# So you think you have a Wolfdog?



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

I see this everywhere (not necessarily here), people posting pictures and claiming to have a wolf or wolf "hybrid". The truth is that most of these "wolves" are just wolfy-looking normal dogs, like Huskies, Malamutes, or German Shepherds. Now, I know most people can't tell the difference between a real wolf, wolfdog, or dog, so I'm going to try and explain this with pictures to (hopefully) lessen the amount of confusion there is about this. Before I begin, though, I'd like to point out that calling them "hybrids" is technically incorrect - a "hybrid" is what you get when you cross two animals of a _different_ species, such as a horse and donkey to make a mule.

With that out of the way, how can you tell if your (or anyone else's) dog is part wolf? There are three ways to tell - genetics, via DNA test, phenotyping, and behaviour. It's difficult to find anything conclusive on behaviour differences, so I'll just be covering phenotype for now.

*Wolves*








The following are wolf traits:

-Small, rounded, furred ears
-Slanted eyes
-"Earthy" colored eyes - yellow, orange, orangey brown
-Intense look
-Eyes are reflective in the dark
-Long, almost spindly legs
-Cow-hocked back legs
-Tail is usually kept straight
-Run or walk in a straight line with one track
-Long muzzles
-Born a solid dark brown/grey color
-Born in spring (March to April, though Arctics can be born May to June)
-Have a cape of fur starting behind their shoulders in a "V" shape (dorsal cape)
-Large head and paws
-Narrow chest and hips
-Nose, paw pads, lips, and "eye liner" are solid black
-Dark-colored nails (taupe for Arctics)
-Well-blended coats
-Large teeth compared to dogs
-Straight back
-Furred paws
-Fur is long with a double coat, individual hairs are banded
-Slink instead of walk (head down, level with chest)
-More fluid movement
-"Molt" once a year instead of shedding like a normal dog

The following are *NOT* wolf traits:
-Floppy or large ears
-Barrel-chested or thick physique
-Distinct markings like you see in Huskies or German Shepherds
-Curly tails
-White, clear, or multi-colored nails
-White coloring or distinct markings on pups - not even arctic wolves are born white!
-Blue or mismatched eyes
-Liver, pink, or "snow" noses or paw pads
-"Red-Eye" when in the dark
-Sharply sloped skulls
-Coat being one solid color
-A curved back, as seen in German Shepherds
-Rear dew claws


*Wolfdogs*








Could you tell the difference between that wolfdog and the wolf from above? Exactly!

High content wolfdogs look _just like_ real, 100% wolves do. Only when you start getting into the mid and lower contents do you begin to see the doggier traits showing through, and even then, they still look wolfy. Here are some traits that can appear in mid to low content wolfdogs:

-The ability to breed multiple times a year or off-season
-Born with pre-dominant markings
-Blue or mismatched eyes
-Pink, liver, or snow noses/pads
-Curly tail
-Large ears

Most wolfdogs still generally adhere to the wolfy look of being more slender and having the distintive wolfy face - you will always be able to tell that a dog has wolf in it, even in a low-content it is very obvious.



*Images*
Below are some images to help illustrate the things I've covered.

An example of a cow hock:









Big, furred feet with long toes:









Furred ears:









Molting:









Wolf and wolfdogs change eye color as they get older:









More images below.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

Wolf:









High/Mid-Content wolfdogs:

























Low-Content Wolfdogs:


















*!!DOGS!!*
None of these have any wolf in them!


































So please please keep this mind - real wolfdogs *DO NOT* make good pets! Their behaviour is very different than a dog's, and even if you owned dogs, wolfdogs are a whole other level. There are so many breeders out there claiming to be selling high content wolfdogs that are very clearly just Malamute/Husky/German Shepherd or some kind of mutt. Breeders will often try to make things up in order to explain things - like how their white puppies are just arctic wolves, or that their wolfdog can breed in the off-season because they were hand-raised. Papers that indicate wolfdog lineage are not evidence of being true wolfdogs - these registries will put down whatever you want for the money. Please don't be fooled!


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

They really are not that rare. I could name dozens of breeders. However yes there is also a ton of misrepresenting breeders out there too.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

You also said here are traits that will appear in lower content wolfdogs but not higher. 

Here is a high content animal with a pink nose and that was born white. Now I know these things are not the norm. but saying they wont is incorrect and like saying it will never happen .
http://www.thewolfcrossing.org/#/otto/4587840990

Also here is a bi eyed animal that does have one blue eye, that is most definitely not a low content.


----------



## Hiraeth (Aug 4, 2015)

Is this your way of telling us that your Pit/Husky/GSD/wolf dog isn't actually part wolf dog? Just out of curiosity, since you're the only person I've seen on the forum claiming they have a wolf dog lately.


----------



## Renoman (Mar 20, 2007)

Hiraeth said:


> Is this your way of telling us that your Pit/Husky/GSD/wolf dog isn't actually part wolf dog? Just out of curiosity, since you're the only person I've seen on the forum claiming they have a wolf dog lately.


Well that's going to leave a mark.


----------



## SirviRavenWind (Dec 1, 2014)

I did have GSD/husky cross that did look very much like your pictures of wolves. I know for a fact that she was NOT a wolf dog, sure people are stupid but to say a dog could never look like a wolf is false even if it is very rare to happen. I have also seen low content that had half and half traits. They do not make good pets, but some people don't care about that so they do need sites on how to keep them secure and other issues.


----------



## Kate M (Sep 2, 2014)

I had a husky/GSD that people constantly asked if she was part wolf. She didn't look an ounce like it: black and white markings, curled tail, barrel body, HUGE GSD ears but tiny head. 

People believe what they want to make dogs unique.


----------



## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

If you aren't 100% sure, you do NOT want to represent your dog as being part wolf. The rabies vaccine is not legally recognized in wolves, and your homeowner's insurance is going to get mighty cranky about it. It's not something you want to claim if you don't have to.


----------



## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

Phenotyping is notoriously inaccurate for dogs, what makes you think it is any more accurate for wolfdogs?

I also think neglecting to talk about the behavioral differences is silly. The two wolf-dogs that I have met, while a small sample, were VERY different in their behaviour than any dog I've ever met, and that was way more telling than their physical characteristics.


----------



## Amaryllis (Dec 28, 2011)

Willowy said:


> If you aren't 100% sure, you do NOT want to represent your dog as being part wolf. The rabies vaccine is not legally recognized in wolves, and your homeowner's insurance is going to get mighty cranky about it. It's not something you want to claim if you don't have to.


Also, wolf hybrids are illegal in a number of states, so claimed wolf hybrids can be, and have been, seized and euthed without any proof other than the owner's claims. Even in states where hybrids are allowed, they often require special enclosures and other safety measures that aren't cheap or even possible for most people to have. So, unless you know for a fact that your dog is a hybrid _and _you live in a state where that's allowed _and _you have the necessary safety measures in place, do not claim that your dog is a hybrid. Don't claim it on Facebook, don't tell your friends, don't brag on forums, just enjoy your dog.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

Cindy23323; Even if all the ones you could name are real breeders, that's still not very many, and most of what I see advertised online are fakes. As for the link, there is a condition (I forget the name of) that is similar to albinism, but instead of having no melanin, they're missing most of it. It's similar to the disease in humans called Chediak-Higashi syndrome. As for the bi-eyed animal, I can't get a good look at the rest of it, but from what I saw of the album it came from, the place it lives is home to both wolves and wolfdogs of differing content. I said that wolves or high-content wolfdogs can't have have blue or bi-colored eyes because they do not possess the gene to have them, you would need that particular recessive gene in both parents to get it in the offspring. Biologically speaking, that animal can not be a full-blooded wolf or high-content, and very highly unlikely of being mid-content.

Hiraeth; You really seem to have a problem with me and I don't know what it is. Here's a quote from me:


> My first dog is half pitbull, the other half is most likely German Shepherd wolfodg,


I did not claim to have a "Pit/Husky/GSD/wolf dog". We don't know WHAT she is, there was a neighbor near where her mother lives that claimed to have a Malamute wolfdog/German Shepherd wolfdog (changed his story) who had a habit of escaping and wasn't fixed. Because of the coloring of the pups, we assumed it most likely be the father, though obviously we were very dubious of his claim that it was anywhere near being wolf. HOWEVER, she does show some MINOR signs of POSSIBLE wolf lineage. Such as a having a dorsal cape (NO DOG SPECIES has one), her claws turning from light to dark when she grew up, her eyes being slightly more slanted than normal, her slightly odd behaviour, not being born with any white and growing up to have white markings and distinct markings, her fur being double-coated and the hairs being banded, showing the scent gland on the tail (appears in normal dogs as well, but seen in all wolves). I don't tote her as being a "wolfdog" to everyone because you could not tell just by looking at her, she looks like a PitxShep. If people ask I mention it as a possibility, but I don't say "HEY LOOK AT MY WOLFDOG!!!!11!"

SirviRavenWind; Yes, it's possible for normal dogs to look _wolfish_, that's why I made this post, and also why there's a lot of confusion around this.

Willowy & Amaryllis; I wasn't aware, but we had no intention of registering her as a wolfdog at all. She was going to be registered as an American Staffordshire Terrier mix, because that's all we solidly know about her lineage. However, I did just look up wolfdog legislation in my state (Oregon) and the only law pertaining to the "breed", if you will, is that the rabies vaccine is not registered and any bite by a wolfdog is handled as if it were a wild animal.

gingerkid; Is phenotyping inaccurate? I've never heard that, I suppose if you were talking to some one who didn't have the specifics of a certain breed's look it would be hard, but if you _knew_ it should be easy, right? I didn't want to make it too long, but if you think it's a good idea I'll take a crack at it. I should also probably list sources, too, huh?


----------



## Hiraeth (Aug 4, 2015)

Captain_Russia said:


> Hiraeth; You really seem to have a problem with me and I don't know what it is.


It's probably that you expected your puppy to hold it for 15 hours at a time resulting in UTIs and her sleeping in urine to the point of having urine scald, insisted on us providing age-specific sources stating that your puppy needed to go outside before breakfast in order to prevent accidents, started three threads about potty training and then refused to admit they were about potty training, didn't accept anyone's advice, were constantly combative while changing your story so many times no one could keep track and then you started a thread saying wolf dogs were super rare and "educating" us all about them only to come back and list all the reasons you think you might have a wolf dog. 

I'm pretty sure that about sums it up.

Oh, and here's your post: 



Captain_Russia said:


> My step-uncle has a pure pitbull named Lilith which got out of his yard several months ago (for the second time) and had puppies, four of them. We're not sure what they are, but one of his neighbors *supposedly* had a tundra wolfdog that had Alaskan Malamute and German Shepherd in it...


So she's a Pit/Malamute/GSD/wolf dog instead of a Pit/Husky/GSD/wolf dog. My mistake.


----------



## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

1) There is only one dog species, unless you're referring to the taxonomic family canidae, in which case you're still wrong because wolves belong to that group.

ETA: I should qualify this with phenotyping by actual wolf or wolf-dog experts is likely to be much more accurate than phenotyping by the average person.

2) Using phenotype to identify breeds among dogs has been shown in multiple studies (conducted on so-called "dog professionals" such as vets, vet techs, groomers, and trainers) to be incredibly inaccurate and correlate very poorly genetically identified breeds. While identifying breed by DNA is not 100% accurate, it is more accurate than visual identification, especially given how little most people (even "dog people" and professionals) know about inheritance of physical dog traits.


----------



## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

Hiraeth said:


> It's probably that you expected your puppy to hold it for 15 hours at a time resulting in UTIs and her sleeping in urine to the point of having urine scald, insisted on us providing age-specific sources stating that your puppy needed to go outside before breakfast in order to prevent accidents, started three threads about potty training and then refused to admit they were about potty training, didn't accept anyone's advice, were constantly combative while changing your story so many times no one could keep track and then you started a thread saying wolf dogs were super rare and "educating" us all about them only to come back and list all the reasons you think you might have a wolf dog.
> 
> I'm pretty sure that about sums it up.


You forgot disregarding what the actual wolf-dog expert said about wolf-dogs.


----------



## Amaryllis (Dec 28, 2011)

Captain_Russia said:


> Cindy23323; Even if all the ones you could name are real breeders, that's still not very many, and most of what I see advertised online are fakes. As for the link, there is a condition (I forget the name of) that is similar to albinism, but instead of having no melanin, they're missing most of it. It's similar to the disease in humans called Chediak-Higashi syndrome. As for the bi-eyed animal, I can't get a good look at the rest of it, but from what I saw of the album it came from, the place it lives is home to both wolves and wolfdogs of differing content. I said that wolves or high-content wolfdogs can't have have blue or bi-colored eyes because they do not possess the gene to have them, you would need that particular recessive gene in both parents to get it in the offspring. Biologically speaking, that animal can not be a full-blooded wolf or high-content, and very highly unlikely of being mid-content.
> 
> Hiraeth; You really seem to have a problem with me and I don't know what it is. Here's a quote from me:
> 
> ...


Why not show us your dog? That would probably clear up a lot of this.


----------



## Effisia (Jun 20, 2013)

Amaryllis said:


> Why not show us your dog? That would probably clear up a lot of this.


I would love to see pictures. Sounds like an adorable dog, whatever kind of mix it is!


----------



## LittleFr0g (Jun 11, 2007)

Reminder people, swearing is NOT permitted on this forum, whether you block out key letters or not.


----------



## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

Captain_Russia said:


> I tried to do something helpful.


This may come as a shock, but wolf-dogs have been discussed on this forum in some detail, multiple times before. Most people here are not the ones that need educating, and the ones that need educating generally don't care.



> gingerkid; I didn't mean species, I meant the breed or type or whatever, I don't know the word for it right now. The study or experiment you're talking about sounds interesting, if you could link it to me or tell me how to find it I'd like to read through it.
> Also, what wolfdog expert are you talking about? That second post is confusing me.


You'd previously complained about people not being able to understand you and blamed those same people for not being able to understand you. This is why. Use the words that you mean, and not the closest stand in that you can come up with in 2 seconds.

You also kind of have this attitude that people on here couldn't possibly know more about what you're posting about than you do. I am not a wolfdog expert, but there are others on here who are (at least compared to the rest of us, if not by actual profession). Assuming that people who disagree with you don't know anything about the subject is a really poor habit to get into.

ETA: Posting a link to the phenotyping study (which is only applied to dogs of mixed heritage: http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/10888700902956151#.VtUZHcYrLnA


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

I've seen others do that swearing thing, I don't know if they got in trouble or not, but you just edit my post instead of deleting it, please?

I didn't find any topics on wolfdogs, maybe I just didn't look hard enough. I tried conveying what I was trying to say and it didn't work, I'm sorry. And I don't have that attitude (or at least I don't think that way). I'm not assuming that they don't know what they're talking about, I'm using what others (who DO know what they're talking about) have said, and the one opinion I get to the contrary is suspect.

Also, here's a thread with puppy pictures of Hemset, I can't get any very recent ones at the moment. Puppy Pictures.


----------



## TSTrainer (Aug 6, 2015)

I have not interacted with Cindy on this forum (yet!) but I have read many of her posts in the past and she is very knowledgable and ACTUALLY OWNS wolfdogs and (correct me if I'm wrong) has been involved in wolfdog rescue. Probably not a good idea to argue whether or not she knows many legit breeders, because it is a safe bet that she does.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

I wasn't aware of that, she should have mentioned that in her post. The impression I got was that she just googled some pictures or something. Sorry, Cindy!


----------



## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

Captain_Russia said:


> I didn't find any topics on wolfdogs, maybe I just didn't look hard enough. I tried conveying what I was trying to say and it didn't work, I'm sorry. And I don't have that attitude (or at least I don't think that way). I'm not assuming that they don't know what they're talking about, I'm using what others (who DO know what they're talking about) have said, and the one opinion I get to the contrary is suspect.


This is exactly what I am talking about. What made you think Cindy's posts were suspect? What qualifies you to make that assumption in the first place?


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

Because I found like five whole websites dedicated to wolfdogs which all said that it was a genetic impossibility for a wolf or high-content wolfdog to have blue eyes. That, and the white wolf pup they linked to as evidence that wolf pups can be born white was a genetic mutation, it's not common at all. That's being intellectually dishonest.


----------



## Effisia (Jun 20, 2013)

Captain_Russia said:


> Because I found like five whole websites dedicated to wolfdogs which all said that it was a genetic impossibility for a wolf or high-content wolfdog to have blue eyes. That, and the white wolf pup they linked to as evidence that wolf pups can be born white was a genetic mutation, it's not common at all. That's being intellectually dishonest.


Just FYI, I found more than five whole websites dedicated to convincing people that the Earth is indeed flat.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Captain_Russia said:


> Cindy23323; Even if all the ones you could name are real breeders, that's still not very many, and most of what I see advertised online are fakes. As for the link, there is a condition (I forget the name of) that is similar to albinism, but instead of having no melanin, they're missing most of it. It's similar to the disease in humans called Chediak-Higashi syndrome. As for the bi-eyed animal, I can't get a good look at the rest of it, but from what I saw of the album it came from, the place it lives is home to both wolves and wolfdogs of differing content. I said that wolves or high-content wolfdogs can't have have blue or bi-colored eyes because they do not possess the gene to have them, you would need that particular recessive gene in both parents to get it in the offspring. Biologically speaking, that animal can not be a full-blooded wolf or high-content, and very highly unlikely of being mid-content.
> 
> Hiraeth; You really seem to have a problem with me and I don't know what it is. Here's a quote from me:
> 
> ...


That animal does not have any type of condition, so again you are saying false info, I know exactly what it came from. It came straight up from inbreeding as the breeder admitted he bred son to mother. 

The bi eyed animal is a high mid. If you can not tell that then you obviously can not phenotype. Even though I did not post a lot of pics of said animal its still quite obvious from the one pic that the animals is no low or just a mid. Please stop giving out false information, most of what you say is correct but not all of it.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Captain_Russia said:


> I wasn't aware of that, she should have mentioned that in her post. The impression I got was that she just googled some pictures or something. Sorry, Cindy!


Is everyone just supposed to automatically throw out they're credentials? If so you forgot to post any of yours. So what experience do you have other then me assuming the same about you that you thought about me ( just reading and googling online) Please share pics of your wolfers. Not sure how you got the impression that I only googled something.

Yes I was a member of wolfdog rescue resources for a few years, and also own my four own wolfers. Here are two of them. Selene and Loki who are 9 and 8 that I have owned from the time one was 3 and a half weeks old and the other 4 weeks old. And those were not my first wolfdogs.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

People who say the Earth is flat can't tell you why the Earth is flat.

How does inbreeding make a wolf be born white? Wouldn't the parents have to have born white, too? Obviously I'm not a genetic scientist, but that seems like the kind of thing that can't just appear out of the blue.
It looked like a high-content from what I saw, it was just the eyes that were getting me. Do you know it's lineage? It would need the blue-eye gene from both parents, so how far back are the pure wolves? Obviously some of its wolfdog ancestors would be bred to more pure wolves if this one is mid-high content. I'm just curious how long it would take to get a blue-eyed high content if you strived for one.

http://realwolfdogs.tumblr.com/roughguidetowolfdogcontent
http://www.texx-wolf-tails.com/contentandphenotyping.htm & http://www.texx-wolf-tails.com/wolfdogscomparison.htm
http://imgur.com/gallery/TqaTE
http://www.dogforum.com/general-dog-discussion/my-dog-half-wolf-145954/
http://www.saintfrancissanctuary.org/forms/ID%20Guide.pdf


----------



## Lillith (Feb 16, 2016)

Cindy23323 said:


> Is everyone just supposed to automatically throw out they're credentials? If so you forgot to post any of yours. So what experience do you have other then me assuming the same about you that you thought about me ( just reading and googling online) Please share pics of your wolfers.
> 
> Yes I was a member of wolfdog rescue resources for a few years, and also own my four of my own wolfers. Here are two of them. Selene and Loki who are 9 and 8 that I have owned from the time one was 3 and a half weeks old and the other 4 weeks old. And those were not my first wolfdogs.


Curious, can you train wolfdogs like regular pet dogs? Or is their behavior that different?


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

From what I've heard (obviously correct me if I'm wrong) but no, you can't really. When they reach 2-3 they get very independant and it's hard to control them. You can train before that, but it's harder and they'll never really be reliable. My dad's friend Pete got a wolfdog and he's had dogs his whole life, but that wolfdog scared him, and he couldn't control her.


----------



## Effisia (Jun 20, 2013)

Captain_Russia said:


> People who say the Earth is flat can't tell you why the Earth is flat.


Yes. Yes they can. With an incredible amount of detail and a bunch of their own scientific claims that are very thorough in debunking round earth theories and the reasoning behind them.

Granted, there are also new conspiracy theories dedicated to convincing people that Katy Perry is actually JonBenet Ramsey and that Nikki Minaj is really Jay Z. But again, all of these are very detailed theories with plenty of 'evidence' to back them up. The internet is a veritable rabbit hole of websites dedicated to just about anything you can imagine, true or otherwise. Google works on SEO, not truth.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Inbreeding always causes odd thing. For example. These are from a breeder here in Va. Unfortunately he has triple inbred animals and continues to inbreed (obviously not a good breeder) Well take a look at these puppies. If you didn't see pictures of the parents and only seen these babies you would say. No these are definitely not high content pups due to all the white spots they are born with.
As highs are not supposed to have white tipped tails. Be born with white stockings, white around the neck etc. etc








Sorry not a good pic, but you can still see the point I'm making with it









Now here is one of those babies at a year old that belongs to my sons ex girlfriends mother


----------



## Greater Swiss (Jun 7, 2011)

Cindy, I just wanted to say Selene and Loki are breathtaking.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

I can't really doubt how wolfy it grew up to look. That's very odd, I wonder why inbreeding would do that? Though I suppose it doesn't really matter. I'll change my original post.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Captain_Russia said:


> People who say the Earth is flat can't tell you why the Earth is flat.
> 
> How does inbreeding make a wolf be born white? Wouldn't the parents have to have born white, too? Obviously I'm not a genetic scientist, but that seems like the kind of thing that can't just appear out of the blue.
> It looked like a high-content from what I saw, it was just the eyes that were getting me. Do you know it's lineage? It would need the blue-eye gene from both parents, so how far back are the pure wolves? Obviously some of its wolfdog ancestors would be bred to more pure wolves if this one is mid-high content. I'm just curious how long it would take to get a blue-eyed high content if you strived for one.
> ...


Inbreeding causes all kinds of unnatural things. Yes with blue eyes both parents do have to have the gene. However that has nothing to do with content. You can get a mid content by breeding wolf to husky. So the puppies out of those parents are mids. Breed those mids back to a pure or wolf and you are going to get even higher content puppies who have that gene. Lets says those are higher mids. You get two higher mids carrying that gene and breed them together and guess what, then there is a chance that they are going to have a blue eyed baby that's a higher mid. Its rare but it can happen.

Here is another animal that belongs to Vicki Spencer that has one parti eye. She is definitely not a low content either. Not sure of her exact percent would have to contatct Vicki.


----------



## LittleFr0g (Jun 11, 2007)

Captain_Russia said:


> I've seen others do that swearing thing, I don't know if they got in trouble or not, but you just edit my post instead of deleting it, please?
> 
> I didn't find any topics on wolfdogs, maybe I just didn't look hard enough. I tried conveying what I was trying to say and it didn't work, I'm sorry. And I don't have that attitude (or at least I don't think that way). I'm not assuming that they don't know what they're talking about, I'm using what others (who DO know what they're talking about) have said, and the one opinion I get to the contrary is suspect.
> 
> Also, here's a thread with puppy pictures of Hemset, I can't get any very recent ones at the moment. Puppy Pictures.


if you see people swear, report it. And no, posts with swearing in them will be deleted, not edited.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Captain_Russia said:


> People who say the Earth is flat can't tell you why the Earth is flat.
> 
> How does inbreeding make a wolf be born white? Wouldn't the parents have to have born white, too? Obviously I'm not a genetic scientist, but that seems like the kind of thing that can't just appear out of the blue.
> It looked like a high-content from what I saw, it was just the eyes that were getting me. Do you know it's lineage? It would need the blue-eye gene from both parents, so how far back are the pure wolves? Obviously some of its wolfdog ancestors would be bred to more pure wolves if this one is mid-high content. I'm just curious how long it would take to get a blue-eyed high content if you strived for one.
> ...


First link the person only gets 75% of what they say right, the person actually hides the fact of who they are because of it. All of the pictures that they are showing examples of are just pictures that they have stolen off line. Heck they even got a ton of my pictures that they took. The wolfdog community have been trying to find out who it is for quite some time now.
Second link is Natasha Woodall who owns Texas Wolfdog Project rescue in Texas. Write her, she will also inform you that there is the occasional odd ball. And that yes it is not the norm but that it does happen sometimes. Its just not talked about much because then every tom **** and harry that has a pi bald husky or bi eyed animal will start yelling that the animal they have is a high content also that is not the norm. Its obvious by these pictures I've shown you that they are what I claimed them to be, there is no mistaking that.
Fourth link, again someone who is just going around stealing pics.
Fifth link, to the dogforum, funny that top picture is mine.
Sixth one, if you read it just says strong evidence, write them, they'll also tell you there is the occasional abnormality.

Just reading on the internet does not make you know everything about these animals. There are a ton of sites out there that give misinformation. I mean heck I have argued with people over this website. Just because its written does not make it so. Read this page then get back with me and tell me how much is wrong on it.
http://www.freewebs.com/wolfhavenspiritofthepast/


----------



## hanksimon (Mar 18, 2009)

Cool! I'm in South Carolina, and have no clue what our wolfdog laws are. However, my next door neighbor had a wolfdog, and two putative wolfdogs (probably husky or spitz-type breeds - long legs but not legy, and tremendously agile, nearly cat-like). But the wolfdog was clearly different, scary different, although 'timid' and not dog-like aggression ... but not fearful (?). But this description explained to me why she walked 'hangdog,' slinking with her head low, as if her neck were injured. Also, interesting was that she was 'socialized' with people and animals, but clearly not a social 'dog'.

I don't understand "rabies doesn't register" - the rabies vaccine has not been proven to be effective with wolfdogs? Or the law doesn't recognize the effectiveness?

I was told that it was easy to tell the difference between a dog and a wolf - walk up and pat them hard on the head. The dog may duck and wag his tail ... and the wolf will eat you ... then try to get away. ;-)


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Greater Swiss said:


> Cindy, I just wanted to say Selene and Loki are breathtaking.


Thank you very much. Here is a couple pics that I took not long ago. My middle son just came home after living 5 years in florida. He had not seen either in that time period. So I thought they wouldn't remember him and shy off. But look at the greeting he got.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

I know there's the occasional oddity, I never tried arguing about that. It just seemed to me like you were using it to try and debunk all of what I was saying, not just that.
I don't really see the issue of "stealing" pictures to illustrate a point, it's not really stealing to me. And about that link, ugh! I don't think I saw a single wolf on that whole site! Those are the kind of people that bug me about this whole thing. Obviously not everyone is going to be correct in everything they say, but if you take a consensus of ten, twenty, or more and they all have certain things in common, it's reasonable to assume that it could be correct. As was brought up before, yes, I could just find ten or twenty sites dedicated to how the Earth is flat, but how many hundreds or thousands are there that prove the Earth is not? Majority rules, in most cases.

There is no USDA approved wolfdog vaccine. From what I can tell, the vaccine does work, it's just not designated for use on wolfdogs and therefore is not officially recognized.


Cindy those pictures are adorable! I just pictured in my head
*lick*
*nom*
"I was not prepared for this."


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

I was not trying to say everything you said was incorrect (or everything that you simply reworded from what you read on sites as you do not actually or have actually owned a wd) only a couple things that could happen, and that have happened before even though it is not the norm. Unfortunately if Majority rules then we are totally messed over as there is a ton more misrepresenting sites that spew off a bunch of bs then there are actual real sites. 
You really should join some fb wd groups if you are truly interested in wolfdogs, as there are tons of wolfdog owners on them that have owned them for years, most of these groups do not allow misrepresentation
Don't recall bring up the rabies vaccine anywhere, I'm fully aware it has not been approved. Edited: never mind just noticed that part was meant for someone else

https://www.facebook.com/groups/wolfdogz/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/WDEducationForBeginners/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/PhenoSkillz/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/RealWolfdogPuppiesForSaleAdoption/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1137591199589650/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/wolfdogroute/?ref=browser


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

hanksimon said:


> Cool! I'm in South Carolina, and have no clue what our wolfdog laws are. However, my next door neighbor had a wolfdog, and two putative wolfdogs (probably husky or spitz-type breeds - long legs but not legy, and tremendously agile, nearly cat-like). But the wolfdog was clearly different, scary different, although 'timid' and not dog-like aggression ... but not fearful (?). But this description explained to me why she walked 'hangdog,' slinking with her head low, as if her neck were injured. Also, interesting was that she was 'socialized' with people and animals, but clearly not a social 'dog'.
> 
> I don't understand "rabies doesn't register" - the rabies vaccine has not been proven to be effective with wolfdogs? Or the law doesn't recognize the effectiveness?
> 
> I was told that it was easy to tell the difference between a dog and a wolf - walk up and pat them hard on the head. The dog may duck and wag his tail ... and the wolf will eat you ... then try to get away. ;-)


 When they were making the rabies vaccine they only tested it on certain breeds of dogs, then decided it would work on all dogs, however they did not test it on a wolf and use that excuse to be able to say it might not work on a wolfdog, therefore it allows some states to actually ban wolfdogs by simply saying "it shall be illegal to own, maintain, sell, or trade any canidae or felidae for which there is no USDA licensed rabies vaccine."

South Carolina is legal. 
Here is a link to state laws http://wolfology1.tripod.com/id180.htm


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

Thank you for the links. Wolves are actually my favorite animal so I like wolfdogs a lot, though I don't think I'll ever get one or at least any time soon, I need way more experience with normal dogs before that happens.


----------



## sassafras (Jun 22, 2010)

Is someone actually trying to school Cindy on wolfdogs? lolz


----------



## parus (Apr 10, 2014)

hanksimon said:


> I don't understand "rabies doesn't register" - the rabies vaccine has not been proven to be effective with wolfdogs? Or the law doesn't recognize the effectiveness?


The studies required to make a vaccine "official" and determine the required interval between boosters for bureaucratic purposes require quite a bit of time and effort. So animals that are financially lucrative and/or super prevalent and therefore a public health concern get first dibs and the others come later, if ever. I don't think anyone disputes that the rabies vax works on wolves or wolf dogs, but for policy purposes it has to be really locked down definitively.


----------



## parus (Apr 10, 2014)

Captain_Russia said:


> HOWEVER, she does show some MINOR signs of POSSIBLE wolf lineage. Such as a having a dorsal cape (NO DOG SPECIES has one)


Setting aside the phrase "no dog species," there are plenty of dogs that have poofy/spiky hair in that region that someone who doesn't really know what they're looking at could readily mistake for a wolfish dorsal cape.


----------



## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

My 12lb mutt has something that could easily be mistaken as a dorsal cape. Ie: Longer, spikier, harsher hair on her neck and over her shoulders. 

I promise she is about as much a wolf as she is a tiger.


----------



## Hiraeth (Aug 4, 2015)

CptJack said:


> My 12lb mutt has something that could easily be mistaken as a dorsal cape. Ie: Longer, spikier, harsher hair on her neck and over her shoulders.
> 
> I promise she is about as much a wolf as she is a tiger.


Same with Atlas. I get asked if he's a wolf hybrid a lot. Especially because he howls and has the most ridiculous prey drive I've ever seen. Still not a wolf dog.


----------



## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

CptJack said:


> My 12lb mutt has something that could easily be mistaken as a dorsal cape. Ie: Longer, spikier, harsher hair on her neck and over her shoulders.
> 
> I promise she is about as much a wolf as she is a tiger.


Ida has that too, she and Kylie are obviously both wolfdogs and not sheltie mixes.


----------



## BostonBullMama (Apr 20, 2013)

Brody and my bully-boy, Toby. 
Interested to hear what you have to say about Brody, *Captain_Russia*.


----------



## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

All dogs seem to have a dorsal cape. My JRT had a very big one when he arrived as he'd never been stripped, he was even wire haired. Bucky's is very prominent as he is sable which has tipped hairs, also not limited to wolves.


----------



## CorgiKarma (Feb 10, 2009)

Given your description, my corgi is as much wolf dog as your dog...but instead of a "dorsal cape" she has a "fairy saddle"...I know many dogs with this sort of fur around their necks...and they aren't wolves!


----------



## BigLittle (May 28, 2014)

Louie has a false saddle on his back and neck. It is made up of very thick hairs that start dark and become pale at the tips. It is overall darker than the rest of his fur. At first, I thought it was a fur color somehow showing through his solid liver coat, but it is really just a different hair texture. He is pure deer Chihuahua or mostly Deer/tiny bit of Rat Terrier.


----------



## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

Every dog I've known has had thicker, coarser fur on their shoulders. My Lab had an impressive patch of coarse fox-red fur there (the rest of her fur was almost white). I'm not sure what the difference is between that and a wolf's dorsal cape but yeah.

And, yep, the rabies vaccine almost certainly works on wolves and wolf-dogs, but it's only legally recognized in cats, dogs, and ferrets. They haven't done the necessary studies on other animals, and won't if it's not profitable.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

parus & CptJack; I meant "breed" I mix words a lot. And her fur isn't spiked or poofy, it's actually a layered, textured, and colored differently than the rest of her fur.

Hiraeth; He's certainly a pretty dog, but I'd never mistake him for a wolf! What type of dog is he, anyway? From the sideways portrait in your signature I was thinking maybe a white German Shepherd mix, but that other picture is about the farthest thing from a GSD you can get.

BostonBullMama; Brody's pretty. I can see why you brought him up, but from the looks of things it's not what I was talking about.

From what most of you are describing, I get the pitcure of a kind of mane, around the neck. This isn't what she has; in fact, she's short-haired and has no poof at all - BigLittle is most closely describing what she has, I think. Here's a description I found for what a dosral cape in a wolf is:


> The coats vary in color and in texture all over a wolf’s body and they have banded fur(each individual hair has a few different colors per strand). It lies on the body differently than a dog’s fur does. Their fur makes up a pattern that outlines a “v” shape draping down their backs called a dorsal cape(not to be confused with the black saddle of a GSD. That is coat color, not a real change in fur pattern/length.). Some capes are more readily noticeable than others. On black wolves it is still there but harder to see. The dorsal cape starts behind the shoulders and comes to a point on the mid back.












That being said, I'm getting a lot of people saying that it's more or less normal, so I suppose it was really nothing. Here's where I have some pictures of her:
Pictures


----------



## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

No, not mane-like. What I'm describing looks just like what the wolf has but not quite as long. I think it's pretty common in dogs.

Have you sent a.picture of your pup to the So You Think You Have A Wolfdog site (that's where the picture/quote is from, right)? They seem pretty straightforward .


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

No I haven't sent a picture, this was actually the first time I posted a picture of Hemset anywhere and it became really obvious really quickly that I was mistaken. xD From what I read about wolf phenotyping I was under the impression that it wasn't a normal dog thing at all, but I guess it's just... a different kind in wolves? It's way more obvious in a wolf, at least.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Captain_Russia said:


> parus & CptJack; I meant "breed" I mix words a lot. And her fur isn't spiked or poofy, it's actually a layered, textured, and colored differently than the rest of her fur.
> 
> Hiraeth; He's certainly a pretty dog, but I'd never mistake him for a wolf! What type of dog is he, anyway? From the sideways portrait in your signature I was thinking maybe a white German Shepherd mix, but that other picture is about the farthest thing from a GSD you can get.
> 
> ...


There is also another error in your first post too. You have born in late april. While yes there is animals born in late april that is not always the case. Highs and pures can be born any time in spring. March all threw out april. Heck arctic lines can be born in May and up threw June. Also the dark colored nails, that part is mostly right however arctic lines can have taupe colored nails.

That not a very good example of a dorsal cape for some people to see as the animal is the same color.

Here's a couple examples of Loki's cape where you can clearly see the different colors along with the outline of black, the one picture also points out the precaudal gland


----------



## BostonBullMama (Apr 20, 2013)

Captain_Russia said:


> parus & CptJack; I meant "breed" I mix words a lot. And her fur isn't spiked or poofy, it's actually a layered, textured, and colored differently than the rest of her fur.
> 
> Hiraeth; He's certainly a pretty dog, but I'd never mistake him for a wolf! What type of dog is he, anyway? From the sideways portrait in your signature I was thinking maybe a white German Shepherd mix, but that other picture is about the farthest thing from a GSD you can get.
> 
> ...


I brought Brody in because literally -everyone- thinks he's a wolf mix, including his owner and breeder. 
According to the breeder his GSD/Husky was an outdoor dog and bred with a husky/wd mix. The cape you continually described is pretty prominent in Brody, and his temperament isn't much like your typical dog - but that's due to his history. 

Anyway, my point was dogs -in general- have that basic looking cape. My bulldog even has it, his fur is thin as anything, he's naked on his belly, but around his neck and shoulders it's thicker. Not so much so, but more so than the rest of his body. Brody is not a wolfdog, but to an untrained eye he appears pretty wolfy-looking. You just can't judge a book by it's cover.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

Cindy23323; Oh wow, I guess when it was described as a "V" it was _literally_ a "V" and not just a bit of raised fur or anything. I knew about the arctic nails and the the breeding variance, I guess I forgot to add that originally! I'll do it now, and can I use that picture of Loki in the post? As a side note, I find the notion hilarious of people trying to break into your house with a bunch of wolfdogs in your backyard, especially when one of them is chewing on your security. xD

BostonBullMama; Yes, I can see that now, I was just being dumb because I haven't seen a lot of dogs, and when I do see them I don't usually focus on their neck. I was actually thinking of getting a DNA test for her, not to see if she's wolf but to show the guy I got her from that her father WASN'T wolf. Some one on a different thread (I forget their name) mentioned something I hadn't thought about, that he could endanger any future litters by trying to pass them off as wolfdogs. It's a very real possibility, especially when it looks like she got pregnant again for the third time.


----------



## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

Poor girl! Does he breed her on purpose, or do you think he'd be willing to let someone (like you!) help him get her spayed? If he was going to kill the pups in the last litter I feel like this litter is in danger as well . If you could get her spayed she (and her puppies) would be so much better off. 

I'm not sure the usual DNA tests look for wolf markers. You might have to get a specialized test.


----------



## BostonBullMama (Apr 20, 2013)

A DNA test likely won't show 'wolf' since they'd be looking for other dog breeds.


----------



## MastiffGuy (Mar 23, 2015)

BostonBullMama said:


> A DNA test likely won't show 'wolf' since they'd be looking for other dog breeds.


1 and 2.0 will not show wolf, Wilson 3.0 will show wolf and coyote.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

He doesn't breed her on purpose, his yard isn't secured and he doesn't watch her, she gets out all the time and other dogs can get in. I've tried convincing him to get her spayed but he doesn't listen. I found a shelter in his area that gives out tickets for cheaper surgeries, hopefully he'd be willing to get her fixed if it was cheaper or free. In the mean time I hope she really isn't pregnant, I'd have to find all the puppies homes again.
As MastiffGuy said, there's a test that's very broad, I believe I looked and it was about $80.


----------



## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

Captain_Russia said:


> He doesn't breed her on purpose, his yard isn't secured and he doesn't watch her, she gets out all the time and other dogs can get in. I've tried convincing him to get her spayed but he doesn't listen. I found a shelter in his area that gives out tickets for cheaper surgeries, hopefully he'd be willing to get her fixed if it was cheaper or free. In the mean time I hope she really isn't pregnant, I'd have to find all the puppies homes again.
> As MastiffGuy said, there's a test that's very broad, I believe I looked and it was about $80.


Regardless if he breeds her on purpose or not, it's not fair to her and it's pretty irresponsible of him. I hope you can encourage him to get her spayed.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

MastiffGuy said:


> 1 and 2.0 will not show wolf, Wilson 3.0 will show wolf and coyote.


Unfortunately it is not accurate. People with known lineage in the wd community have already tried it and its way off. The only test open to the public that is accurate is the UC Davis test. It will not let you know the dog breeds though, it will simply tell you if the animal is all dog, all wolf or a wolfdog.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Captain_Russia said:


> Cindy23323; Oh wow, I guess when it was described as a "V" it was _literally_ a "V" and not just a bit of raised fur or anything. I knew about the arctic nails and the the breeding variance, I guess I forgot to add that originally! I'll do it now, and can I use that picture of Loki in the post? As a side note, I find the notion hilarious of people trying to break into your house with a bunch of wolfdogs in your backyard, especially when one of them is chewing on your security. xD
> 
> BostonBullMama; Yes, I can see that now, I was just being dumb because I haven't seen a lot of dogs, and when I do see them I don't usually focus on their neck. I was actually thinking of getting a DNA test for her, not to see if she's wolf but to show the guy I got her from that her father WASN'T wolf. Some one on a different thread (I forget their name) mentioned something I hadn't thought about, that he could endanger any future litters by trying to pass them off as wolfdogs. It's a very real possibility, especially when it looks like she got pregnant again for the third time.


Unfortunately it would do no good as those two would probably just run and hide from them, especially Loki he's such a big scaredy cat of strangers. Yes you can use my pics for education, I have a ton more that I use giving examples. I'll post some more.

Here's one that shows off how cow hocked wolfers are.









Selene and Loki before and after on how they are dark when they are born (of course not talking about the exception of being inbred like we have been discussing but the norm)

















side by side of a high next to a low/no









well furred ears with no pink showing









Big feet with long toes. 









Another thing about wolfdogs. A lot of people will say "I know for fact they are a wolfdog, his papers says so". Any registery that will register a wolfdog is not worth the paper they are printed on. All of them will register any type of animals as whatever you want it to be just for the money. I've seen people in the wd community register pigs as wolfdogs threw some of them. Heck I registered Selene and Loki both (high contents) as Native American Indian dogs just to see if they would do it and guess what, both are now registered NAIDS, lol


















Also, they do not shed year round like dogs. They only do it once a year towards the spring and they do not shed like regular dogs either, they molt.

















Eye pics at different ages, 4 weeks, 8 weeks and then at 6 months. How they start blue and change (in a high content not lows and mids that can be blue or bi eyed)


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Oops just noticed the eye picture did not go threw


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Lillith said:


> Curious, can you train wolfdogs like regular pet dogs? Or is their behavior that different?


I'm sorry I missed this post. They are much more harder to train that regular dogs and it takes longer. High contents like the pair of mine that I pictured are not house pets either, the norm for them is to want to be outside and I've heard many tails of people trying to keep them indoors and they will destroy everything along with breaking out a window just to get outside.


----------



## Lillith (Feb 16, 2016)

Cindy23323 said:


> I'm sorry I missed this post. They are much more harder to train that regular dogs and it takes longer. High contents like the pair of mine that I pictured are not house pets either, the norm for them is to want to be outside and I've heard many tails of people trying to keep them indoors and they will destroy everything along with breaking out a window just to get outside.


Thanks for the info! It really puts into perspective the years and years of careful breeding humans have done to attain the wide variety of domesticated dogs we enjoy today. Also, what kind of dogs will breed with a wolf? It seems dogs and wolves don't like each other. I had a dog that loved every other dog, but he saw a coyote and wanted to kill it even before he got close enough to sniff it! I imagine he would have done the same if he saw a wolf.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Lillith said:


> Thanks for the info! It really puts into perspective the years and years of careful breeding humans have done to attain the wide variety of domesticated dogs we enjoy today. Also, what kind of dogs will breed with a wolf? It seems dogs and wolves don't like each other. I had a dog that loved every other dog, but he saw a coyote and wanted to kill it even before he got close enough to sniff it! I imagine he would have done the same if he saw a wolf.


Any kind of dogs will breed with wolves. Usually people will use breeds that complement the wolf though, something like your northern breeds, huskies and mals or some people use gsd's on the first F1 50/50 percent breeding. The two I showed pics of are F1 98% though. One parent was a pure wolf and the fathers were F1 96%. F1 means a parent was a pure. Maybe your dog was just sensing that the coyote was a born wild animal. I've had my animals at the dog park and they have gotten along fine with other dogs.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

How large or small have you ever seen a high content be? I saw an image of some one with what they said was a Great Dane wolfdog and it was enourmous! I imagine people have bred wolves to smaller breeds as well, I just don't know how small. I think a miniature wolfdog would be adorable! From what I know of genetics it wouldn't be overly difficult to breed smaller wolfdogs, though it's probably a terrible idea since most medium-small or small breeds of dog seem to have anger issues (probably because their owners let them get away with stuff they shouldn't as it's "cute").


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Was it either of these two animal? I know who both are and the breeders they came from. Both these pictures people decide to take them and make stuff up about them. They over exaggerate the size of the animals as both pictures are perception shots that make them appear a lot larger then they are. But however if the picture you seen was a true great dane wolf mix then I imagine the animal was not that attractive as neither breed complements each other. The size range for these guys are normally 70 to 120lbs.
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/66/d1/b6/66d1b65974fa4ef05afe3ac1d0def7cd.jpg
https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/37/c0/d2/37c0d29afc5a627831a206bf426583d1.jpg

After doing a search this pops up, someone took this picture just from being online and decided to call it a newfoundland/great dane mix with is untrue. This animal is from the breeder Brry Hadvet of Wolfzone 1 in Texas.

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/479703797779868723/


----------



## Lillith (Feb 16, 2016)

Cindy23323 said:


> Any kind of dogs will breed with wolves. Usually people will use breeds that complement the wolf though, something like your northern breeds, huskies and mals or some people use gsd's on the first F1 50/50 percent breeding. The two I showed pics of are F1 98% though. One parent was a pure wolf and the fathers were F1 96%. F1 means a parent was a pure. Maybe your dog was just sensing that the coyote was a born wild animal. I've had my animals at the dog park and they have gotten along fine with other dogs.


Yeah, true, his "job" was to keep the farm free of vermin.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

It was the second one that I saw, thank you for the info. My aunt said she bought a high-content wolfdog in Oregon about a year ago, do you know of any breeders in that state? I haven't seen a picture of it, but she says it's well-trained and loves to be around children (she leaves a supposed _high content wolfdog_ alone with toddlers!!!), which makes me think it might not be - that, and Oregon's only recently seen wild wolves returning.


----------



## Cindy23323 (Mar 31, 2010)

Captain_Russia said:


> It was the second one that I saw, thank you for the info. My aunt said she bought a high-content wolfdog in Oregon about a year ago, do you know of any breeders in that state? I haven't seen a picture of it, but she says it's well-trained and loves to be around children (she leaves a supposed _high content wolfdog_ alone with toddlers!!!), which makes me think it might not be - that, and Oregon's only recently seen wild wolves returning.


What does Oregon "only recently seeing wild wolves return" have to do with wolfdog breeders being in Oregon? No breeders are using wild caught animals. These are lines that have been in captivity for decades. By the way you are describing the actions of the animal I seriously doubt he/she has significant content.


----------



## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

I'm not really sure what I was thinking about the wild wolves thing, it just seemed wrong somehow that the state would allow wolfdogs to be bred while not having many pure wolves in the wild. My brain does weird things.


----------



## Jessica Lauren (9 mo ago)

Thank you for posting this information. It is so important for people to learn how to distinguish between true wolf and wolfdog traits, and traits of domestic dogs, that simply have wolfy-looking physical characteristics. I have seen regular domestic dog breeds being misrepresented as wolves or wolfdogs by breeders who are looking to profit off of their wolf-like physical traits, but unfortunately these people are just taking advantage of the fact that most people have not been extensively educated on the distinct differences that separate domestic dogs from wolves and wolfdogs, and let me tell you, these differences go FAR beyond the physical traits. I personally own a beautiful, solid black, male wolf. He is my true and best companion, but he is NOTHING like a domestic dog. Someone who is not overly familiar with the ways in which physical attributes differ between dogs and wolves, might initially mistake my wolf for being a solid black German Shepherd with a medium/long coat, but in reality, his appearance differs immensely from that of a GSD, and his personality couldn't possibly be more different than that of any breed of dog. I have extensive experience with dogs and wolves, and I had been very well aware of what I would be getting myself into, including how to properly care for, and handle a wolf, but despite all this prior knowledge, preparation, and awareness, it is still a full-time job for me to own and properly care for my wolf. I can't possibly place enough emphasis upon just how drastically different, just how costly, and just how much of a 24/7 investment, having a wolf actually is. It is something that I have had to dedicate my entire life to; with my wolf and his care assuming the position of my #1 priority, and all other people, places, things, relationships, and occasions taking the back burner to him. I know that sounds a bit extreme, but I am NOT exaggerating. Between the energy and prey drive, the high intelligence and sharp analytical and critical thinking skills, the extreme independence, the ability to climb, escape and problem solve, the stubbornness, howling, special dietary needs, greater social needs, an inability to be left unattended, the high need for extended periods of exercise and mental stimulation, plus so much more, owning a wolf, or wolfdog really is incomparable to owning a domestic dog. I love my wolf and wouldn't want to change a single thing, but I genuinely have dedicated my whole life, 24/7/365 to him, his care, and his proper upbringing. Despite working with him every day, for over several hours, on various aspects of training, he is still extremely destructive, stubborn, powerful, impatient, manipulative, sneaky, and extremely difficult to manage, at times. He just turned 3 and although he does need regular work, and improvement, he has already come a very long way, but that is just one example of what kind of a commitment this coincides with. Surprisingly, my wolf has actually been able to function more like a domestic dog than I would have ever foreseen or expected, but when I say more like a domestic dog, I emphasize that there is still VERY little in common between him and a domestic dog breed, just the fact that he has been able to bond with me and learn to respect me enough to obey my commands as often as he does, is still something that shocks me though. Nonetheless, even as someone who had many, many years of experience with dogs and wolves, leading up to accepting ownership of my wolf, I still find owning a wolf to be indescribably challenging, and although the reward of all this work, commitment, and sacrifice is more rewarding than it is challenging, for me, I just want to say that this is not something I would ever suggest or recommend that anyone else attempt. So often, people purchase or adopt wolves or wolfdogs because they think it will be, "cool" or, " badass" yet by the time 6 months goes by, the poor animals are being surrendered to wolf sanctuaries (as shelters will not take wolves or wolfdogs and are known to even euthanize them), since the investment and commitment required is often overlooked, underestimated, or something that some people are even fully unaware of. Unfortunately, there are so many wolves and wolfdogs, flooding the sanctuaries all over the USA, due to the lack of education, experience and full understanding of people, prior to hastily assuming that these wild animals will make good pets. These animals are beautiful, majestic, incredibly intelligent, and ownership of one can certainly offer great reward, but it is going to require a complete life change, and consistent, hands-on work. They do not and will not make good pets, ever. Unless someone is willing to make a serious commitment to one of these animals for the next 20 years of his or her life, and he or she is willing to become extensively educated on their behavior, health, strengths, weaknesses, and has, otherwise, made it a priority to learn how to, not just meet all such needs, but to exceed them, for the animal, and is willing to make an every day practice, around the clock, out of doing so, then I would highly advise against getting a wolf or wolfdog. There are plenty of wolfy-looking domestic dog breeds that make amazing pets, only, with much greater ease, and with far fewer obligations and sacrifices required!!


----------



## DaySleepers (Apr 9, 2011)

This is a seven year old thread, and the original poster has been banned. I'm closing the thread to further replies, but feel free to start your own thread, or join in any of our current discussions!


----------

