# "It's Me or the Dog"



## Noel (May 24, 2008)

Does anyone watch this show? I like it. It has provided me with very useful information. It helps my mom because Noel will jump up on her, and my mom does not like it, and Victoria Stillwell, the trainer on the show, said that when a dog jumps up on you to cross your arms over your chest and turn your back and not look at her. And it really works.

What do you guys think of the show?


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## bluedawg (Apr 20, 2008)

I liked that show. I dont have cable or sat so Ill watch when I visit my parents. Plus she is hawt.


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## gingersmom (Jun 2, 2008)

I like watching that show. Several stories have emphasized the importance of (1) exercise and (2) clear rules for the dog. She communicates the basics very clearly, and pays attention to training the owners and making sure that the family conveys consistent messages to the dog. I'm not sure I'd want someone to use her sound aversion methods without the guidance of a trainer, though.


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## Lorina (Jul 1, 2006)

I love the show. I don't watch it much, but I really like that trainer. 

And as a fully heterosexual woman, I agree. She's hawt.


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## Noel (May 24, 2008)

Well, I guess you all like the show...


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## DJsMom (Jun 6, 2008)

I love it! I think Victoria is really good! I've picked up lotsa tips from the show. My 9 yr old grandson loves watching it too & tried to incorporate some of her methods in the training of our new pup.


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## Dakota Spirit (Jul 31, 2007)

I like it a lot (watching an episode now, in fact). Actually, it happens to be one of the few televised training programs I actually enjoy.


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## InverseLogic (Jun 1, 2008)

I haven't had the chance to see a single episode. I haven't had cable in YEARS. I don't watch too much TV anyway though.


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## Noel (May 24, 2008)

Oh. Right now I am watching Inu Yasha. 
Anyways, her training techniques are very effective, I think.


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## opokki (May 30, 2006)

I like this show a lot and watch whenever I can.


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## HuskyLuv (May 16, 2008)

I love the show as well, lots of good stuff I've learned from Victoria.


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## Noel (May 24, 2008)

Apparently this show is very popular.


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## kelliope (Apr 4, 2008)

Count me in! I love the show.

Honestly I never understood what people didn't like about Cesar's methods (not to turn this into a Cesar thread!) until I started watching Victoria. Suddenly it became crystal clear. I really enjoy her show - and I love the accents!


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## BoxMeIn21 (Apr 10, 2007)

Noel said:


> Well, I guess you all like the show...


Yes! I love that show...She's a pretty good trainer.


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## Noel (May 24, 2008)

Yeah, the shows take place in the UK, i think. that is why they have the accents.


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## Patt (Feb 12, 2008)

I like Victoria Stillwell and watch the show when I can. It's in reruns now.


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## LMH (Jan 2, 2008)

kelliope said:


> Count me in! I love the show.
> 
> Honestly I never understood what people didn't like about Cesar's methods (not to turn this into a Cesar thread!) until I started watching Victoria. Suddenly it became crystal clear. I really enjoy her show - and I love the accents!


Yeah, she has a totally differnt method. But she doesn't take on very aggressive cases as Cesar does. But for basic training and unruly dogs I thinks she's great.


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## BoxMeIn21 (Apr 10, 2007)

LMH said:


> Yeah, she has a totally differnt method. But she doesn't take on very aggressive cases as Cesar does. But for basic training and unruly dogs I thinks she's great.


Uh-yea she has.  She is MUCH better than whatshisname.


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## LMH (Jan 2, 2008)

BoxMeIn21 said:


> Uh-yea she has.  She is MUCH better than whatshisname.


Haha-yeah to each there own I guess. But I don't think she would take on some of the cases ol'whathisname has. I was having problems with my dog I would call her in. 
If my dog was truly agressive I would call whatshisname.


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## French Ring (Mar 29, 2008)

LMH said:


> Yeah, she has a totally differnt method. But she doesn't take on very aggressive cases as Cesar does. But for basic training and unruly dogs I thinks she's great.


 I have to say I agree with you. I haven't seen Victoria takes in very aggressive dogs (red zone aggression) like Cesar has. I would be more comfortable with Cesar's handling if I had a super aggressive dog.


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## Noel (May 24, 2008)

Yes, Victoria takes on more behavioral problems more than aggression, even though aggression is a behavioral problem. I confusing myself... 
I have seen a lot of cases on there where the dogs like the woman, and her husband is not able to sleep in the bed with her, because "the dogs wont let him". my mom said that if she had a dog like that, then she would just get rid of it.


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## kolp (Jun 15, 2008)

I love the show and watch it whenever I can!


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## DJsMom (Jun 6, 2008)

Noel said:


> I have seen a lot of cases on there where the dogs like the woman, and her husband is not able to sleep in the bed with her, because "the dogs wont let him". my mom said that if she had a dog like that, then she would just get rid of it.


I watched that 1 today Noel, & I have to say I think I would have canned the wife & done much better by those dogs, lol! I know I shouldn't judge others until I've walked in their shoes, but DANG, i can't believe she let those dogs, especially the pom, ever get to that point!


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## Evie (May 2, 2008)

I love watching her show and have tried some of her techniques to correct behavioral issues.  

If I had an aggressive dog, I would utilize Cesar's techniques.


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## kelliope (Apr 4, 2008)

She took on a rather aggressive American Bulldog that was quite reactive to guests. She also took on a white GSD that would chase people around the house and I thought was quite aggressive. And then there was the Chinese Crested that was completely vicious. All dogs got much better with positive training. The Chinese Crested was taken downtown and walked among the crowds without issue - it was really amazing!


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## Lorina (Jul 1, 2006)

What I like about IMotD is that it's not her overpowering or intimidating the dog into behaving. It's her showing the owners how to be _the owne_rs. The owners are the ones who do all the work.


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## Billiie (Jan 16, 2008)

I have never seen this show! Hmm.. maybe I don't get it in Canada? lol. Sounds good though.


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## Noel (May 24, 2008)

Yeah, she does not try to sound intimidating or mean - she just teaches the owners how to be the boss and not an evil dictator.


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## Dakota Spirit (Jul 31, 2007)

Lorina said:


> What I like about IMotD is that it's not her overpowering or intimidating the dog into behaving. It's her showing the owners how to be _the owne_rs. The owners are the ones who do all the work.


Agreed. I love how many of her techniques are based on re-direction rather then some harsher method. Not only have I personally seen dogs respond far better (and faster) to these methods, but ultimately they are always humane.


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## Noel (May 24, 2008)

Extacly


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## French Ring (Mar 29, 2008)

Noel said:


> Yes, Victoria takes on more behavioral problems more than aggression, even though aggression is a behavioral problem. I confusing myself...


 Ok, what I mean by "red zone aggression" is when you need to tame an overly-aggressive dog that is about to "explode" and the only goal it has is to "KILL". Like for example, how can you work with pitbulls who were bred for dog fighting? If they get into fighting, they are fighting to death. Now you want to get them to be docile with each other again. How can you fix those pitbulls who were bred and taught to fight?

No offense to anyone who likes Victoria, I have not seen her handling any thing like that yet. Cesar has rescued MANY pitbulls from the street who were bred and taught to fight. That is something not so many people have been successful. 

A moderate dog problem such as nipping, barking, whining, taking control over their house, and getting things in their way are not the same as having a dog who is in red zone aggression. They are thinking about killing you or whatever is in present of them. I'm talking about extreme aggression. There are dogs out there who trained to kill people or animals. 

I know a guy who had a German shepherd (Otis), trained for policework,was very aggressive with handlers. He dragged one of the police handlers down the street and he had been sold to few different police dept. It seems like none of those police officers could handle Otis; however, Otis was an excellent PPD on street. He had no problem take down bad guys, but none of those handlers knew how to handle Otis properly. 

Later on, somebody from New Mexico police dept sent Otis to the right handler who knew how to handle him properly and never had any handler aggression issues that was Ed Frawley. Sometimes it takes one special person with tons of experience and understand how to handle a dog like that.


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## Dakota Spirit (Jul 31, 2007)

French Ring said:


> Ok, what I mean by "red zone aggression" is when you need to tame an overly-aggressive dog that is about to "explode" and the only goal it has is to "KILL". Like for example, how can you work with pitbulls who were bred for dog fighting? If they get into fighting, they are fighting to death. Now you want to get them to be docile with each other again. How can you fix those pitbulls who were bred and taught to fight?


Talk to BAD RAP  They took in the Vick dogs for rehabilitation and I guarantee, used nothing but positive based training. That is to say, no flooding or many of other methods Cesar commonly uses. I won't argue Cesar's rate of success, but that doesn't mean I don't believe there is a better way to go about it.


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## Cheetah (May 25, 2006)

Victoria Stilwell rocks! I love her show, and her methods.

(Did somebody say Inuyasha?)


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## Mish Mish (Sep 1, 2008)

sorry to resurrect an old thread, but as a new owner I was curious how other dog owners felt about Victoria Stillwell. 

I watched her show for awhile before I got Charlie and I definitely had a better idea about how to deal with certain issues. Her methods have worked for us, especially redirecting him from growling a barking at other dogs while we are on walks.


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## spottydog (Mar 14, 2007)

I love watching the show as well! Victoria does a good job. we've picked up lots of useful tips on dog training and insights into dog behaviour, especially the episode with the greedy dalmatian. Everytime the dog did silly things I would think how like my spotty that was!


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## Mish Mish (Sep 1, 2008)

I also like that Victoria really encourages dog/people boundaries--she's not too precious about the dogs, but she helps the families understand what dogs need.

The Teddy Pom Pom episode was my favorite! What a little terror. I also really like the episode with Niles, the chihuahua who seemed to hate his owner!


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## spottydog (Mar 14, 2007)

Right right, she is firm with families when they're obviously not doing the right thing, but she takes the time to explain and tells them what they need to do to fix the problem. Kinda like when you go see a doctor; I hate the ones that rattle off medical terms at you without explaining whats going on at layman level.


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## Talynn (Sep 10, 2008)

> The Teddy Pom Pom episode was my favorite! What a little terror.


Oh, Teddy Pom Pom! Poor little thing. Every time that owner cooed "But 'e's my widdle baaaaaby!" over the top of that snarling, snapping, obviously miserable doggie, I just wanted to reach through the TV and smack the woman!

Chiming in with Love The Show, as well


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## Ender (Sep 16, 2008)

Stilwell is alright, but I personally prefer Milan. I don't find his methods intimidating, harsh, or inhumane at all. I've tried both methods of training on my dogs and Milan's just work so much better.


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## pamperedpups (Dec 7, 2006)

"I don't find his methods intimidating, harsh, or inhumane at all."

Just to clarify, the trainee decides this, not the trainer.  You might try watching an episode of the Dog Whisperer without sound, paying careful attention to the body language of the dogs. Muted it's especially evident when the dogs are expressing their fear, anxiety, confusion, etc. throughout.


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## Ender (Sep 16, 2008)

Actually, I've never really watched it with sound. I'm partially deaf and usually don't wear my hearing aids when watching TV. I read lips, body language, and captions. 

And actually, maybe you can call his methods inhumane if only because he's not treating the dogs like humans, but dogs.


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## pamperedpups (Dec 7, 2006)

CANINE BEHAVIOR - A PHOTO ILLUSTRATED HANDBOOK
by Barbara Handelman 

CANINE BODY LANGUAGE, A PHOTOGRAPHIC GUIDE
by Brenda Aloff

ON TALKING TERMS WITH DOGS: CALMING SIGNALS 2ND. ED.
by Turid Rugaas

All three are excellent guidebooks on understanding _canine_ body language. 

Do dogs treat other dogs to collar pops?


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## Ender (Sep 16, 2008)

I believe I have a certain understanding of canine body language. I have to, as I'm studying to be a vet tech. I have seen many fearful, apprehensive dogs. So, you can stop being condescending and sarcastic now. I do not care if you agree with my opinions or not, I was just stating that Cesar's methods work better than Stilwell's with MY dogs. And my dogs are definitely not fearful or apprehensive of me.


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## poodleholic (Mar 15, 2007)

Dakota Spirit said:


> Talk to BAD RAP  They took in the Vick dogs for rehabilitation and I guarantee, used nothing but positive based training. That is to say, no flooding or many of other methods Cesar commonly uses. I won't argue Cesar's rate of success, but that doesn't mean I don't believe there is a better way to go about it.


I'm with you. There IS a better way to deal with aggressive dogs than using force. Turrid Rugaas is brilliant in her work with red zone aggression, internationally known and highly regarded, and would be the first one to tell you that you don't use aggression to work on aggression issues. It's not necessary.



Ender said:


> Stilwell is alright, but I personally prefer Milan. I don't find his methods intimidating, harsh, or inhumane at all. I've tried both methods of training on my dogs and Milan's just work so much better.



You have the right to your opinion. I invite you to explore just why what CM does is totally unnecessary, and makes those of us who know better, cringe. 

Here: http://www.4pawsu.com/dogpsychology.htm


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## Patt (Feb 12, 2008)

I llike Victoria Stillwell, but I also like Cesar Millan. It's whatever works best for your dogs.


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## Lonewolfblue (Oct 28, 2007)

Ender said:


> I believe I have a certain understanding of canine body language. I have to, as I'm studying to be a vet tech. I have seen many fearful, apprehensive dogs. So, you can stop being condescending and sarcastic now. I do not care if you agree with my opinions or not, I was just stating that Cesar's methods work better than Stilwell's with MY dogs. And my dogs are definitely not fearful or apprehensive of me.


I also thought that Cesar's was was the only way, when I got my Betty. I had purchased his book, all the DVD's, as well as Season 1 and Season 2. It only took a couple weeks for me to realize that is was only increasing Betty's reactiveness. She's definitely been a "Special Needs" type of dog. And it's taking time working with her issues. One of the best DVD sets I've come across is Constructional Aggression Treatment. Worked very well when I used it to add another dog to the family. Another excellent DVD, which I've been using as one of my key training DVD's at the park with her is Cujo Meets Pavlov! by Kathy Sdao. 

Now for Stillwell, lol. I don't get the channel, but have watched some of the episodes online on utube, and am really impressed. I really like how she wants to see all the behaviors as a whole before actually starting to work with the dog owner. She wants to see EVERYTHING. She doesn't say, well, the dog does this so you need to do this, and the dog does this other thing so you have to do something different for that. She takes the whole picture and figures out exactly where the problems start, and nips them in the bud with redirection. I might have to try some of the things with Betty now, lol. 

Another thing I picked up on in one of the episodes, the one with the Separation Anxiety, where the dog first goes to the fridge and eats, and eats, and eats, lol. The problem was not in the SA, but that they were actually rewarding that behavior by roughhousing and playing with the dog when they got home. It was reinforcing that behavior. When looking at myself, with 3 dogs that love their crates now, and none have SA, I see myself doing exactly what she said they need to do. When I got Chloe, she would whine and whine when I left, and when I got home from work, I wouldn't rough house with her. I would just ignore her jumping and go to the next crate and let Betty out. If Betty sat nicely for me, she'd get a nice petting and hug. If she jumped and was excited, I'd ignore her and move on to Nell's crate and let her out. Nell would just come out excited and run to the door because she's got to go potty. I really picked up on her method there, and it's good to know I'm actually doing it right. After 2 days, when I would leave, Chloe would go to her crate and no longer whines. And when I get home, she gets excited sometimes, and other times would sit nicely when she comes out and she'd get a good petting and a hug. All 3 dogs are perfect with the crate, and there's absolutely no SA at all. Feels good knowing I did it right.


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## winniec777 (Apr 20, 2008)

Here's a good test of the best method for working with aggressive dogs: can anyone do it? I think most people would quickly get themselves in serious trouble if they tried Cesar Milan's methods. He gets results (if a cowed dog = good result to you) but he's had XX years to work on it and we don't see what's edited out. I don't think it's wise to have untrained people out there using such extreme methods on aggressive dogs. But most people can try more positive methods with guidance from a good behaviorist and get good results.

It does come down to individual preference but I've seen my dog react to both kinds of methods and I have to say positive methods get my vote hands down. I have a stronger bond with my dog, she's more confident, and I dare say her neck probably feels a heck of a lot better without all those damn leash pops!


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## Mish Mish (Sep 1, 2008)

The separation anxiety episode was excellent--of It's Me or the Dog. I saw that before we got our dog and it really made an impact on me. I think of how a leader dog would greet other dogs--not all crazy and rough-housey, but kind of aloof--I found it works really well when I come home. Charlie does like to high five me and I kind of ignore it until he sits down and then I give him all kinds of attention, but I don't act like a dork!


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## squirmyworm (Jan 7, 2008)

I'm definitely more of a Stillwell fan, along with Patricia McConnell. I use mostly positive reinforcement training with Mesquite, though I do use the occasional leash correction. She's not very food motivated, and I'm not nearly as quick picking up on distractions as she is (I'm training myself, lol) so when she gets fixated on something, sometimes the only thing that can break her focus is a leash pop. But even so, I'm trying to get away from physical correction by thinking up other ways I can break her concentration.

That being said, the reason I like Stillwell's methods better than Caesar's are that they're fundamentally easier to follow (at least for me). Caesar always says "now do this with calm-assertive energy" or "you can't do this until your dog is calm-submissive." Those words don't _mean_ anything to me. They just get in the way of my understanding. I'd rather have it laid out for me like Stillwell does with her clients: when your dog is doing this, you do this.


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## Mish Mish (Sep 1, 2008)

Stillwell doesn't seem to get too wrapped up in dog emotions, instead she focuses on behavior and the motivation for a dog's behavior.

It sees like most dog problems are some combination of a lack of exercise, lack of clear leadership and lack of routines and/or clear expectations. 

Once dogs know they don't have to be in charge, they get lots of mental and physical stimulation and clear directions, their behavior improves.


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## Lonewolfblue (Oct 28, 2007)

squirmyworm said:


> I'm definitely more of a Stillwell fan, along with Patricia McConnell. I use mostly positive reinforcement training with Mesquite, though I do use the occasional leash correction. She's not very food motivated, and I'm not nearly as quick picking up on distractions as she is (I'm training myself, lol) so when she gets fixated on something, sometimes the only thing that can break her focus is a leash pop. But even so, I'm trying to get away from physical correction by thinking up other ways I can break her concentration.
> 
> That being said, the reason I like Stillwell's methods better than Caesar's are that they're fundamentally easier to follow (at least for me). Caesar always says "now do this with calm-assertive energy" or "you can't do this until your dog is calm-submissive." Those words don't _mean_ anything to me. They just get in the way of my understanding. I'd rather have it laid out for me like Stillwell does with her clients: when your dog is doing this, you do this.


Have you read "When Pigs Fly" by Jane Killion? She's got some great ways to gain a dogs focus. Especially those dogs you feel are impossible. I'm almost done reading it through for the first time, and will read it again when finished.


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

I like "It's Me or the Dog"...but I guess my dad hates Victoria. I'm not sure why...something about she "bugs" him. *shrugs* I think he's more of a dominance type of guy, even though he's normally really sweet.


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## Lonewolfblue (Oct 28, 2007)

I was talking to my trainer about the show and she hates it. She says Victoria uses punishment methods. Like the alarm on the fridge, she says it actually hurts the dogs ears (punishment) and doesn't just startle them. She had a few other things she doesn't like about Victoria as well, but wouldn't say. Then when I talked to her about the SA episode I talked about earlier in the thread, she asked how in the heck would the dog know what you are trying to correct? She says there's no link between walking in the house and ignoring the dog unless he's sitting nicely, and what he does when the owners are gone. I think it has everything to do with it. If you come in all excited and roughhouse with the dog, then you are actually reinforcing the behavior he was doing when he was gone.


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## Ender (Sep 16, 2008)

I agree with your trainer on Stilwell.

And I guess I should have clarified something. When I say I like Cesar's methods better, I was talking about his idea of being "calm-assertive." And his idea of visualizing what you want from your dog before you even begin. I've never physically corrected my golden and never will. I find that it's enough to just be calm and expect him to do what I want him to do. Before I watched The Dog Whisperer I was guilty of getting too frustrated, panicky, or excited when trying to train and it never accomplished anything. I like the ideas behind his method better, understanding where your dog is coming from instead of humanizing him. 

It's also helped a lot at the vet clinic. If I had to restrain a dog while he was having his stitches removed and he was freaking out, I'd realize that I was feeling sorry for him and apprehensive. Then I'd just calm down and imagine the dog doing likewise. It honestly works every time.

But, has anyone seen either Milan, Stilwell, or any other trainer work with a deaf dog? Because I'm really at my wits end with my Bartleby, he doesn't respond to any training whatsoever.


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## Patt (Feb 12, 2008)

Ender said:


> Because I'm really at my wits end with my Bartleby, he doesn't respond to any training whatsoever.


Here is a link that might help you. http://www.wagntrain.com/deaf_dog.htm


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## Shannonp73432 (Apr 3, 2007)

I think that every way of training has it's place with different types of dogs. I think that that is one of the great things about training dogs. That there are many different ways of doing things. 

But I also think that some ways of training are geared toward certain types of people. We need to know ourselves before we can help our canine partners. We need to know what we think is "right" for the individuals our dogs are. If a way of training make you uncomforable why do it when there are alternative methods. 

On the same note if something feels like it is right for both you and your dog don't quit on it because you are learning and it didn't work for the three days you tried it.

But let's face facts... Not all dog owners know their dogs. They think they do because a dog is a dog to some people luckily we know better.

I think Stillwell is good, I think Ceasar is good. Both have the good of the dog in mind. 

 Shannon, Nikki, Allie and (soon to be Nate)


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## squirmyworm (Jan 7, 2008)

Lonewolfblue said:


> Have you read "When Pigs Fly" by Jane Killion? She's got some great ways to gain a dogs focus. Especially those dogs you feel are impossible. I'm almost done reading it through for the first time, and will read it again when finished.



I'll pick it up as soon as I can. My "Dog Library Fund" keeps growing...


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## lizalots (Aug 29, 2008)

I like the show. But I am so amazed at how some people let their dogs get away with EVERYTHING on the show. I mean, my dogs are far from perfect, but some of the people and dogs almost seem too far out there for real life! 

Buuuut, I like Cesar better. I think he is a hottie!


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## GroovyGroomer777 (Aug 21, 2008)

Just bumping this up because new season starts tonight at 9PM on Animal Planet. I will be at home with my pups watching the new show which is now helping families in America.

Anyone else say no to going out tonight to watch this show or am I the only geek here?


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## Sunshyne (Feb 5, 2008)

I've actually had it marked on my calendar for the last few weeks! I like the show a lot, and I saw one family who has 5 Pugs that will be featured on the show, so I'm excited to see that episode!


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## GroovyGroomer777 (Aug 21, 2008)

5 pugs holy cow! You must be pumped....maybe they will start with that one! That will be great to watch, pugs are so funny!

I think, love her or hate her, anyone who likes dogs will find it entertaining tv.


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## Sunshyne (Feb 5, 2008)

I consider myself a huge dork for even remembering it's on! I have little to no life so I get excited about those things...

Yes, Puggies are tons of fun & very funny. The show is very entertaining, and my dog goes nuts when it's on, she recognizes the theme song now and runs up to the tv!


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## GroovyGroomer777 (Aug 21, 2008)

Hey, just bumping this up to see who watched the show last night and what you all thought about it.

I thought it was funny that the lady wanted to breed her dog because "He's beautiful and would make a good doggy daddy."


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## Sharon R. (Jul 7, 2007)

I thought the show last night was terrible. First of all, that dog was not a Neopolitan Mastiff. I know that they edit the show, but by the end, all I saw was that the dog now sees the kids as a couple of treat dispensers, and he did very well at sitting for a treat. They had to continuously tell him to wait at the door, and he'd still get up, and they let that slide. I saw nothing with him walking on leash or getting any exercise, but I'd be willing to bet he's dragging anybody he wants. Also, what did they do about his destructiveness?

Well, at least she agreed to neuter him. Though I kept thinking, as Victoria was throwing those balls all over the yard, that somebody better be planning on picking up that mess!


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## 5dogsandahuman (Dec 1, 2007)

> i thought the show last night was terrible. . . . All i saw was that the dog now sees the kids as a couple of treat dispensers. . . They had to continuously tell him to wait at the door, and he'd still get up, and they let that slide. I saw nothing with him walking on leash or getting any exercise, but i'd be willing to bet he's dragging anybody he wants. Also, what did they do about his destructiveness?




Finally. Thank you.


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## Patt (Feb 12, 2008)

Yes, I saw the show and thought it was good.


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## Pepper (Jan 27, 2008)

> Then when I talked to her about the SA episode I talked about earlier in the thread, she asked how in the heck would the dog know what you are trying to correct? She says there's no link between walking in the house and ignoring the dog unless he's sitting nicely, and what he does when the owners are gone. I think it has everything to do with it. If you come in all excited and roughhouse with the dog, then you are actually reinforcing the behavior he was doing when he was gone.


I agree with you, what it does, is give the dog something too look forward to when you are gone, so it can make them anxious for that, "rough housing and play time"



I missed the new episode!!! I recorded it because I wasn't going to be home, and it only recorded 16 minutes of it!!!!


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## melgrj7 (Sep 21, 2007)

Ender said:


> But, has anyone seen either Milan, Stilwell, or any other trainer work with a deaf dog? Because I'm really at my wits end with my Bartleby, he doesn't respond to any training whatsoever.


some people train fish using a visual clicker . . a flashlight usually. Maybe that would work with your dog? Get him to associate a certain visual with something good so you have a way to mark behaviors.


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