# Is my dog inbred?



## jessdb19 (Feb 14, 2013)

We got our dog almost 4 years ago-a puggle. She was only a couple months old when we got her, and we struggled with potty training. (It took her roughly 8 months before she "got it.") 

She was crate trained, praised with treats, taken outside when she had accidents (to a spot behind our house). After she learned, all was good in the world...until a few months later. She got mopey (literally she would cry and sit beneath the coffee table/curtains/etc). So we played with her more. (We are now up to 2-3 hours of play each night, and even more spaced out on the weekends.) 

We were told she was having separation anxiety, and that we might want to think of getting a 2nd dog to help with her feeling like she was missing her "pack." So we did. Ares-a Boston Terrier. Ares was a little puppy, and so we went through potty training (this time it took the little one just a couple weeks to get it.)

Ony was happy...until a few months after later. Again, mopey and depressed. Now she refused to play with us, no ball tossing...no chew toys..nothing. We gave her a warm sweater for the winter to go out in (as now she was refusing to go outside...thought she might be cold...) AHA! Sweaters make her happy! (We thought it was a comfort issue...) That kept her happy all of a month or so. 

Ares, in the meantime, has picked up training like a pro. (Sit, stay, play dead, etc). We were giving Ony treats JUST to go outside...(she is now refusing to even step out of the house.) We are patient, persistent, and trying to understand why our dog is now holding her bodily functions for 12+ hours at a time. We can visually SEE how large her butt has swollen with doggy poo...but no amount of coaxing/treats/walking/etc will help. (We are walking in the evenings, around the block, thinking she just needs to "work it out.") 

We stop walking her a few weeks later, as now when we get the leash she rolls over on her back and pees on herself. (This was never a problem before...she loved going out on the leash, but now it's become a sign of submission.) 

We work on the leash issue (still, after all this time, not fixed.) But we go out to the same spot every day to use the bathroom. 

Fast forward a few months later. We can't get her to play, all she wants to do is be held (CONSTANTLY). We can't sit down without her crying to be picked up and sit in our laps, which we'll give her time with us...but if we stop looking at her, or go into the kitchen (they aren't allowed there) or the bathroom...then she whines (REALLY loud and constant, until we acknowledge her presence and pet and stroke her.) We tried ignoring the whining, hoping it would stop...she just whined louder until it became a screeching braying noise that we could hear from almost a block away. It sounded like we were murdering the dog.

Potty time is to the point where it will literally just fall out of her when we take her outside-(it's NOT medical, she's been checked...many times...we've even squeezed her anal glands thinking it's that problem...it's not.)

We went to my parent's house-she walked outside there and went. No problems. The kennel we kept them at a year ago also had zero issues with her potty time, or depression, or any of the things we have seen.

Then, the REAL problems began right around Christmas. We had a 3rd dog fall into our laps (a BT with behavior issues). He's adapted well, gets along swimmingly with Ares and has become healthy and behaviorally sound. He attempts to play with Ony, and she just walks away from him and lays underneath the coffee table/behind curtains/etc. She has taken up food guarding (this has NEVER been an issue-and wasn't until just recently.)

She's taken up peeing on my clothes/pillow. (Again, not medical, she just got her clean bill of health at the vet less than a month ago-no UTI's or anything.) If we try to play with her, and give her things she gets aggressive and snappy with our other dogs. She cry

If it were as simple as "the other dog has upset her life" then we would find a home for the rehabilitated dog...but this has now become a 4 year long chain of events/problems. Ares and Nitro are now well adjusted, and learning perfectly. (Ares who LOVES learning and will take every chance to pick up something new to do...she doesn't like being bored...will do everything from tracking-to parkour-to treadmill running with me-to swimming-to you name it.) We've tried all of these things with Ony, as well as the KONG treats (we thought it was boredom) to strict bathroom schedules (we thought it might be that she needed a strict potty schedule), to doggy bootcamp, to almost everything under the sun. 

She has regressed to not understanding basic commands (that we use everyday...*sit* being the biggest...and unless we give her a treat IMMEDIATELY upon asking her to sit...it won't happen.) Doing things like walking through a door (she forgot?!), and walking down stairs? (We have a step that goes from the porch to the grass...it's less than half a foot tall, but she has now become baffled by the fact that it exists and runs back and forth on the porch unable to step down until she "relearns it.")

We had gotten her from a shelter, we did not know her past. But now as she's getting older and regressing more and more as time is passing, I'm beginning to wonder if she's truly inbred-or if it's something else.

Sorry, it's a long post but after many vet bills, therapy, doggy training, etc...we are sort of pulling our hair out with frustration.


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## elrohwen (Nov 10, 2011)

Well, the way to make a puggle is to breed a pug to a beagle, so it's impossible for a puggle to be inbred. Of course, someone could breed two related puggles together, but generally designer dogs are bred by breeding two purebreds together.

It sounds like she very well might have neurological problems, or they could be behavioral. Has your vet recommended any medication for the separation anxiety?

For the walking, what specifically have you tried? You mention you're working on her issues, but specifics about what you've tried would help.


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## jessdb19 (Feb 14, 2013)

elrohwen said:


> Well, the way to make a puggle is to breed a pug to a beagle, so it's impossible for a puggle to be inbred. Of course, someone could breed two related puggles together, but generally designer dogs are bred by breeding two purebreds together.
> 
> It sounds like she very well might have neurological problems, or they could be behavioral. Has your vet recommended any medication for the separation anxiety?
> 
> For the walking, what specifically have you tried? You mention you're working on her issues, but specifics about what you've tried would help.


We've tried some anti-depressants, and the "thunder shirt", as well as items that smell like us. She shredded the towel, and ate half of it. The pills just made her sleep. 

When we put the leash on her we have tried short walks around the house, we go to the park.

We've put the leash on the ground and let her just get accustomed to it.

IF we're going in the car (she still LOVES car rides...and cackles like a hyena in heat) then the leash isn't an issue, UNTIL it comes to getting out of the car....again, submissive peeing. (We thought it was excited urination, but she shows the same submissive behavior...) If she could live in the car, she would...and we've tried using that as a training tool, but it hasn't panned out too well, and once we get to a destination (except for my parent's house...) then it's submission and confusion.


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## Nuclear_Glitter (Jun 20, 2012)

What training methods do you use? Like do you use clicker training, a pinch collar, balanced training, what exactly?


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## jessdb19 (Feb 14, 2013)

Nuclear_Glitter said:


> What training methods do you use? Like do you use clicker training, a pinch collar, balanced training, what exactly?


We used the treat method (I'm not sure what it's called). We tried clicker training-that resulted in her running with her tail between her legs when she heard any clicking noise. (We don't hit our pets...but you'd think we beat her by her behavior.) 

Praise and treats-positive reinforcements-attempted play time-etc for good behavior. We tried using the crate when she wouldn't go to the bathroom, we'd give her 5 minutes in the crate and then back outside. (Repeated until she goes to the bathroom.) That worked up until last August-when we found out that she would hold it until going into the crate and then digging spot in her blanket and peeing onto it.


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## doxiemommy (Dec 18, 2009)

You mention you have had her checked by your vet several times, and you say that's not the cause for when "pee just falls out of her" or when she pees on your clothes. Has your vet gone beyond blood tests and such that would find UTI's? I ask because elrohwen mentioned neurological problems. It's possible that she could have medical issues that are beyond a standard UTI, so if your vet is only looking for UTIs or other similar infections, a neurological problem wouldn't necessarily show up on those tests.

I am sorry this is happening, it really sounds like you have tried to find out what's causing it, and you have tried all the right approaches, and have been sensitive to her issues. I don't have any more advice, just that I'm sorry, you must be frustrated!


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## Flaming (Feb 2, 2013)

I don't have any first hand experience with it sounds like the stories I've heard about dogs suffering from dementia. 
I hope it's not the case but might be something to look into.

The stairs thing is what brought it to mind


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## jessdb19 (Feb 14, 2013)

doxiemommy said:


> You mention you have had her checked by your vet several times, and you say that's not the cause for when "pee just falls out of her" or when she pees on your clothes. Has your vet gone beyond blood tests and such that would find UTI's? I ask because elrohwen mentioned neurological problems. It's possible that she could have medical issues that are beyond a standard UTI, so if your vet is only looking for UTIs or other similar infections, a neurological problem wouldn't necessarily show up on those tests.
> 
> I am sorry this is happening, it really sounds like you have tried to find out what's causing it, and you have tried all the right approaches, and have been sensitive to her issues. I don't have any more advice, just that I'm sorry, you must be frustrated!


Not pee...lol. (Sorry for the misunderstanding....no she'll hold that til who knows when.)

It's the poo that falls out...on the ground...just randomly.


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## mashlee08 (Feb 24, 2012)

Is she fixed? If so, at what age?


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## GottaLuvMutts (Jun 1, 2009)

I agree - neurological issues, possible dementia. Could be previous history, but if it's getting worse, then maybe not. 

But I highly doubt that it's inbreeding. Pug x beagle isn't going to produce an inbred dog (though some people might argue it would produce an outbred dog). Now if two puggles were crossed and they happened to be closely related (like bro x sis), then I'd worry.


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## Candydb (Jul 16, 2011)

I am curious about the part that says she doesnt have these issues at your parents house and didnt at the kennel. That sounds like it is situational (at least partially)-- something isnt working in your environment then.... Maybe she would do better in a different Home.... It is just a thought....It might be kinder all around...


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## beretw (Sep 25, 2012)

jessdb19 said:


> It's the poo that falls out...on the ground...just randomly.


This is pretty concerning. Just as she's walking?


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## jessdb19 (Feb 14, 2013)

Flaming said:


> I don't have any first hand experience with it sounds like the stories I've heard about dogs suffering from dementia.
> I hope it's not the case but might be something to look into.
> 
> The stairs thing is what brought it to mind


I'm hoping not. I'll have to do some research on that now



mashlee08 said:


> Is she fixed? If so, at what age?


Yes-she was fixed around 6 months-8 months. (We aren't 100% sure on her age, but that's our best guess)


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## jessdb19 (Feb 14, 2013)

Candydb said:


> I am curious about the part that says she doesnt have these issues at your parents house and didnt at the kennel. That sounds like it is situational (at least partially)-- something isnt working in your environment then.... Maybe she would do better in a different Home.... It is just a thought....It might be kinder all around...


We've talked about it, and thought this might be an option. If she's truly unhappy (vs. a neurological problem) then keeping her somewhere that's not working isn't a fair or kind thing.


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## jessdb19 (Feb 14, 2013)

beretw said:


> This is pretty concerning. Just as she's walking?



It's from refusing to poo. She will hold it until it gets to that stage. (I know this sounds gross)-but it will quite literally be protruding her butt out. We'll take her out, 20 minutes...30 minutes...40 minutes...and she won't go until it gets to that point.


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## elrohwen (Nov 10, 2011)

If it is dementia, there are meds available for that and they do work for many cases, so it's worth a shot.


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## Candydb (Jul 16, 2011)

jessdb19 said:


> It's from refusing to poo. She will hold it until it gets to that stage. (I know this sounds gross)-but it will quite literally be protruding her butt out. We'll take her out, 20 minutes...30 minutes...40 minutes...and she won't go until it gets to that point.


No no. I have worked with people with dementia, they dont hold their poo-- they dont have that kind of self control! They are more likely to be incontinent. Sounds more behavioral if she is "holding" her poo-- we see it in little kids who hold their poo in and get severey constipated, cant remember exactly but it happens sometimes during potty training.... Its a psych issue....(for the kids that is dunno if it holds true for dogs, i would look at, examine what happened in her potty training in your environment... was she reprimanded for pooing in the wrong place, and now she is holding it in not sure where to go(afraid ) to poo.... ? , etc....)
Also with the wanting to be held all the time, she is sounds very insecure, fearful poor little thing... Did anyone punish her or lose their temper with her around her pottying? ( I had a roommate once that was kicking my pup behind my back..) and we all lose our temper once in a while....


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## HollowHeaven (Feb 5, 2012)

Candydb said:


> was she reprimanded for pooing in the wrong place, and now she is holding it in not sure where to go(afraid ) to poo.... ? , etc....)
> Also with the wanting to be held all the time, she is sounds very insecure, fearful poor little thing... Did anyone punish her or lose their temper with her around her pottying?



OP, though this may sound like a small thing 'oh how can all this occur from just one time, one little thing', it's really not small at all. Some dogs really are that soft that it can take one time to freak them out forever. 
So I would be sure to make sure everyone knows how serious this is, and if anyone has done it, they need to admit it so the dog can be helped.


Though, with all these odd symptoms, I don't think this is the case.


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## barbk (Dec 31, 2012)

When you say she has been checked by a vet, have they checked her eyes? Done any blood work? If your parents house has been fairly stable, no big changes, and your home has had some changes with the new dog, it is possible that if she has a problem seeing then she could be reacting to that. Could you give her a x pen outside that is just hers, never moved?


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## Candydb (Jul 16, 2011)

HollowHeaven said:


> OP, though this may sound like a small thing 'oh how can all this occur from just one time, one little thing', it's really not small at all. Some dogs really are that soft that it can take one time to freak them out forever.
> So I would be sure to make sure everyone knows how serious this is, and if anyone has done it, they need to admit it so the dog can be helped.
> 
> 
> Though, with all these odd symptoms, I don't think this is the case.


I also wanted to say, it did NOT have to be abuse or anything like that(wasnt trying to accuse you of anything), just that she could have made a bad association at some point with how you guys toilet at your house (it can be any little old thing) and negative associations are really hard to decondition out of...
I was thinking, maybe change your toileting routine?
For example-- if you have a back yard, make a point of playing with her, treating her, do what ever you can to make the back yard (some future area you will use for potty) as special, treat heavy place that she comes to associate as Good.....
and then when she potties there reward her for it-- cuddles treats etc....
and if say you normally leave to potty by the front door, try going out the back door instead....I mean maybe she's scared of a certain hedge row out front? I dunno....
This isnt well written, I just mean to try to change the routine... to avoid maybe the negative connotation she has picked up--
Its really too bad dogs dont speak english and we cant explain to them what we want!

Oh and the other OP made a good point about the new dogs in the house setting her off as well... thats a thought....


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