# Is Boomer the LR pup too chunky? 14 w/o & photos attached



## brianosaur (Jan 28, 2014)

How much should I be feeding my English lab pup? He will be 14 w/o in two days.
I have found various calculators on the web and I get different results.
His food is 445 kcal per cup and I have been feeding him 3 cups per day total, 1 cup each at 6am, noon & 6pm, for a total of 1335 kcal/day.

I know he is a lab but he was acting like he starving and his universe was coming to an end when I was feeding 2 then 2.5 cu/day a few weeks ago.
Now he just paces around for five minutes after he is done eating wondering if that was all he is going to get, and checking the bowl to see if any food magically appeared into it since he looked away ten seconds ago.

I know that puppies are supposed to get more food then adults, but also not to overfeed LRs bc of growth & hip issues.
I can feel his ribs easily on his underside (stomach & front 'arm pit' area) but not easily on his side.

The food he has been eating received a 4.5 star review from dogfoodadvisor.com
The bag says 3-3.5 cu/day but I know they tend to be high.

I had visitors tell me he was chunky but I'm not sure they know what an English looks like vs an American.
...now I am second guessing.


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## Dog Person (Sep 14, 2012)

I guess the question is how active is he and what else does he get? 445 cal x 3 = 1335 which could be a lot of calories if he doesn't need it. He does look a little chucky but he's also 14 weeks old and may grow out of it (I don't know that answer). Probably the best person to ask about weight is the Vet.

Here is a calculator for beginning guidance: http://www.mycockerspaniel.com/mer.htm and here is a chart about physically looking at the dog: http://www.dummies.com/how-to/content/how-to-evaluate-your-dogs-weight.html

The calculator is a starting point but it may say to feed more but I would question that before doing it. The chart is for "dogs" and I don't know if that also equates to puppies.

FWIW - I was feeding Zoey 2 cups of Orijen when she was a pup and pretty much stopped it because it didn't really agree with her. When I stopped feeding it to her I told the store why and the people there asked how much I was feeding her - their response was I was feeding way too much and an 80 lb dog should only get 1 cup of Orijen a day ... my opinion was I would be feeding way too little food to satisfy her (she should be around 35 lbs so less than 1/2 cup a day - no way). 

Some dogs are natural beggars (Zoey is) and you would think that she is starving ...


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## Rescued (Jan 8, 2012)

He does look a little chunky but so hard to tell from pictures. Can you easily palpate his last few ribs? does he have a waist when viewed from the top?

The service dog org I work with does 3 cups/day for almost all pups (labs and goldens) as a general guideline through 7-9 mos so it doesn't sound like too much off the bat BUT he should have easy to feel ribs (and sometimes even see the last few in the yellow ones when they turn to the side) and have a waist.


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## brianosaur (Jan 28, 2014)

Rescued said:


> He does look a little chunky but so hard to tell from pictures. Can you easily palpate his last few ribs? does he have a waist when viewed from the top?
> 
> The service dog org I work with does 3 cups/day for almost all pups (labs and goldens) as a general guideline through 7-9 mos so it doesn't sound like too much off the bat BUT he should have easy to feel ribs (and sometimes even see the last few in the yellow ones when they turn to the side) and have a waist.


I can feel his ribs easily on his underside (stomach & front 'arm pit' area) but not easily on his side.

I *think* he has a waist but this is my first LR & first pup ever. We joke that he looks like a bodybuilder with a small waist and giant shoulders/chest in comparison.

This is his father:


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## InkedMarie (Mar 11, 2009)

I think both he & his dad are chunky


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## Foxes&Hounds (Jun 7, 2014)

I'm sorry, but I think his dad looks awful...

I'd cut puppy back a little bit; don't need extra weight on growing joints.
He is very cute though


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

You should be able to feel his ribs easily on the side too. You should also be able to see more waist from the top. I'd cut him back just a bit and see how he looks.


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## brianosaur (Jan 28, 2014)

I don't mind cutting back on the food a bit, but I would like to hear from eLR owners/breeders too.

Remember, he is an English Lab.

He dad doesn't look all that different from THIS which shows both American & English.


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## chimunga (Aug 29, 2014)

This doesn't always apply to puppies, and of course there are variances among breeds, but:










Regardless of the breeding, the dad still looks pretty chunky to me.


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## Amaryllis (Dec 28, 2011)

That dog on the left is morbidly obese. Yes, American labs are shown that way, that doesn't make them any less obese.


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## InkedMarie (Mar 11, 2009)

brianosaur said:


> I don't mind cutting back on the food a bit, but I would like to hear from eLR owners/breeders too.
> 
> Remember, he is an English Lab.
> 
> He dad doesn't look all that different from THIS which shows both American & English.


i see an obese dog on the left and an in shape lab on the right.


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## Rescued (Jan 8, 2012)

Yeah Nugs dad is from Rocheby, and he's still at the weight of the one on the right. He has the bones of the left one, but none of them need that much weight. IMO your pup doesn't have nearly enough waist. They do tend to get chunky 

This is an awful picture and he is standing all jacked up, but this is nug just now. Still has the bigger head and chest. Just not all the extra fluff.



Sorry about gross muddy rug. Also sorry about work scrubs but here's him from the top:


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## chimunga (Aug 29, 2014)

Rescued said:


> Yeah Nugs dad is from Rocheby, and he's still at the weight of the one on the right. He has the bones of the left one, but none of them need that much weight. IMO your pup doesn't have nearly enough waist. They do tend to get chunky
> 
> This is an awful picture and he is standing all jacked up, but this is nug just now. Still has the bigger head and chest. Just not all the extra fluff.


I don't think I've ever seen a full-body picture of him. That is how an english lab should look. He's lovely. Kudos for keeping him so fit. People probably tell you he's emaciated. >.<


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## Rescued (Jan 8, 2012)

hahaha yes. all the time. and its tricky, because when he came back from school (had been in NY for 5 months) he came back (full grown, like now) looking like this: 



and I was like WOW he looks pretty good (they usually get a little chunky up in the kennel especially once they've been released from the program). And he did, but he was 76 lbs. He's now 63 lbs. Labs just hold weight weird. He did NOT look fat IMO when he came back from NY. larger yes, but not fat. But he still did need to lose about 13 lbs.


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## Foxes&Hounds (Jun 7, 2014)

Can still be a chunkier build dog without being a pudding


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## chimunga (Aug 29, 2014)

The other day, Purina posted a picture of a Champion Lab that was fed Purina. And they just got reeeeemed. Everyone kept saying how totally unhealthy and overweight the dog looked. Well, the dog's breeder turned up saying that it is against the Lab breed standard to have a tuck. I call BS. She got called out a lot on that comment. 



https://www.facebook.com/PurinaProP...65605291884/10153182942066885/?type=1&theater


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## Rescued (Jan 8, 2012)

chimunga said:


> The other day, Purina posted a picture of a Champion Lab that was fed Purina. And they just got reeeeemed. Everyone kept saying how totally unhealthy and overweight the dog looked. Well, the dog's breeder turned up saying that it is against the Lab breed standard to have a tuck. I call BS. She got called out a lot on that comment.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.facebook.com/PurinaProP...65605291884/10153182942066885/?type=1&theater


I'm on my phone but I think she is correct. I don't think the standard calls for a tuck.

That being said, my dog ain't a show dog so I can keep him at whatever weight I want haha. Like when you compare my two pics- same dog, same bone size, none look *fat* but as you can see one is healthier than the other.


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## chimunga (Aug 29, 2014)

Rescued said:


> I'm on my phone but I think she is correct. I don't think the standard calls for a tuck.
> 
> That being said, my dog ain't a show dog so I can keep him at whatever weight I want haha. Like when you compare my two pics- same dog, same bone size, none look *fat* but as you can see one is healthier than the other.


I don't think she's lying. I'm sure that's what the "standard" calls for. But the standard notoriously favors overweight Labs.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

I actually went digging and apparently the standard actually says there should be minimal to no tuck up. 

That said, even at a point where tuck goes away, holy CRAP that is not an excuse for those dogs to be as overweight as they often are. Like there's big bone and a lot of head and heavy enough not to be tucked (which would bug me a lot) and then there's.... dangerously obese.


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## Rescued (Jan 8, 2012)

chimunga said:


> I don't think she's lying. I'm sure that's what the "standard" calls for. But the standard notoriously favors overweight Labs.


Yesh I mostly (all?) agree. Am going to stop posting on here though as I don't want to hijack someone else's thread. If anyone wants to start a new thread about the topic though I will be more than happy to contribute )


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## chimunga (Aug 29, 2014)

Yep. No tuck. That makes me sad. 



> The Labrador should be short-coupled, with good spring of ribs tapering to a moderately wide chest. The Labrador should not be narrow chested; giving the appearance of hollowness between the front legs, nor should it have a wide spreading, bulldog-like front. Correct chest conformation will result in tapering between the front legs that allows unrestricted forelimb movement. Chest breadth that is either too wide or too narrow for efficient movement and stamina is incorrect. Slab-sided individuals are not typical of the breed; equally objectionable are rotund or barrel chested specimens. The underline is almost straight, with little or no tuck-up in mature animals. Loins should be short, wide and strong; extending to well developed, powerful hindquarters. When viewed from the side, the Labrador Retriever shows a well-developed, but not exaggerated forechest.


http://www.akc.org/dog-breeds/labrador-retriever/

I'd love to know their reasons for not wanting a tuck on them. :/


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## chimunga (Aug 29, 2014)

Rescued said:


> Yesh I mostly (all?) agree. Am going to stop posting on here though as I don't want to hijack someone else's thread. If anyone wants to start a new thread about the topic though I will be more than happy to contribute )


Good plan. OP, cute puppy. Keep him fit, please don't listen to the breed standard, as it appears to be very dumb ^_^


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## Rescued (Jan 8, 2012)

chimunga said:


> Yep. No tuck. That makes me sad.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hehe yes if you want to start a thread I will be more than willing to contribute. Long history, interesting discourse.

But yes OP a chunky pup is preferable to a malnourished one. But it's hard to malnourish a lab  by 4-6 months I like to see "adult" type tuck and waist on my pups. That being me personally, everyone feels differently


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## brianosaur (Jan 28, 2014)

Waddabout this guy? Is he a chunkster?


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## NicoleIsStoked (Aug 31, 2012)

from the side, you can see the definition of his ribs, which is good. but i'd like to see a pic of his waist from the top before i say either way.


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## chimunga (Aug 29, 2014)

brianosaur said:


> Waddabout this guy? Is he a chunkster?


Very, very slight tuck, so not all bad. But still very chunky IMO. I think almost any weight chart would put him as overweight. Maybe not obese, but very probably overweight. Go back and looks at Rescued's Nug. He's a European type lab, and he's at a very nice weight. 

Without getting into a huge debate, in general in the dog community show labs (aka European Labs) are usually seen as being shown at an unhealthy weight. Because they are bred to look stockier, handlers tend to let them get overweight to emphasize their stockiness.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

Honestly I don't think the yellow lab is chunky. It's hard to tell with just a picture but that's a lot of definition around the ribs. Especially for the amount of coat he looks like he has. Some of the bench bred labs are just thicker. Built like a barrel.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

I actually think that yellow lab might be okay, based on the last rib and shape of the rib-cage showing. If he's just built to not have a tuck, I don't think anything including emaciation is going to give him one. Kind of like Molly can be outright fat and still HAVE a pretty sharp tuck. I think those things may actually be separate, just related.


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## chimunga (Aug 29, 2014)

You're probably right. I don't profess to be a lab expert. He just looks really large around the neck to me. But I see what you're talking about on the chest. There's a definition line.


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