# My dog is scared of the e collar



## field hockey girl (May 30, 2020)

In two weeks, my family are all going to our lakehouse and we want to be able to let our dog off leash and have her on the e collar because she will run away otherwise. The problem is, when we put the e collar on her, she just stops being herself. She is extremely scared of it, and when we put it on her she just lies under all the tables, sometimes won't even go to the toilet and just gets really snuggly. Don't get me wrong, when we put it on she gets really nice, but she won't do anything, won't play fetch, run around, she won't do anything.


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## LeoRose (Aug 20, 2015)

Well, the simple answer is to not use an electronic collar, since you are seeing the fallout from that type of training. 

If you want to be able to let her off lead, then you need to train a recall. There is a DVD called Really Reliable Recalls that is very helpful. Clean Run Really Reliable Recall DVD There is also an online class on teaching recalls coming up in August. Fenzi Dog Sports Academy - FE240: Calling All Dogs

Meanwhile, you will have to keep her on a leash or long line.


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## pandora (Mar 19, 2010)

Stop using it then she is obviously scared stiff this damn torture device.
use a long lead keep her penned take her for walks actually try putting effort into this instead of just letting her run around.


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## field hockey girl (May 30, 2020)

I don't think that is the solution. It is not a torture device and for your information, we only ever use the beep aspect of it to alert her. We just want to know how to get her used to it and your comment was not helpful.


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## field hockey girl (May 30, 2020)

field hockey girl said:


> I don't think that is the solution. It is not a torture device and for your information, we only ever use the beep aspect of it to alert her. We just want to know how to get her used to it and your comment was not helpful.


That was about Pandora's comment. In regards to LeoRose we have done so much recall training. My dog is a chaser though. Inside the house and backyard, we say come she sprints. Out of the house, she could not care less, even with treats.


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## Blue_Octopus (May 30, 2020)

I do agree that you should stop using it because of how scared she is of it and it takes just as much training to perfect recall. A longline would also work if your dog is like mine who although attached, will happily leave me to go hunt down local wildlife. E-collars can also be very distressing to "soft" or "sensitive" dogs that do not react well to correction based training like an E-Collar( this also applies for timid and/or unconfident dogs)...


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## petpeeve (Jun 10, 2010)

Well, I'm not sure what else you'd expect. Those are all classic indications of improper use, whether you're only activating the ecollar's warning function or otherwise. Regardless, overall it's simply not working for you. I'd even go as far as saying that your dog's life is miserable because of it. Hard to say for sure, without getting unduly judge-y, but IMO perhaps it's even bordering on cruelty on your part? Maybe. So in light of that I'd also strongly agree with the other posters suggestions of ditching the ecollar entirely. In this case, it's probably best to err on the side of caution.

As for recall training, sounds like you haven't properly "proofed" your dog in high distraction environments. And until you do that ... properly and thoroughly ... your dog will likely fall short of your expectations. 

Concentrate your efforts on proofing, increasing distractions gradually. Use only positive reinforcement methods. Watch the recommended DVD asap, and sign up for the on-line class for August. In the meantime throw away the ecollar.


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## storyist (Sep 19, 2019)

My belief may vary from the majority, but IMO there are very few dogs who can be trained by us ordinary folks to have such a reliable recall that the dog is safe off leash. Other dogs, deer, small animals, there are just too many things that can cause a dog to tune out everything but that lure. My dogs are only off leash in my fenced yard and for certain competitions. Some dogs will run out of an obedience ring (never mine to date, knock on wood), but at least there are enough other dogs and people around in that situation that the runner is caught quickly. My dogs are leashed when off my property. Always. It's for their protection.

I'd say a dog that is so sensitive to the beep of an e-collar that she behaves as described is too sensitive for its use.


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## Canyx (Jul 1, 2011)

Unfortunately, "just a beep" does not say anything about the effect the collar has on your dog. One of the biggest points shock collar users make is to have the human try it out to see how 'harmless' it is. But that action only shows a human deciding their perceptions being more important than the dog's. And from a simple behavior perspective, that is not how any learning works in any animal. Besides the fact that dogs have different epidermal and nerve structures than we do, even if it was 'just' a beep or a tickle, we don't know how that dog will perceive that sensation.

A good analogy is situations surrounding human fear. If you were afraid of spiders, would it convince you to hold one if your friend reassured, "this one can't bite you - it's harmless!"? There is proof everywhere that just because a stimulus is literally harmless, doesn't speak to the psychological and physiological effects on the dog's mind and body. 

I am sure that you love your dog and you just want her to be able to enjoy freedom and be safe. But objectively speaking, your dog is showing extreme signs of fear when this tool is applied. If you've only used the beep, then I can't even imagine how you would begin to desensitize her to the collar. I am not here to call you an abuser or torturer. But you have already identified the problem - this tool is not a good fit for your dog. Honestly, this is exactly how these collars work. The dog becomes too afraid of consequences to run away. Your dog is just having a more extreme reaction than other dogs might. Most owners would find this acceptable - if a dog is too scared to cross boundaries, they see the problem as fixed because the dog won't run away. I commend you for caring about your dog's emotions and mental wellbeing. And I understand that you don't want to see your dog cowering every time the device is put on. There are other solutions to keeping a dog safe and getting them exercise and enrichment outdoors. I hope you find a happy solution for yourself and your dog.


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## parus (Apr 10, 2014)

My dog is hard as hell but he hates the smoke alarm low battery beep. Acts like it's going to murder us all. It'd be unkind to put a beeping collar on him. Can't even imagine how upsetting it could be to a more sensitive dog.


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## field hockey girl (May 30, 2020)

Thank you for your thoughts. You have convinced me that I shouldn't use the e collar. I seriously don't know what to do though. At my lake house, we have a super long leash for my dog, but she just wants to keep going further. She is an explorer by heart, and she hates any type of leash. When she was a puppy she was scared, so we could let her off leash and she would come back. If we accidentaly let the door open she would just hang around our backyard. Now if we accidentally leave the door open, she sprints. When my I lived in England, I went to several training sessions when she was a puppy. These were focused on recall. There were other dogs just around her and she would still come. There were even people squeaking toys and clapping. It's just outdoors. I feel sorry for her. She loves running through the lake, playing fetch just being free. When I go on walks with her, she wants to be off leash and sniff things. I just don't know what else to do. Do you have any suggestions?


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## Blue_Octopus (May 30, 2020)

Long leads are a great way to do those things with your dog! The longer the better. I have a German Pointer so I can relate to the things you are saying but for her safety and the wildlife's I keep her on a leash at all times. Even when we went hiking my dog was on a leash (she is 13 now and the vet said hiking and similar activities are a no-go).


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## parus (Apr 10, 2014)

You can make a REALLY long long line yourself by buying a clip and a rope made of an appropriate material. Here's a good link on their construction and use: Dog Training Leads: How To Use A Long Leash To Help You Train Your Dog


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## Canyx (Jul 1, 2011)

I think compromise is present in all parts of dog ownership. It's not that your dog can never run free or explore. But maybe she can run free in safer areas, or go on a hike with you on a long line? That way she still gets to experience the outdoors, run, swim, etc. She just doesn't need to have endless borders to her exploration. We all want our dogs to be happy and experience those unbridled moments. But indulging that is kind of like letting kids choose their own menu - no one should be surprised if they would choose candy and pizza for three meals a day. So same for your dog. I'm sure you can find areas and times when she can run off leash, situations where she can explore in a more controlled way, and maybe even some times when she's not allowed to be off leash or far (ex. in a new area, perhaps). 

The only thing about long lines is you should use it with a harness. Hopefully your pup is not afraid of that. But it protects your dog if she gets tangled or hits the end of the line. Better that the pressure is on her body and not her neck.

It also sounds like she loved training and did great at recall games in the past. You're right that once a dog experiences off leash freedom it can be hard to motivate them to be more restrained. And I have seen dogs refuse food once off leash outside. But if you go back to basics and start doing some training with treats, especially on the long line, your dog should be able to relearn all those skills. And maybe she can even be trustworthy off leash again 
Best of luck!


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## pandora (Mar 19, 2010)

field hockey girl said:


> I don't think that is the solution. It is not a torture device and for your information, we only ever use the beep aspect of it to alert her. We just want to know how to get her used to it and your comment was not helpful.


Heres the thing torture does not have to involve physical pain. So if I point a gun at you and command you to do something you comply, not because Ive hurt you but because Ive scared you, the gun doesnt have to be loaded the mere implication or something worse to come is enough.
You claim you only beep your dog but this beep terrifies her therefore to continue using it is torture you are trying to train by fear which is another method comdemned by most decent trainers and countries. The reason she gets snuggley is not because she want to be with you its because she knows if she strays you will beep her so she is making herself submissive to you to avoid punishment. Thats sad for her and pathetic as a training method.

You didnt like my answer not because it wasnt helpful but it challenged your way of doing things.
The advice is sound stop using the collar and start using a long line or a fence or actually walking with your dog instead of letting her roam.

I know thats not the answer you want but its the only sound one there is. As for my challenge to your methods its not just me millions of people and many countries and lawmakers feel the same way.. I dont think we are all wrong.


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## Lillith (Feb 16, 2016)

You can purchase very long lines for your dog on Amazon. I used a 100ft line to walk my dog when we lived in town because the parks and large green areas were quite close to streets and other people's houses, and even though my dog has a pretty great recall, the risk of a giant jackrabbit popping up and leading my dog on a chase right into a car was a little more risk than I wanted to take. Long lines are really great options to give your dog some freedom, as well as have complete control.

I must second some advice state above, ALWAYS use a harness with a long line. I purchased a harness for a reasonable price from Amazon, as well.


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## Blue_Octopus (May 30, 2020)

pandora said:


> Heres the thing torture does not have to involve physical pain. So if I point a gun at you and command you to do something you comply, not because Ive hurt you but because Ive scared you, the gun doesnt have to be loaded the mere implication or something worse to come is enough.
> You claim you only beep your dog but this beep terrifies her therefore to continue using it is torture you are trying to train by fear which is another method comdemned by most decent trainers and countries. The reason she gets snuggley is not because she want to be with you its because she knows if she strays you will beep her so she is making herself submissive to you to avoid punishment. Thats sad for her and pathetic as a training method.
> 
> You didnt like my answer not because it wasnt helpful but it challenged your way of doing things.
> ...


The OP already decided not to use the E-collar...


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## pandora (Mar 19, 2010)

Blue_Octopus said:


> The OP already decided not to use the E-collar...


Which is great, but often when newbies or lurkers read through these threads its good to have a full explantion of things ..


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## field hockey girl (May 30, 2020)

Ok, I think I'm going to look into the long lead because it seems perfect for a dog like her. I have one other question though. My dog has a habit of table surfing. We have tried so many things to try to get her to stop, but nothing seems to stick. The e collar did help with that, but I now realise it was just because she was scared. Does anyone have any training tips as to how I can get this habit to stop?


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## RonE (Feb 3, 2007)

Table/counter surfing is a self-rewarding behavior. The most effective solution is to avoid the opportunity and keep food off an untended table or counter.

Pick your battles.


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## field hockey girl (May 30, 2020)

I'm surprised that is what you would say. It is impossible to remember everytime you make something to remember that your dog will jump. I can set up the table, and then go into the closet to get some napkins and when I come back I see my dog jumping on the table. Not to mention even sometimes when we're eating dinner and talking, my dog will just jump up looking for food. It is impossible to avoid the situation


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## RonE (Feb 3, 2007)

Crate the dog then while you are cooking or eating or confine it to another room. 

Truly, it's not rocket science. I sense you're looking for quick and easy solutions. You have two.


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## LeoRose (Aug 20, 2015)

I remember every day that I live with opportunistic vultures. Between the dogs and cats, anything left out is liable to be at least nibbled on or licked. 

It's just been the past few weeks that my dogs (ages 8 and 6) have been left out while we are eating dinner, and half the time, they still run to their crates when we start pulling out plates and utensils.


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## field hockey girl (May 30, 2020)

Putting my dog in the crate is what we have been doing so far. The problem is when people come over and we're having dinner, she whines a lot. She starts barking and really going crazy. I was wondering if there was any training method to get her to ignore the food or something like that.


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## BKaymuttleycrew (Feb 2, 2015)

Does your dog know a 'go to place/mat', or other 'station' type cue? If not, that's were I'd suggest you start. 

Train, and *heavily* reinforce your dog lying on her bed/mat/etc... especially when you are preparing food, working in the area of food, serving/eating or otherwise interacting with ...... FOOD! 

Train this in the absence of guests & work on her impulse control in & around the kitchen area. Reward heavily for her remaining outside the 'human food zone'. When you can't (or don't want to) be actively working with her on this behavior then simply gate or crate her out of the kitchen/dining areas. 

If she fusses? Ignore. Simply ignore.


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## field hockey girl (May 30, 2020)

my dog know the command crate and know that means go to the crate. We generally use the crate though when we go out, so she associates it with we're going to be away for a couple of hours. My does also have a mat, and I think that would be a better one to her to because she likes to watch everybody. She just sits down and watches everyone walk by. My family have gone on road trips before, and we can generally get her to lie under the table and not walk around the hotel by the third or fourth time. It's just as soon as we step out of the room or aren't paying attention


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## parus (Apr 10, 2014)

My one dog is trained to lay on his bed during human cooking/mealtimes. Like this:




He knows he only gets food/treats if he's on his bed, so he doesn't approach the table or counters anymore. 

I am working on also training my puppy to do this, but he just doesn't have the level of chill necessary yet to lay in one place that long when not asleep. So for now we crate during meals because if he's not mature enough to learn good habits yet, I at least don't want to let him develop bad habits.


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## 3GSD4IPO (Jun 8, 2016)

I use e collars a LOT in training. You are using the collar inappropriately. You need to train the dog FIRST. I did not start to use the e collar on my dog until the dog was TWO. This, after training a LOT (every day.. something) and even then it is used sparingly and specifically. 

If you are using an e collar to prevent counter surfing and to make the dog come to you, then you are using it wrong. Totally. Wrong. That is not what it is for. If you are using it to enforce a recall, and the minute you put the e collar on the dog shuts down, you have used if VERY wrong (and there is no guarantee the dog will come because the dog has not been trained).

Using an e collar in the manner you have been is like hitting a very young Toddler for not using a spoon to eat without showing him how to use the spoon first. 

The device itself is not cruel. The way you are using it most certainly is.

In fact, both my dogs who do get e collars put on actually get EXCITED when they see me get the e collars out. It means we are going to DO something (they think training is fun and play). Neither dog wore an e collar until the dog was 2 years old (or pretty close to it). This was with extensive daily training without the e collar. 

A dog that will "run away" needs to be on leash. The owner of a dog that would run away needs to examine their relationship with the dog and figure out why the dog is running away. Most dogs who do not have a good recall have not been given a good reason TO recall. If they do (finally) come when called the owner may be angry and hit the dog (why come back if you are going to get hit?). Even more often the dog comes and the owner does nothing or just says "good dog.." Sorry.. that just isn't enough in the dog's mind. 

You need to make coming to you the best thing ever NO MATTER WHAT has just happened. Food (and not dry kibble or dog treats but something good like Hot dogs!) and play and CELEBRATING recalls is the way to get it. Being punitive with an e collar without making recalls the best the ever for the dog will likely get the dog to run further from you and not come back. 

Put the e collar away. You are doing it wrong. You are being unfair to the dog. The only thing you are making clear to the dog is you cannot be trusted.


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## 3GSD4IPO (Jun 8, 2016)

Never leave anything on the table that the dog can eat. Ever. When cooking and/or eating have the dog lay down on a bed or crate the dog. NEVER feed the dog from the table or counter. 

I was thinking about this the other night. Both dogs were laying there on the floor and I was eating a steak I had just charbroiled. Neither dog even LOOKED at me. In fact, the cats did not either. And I realized it was because I never gave them anything while I was cooking or eating. They did not expect it and so did not even look at me. I never told them a thing. When I am cooking if a dog comes in the kitchen I give the dog a job (to lie down). When I am not in the kitchen there is NOTHING on the counter to eat. Ever.


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## field hockey girl (May 30, 2020)

To respond to the @3GSD4IPO my dog is two. I was bringing her to the dog park, with treats as she had been coming back other times. Then when it was time to go, unlike other times, she looked at me as I told her to come, and then ran off the other way. She knows how to come, and she does it all the time, I just got the e collar as a safety precaution whilst I was practicing recalls. The next time I was at the park she had her e collar on and she was doing great with recalls. Then she started to run off to another dog. I told her to come, she looked at me, and again she didn't. Then I gave her a beep and she did come back, but she didn't feel like playing, and was kind of just moping around. I didn't know why, and then the next time I tried to use the e collar for training, she was moping around as well. I thought she wasn't used to it, so tried to leave it on her for a short bit of time. That's when I noticed she wasn't jumping on the table. I also showed her how it doesn't do much, but she was scared of it so I came to this forum. I don't try to be cruel. Now I have turned to the long lines. Also, you are very lucky to have animals that won't jump on the table. I don't. She jumps on the table to get the compost, paper towels, toys that are on there, even pencils. Anything that looks interesting, she will take it. You might say it is easy to just not leave anything on the tables, but it isn't. It isn't even the tables. The counter, any chairs, anything that has anything on it she will take. Now I am practicing leave its with her and just moving the food to the counter and stepping away.


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## pandora (Mar 19, 2010)

George came from a place where they did zero training he was 18 months .. Hes a beagle not known for their wonderful obiedience but within a short space of time he has learned that mealtimes were only at mealtimes and not every time we walked into the kitchen. He learned that our didning table would get him nothing so he has totally stopped begging.

Taking stuff is still sometimes a problem but we use a leave it and we reward good behaviour. George has learned that if it isnt his he must leave it alone.
An ecollar never came into this just repeating ourselves until we were blue in the face and he got the message. It takes time but any dog can learn if you are willing to put the work


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## 3GSD4IPO (Jun 8, 2016)

I am not lucky.. I simply keep an eye on the dog and give him a Job in the house or crate him if I am not watching him. I keep things off the table and counter. That is all. 

The other day I was busy with something. I was suddenly "where is my dog?" Not the older dog.. but the young dog I am training in sport. I looked around and then went to the screened porch. He was standing on the table watching the neighbors (a quarter mile away). He could see better up high. I did not scold him. I just called him and he hopped down. I don't put anything off limits except the cats. Dogs must not chew on cats... and he gets that. No other "rules." I just give him a job (go to mat, lie down, etc.) or I crate/kennel him. 

I would NEVER use an e collar when my dog was interacting with other dogs. I would NEVER take my dog to a dog park. I hate dog parks.. a lot of dogs hate them too. 

Recall with an e collar for training is always one on one in a large enclosed area. When the dog gets to you IF you have stimmed him you have to make a party that is bigger and better and greater than the stim. It really requires a lot of training first both of dog and handler.


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## mustluvdogs66 (Mar 30, 2017)

I’m so glad you decided to ditch the e-collar. It’s common for dogs to not listen in unfamiliar places. I would just keep the long lead on at all times outside. You might be able to train a better recall given some time and training. The key will be practicing with her at the cottage. Take small steps and reward her highly for coming from close distances at first. Then run further away. Slowly adding in distractions (people, other animals, etc..)


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## Kyllobernese (Feb 5, 2008)

Have you tried putting him in the crate when your are eating and giving him a stuffed Kong or something to chew on?


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## Utop1st (Jan 28, 2020)

Perhaps your dog does not like the electronic collar, try to choose a different one, and watch the reaction. If she also reacts to other collars, then most likely she is just being naughty. I work as a veterinarian and know some techniques on how to train dogs. For example, when my dog executes a command correctly I give it Ace antlers, and thus it understands that it is doing everything correctly. If it is naughty or does not follow my commands, I try to scold her in a strict voice. But in any case, do not hit the dog, it will not lead to anything good.


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## Tarmack (Sep 23, 2021)

Lillith said:


> You can purchase very long lines for your dog on Amazon. I used a 100ft line to walk my dog when we lived in town because the parks and large green areas were quite close to streets and other people's houses, and even though my dog has a pretty great recall, the risk of a giant jackrabbit popping up and leading my dog on a chase right into a car was a little more risk than I wanted to take. Long lines are really great options to give your dog some freedom, as well as have complete control.
> 
> I must second some advice state above, ALWAYS use a harness with a long line. I purchased a harness for a reasonable price from Amazon, as well.


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## Tarmack (Sep 23, 2021)

I bought a long line but all my dog does is get tangled up in it. He doesn't just run out in a straight path, but runs around, or back and forth which causes him to get it tangled up. I mainly tried the e collar because when weather gets real cold, I don't want to have to take him out on a leash to pee. The dog we had before we could do that and he would not run off...he wasn't trained not to run off, he just seemed to know his boundaries or just didn't want to run off. Just wanted this little rescue dog to be the same. He is very scared of just fhe sound of the e collar.


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## DaySleepers (Apr 9, 2011)

This thread is over a year old and the original poster hasn't been active here for some time. I'm closing this thread to avoid confusion, and urge you to start a new thread of your own! That way currently active members will be more likely to see it and be able to offer help for your specific situation.


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