# Any expereince with a Cão de Fila de São Miguel (Azores Cattle Dog)?



## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

There seems to be a nice range of owners on here, many with Cattle Dogs. I'm curious if any one has any experience with the Azores Cattle Dog?










I've always been interested in the breed, the few people I have chatted with who own one makes them out to seem like a really nice dog, but a lot of the online info paints them to be very aggressive. I'm curious which is the truth?

If you have met one, what were they like? High energy? Herding behavior? Human aggressive? Dog aggressive? Soft? Hard?

Any info would be greatly appreciated.


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## RBark (Sep 10, 2007)

No experience but the ears are hilarious lol


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

Yea, they are cropped round like that. Its kinda silly, IMHO.


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## charaseac (Oct 18, 2009)

RBark said:


> No experience but the ears are hilarious lol


Lol the first thing i noticed too.. what a funny ears


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## RBark (Sep 10, 2007)

BradA1878 said:


> Yea, they are cropped round like that. Its kinda silly, IMHO.


Is there a purpose or is it just aesthetics?


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## trumpetjock (Dec 14, 2007)

They look like a hyena!


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## pittsabowawa (Jul 26, 2009)

trumpetjock said:


> They look like a hyena!


OMG.. Thats the exact picture I was about to post until I scrolled down 

I think they are very pretty dogs.. never heard about 'em before though.


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

RBark said:


> Is there a purpose or is it just aesthetics?


There is purpose to cropping ears, yes... But this is a stylized crop and not just a basic blunt "Shepard's Crop", so it seems more for looks IMHO. I mean, they may be cropping the ears for work, but to crop them in a specific style is only for looks.


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## Miranda16 (Jan 17, 2010)

actually i would say they look more like african wild dogs http://www.bio.davidson.edu/people/vecase/Behavior/Spring2009/Landfried/images/African-wild-dog.jpg

actually little tidbit for those who didnt know... hyenas are actually more closely related to cats than dogs


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## trumpetjock (Dec 14, 2007)

Miranda16 said:


> actually little tidbit for those who didnt know... hyenas are actually more closely related to cats than dogs


yeah, dogs and hyenas aren't even remotely related. not sure about the cat thing.


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

Ok, here's *CHUPA*, our Azores Cattle Dog!


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## Keechak (Aug 10, 2008)

HOW COOL! I love Azores! I've always wanted to meet one. I have done a few dawings of them to show my love lol.


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## RaeganW (Jul 14, 2009)

OMG he is SO cute! Chupa as in, Chupacabra?


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## melgrj7 (Sep 21, 2007)

Very cute, congrats on the new pup.


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

Thanks all! 



RaeganW said:


> OMG he is SO cute! Chupa as in, Chupacabra?


Yes, "Chupa" as in Chupacabra. LOL... 

Chupa: "Chupa, or chupas, are mysterious objects, or UFOs, that can be seen by night in the eastern forests of (mainly) Brazil"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chupa_(anomaly)


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## Crantastic (Feb 3, 2010)

You got one! He is adorable. Why did you decide to add one to your pack? What did you learn about them? Your initial post got me all curious about them, haha.


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## Equinox (Nov 11, 2008)

Never heard of the breed until now, when I opened this thread.

But that puppy is so adorable. I'm melting <3


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## marsha=whitie (Dec 29, 2008)

Equinox said:


> Never heard of the breed until now, when I opened this thread.
> 
> But that puppy is so adorable. I'm melting <3


I'm with you on this. That absolutely adorable pup is going to be a head turner when he's grown!


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## BorderGal (Nov 29, 2008)

Never heard of the breed until now. That pup is darn cute for sure. The adults looks like a mastiff/pit/boxer cross to me...but what do I know...here a "cattle dog" is a border collie, McNab, Aussie, Queensland or any mix thereof..and half the people in Hollywood marry half the other people in Hollywood for publicity...that is when they are not breeding designer dogs for publicity and money (just my opinion of course)


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## Miranda16 (Jan 17, 2010)

so when are there gonna be videos of the new pup ...... haha


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

Crantastic said:


> You got one! He is adorable. Why did you decide to add one to your pack? What did you learn about them? Your initial post got me all curious about them, haha.


I've been researching the breed for a few years, talking to owners and breeders about them. I was drawn to them because they are guardians and drovers, which is an interesting mix. A lot of cattle dogs will guard, but their main role is to drove - but the Azores Cattle Dog was "designed" to do both roles equally.

For Chupa, I was looking for an obedient dog that was robust and rugged for hiking with me, would provide a mild amount of protection without being overtly dog aggressive. 

Blue, our Cane Corso, was supposed to have that role, but he is too aggressive toward strange dogs to hike with comfortably. 




BorderGal said:


> The adults looks like a mastiff/pit/boxer cross to me...but what do I know...here a "cattle dog" is a border collie, McNab, Aussie, Queensland or any mix thereof..


Some Bull Dogs can also be called "cattle dogs". These dogs were used to work dairy cattle in the Azores. Chupa comes from a breeder in CAN who works his dogs on his beef cattle.


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

Miranda16 said:


> so when are there gonna be videos of the new pup ...... haha


I have a few, I just need to upload them.


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## Miranda16 (Jan 17, 2010)

BradA1878 said:


> I have a few, I just need to upload them.


 good im excited


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## ollin (Jan 28, 2010)

I agree with the other posters beautiful dog. Keep us updated with pics and videos.


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## GillLivestock (Apr 11, 2010)

Concerning the original question, the breed is a mix. I think the "literature" which relates to the breed's aggressiveness is largely from people who have wrongly interacted with the dog. By this I mean people who view it more as a pet, when it is a working dog and is bred for such a task. 

The dogs are extremely loyal to their owner, and as such, can be territorial or even aggressive to others (this includes people they know and strangers). Thus, they need to be socialized from a young age, but generally do well with children. For some reason, our dogs also interact well wither smaller dogs, although we had problems between our female and an older Border Collie (due to assertion of power). Also, the dog is very dominant and will immediately assert his/her power within the household. This needs to be curbed immediately for it will cause many problems later on. Think closer to how one would train a Rottweiler, German Shepard, Doberman, or Presa Canarios (apparently Sao de Fila's are close cousins to this breed). 

On that note, they love to please their owners, but can do well enough on their own. They need to be constantly challenged intellectually, so herding practices are good exercises. I've read that they do well with children, although I am skeptical of this. I guess it really depends on the individual dog, rather than to generalize the breed. Obviously what they are bred for strongly plays a part, and they are gaurd/herd dogs. Also, they haven't been domesticated for very long, in comparison to other dogs. They aren't like Labs or Retrievers who will let almost anything dominant them; these dogs have a lot of pride. 

I'd give caution to anyone who is interested in one. Obviously they are much better suited to a work environment (I have an issue with people who try to sell them as "family" dogs... they certainly are not a dog for someone who has little time to devote to them).


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## bigblackdogs (May 28, 2009)

how adorable!! and what an interesting way to crop. are you cropping or leaving natural? I would assume it would be difficult to find a vet that can do such a crop.


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

Thanks for the info! Our little guy doesn't appear to be very aggressive, so I am starting to agree with what you wrote. He is "gaurdy" and showed that a pretty young age, which was not a surprise. I do want him to guard the yard with Blue, so I am pleased with his guardy-ness as long as it stays on "his" property and doesn't carry over to guarding just me or my wife in public. That is where socialization will play a big role. So far he has done really well in puppy classes and with socialization.

My only complaint is he is a bit of an assertive ass... But I guess assertiveness and persistence is a quality a 70lb dog needs to do their job of pushing around an 800lb cow, huh?



GillLivestock said:


> Concerning the original question, the breed is a mix.


From my research, the breed has not been mixed for 300 years or so... Does that still qualify as a "mix"?




bigblackdogs said:


> how adorable!! and what an interesting way to crop. are you cropping or leaving natural? I would assume it would be difficult to find a vet that can do such a crop.


If we have them cropped it will be a "shepherd's crop" and not the fancy round crop... but really, its unlikely I will crop them.


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## GillLivestock (Apr 11, 2010)

What I meant by being a mix pertained to the research you had conducted which said that the breed was "good/bad". The bred certainly has not been mixed with others for many years, hahah! 

Our fila is assertive as well! We've been able to curb that a bit just by making sure she gets enough physical and mental exercise. They certainly like to stand their ground, even a litter of pups we recently had would not back down from strangers until they were within a 2ft of them or so.

I have a sort of strange question, but does your dog enjoy playing 'fetch'? Ours would much rather chase windshield wipers or cars passing by while in the car for a drive. We've never really been able to get her interested in fetch actually.


We cropped the new litter (ears and tail docked), but their mother's litter only had their tails done. It's really about how close you want to keep to the standards (and if you don't care much for that, your own personal preferences).


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

GillLivestock said:


> What I meant by being a mix pertained to the research you had conducted which said that the breed was "good/bad". The bred certainly has not been mixed with others for many years, hahah!


Oh, I see, my mistake. LOL That makes more sense.



GillLivestock said:


> I have a sort of strange question, but does your dog enjoy playing 'fetch'? Ours would much rather chase windshield wipers or cars passing by while in the car for a drive. We've never really been able to get her interested in fetch actually.


Well, Chupa is only 10 weeks now, he doesn't really show much interest in chasing balls/sticks so far. But I will give it a try and see if he shows more interest as he gets older.

Chupa doesn't seem to like the outdoors as much as I expected. He wants to be inside with us. If we are outside he is fine with it, but he is not very interested in being out with the other dogs. I am hoping this is a maturity thing and he will eventually become more independent as I will need him to guard the yard with our Cane Corso once he is old enough.

Have you experienced this with any of yours?

I didn't realize you breed as well, that's cool. What is your kennel name? I had a hard time finding Fila breeders when I was looking.

Thanks!


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## GillLivestock (Apr 11, 2010)

Chupa is a great name! 

Our older bitches (5yrs, same litter) are generally able to be on their own and gaurd. Bebe is much better at it though because she's been trained to gaurd the farm, while Knox is more of the house dog. Knox prefers to be inside and stay with her owner; she's extremely loyal.

No, we don't have a kennel, but breed for our own. We originally got into the breed through a OPP K9 training kennel where the fila's came from the Azores. They gave up on the breed, I'm assuming they did not like their personality for the type of training they offerred.

I'd like to start a kennel but need more 'education' on the subject (I'm in my early 20s--hah). Although my dad use to breed Rotti's and other breeds. I know of at least two kennels in the States (we are from Ontario, Canada), one of which specifically trains filas, Cane Corso's, etc. for gaurding purposes. Where abouts did you get your pup from? We're thinking about breeding once more (Knox), but that won't be until Oct/Nov.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

You have a fila and you have not shared any pictures yet?!


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

GillLivestock said:


> Chupa is a great name!
> 
> Where abouts did you get your pup from? We're thinking about breeding once more (Knox), but that won't be until Oct/Nov.


Haha, thanks! I get a lot of laughs when I tell people his name. Acoriano Kennels is where we got Chupa from.



Laurelin said:


> You have a fila and you have not shared any pictures yet?!


I posted a few on page 2, but here are some more recent ones. He's growing fast...


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

Well, we were having a hard time getting Chupa to be outside by himself, or with the other dogs. He just wanted to be inside with us. I had never experienced this, all our dogs LOVE the yard and even as puppies want to be out exploring with the big dogs. If anything, we have had the opposite issues - dogs/puppies wouldn't come inside when we needed them to!

So, today I took a handful of kibble and just tossed it into the yard while Chupa was out there. Well, that worked like a champ! Now he doesn't want to be inside, he's been searching the yard for food most of the day. LOL

Silly Chupa, the piggy.


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## InkedMarie (Mar 11, 2009)

RBark said:


> No experience but the ears are hilarious lol


no kidding, that's the first thing I thought, they almost look fake


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## InkedMarie (Mar 11, 2009)

BradA1878 said:


> Ok, here's *CHUPA*, our Azores Cattle Dog!


What, you asked and you already had one? I wish i lived in NM, I'd be begging for a visit!


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

InkedMarie said:


> What, you asked and you already had one? I wish i lived in NM, I'd be begging for a visit!


LOL... No, I asked and no one responded. Then I purchased one. When I asked I was thinking of getting this little guy and decided to. Then I updated this thread with pics of him.


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## InkedMarie (Mar 11, 2009)

BradA1878 said:


> LOL... No, I asked and no one responded. Then I purchased one. When I asked I was thinking of getting this little guy and decided to. Then I updated this thread with pics of him.


Oh, I thought your questions were like a tease, asking then bam! pictures!!
You have the most interesting pack of dogs I think I've ever "met"


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## FilaDeSaoMiguel (Nov 28, 2010)

I'm currently fostering a cao de fila de sao miguel. Do you have any tips? She is highly reactive to cars and small animals, and it's hard to get her to focus when outside. She is great in the house and learns very quickly.


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## TheBearCat (Jun 5, 2010)

Is there any relation to the Cimarrón Uruguayo with Azores Cattle Dog?


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## GillLivestock (Apr 11, 2010)

Sorry it took so long. This is one of our dogs, Knox, from a year ago. We are expecting puppies in March 

Hopefully I can take some more pictures of the other two dogs (Bebe, female littermate to Knox; and Tank, son of Bebe). Tank has his ears cropped, while the two females do not.


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## wildboar (Feb 24, 2011)

Hello I am looking for a breeder of these dogs in Ontario, Canada. Can I please get some contact info please. I think GillLivestock is a breeder I talked with about a year back but not sure. If I am right I have seen your dogs working in a tv program once. Very impressive. Have loved the breed ever since and think it might be time to get one.


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

www.acorianokennels.com


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## wildboar (Feb 24, 2011)

BradA1878 said:


> www.acorianokennels.com


Is this breeder not in the USA? Unless I read the contact section wrong.


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## BradA1878 (Nov 28, 2009)

They're in CAN


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## JeffGee (Apr 3, 2011)

BradA1878 said:


> There seems to be a nice range of owners on here, many with Cattle Dogs. I'm curious if any one has any experience with the Azores Cattle Dog?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I actually own one of these. Great dog, very intelligent and striking features.
It's not a breed for everyone, not a dog everyone can handle.
They are very rustic, independent and territorial.
If you have a pup, socialize the $h.t out of them, otherwise you may run into aggression towered humans and other animals.
You'll still find yourself fighting for Alpha over and over as that comes with the territory and this breed will push your limits.
They make great protection dogs and don't require a lot of attention at all.
In fact, mine prefers to be just a distance away from us, almost like watching a herd.
Their tails are cropped for herding and ears are rounded for looks.
Females are smaller than males, but I find are just as dominant.
Make sure the dog is very well socialized before inviting strangers or kids, as they see your home as their terf.
They may be cuddly and lovely at one point, but this breed is always looking for your weakness to become alpha, so have patience, work them, maintain dominance and love them unconditionally, even if they may not show that they care for it at times, the look in those deep brown intelligent eyes will show you otherwise.

Another thing is, careful around wild animals, the natural instinct to hunt will come out as they may chase rabbits, skunks, squirrels and actually turn them into food. That can all be addressed with plenty of early social behaviors and exposure.
Just remember that you own a Very rustic and unique breed!


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## Allyfally (Mar 4, 2011)

I've seen them in dog breed books before. I think they're adorable! I love the ears, they remind me of teddy bears.

And your pup is precious!! Aww, I wanna snuggle him!


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## jmop (Nov 3, 2011)

This is just my opinion:

This breed has not been bred by "show breeders" before the 80´so they are not so homogeneous as other long selected "international" breeds.

I would say the best of this dogs would be wary of strangers, allert, somewhat agressive to people and other dogs, energic, intelligent and absolutely submissive and devoted to one owner. If you *watch the video in french* the herding dog always keeps an eye on the owner. I would say this is the supposed relation to the owner.

Their main and traditional funtions are property guard and cow herders.

You can obtain data from the following sites:

SOME OF THE ORIGINAL CFSM STOCK

http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/sets/72157604715954219/show/

VIDEO IN PORTUGUESE (CFSM BREED CLUB)

http://caofilasaomiguel.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=8&Itemid=2

VIDEO IN PORTUGUESE (CFSM BREED CLUB)

http://caofilasaomiguel.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=9&Itemid=10

VIDEO IN FRENCH
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=DIO2KSIZ


Some breeders in Portugal(there are others in Portugal and in other countries):

www.azorescattledogs.com/
http://www.matadoeucalipto.com.pt/
http://www.canildapedravilaverde.com/
http://www.casadasnoveilhas.com/
http://filasdesaomiguel.webnode.com.pt/
http://www.noroestesuevo.com/
http://canilvaledapalha.no.sapo.pt/
http://www.fontedolobo.com/
http://www.montedatribo.com/filas.html
http://www.casadatorre-romaoefolque.com/C-O-DE-FILA-DE-S-O-MIGUEL

I believe some of this dogs are excellent. ( Just an opinion)


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## Muskiehunter (Jan 7, 2014)

Natural ears and tail.


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