# Puppy panics near storm drains



## Hazelnut (Oct 23, 2016)

I currently own a 16 week old collie who has huge enthusiasm for other people/dogs. We are working on curbing his excitability.

We have hit a bit of a large stumbling block - one that I worry about more than his overzealous behavior with other dogs/people. He has started to absolutely panic whenever we approach a storm drain on our walks. This only started happening yesterday, and we are walking the same neighborhood streets since I brought him home 6 weeks ago... I believe he is at an age where he is finally obtaining depth perception. I double-checked with my OH to make sure he hadn't accidentally gotten a paw caught in one on a walk with him (due to the alarming reaction), and his answer was no. 

I didn't want him to think that it was ok to completely freak and try to pull me away from the drains - or pulling/guiding me in general - so I have been firmly moving him towards them. I feel bad forcing him, but I have read things that allowing your dog to use aversion or coddling their fear response will only escalate into further issues down the road. However, I am also concerned that I am damaging his confidence in me by forcing him to confront a frightening situation.

So far I've tried introducing new and extremely high-value treats (bacon and roast beef) by laying them literally along the edges of the drain, which he will sniff around and consume. Getting him to the drain, however, is the real issue. I tried running with him past one, as well as picking him up and standing right on it, to sitting with him and rewarding calm behavior...I'm troubled since I don't know if I could be inadvertently rewarding anxiety that isn't manifesting as a physical response. 

We were fortunate to see the mailman come around the last gutter we were sitting next to; meeting a new person who even gave him a treat seemed to override the worries about the gutter! I just know this is unlikely to happen again, so what is the best game plan? Should I get my OH to stand by one as positive reinforcement/distraction as we pass by?


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

Personally, those things make me nervous too. I don't see any reason to get him more comfortable being close to one. I think I'd want my dog to stay away from them. Now, if he won't walk on the sidewalk near one, that's a problem, I'd work on getting him comfortable enough to walk by without worrying. But actually standing on one or getting very close to it? No way.

Collies are pretty soft and prone to nervousness so I definitely wouldn't force anything. Be on his side! Distractions and treats are great.


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## Hazelnut (Oct 23, 2016)

I live in a network of cul-de-sacs, but no sidewalks unfortunately. I would never force him to walk over one, we used to just casually stroll past it. I have no idea why or what went wrong.


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

Well, he probably just noticed one, it kind of freaked him out, and then you started trying to get him closer to it. Which would be pretty scary. What do you think he would do if you just stood there and let him freak out, until he calmed down?


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## Lillith (Feb 16, 2016)

Lol, that sounds like a WPP, Weird Puppy Phases. Sometimes puppies just randomly become afraid of new objects, and sometimes even objects they've seen numerous times before. They are typically called fear periods and can last for a day to a couple weeks. From 5 months (we adopted him at 5 months old, but I'm sure he had freak outs before us) to...well, to now, just less frequently, Ralphie freaked out at boxes, rocks, fire hydrants, electrical boxes, little weeds, big weeds, weeds that just looked weird, weeds that hit him in the face, people, dogs, people and dogs, people that looked like dogs, statues, full trash bags, empty trash bags, a street, a sidewalk, A TREAT, a lady on crutches, me on crutches, a baby bird, and sometimes something invisible that was apparently apparent to the dog, just not me.

So yeah. Expect more of that.

In those situations, I let Ralphie approach if he wanted. I never forced him. Ever. If he wanted to just watch it, sure. If he wanted to pee on it, even better. If he wanted to eat it...well, I let him eat the weeds. And the treat. Forcing can sometimes crate a negative association with that object. 

Most likely your puppy will forget that he's afraid of storm drains in about a week. Maybe tomorrow, who knows. It really is not unusual for puppies, from 8 weeks to probably around 18 months, to have fear periods where the world is suddenly a scary place. One day they're scared of a box, the next they're sitting in it and chewing it into a pulp.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

WPP? My near adult rescued dogs did that. Sassy found new things to shy at on every walk for the first YEAR and we walked at least twice a day. The best one was the saw horse barrier that was up for a good month. We passed it daily and she shied at it every time. Guess she was pretty brave though as she would go up to sniff and never had to scream at the new things. She was 11 months old when she came home with us.

Max panicked over an empty car trailer and a bin of pumpkins on the same walk. I stopped and let him lead the way - out of there. The car trailer clearly was a fuzzy black dog eating thing that was terrifying for about a month but the next time we passed that pumpkin bin he was fine. He was about 1 year old.

Bucky gets fascinated by things. I stop and let him look. When he's ready to move along I wait until he comes to my side. One of the oddest things he did was stop 6 times as we passed a woman gardening on the other side of the street. Taking a 3D memory of the event? He's 3 years old.

My dogs don't care for drain grates. I understand as they could trap toes. They do want to climb into open drains though. Scares me to death as they would fit through.


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## Lillith (Feb 16, 2016)

Kathyy said:


> WPP? My near adult rescued dogs did that. Sassy found new things to shy at on every walk for the first YEAR and we walked at least twice a day. The best one was the saw horse barrier that was up for a good month. We passed it daily and she shied at it every time. Guess she was pretty brave though as she would go up to sniff and never had to scream at the new things. She was 11 months old when she came home with us.
> 
> Max panicked over an empty car trailer and a bin of pumpkins on the same walk. I stopped and let him lead the way - out of there. The car trailer clearly was a fuzzy black dog eating thing that was terrifying for about a month but the next time we passed that pumpkin bin he was fine. He was about 1 year old.
> 
> ...


Lol, I made WPP up. It's the only way to stay sane sometimes when your dog is barking at a funny looking thistle for 10 minutes.


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## khennessy (Oct 16, 2016)

Hey, my puppy randomly freaked out over a big rock the other day. We stopped the walk, let her examine it from a distance for a little (gave treats because she stopped losing her sh!t), and moved on. Today we went hiking and passed many rocks, she didn't even look twice. Instead, today, there was one particular bench that she got freaked out by. 

Don't force it. Let her go at her own pace. Storm drains still freak me out a bit too.


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## LennyandRogue (Jun 25, 2016)

One time Rogue submissively urinated on a statue of thomas jefferson. He was 6 months old at the time, and now at 11 months thomas jefferson is no longer scary.


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## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

very typical puppy, and agree with the previous thought of a pup that just realized to notice it. Forcing the pup at the situation only re enforces the fear so that will set you back for having to get over the "learned fear".. of being forced at it. Usually when I start walking the pups from my mentors litters it happens every time from one group of pups to the next litter and each litter for years.. It's a fire hydrant .. some don't even notice it and walk right by it, some stop and stare at it leery and rush wide past it, looking to see if it is chasing after them. Some stop stare leery but creep towards it trying to smell the air, and some charge it barking... No matter what I just hold the leash and go with them what ever decision they choose to make. Eventually they all go up in their own way and investigate it on the walk an then they over it.. " they learning coping skills on how to deal with strange new things... once they see what the fire hydrant is up close.. no matter how they got there is confidence for the next strange thing and the next strange thing.


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## cookieface (Jul 6, 2011)

My older dog had the same fear. What I did with her was create distance (e.g., cross the street) but continue to walk past and chat with her like normal. There were probably extra treats involved (we were learning LLW at the same time). We gradually moved closer to the drain, but I let her set the pace. After a few walks, they were no big deal.

With other things (e.g., statues, weird holiday decorations), I have given the opportunity to explore at her own pace on our first encounter. But, with storm drains, I didn't want her to bolt into the middle of the street so we were more controlled in our approach.


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## hanksimon (Mar 18, 2009)

It's a normal fear cycle thing ( AKA WPP ;-) ). Storm drains smell funny and sound funny. Compromise with him and allow him to veer around it while walking, but not panic ... so walk far enough away that he can almost ignore it. If he is like my dog, in a few months, he will completely ignore the drain or even find it interesting.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Bucky was really cautious around a broken sand bag this afternoon. The full ones were fine but that busted one with a string hanging out and edges flapping was pretty scary. First he stood on his hind legs then he planned to lunge at it but was thwarted by a short leash but easily managed to do 1 step 2 step close enough to check it out. Hadn't seen that response from him before and he's been here over a year. Oddly that could mean he's getting more relaxed around me and when out and about.


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## hanksimon (Mar 18, 2009)

Mikee is almost 2yo, but he's only been in the real world for about 6 mos ... so I compare his social development behavior to that of a much younger dog. He also is wary of new things, but it has been a common tendency for him. When I first got him, he was scared of a large black buzzard feather in the field, barking at it but wouldn't approach it. Now, he'll chase feathers and play with them. When he saw a large pinecone, he growled at it, but was willing to chase it when we tossed it away. He thinks they're great chewtoys, now. When the hurricane knocked tree limbs and branches down, he had a fearful barkfest. But, when we picked them up, he cringed. I don't think he was beaten, but I do think he might have been 'punished' with sticks, flyswatters, and newspapers, based on reaction. But, when we threw the sticks, he chased them and destroyed them ... and now if I pick up a stick, it is game on! ... And, I can beat him with a pine branch and he thinks it's a great game of keep away .... He's happy to pick up a small downed tree and run around the field with it, playing keep away. Halloween was a terrific time for introduction to scary things ... I think his 'fear cycle' is going to be longer than the average puppy ... but he's getting there. BTW, just to be clear, I don't necessarily recommend picking up a scary thing and beating a frightened puppy with it .... however, if he weighs 70 lbs ... ;-)


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## Hazelnut (Oct 23, 2016)

Thanks, guys! Reading all of the experiences is reassuring. He got to the point where he would freeze up even though we were walking on the other side of the street from one. I have been keeping up with the very tasty treats. Luckily one of the two storm drains on my cul-de-sac is right at the end of my front lawn. I made sure to scatter it with roast beef often and let him investigate at his own pace, and now he will check it out every time we go for a walk. He has also started coming around to the other storm drains we encounter as I create super fun time with his fox toy whenever we approach (+ tasty treats).

As mentioned in the first post, I also sat by the other storm drain (the one not by my property) on our afternoon walk and we waited for the mailman to come around. Luckily we hit a streak of three days in a row where he showed up at the same time. He usually isn't allowed to greet strangers because he is still overly excitable, but with the mailman I made the exception and try to keep the greeting as polite as possible. It really seems to be paying off with regards to his nervousness around the drain. This morning we both strolled right past one with no hesitation/interest - he was too busy wanting to chase the leaves blowing in the wind - so I'm sure the drain is no longer at the top of his list of concerns!


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## 3GSD4IPO (Jun 8, 2016)

I do not know this dog other than its age. The fear of grates may be a fear period but more likely it is not. 

Dogs that must be police dogs cannot be afraid of grates, fire escapes, slippery or shiny floors and so forth. Interestingly, in my breed, we have found this fear genetic based. A puppy can be exposed to all of these situations and be a confident dog. As the puppy ages, these fears manifest and disqualify them from police work. 

Collies have changed over the years as they no longer are working dogs and have become Show Dog focused with excessive coats and no need for a confident, working temperament needed to handle a flock of sheep. As looks have trumped temperament, confidence has taken a back seat. I suspect this is the underlying problem with your dog's fear of grates. 

You may be able to manage the fear, but NOT by force. Do not buy into or coddle the dog when she spooks. Simply STOP MOVING. Let her relax. When she is relaxed, see if she will take food (or engage with a favorite toy). Teach her a focus word at home (look.. which means look at your eyes). Build duration for look away from distraction. Make looking at you her safe default behavior. Add distractions. Take her a lot of different places and work on "look." 

When that is solid, take her back near grates and ask for "look." Move ever closer and keep at it. Maje those grates a good place (NO FORCE). 

As she relaxes you MAY eventually get her to walk over grates calmly. You may not. It may be one if those "forever" jobs. 

I repeat.. do NOT force the dog. That will cause your dog to mistrust you AND the grates.


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