I invested too much into it. Looks like I'm going to have to find higher end gear!


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## Sibe

Ah ok, looked like leashes in low res. I have the same line and I love it.


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## sassafras

Nice! I think "easy" is my most often uttered command, lol. And I ride my brakes mercilessly, partially to amp up drive a little and partially to correct for differences in speeds between the dogs (Toast is by far the fastest and will pull all the weight if I don't).


----------



## Foxes&Hounds

Team Hobbit Dog!


----------



## Sibe

Mushing. I think dogs like it.









Sauce: https://www.facebook.com/EnduranceK...4551936915822/924866230884387/?type=3&theater


----------



## Wet Beards

lol I think you're right.
Priceless


----------



## sassafras

Hahah priceless.


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## Sibe

Yeaaaaaaah let's walk down this hill today.









There were other flatter snowy parts she went FLYING through, just loving it!


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## Sibe

Ordered new open back harnesses since the ones I got last year were falling apart after only a couple months and also didn't fit well enough. Decided on these. Denali is getting hot pink webbing with lime green chest, and Kaytu is getting purple webbing with lime green chest.
http://www.wcdogsupply.com/store/p2/Razor_Back_Comfort_Harness.html

How to tell if your harness is too long, and why a long harness is bad:
It cuts up under their ribs.


----------



## kdawnk

Why would someone want this harness (Urban Trail Harness)
http://www.alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=155

Over this harness (X-Back Harness)
http://alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodview.asp?idProduct=17

For biking or sledding. Most likely more-so for future biking. She already bikes with me and knows the commands and directions I just don't have any of the gear needed to let her pull me. I'd like to do winter activities too, given it's (usually) mostly winter here, but I'm seriously uncoordinated (on snow/ice) and don't think I'd be a skijor candidate. I'm assuming Alpine Outfitters ship everywhere? Is that correct. I was digging on their site, but must have missed it.

I read through the whole thing so I think that's my only questions so far with this process.


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## sassafras

kdawnk said:


> Why would someone want this harness (Urban Trail Harness)
> http://www.alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=155
> 
> Over this harness (X-Back Harness)
> http://alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodview.asp?idProduct=17
> 
> For biking or sledding. Most likely more-so for future biking. She already bikes with me and knows the commands and directions I just don't have any of the gear needed to let her pull me. I'd like to do winter activities too, given it's (usually) mostly winter here, but I'm seriously uncoordinated (on snow/ice) and don't think I'd be a skijor candidate. I'm assuming Alpine Outfitters ship everywhere? Is that correct. I was digging on their site, but must have missed it.
> 
> I read through the whole thing so I think that's my only questions so far with this process.


Some people prefer the "half back" harnesses like the Urban Trail for biking because the point of attachment to a bike is higher than the point of attachment to a sled. I don't know that anyone KNOWS this but people worry that the x-back will distribute the weight oddly at that higher angle. Also, some dogs can learn to back out of x-backs and get loose but that's very difficult in a half-back. 

Personally I use an x-back almost always. I have the Urban Trails harnesses as well and I like them for hiking or "around town" kind of stuff. But I just didn't like how my dogs ran in half-backs in front of the skis or scooter and much prefer the x-backs.


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## Sibe

kdawnk said:


> Why would someone want this harness (Urban Trail Harness)
> http://www.alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=155
> 
> Over this harness (X-Back Harness)
> http://alpineoutfitters.net/scripts/prodview.asp?idProduct=17
> 
> For biking or sledding. Most likely more-so for future biking. She already bikes with me and knows the commands and directions I just don't have any of the gear needed to let her pull me. I'd like to do winter activities too, given it's (usually) mostly winter here, but I'm seriously uncoordinated (on snow/ice) and don't think I'd be a skijor candidate. I'm assuming Alpine Outfitters ship everywhere? Is that correct. I was digging on their site, but must have missed it.
> 
> I read through the whole thing so I think that's my only questions so far with this process.


The half harness is a great multi-use harness. Not just for mushing, but for hiking, walks, anything. It's fully padded which is awesome.

The half harness is also a great option for dogs who don't pull very hard. An X-back will bunch up, not fit right, and be uncomfortable if not being pulled tight.


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## kdawnk

Sibe said:


> The half harness is a great multi-use harness. Not just for mushing, but for hiking, walks, anything. It's fully padded which is awesome.
> 
> The half harness is also a great option for dogs who don't pull very hard. *An X-back will bunch up, not fit right, and be uncomfortable if not being pulled tight*.


That's a good point which might make Sans uncomfortable and want to stop repeatedly. She's very easily discouraged. So maybe start with the half-back and potentially transition to X-back when she gains confidence with pulling.
Where do people find single person single dog sleds that aren't like $800+ dollars. They look so rickety. I keep toggling between wanting to make something myself, and wanting to find something from someone else. It'd just be a hobby I'd like to try, I'm not sure I want to commit my life to it yet haha

Thanks for both your answers!


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## sassafras

And if she's comfortable in a half-back, there's no reason to change really. My dogs really don't seem comfortable pulling in the half backs, they do best in the x-backs. But a lot of people like the half backs or open backs a lot. 

There are a couple of musher's exchange groups on Facebook where people sell or trade used equipment. They are broken up by region, generally. For a single dog are you looking at kick sleds? I don't see them come up that often in my region but man there are some good deals that do come up. Also check out sled dog central (all one word plus dot com but I don't want to get moderated for the link), there are all sorts of links to vendors and such.


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## kdawnk

I'll probably order the half back. Do you think getting a starter kit with a thing to hook up to my bike from that site is a good deal? Or should I look for other sites. I'm not really familiar with any other sites and shipping to Canada is sometimes a weird problem.

Yeah I have the image in my mind that a kick sled would be less terrifying and more sturdy than attempting to make both my legs cooperate with skis. 
I'll check some of that stuff out, I've been looking for a while. The mechanics of them seem pretty simple so you wouldn't think they'd be as expensive as they are.


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## Foxy4ever

Wow, lots of cool photos on this thread! I've always been drawn to dog sledding, unfortunately my current climate barely gets snow, mostly just rainy and cold in the winter!
Anyway, I longboard and would love to (eventually) take my pup along so I guess longboardjing 
some general questions regarding that...
First off, Amaroq is 4 months so I'm thinking too young to do any pulling till about a year old is this right? Although it'd more be running beside me I think.
Currently, I've already gotten him used to skateboards and my longboard, he'll jump on and ride it for a few feet or jump on and off...although I'm slightly regretting this because now whenever I try to ride, he'll sometimes try to jump on/go right in front of it, I wanted to get him used to walking beside me while I ride but I'm not sure how to train him not to cross in front...how do you train commands like slow down or stay to one side? What do you guys think about training him to both ride on the board with me (I'd have to train him not to jump off...not sure if this will work when he's full grown but it'd be very practical for giving him a rest or cruising through a busy area) and also running beside me and eventually learning to pull me, would it be confusing sometimes being allowed on the board and sometimes having to keep distance? I'm just starting to add some mushing related commands in our daily outings, like left, right, on by and hike (to run faster preferably pulling a bit...only use this a bit though because I'm being careful not to run too much with him till he's older). Also, although I don't mind him pulling when I tell him to, I'm thinking of getting a harness to get him used to it and so that he can differentiate better between when he's allowed to pull and when we're going for a normal loose leash walk...(which still needs a lot of work)...I'm rather new to this area of dogmanship so any advice is appreciated! At this age what should I be training Amaroq, is there anything I'm doing wrong/shouldn't do?
Thanks


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## PatriciafromCO

do enjoy this thread, not anything to offer to mushing, but love seeing how they love it ...


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## franklinstein

I was wondering if anyone had any idea of how to tell of a dog will be good at skijoring? I want to start with my pup, but I'm nervous she may not have the drive to do it.


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## sassafras

If she tries to pull on walks, she will probably like it. Mostly you need a dog who is willing to stay out in front of you.


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## franklinstein

Looks like I'm going to start training her for some skijoring then!


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## Prozax

Absolutely love this thread! You guys have wonderful dogs and I appreciate the knowledge you shared here 
I want to get my setter to pull the bike once it's nice and sunny outside. She's naturally a puller, so I've started to teach her left/right on leash and stop. We'll see how we'll do as I've never done this before, but love biking.


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## KayaScout

So I know I don't belong on this thread BUT we have seen a few mushing teams out an about, mostly from a distance. But yesterday, we passed a team that was pulling their 4-wheeler right when we were getting onto the trail and man did Kaya's eyes light up! I know that sounds silly, but its like I could tell she was thinking "holy crap I NEED to run with these doggies!" and after they passed she tried to sprint with them and was whining when she couldn't get passed the end of her leash. Any thoughts or advice to give Kaya something like this without actually being on a mushing team?


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## Naessly

Hi there! Hopefully I'm in the right thread. 

I was wondering..I want to get into sledding eventually but I'll start with canicross and bikejoring.. Is there a way to teach the dog to pull (especially with a sled) -but- make the difference between the sled, bike or etc and the leash?
I don't know much about it yet so that's why I'm asking here. How do you teach to pull? Because of course, if I take my dog for a walk some days I want to be walking him and not the other way around  

I'm guessing he will make the difference if I simply teach him the two things separately, have him understand that it's a different situation, environment and etc? Will he know the difference between the harness and the simple collar/leash, too?


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## sydneynicole

KayaScout said:


> So I know I don't belong on this thread BUT we have seen a few mushing teams out an about, mostly from a distance. But yesterday, we passed a team that was pulling their 4-wheeler right when we were getting onto the trail and man did Kaya's eyes light up! I know that sounds silly, but its like I could tell she was thinking "holy crap I NEED to run with these doggies!" and after they passed she tried to sprint with them and was whining when she couldn't get passed the end of her leash. Any thoughts or advice to give Kaya something like this without actually being on a mushing team?


I know some people that train with tires. You'd need the right harness/set up, and lighter/smaller tires at first, of course. Is that what you meant? That would be a way for her to pull something, at least.


----------



## sydneynicole

Naessly said:


> Hi there! Hopefully I'm in the right thread.
> 
> I was wondering..I want to get into sledding eventually but I'll start with canicross and bikejoring.. Is there a way to teach the dog to pull (especially with a sled) -but- make the difference between the sled, bike or etc and the leash?
> I don't know much about it yet so that's why I'm asking here. How do you teach to pull? Because of course, if I take my dog for a walk some days I want to be walking him and not the other way around
> 
> I'm guessing he will make the difference if I simply teach him the two things separately, have him understand that it's a different situation, environment and etc? Will he know the difference between the harness and the simple collar/leash, too?


I taught my dog to pull by saying "let's go!" Then getting her riled up and excited and running. Now I just have to say "let's go!" and she knows we're starting. I'm not sure how others do it though lol. She only pulls wearing a harness, and walks nicely on the leash. Even in the harness, she doesn't pull (besides the excited 'we're about to have fun' pulling) until I say Let's go.


----------



## Naessly

Right! Thank your for the tip! I hadnt even though abouy giving a cue hehe


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## KayaScout

sydneynicole said:


> I know some people that train with tires. You'd need the right harness/set up, and lighter/smaller tires at first, of course. Is that what you meant? That would be a way for her to pull something, at least.


Yes thank you! I have seen the different harnesses they use for mushing compared to just the general one we have. This is definitely something worth looking into, I just wouldn't know how to go about it. If she's doing it alone, what would motivate her to even run if I am standing back where she started, you know?


----------



## Sibe

I've been collecting tires, drilling holes in them (holy cuss, so much sparks! wear goggles, gloves, and long sleeves and long pants!!) and sticking bolts through them as I'm getting ready to start a mushing seminar and classes. Here is how I'm teaching "line out" and from there you can add the Go word, usually "Hike!"

What you need
-Clicker
-Treats
-Dog in appropriate mushing harness
-Harness attached to tire or other anchor by at least a 4 ft line

Step 1
Stand in front of your dog. Quietly move backward, luring your dog, until the line is tight. Click the instant the line is tight, and give your dog a treat. Your dog should remain standing and keeping pressure on the line. Click and treat every second for 5 treats, then release your dog by rolling a treat behind your dog (you can offer praise here too, good dog!). If your dog was not calm and still, repeat this step. 

Repeat Step 1, clicking and treating every 2 seconds, then every 3 seconds, 5 seconds, 10 seconds, and 10-15 seconds. Repeat any duration that your dog is struggling with. Always end your training session with success!

Step 2
When your dog can remain calm and still with a tight line for 10-15 seconds, it's time to add the cue! With your dog holding the line tight, roll a treat behind your dog. As soon as your dog has eaten the treat, say "line out!" in a cheery, strong voice. Your dog should come back to tighten the line. Click the instant the line is tight, and give your dog a treat. Pause for 2-10 seconds, then click and treat. Pause for a random duration and click and treat a total of 2-5x before releasing your dog by rolling a treat behind your dog. This is important so that your dog does not learn to expect to be release after a certain number of treats. Dogs _love_ to find patterns and we don't want a release pattern with this behavior.

Practice Step 2 until your dog is listening to the cue at least 9 out of 10 times. Always end your training session with success!

Step 3
When your dog is understanding "line out," take a couple steps toward your anchor point [edit: at this step, you'll be facing the same direction as your dog, not face to face] so that when your dog is lined out they will be just barely ahead of you. Roll a treat behind your dog and give your "line out!" cue. Your dog will have to go just barely in front of you to tighten the line. Give a verbal marker instead of using the clicker [dogs are likely to turn to you if using a clicker, use what works best for your dog]. Pause 2-15 seconds then calmly walk in front of your dog to deliver the treat. Reward a total of 2-5x for keeping the line tight before releasing your dog. Gradually start from closer and closer to your anchor point, giving your "line out!" cue then pausing 2-15 seconds before rewarding.


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## KayaScout

Holy guacamole thank you so much Sibe! This is for sure something that I want to try come spring time! I appreciate you taking the time to write all this out step by step


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## Sibe

KayaScout said:


> Holy guacamole thank you so much Sibe! This is for sure something that I want to try come spring time! I appreciate you taking the time to write all this out step by step


 Copy-paste from my handout I'll be giving out after lesson 1. Denali learned on the go, and then Kaytu the same by following Denali, so I had to come up with a way to teach a solid "line out" to newbies in my classes. This is what made sense to me, and what I thought dogs would catch on to. Have had one guinea pig to try it out so far and the dog caught on really quickly. Let me know if it works for you


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## Naessly

I've got a question regarding equipment...I'm posting in the mushing thread because I didn't see a scootering thread (and anyway it's considered mushing, no? but on dry land?) 

Anyway, does anyone in USA or Canada (I'm from Canada) have some advice as to where to buy a good scooter to use with my dog? I've seen some links but they were extremely expensive and in euro.


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## Sibe

Naessly said:


> I've got a question regarding equipment...I'm posting in the mushing thread because I didn't see a scootering thread (and anyway it's considered mushing, no? but on dry land?)
> 
> Anyway, does anyone in USA or Canada (I'm from Canada) have some advice as to where to buy a good scooter to use with my dog? I've seen some links but they were extremely expensive and in euro.


Kickbike, or PawTrekker. Toucan (the basic kind without suspension, I hear the suspension version isn't so great).

Diggler used to be commonly recommended but I think they went out of business. Can search online to find them secondhand.


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## Sibe

It was about 30*, windy, and snowed last night. Perfect for miss Perfect Precious Poofy Princess Prissy-Pants Prancy-Paws to enjoy a run. She really doesn't like running on dirt; she'll move but doesn't really enjoy it. She _loves_ running in snow. Also, NEW HARNESS!!!! WC Razor Back. I got a lime green chest and hot pink webbing for Denali, Kaytu's is lime green chest with purple webbing.


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## Foxes&Hounds




----------



## Prozax

Hi,
Can someone please tell me if this harness would be ok to start Ellie in pulling the bike? 

http://www.neewa.it/en/prodotti/sport-line/pettorina-running.aspx


It's the only one I can get fairly easy. If not, I'll keep hunting for one.
Thanks!


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## Foxes&Hounds

Prozax said:


> Hi,
> Can someone please tell me if this harness would be ok to start Ellie in pulling the bike?
> 
> http://www.neewa.it/en/prodotti/sport-line/pettorina-running.aspx
> 
> 
> It's the only one I can get fairly easy. If not, I'll keep hunting for one.
> Thanks!


Different harnesses work better for different dogs; its usually trial and error to find the best one for your dog.
There were a couple of dogs in Neewa gear at our last event; they are designed for it so worth a go!


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## Prozax

Thanks, I'll give it a go and see how it works  Thanks a lot for your answer.


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## Prozax

Yet another question:

I have no idea how I am going to attach the line to the bike. Does anyone have any ideas how to do that? This is my bike:









Would this line be ok for pulling? It only says it's ok for canicross, that's why im not sure.

http://www.neewa.it/en/prodotti/sport-line/linea-dog-trekking-ammortizzata.aspx



I took Eli out on the trail last weekend. Encouraged her to pull a little while I was running. She is sticking to the trail and has learnt left and right. I can't wait to get her to pull the bike.


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## sassafras

It should be fine. I personally prefer a slightly longer line in front of the scooter, but there's no reason I can see that this line wouldn't work for you. It's easy to add length if it turns out you want more space.


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## Sibe

Denali was on the bed. I invited her to come and she put her head down. Fine, fine, you lazy bum. Kaytu had a great time. 20*, snowing. Husband took my car (with the bike rack) to work so I left from the neighborhood. Much more concrete than I like so we put booties on. She lost one somewhere in the neighborhood on the way to the park and I decided to let it be an experiment- I was not too worried about her pads getting damaged or I would have gone back. Dry concrete, wet concrete, snow on concrete, dirt, snow on dirt, lots of variety.



















Back feet once we got home









Front foot that lost the bootie









Front foot that had bootie









Need a belly bath to melt the ice and clean her up!









Did not want.









All clean









Right back in the snow in the backyard. Sleeping now inside.


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## Prozax

I ended up getting all of her bike gear from a mushing competition we went to, in Hungary. Coincidentally, the guy making and selling them there is romanian! He helped me choose the proper size for her. It's an xback harness, it looks really cool! 

Today I took her out for the first time and she absolutely loves it. She pulls really hard and she's so happy doing it. We got up to 25km/h and it was all her just pulling me along.

I got her a dog bike trailer, since the trail is far away from us ( 8 km of asphalt) so we'll probably be doing this on the weekends only. That feeling when she starts pulling is just awesome!


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## Prozax

We maybe did 1 km, since it was her first time and she pulled non stop. Is that a good starting point or did we over do it? She was tired at the end, but wanted to go again, so I hope I didn't tire her out too much. If she stops pulling hard and trots, does that mean we should stop or is it fine to keep going, but at a slower pace?

Also, would it be safe to have her pull on concrete for short distances? We have a bike path that's paved, right near our building. I was thinking I could take her there and stick to one side and encourage her to pull from the side( so she would be running on dirt while the bike is on the path). Would that be ok or would I be teaching her a bad and unsafe habit?


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## Prozax

We have some trouble slowing down once we get going, but I'm trying to teach her the go slow command. She'll probably get it after we go out a few more times because right now she can barely contain her excitement and just pulls. Today she pulled the bike from under me, before I managed to mount it. So yeah, work in progress!


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## druvarh

OMG! This thread is awesome! I've never tried any of the listed sports so I'm just posting to follow.


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## SnarkHunter66

Prozax said:


> We maybe did 1 km, since it was her first time and she pulled non stop. Is that a good starting point or did we over do it? She was tired at the end, but wanted to go again, so I hope I didn't tire her out too much. If she stops pulling hard and trots, does that mean we should stop or is it fine to keep going, but at a slower pace?
> 
> Also, would it be safe to have her pull on concrete for short distances? We have a bike path that's paved, right near our building. I was thinking I could take her there and stick to one side and encourage her to pull from the side( so she would be running on dirt while the bike is on the path). Would that be ok or would I be teaching her a bad and unsafe habit?


I scooter with Riley and the nearest park that isn't straight up and down hills has paved roads and graveled trails. As much as I've tried, Riley won't run on the grass next to the road, he'd rather run on the pavement. It hasn't seemed to affect him but we only get to scooter maybe once or twice a month during cool/cold weather. I wish we had someplace with dirt trails! As far as being off to the side, as long as the harness doesn't rub her from being off to the side, I don't really see a problem. Riley also likes to blast off at the beginning but then settles down to a lope or trot (with a scooter, I think it's easier to balance at slower speeds). I let him choose the pace and if he decides he needs a breather, he'll slow to walk for awhile before taking off again. There are a couple of ponds along our route, too, so I'll also stop and let him wade in and cool off.


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## Prozax

SnarkHunter66 said:


> I scooter with Riley and the nearest park that isn't straight up and down hills has paved roads and graveled trails. As much as I've tried, Riley won't run on the grass next to the road, he'd rather run on the pavement. It hasn't seemed to affect him but we only get to scooter maybe once or twice a month during cool/cold weather. I wish we had someplace with dirt trails! As far as being off to the side, as long as the harness doesn't rub her from being off to the side, I don't really see a problem. Riley also likes to blast off at the beginning but then settles down to a lope or trot (with a scooter, I think it's easier to balance at slower speeds). I let him choose the pace and if he decides he needs a breather, he'll slow to walk for awhile before taking off again. There are a couple of ponds along our route, too, so I'll also stop and let him wade in and cool off.



Yeah, I gave up that idea. I really don't want to do anything to hurt her, and especially not with this, which is supposed to be fun!
We managed to find a sort of an abandoned field nearby and I walk her on leash and then hook her up to the bike when we reach dirt. It's great for working on distractions too, since there's a lot of tiny animals around, birds and cows. Last weekend we increased the distance to about 3 km, with an average of 20km/h. She threw me off the bike once, when she REALLY wanted to inspect a rock of all things, but other than that it was a good run. 
I think I'll go further next time, since I tend to stop when she won't pull hard. I don't know, I'm afraid of getting her exhausted or something, if that can even happen. Thanks a lot, SnarkHunter66!


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## SnarkHunter66

Well, if you're letting her dictate the pace (and she's not a dog who will run herself into the ground), I don't think you'll have to worry about exhausting her. I do keep an eye on the temperature and humidity, we only scooter on cool days (below 60º F/15.5ºC) and Riley is happiest when the temp is a little above freezing.


----------



## sassafras

Yea most dogs will learn to set a sustainable pace. There are dogs that are SO driven to pull that they'll really run themselves into the ground as snarkhunter said, but IME that's not common. Even my malinois who has crazy drive won't do that. 

I prefer dirt trails but I just don't have access to enough or long enough dirt trails to run them exclusively. Personally, for my purposes - recreational only, short distances - I don't worry too much about running on concrete. The only surface I really actively dislike is gravel because I worry about their feet. One park here uses gravel to build up low lying dirt trails that flood in rainy weather so I do encounter it from time to time, if I'm really worried I just hop off and walk the scooter through it. Although my dogs have pretty tough feet and I haven't actually encountered any problems.


----------



## gray

Just have to share a pic of my awkward team after I let them stop to wade in a stream we were running next to. Long story short, they had to ride in the back of the truck with the bike on the way home, lol.

Bruno's (left) AO x-back harness should be coming in soon, and I can't wait! I didn't bother getting the beagle one because she doesn't pull anyway; she keeps enough slack to let her brother do all the work. It's just not her thing, which is fine. Bruno is a mushing monster, though! Hopefully the new pup will like it when he gets old enough, but we'll see!


----------



## Sibe

That is fantastic, they look like they're loving it! I love doing "mud runs" every so often. Big clean up but it's worth it, I think it's a blast to slash and slosh through the mud.

Santa brought me an early xmas present. Surly Moonlander! I cannot wait for snow. My mountain bike is too squirrely in snow but we don't get enough to justify getting a sled. Fat tire bike was the answer and this is the fattest. It's almost 5" wide.









I met the sellers in front of a bike shop. They were keeping their pedals, so I went in and bought pedals for it and thought it would be a good idea for them to also do a quick check to make sure it was in good condition.

The tires have a PSI range of about 6 to 12. They are so squishy! It just floats over everything, I rode it across the rocks that edge the grass in the neighborhood and it's barely bumpy. Goes up and down curbs like nothing.


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## Sibe

FYI, I am loving the fat bike. It is sooooo smooth. Here's the husband trying it out, I think he's maybe had the dogs pull him once before? Maybe? But it's pretty intuitive and Kaytu knows her job


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## Prozax

Congrats, it looks great! And very stable too  Enjoy your new ride!


----------



## Foxes&Hounds

Me and Gwen raced again this weekend 



















I broke my face.....and a lot of my leg and side... ruh roh


----------



## Sibe

Hope your face (and leg and hip and everything) are healing well and you're not too sore! So I see you're on grass... what did your face and everything rash into?? Gwen iirc always looks so freakin' happy when she's running, but here looks so serious and it's cracking me up. Love the way that harness fits her too!


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## Foxes&Hounds

Running attached to stuff is very srs bsns don't you know! "GOTS GO FAST!!!!" 
I love how she doesn't look in any way concerned about me on the finish line photo :laugh:


There was a gravel stretch for maybe 0.5km of the course, so that was definitely the place I had to come off... not the nice soft grass lol, oooh noo
We did the shorter version of this course, with only the big evil hill and the gravel at the beginning rather than the end:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=14IPggKZvag


----------



## Sibe

Put a collage together for a Siberian mushing group on facebook.









Inspired by this photo, https://www.facebook.com/EnduranceK...1936915822/924866230884387/?type=3&permPage=1


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## Kyllobernese

Posted this in another section, then noticed this one. I have just started to train Kris to work in harness. This picture was the first time she had it on. She did not bother at all with pulling something behind her even though it was quite noisy on the road. Started on the road as it was plowed out so easier walking. I had two x-back harnesses so gave one to my sister and she started with her Golden at the same time.
Didn't do a lot today as it was -20C so Kris got cold feet pretty fast, will have to get boots for her for this winter snow.


----------



## Sibe

Kyllobernese said:


> Posted this in another section, then noticed this one. I have just started to train Kris to work in harness.


 Awesome that she didn't mind having something behind her!

Do the straps on the sides land behind her last rib? It should be on her ribs, if it's too long it will squeeze her abdomen and organs as she pulls.


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## Kyllobernese

Here is another picture of Kris actually pulling a light weight. Does the harness look alright?


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## Prozax

Im not an expert or anything, but the harness looks too big. The guy who fitted Eli with hers, mentioned it needs to end at the base of the tail. Kris's looks longer than that.


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## Foxes&Hounds

Looks much too big to me too. 
Watch with the attachment point there; dragging weight from the ground like that in an x-back will be putting pressure on her spine


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## Sibe

It does look big.


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## Kyllobernese

If I shorten the strap that runs along her back, will that fix the problem?


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## Foxes&Hounds

Tbh it looks a little too big around the shoulders, as as Sibe says, the ribs too, which shortening the back wouldnt change :/


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## Prozax

Kyllobernese said:


> If I shorten the strap that runs along her back, will that fix the problem?


The problem isn't just that it's long. The rib strap looks like it would cut her under the ribs and it would put pressure on her organs. 
Also, this kind type of harness is not good for pulling weights. You need a special weight pulling harness with a lower connecting point. If you want to do canicross or bikejoring then you can use this type of harness right away, you don't need to have her pulling weights first.


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## Kyllobernese

I do not intend to use it for weight pulling but as it is the harness used for pulling sleds is it not suitable for pulling a sled? What I had hooked up to her was just to get her used to having something behind her and not what I intended to use it for and to give her something else to do.


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## Foxes&Hounds

Kyllobernese said:


> I do not intend to use it for weight pulling but as it is the harness used for pulling sleds is it not suitable for pulling a sled? What I had hooked up to her was just to get her used to having something behind her and not what I intended to use it for and to give her something else to do.


The attachment points are different and causes the dog to use its body in different ways to cope with them.
You'd probably be better with her on a belt canicross style rather than weight pull for her to get used to things. Then you can work on commands etc much more safely at the same time (if she doesn't know them already)


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## Kyllobernese

I may need to adjust the way the x-back harness fits Kris but we have sled dog races here every year and that is the only harness that I see used on the sled dogs. The other xback harness I had I knew was too big for Kris so gave it to my sister for her Golden. It does fit her the way I have been told it should. Attached is a picture of her pulling a sled. They had great fun and that is all I want to do with Kris.


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## Sibe

Some recent pics, for anyone who isn't already spammed by mushing stuff on my facebook haha

Visited my inlaws and tried my fat bike in deeper snow. First day was fun but kind of sucky, we expected this road to be more packed than it was. Deep ruts on the sides I couldn't ride in, and loose chunky powder in the middle. I fell a lot and walked a lot.




































And immediately wiped out! My left shin is bruised and torn up from scraping it on my pedal as I went down a few times (nothing compared to what Foxes&Hounds did on her fall, hope that's healing well btw!).




































Two days later went on a much better road, much more packed. Also had the girls side by side instead of one in front of the other.









This morning









Video from this morning
https://www.facebook.com/beyondblond/videos/pcb.10103306597983123/10103306596156783/?type=3&theater


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## Foxes&Hounds

How cool are those harnesses!!! :O


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## Sibe

I love them, favorite harnesses I've ever used! The hot pink on Denali is really nice too so people can actually see her. Also why I chose lime green chest, high visibility. Edit: also they're not fleece, so no ice gathers on them, nor any stickers/burrs, or even fur.
WC Dog Supply, LLC. I guess they only have a facebook now because they were getting more orders than they could handle with their website. Easy to see why.


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## Sibe

Captain Ice Beard


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## Prozax

That looks like so much fun!! The dogs and the snow, so jealous  Such a perfect day, sorry for the bruises though. Please spam us some more. Have you thought about trying skijoring with them, when you get more snow?


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## Sibe

Prozax said:


> That looks like so much fun!! The dogs and the snow, so jealous  Such a perfect day, sorry for the bruises though. Please spam us some more. Have you thought about trying skijoring with them, when you get more snow?


 I have done skijoring several times previously when we visit inlaws in the mountains. I'm not as steady on skiis as I don't have regular practice. Also, skiis have no brakes and I personally feel like there is a bigger risk of breaking a leg than with biking (or sledding). 

This was first time ever, 2013. I since ditched the poles, and actually trust Kaytu more. I had a head collar on her to prevent her from dragging Denali- and myself- off the trail. She did perfect though.


















This is the only way I can brake on skiis. Yell and fall down.


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