# Tell Me About Rat Terriers



## Little Wise Owl (Nov 12, 2011)

Since CptJack convinced me to do so, I'm going to make a thread for information on this delightful breed. SO, tell me about 'em. Are they good with children/cats/other dogs? Are they incredibly high energy? Do they need a job? What sports do they excel at? What sizes do they come in? Why can't I find any good breeders in Canada? What colours do they come in? Do they have any health problems? yadda yadda. lmao


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## Little Wise Owl (Nov 12, 2011)

oh my goodness who is this dog and where can i get her


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Little Wise Owl said:


> Since CptJack convinced me to do so, I'm going to make a thread for information on this delightful breed. SO, tell me about 'em. Are they good with children/cats/other dogs? Are they incredibly high energy? Do they need a job? What sports do they excel at? What sizes do they come in? Why can't I find any good breeders in Canada? What colours do they come in? Do they have any health problems? yadda yadda. lmao


They are good with children as long as you remember they are terriers and do have teeth. :3 Merlin tolerates kids but doesn't like them. I suspect this would be different if he grew up with them. Merlin is good with cats. RTs have less prey drive than other terriers. Merlin is good with other dogs. Most Ratties are quite dog amiable. 

They are... What ever energy you want.  Mer can go all day at daycare with the big dogs, go on a hike, do some training, then crash. Or he can snooze all day. Ratties are still new on the scene but they are super biddable which makes them great agility, flyball, obedience, weight pulling, barn hunting dogs. They can actually do anything as long as they are warm. Mer would rather stay in for the day if it's snowy. 

They come in Miniature and Standard for most registries. "Working" RTs can come in a plethora of sizes. Anywhere for petite to decker. Some are like 35lbs? Merlin is at the small end of standard. His preferred weight is between 15.5-16.5lbs and he is ~13" at the shoulder. They come in black bi, blue bi, red bi, and tri color. Not many health issues as they aren't popular by any means. Breeders should probably check hearts, patellas, and hips. 

Uhhh... Here are some pretty Ratties:








Blue bi








Black bi








Red tri








Red bi








Black tri (Merlin as a teenager c


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Let me see what I can pull up to tell you:

First of all: They're nothing at all like JRT. They're softer, more biddable, and over all much more moderate dogs. They have a good off switch, they can hunt like anything but aren't bad with small livestock and they're not likely to try to eat the family cat. They aren't particularly hard-headed, though they're masters of what I can only call passive aggressive resistance to things they don't want to do (ie: "NO AND YOU CAN"T MAKE ME" is not them. "Do I HAAAAVE TO" and dragging their feet is.). They don't dig much over all. They aren't overly vocal. 

They're utilitarian farm dogs. In the south they are used as squirrel dogs, in the west they chased jack rabbits, and somewhere between they're used for HERDING, of all things. There are sight and scent hounds in their breed development, along with terriers. They are FAST, they are biddable and they are sensitive, intelligent, and well rounded. The ones I've met were all totally off leash reliable; that doesn't mean they all are. They do well on a farm and herding the livestock, yeah, but they've got a good off switch and will be just fine with an elderly owner in an apartment and getting occasional walks. They don't tend to be destructive, and they're mostly only pesty in the sense that they ooze up to you and seek attention almost all the time; they're pretty danged velcro. 

They don't play rough - they tend to play chase or ball. Wrestling isn't their thing, IME. They tend to have VERY POLITE dog manners, and IME tend to be tolerant of other dogs nonsense in spite of it. A lot of them are completely ball crazy.

As a breed they have no major health issues - they're new. You can get them from 18" standards to, I think it's 10" miniatures. There are also deckers (Giants) and toys. Deckers can be inside the standard but some are over. The tiny toy ones are under. 

If they have one negative trait it is that they tend toward (IMO) being a bit shy/high strung and that softness can be taken to an extreme. Soft and even a little stubborn can be difficult for some people. The only other thing is cold intolerance. They'v'e got a short, single coat, don't generally have a lot of body fat and freeze pretty easily. The other downside for you in particular is finding them in CA would be hard. 

But basically? Agility? OK! Obedience? Cool. Flyball? HECK YES. HIKE FOR MILES? Sure. Work on a farm? Absolutely. Spend days on end snuggling on the couch? Also perfectly cool.

The only people I would steer away from RT are people who shouldn't have a dog at all, or people who really need a dog with a harder temperament - they're pretty easily crushed/shut down by things like corrections or compulsion training.

*ETA* Oh, sports. Yeah. Whatever, they're cool. Frost has earth dog titles of some sort, Jack has his UKC weight pull title, and there are ratties tearing it up in flyball, agility, and free style. The only thing I'd be unsure about is dock diving and that's because while there are apparently RT who like to swim - I haven't met them and mine would rather be shot than go in over their toes.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

RabbleFox said:


> They are good with children as long as you remember they are terriers and do have teeth. :3 Merlin tolerates kids but doesn't like them. I suspect this would be different if he grew up with them.


I'm not so sure, actually. Jack grew up being Jr. Handled with kids in the home, and both of mine live with my kids and have been regularly exposed to my nieces and nephews. Both the dogs hate the younger kids and my autistic son. Don't get me wrong, they're not aggressive with them but they are NOT comfortable and avoid like mad. We just make sure no cornering happens and it's fine but a kid under about 12 walks in (or my autistic kid) and the dogs walk OUT. If they can't, they stand there and are okay but they'd really, really clearly rather NOT.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

CptJack said:


> I'm not so sure, actually. Jack grew up being Jr. Handled with kids in the home, and both of mine live with my kids and have been regularly exposed to my nieces and nephews. Both the dogs hate the younger kids and my autistic son. Don't get me wrong, they're not aggressive with them but they are NOT comfortable and avoid like mad. We just make sure no cornering happens and it's fine but a kid under about 12 walks in (or my autistic kid) and the dogs walk OUT.


^I agree. Most of my experience is with just Mer so I didn't want to over generalize. Merlin avoids my four year old cousin like the plague. I put him away when she is over because he isn't into her. Sometimes my 12 year old sisters friends can be overwhelming if they all crowd him. 

Something I forgot: Merlin can be very shy without me there. As a breed they are pretty shy but Merlin's is practically a fault. He doesn't like men much but I think they might just be him?

Mer is also fantastic off leash. Phew. We haven't a fenced in yard so it's nice to not really have to worry about him wandering off. Especially in the snow! Maybe double coated RTs need to be invented.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

RabbleFox said:


> ^I agree. Most of my experience is with just Mer so I didn't want to over generalize. Merlin avoids my four year old cousin like the plague. I put him away when she is over because he isn't into her. Sometimes my 12 year old sisters friends can be overwhelming if they all crowd him.
> 
> Something I forgot: Merlin can be very shy without me there. As a breed they are pretty shy but Merlin's is practically a fault. He doesn't like men much but I think they might just be him?
> 
> Mer is also fantastic off leash. Phew. We haven't a fenced in yard so it's nice to not really have to worry about him wandering off. Especially in the snow! Maybe double coated RTs need to be invented.


My dogs are pretty velcroed to my husband, so I think the men thing probably is individual. I also suspect hte issue with kids is related to being a bit soft/shy/serious. It's a lot of noise and chaos and unpredictability with little kids and that does NOT go over well with the RT I know. Apparently this isn't quite universal and some are definitely more outgoing than others, but yeah. It's a thing I've noticed. It's not like "OMG HATE MUST KILL" but more "AAACK TOO MUCH NOT COMFORTABLE."


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## Canyx (Jul 1, 2011)

Rat terriers sounds awesome but I don't think I'd ever own one. 



Little Wise Owl said:


>


NEVERMIND.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Oh. Pictures:









This dog looks so much like Jack that it's creepy.









I want this puppy.









I REALLY want this dog.

And This Breeder has some really nice eye candy.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Canyx said:


> Rat terriers sounds awesome but I don't think I'd ever own one.
> 
> 
> 
> NEVERMIND.



LOL. Yeah. Their appearance kidn of appeals to me more when you get to the bigger/blockier dogs. I prefer the speed and temperament of the ones with sighthound influence, but my next one is GOING to be someone breeding standards, exclusively, and ideally with Decker lines.

...Maybe I'll factor in a plane trip out to MO to get my next dog from Seegmillers. ...My next RT, anyway. I still want a BC.


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## Kyllobernese (Feb 5, 2008)

I had never really thought too much about Rat Terriers until my niece got one and now my sister has one. Both of them are I think it is called Pearl colored with white markings.

They are both really friendly, my sisters is a little too friendly with strange dogs sometimes. She has started her in Agility but she is a really sensitive little dog so it is going to take a while. She absolutely loves their cat, has ever since she was a puppy. Attached is a picture of her as a puppy as I do not have any recent ones.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

For reference, a Decker Rat Terrier:









If I weren't so set on a Cardi for Next!Dog... Those Deckers be handsome!


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## Melle (Aug 9, 2013)

I've always admired Rat Terriers from afar because most of the ones I see are smaller than I'd like, but now that I know that Decker's exist...

I also take to the sturdier, blockier appearance of the bigger Decker ones.


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## taquitos (Oct 18, 2012)

I really love the look of RTs.

Definitely one of my favored smaller breeds 

I wish they were more common here in Canada.

More pictures please!

Also, are they "serious" or more "goofy"?


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

taquitos said:


> Also, are they "serious" or more "goofy"?


Serious. Definitely serious. They have fun and can be HAPPY, but I've never met a goofy RT. Granted most of the ones I know come from a couple of breeders, but they're definitely not what I'd consider clowns. Dignified happy? I don't even know how to describe that, except that they tend to have an air of restraint most of the time.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Melle said:


> I've always admired Rat Terriers from afar because most of the ones I see are smaller than I'd like, but now that I know that Decker's exist...
> 
> I also take to the sturdier, blockier appearance of the bigger Decker ones.


Deckers are always standards. Standards are not always Deckers is the best way to handle that/keep it straight. It gets a little confounding but they are such. gorgeous. dogs.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

I think they are both! Meij is very serious around steamers and around other dogs. He is pleasant but distant. With me he can quite the goof. Mostly he just states at me intensely for pets. Who knew that petting could be such srs bsnss. Training him is super fun because he very, very focused and his tag wags a mile a minute. 

Ratties do it all. 









Merlin's relative. 









Flyball is vry srs bsnss. 









Obvi good at ratting. 





Rattie doing some very light herding work. The owner calls the dog off but you can see the little dog drop her head and come in to push the birdies around. I want Merlin to try it!


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## taquitos (Oct 18, 2012)

CptJack said:


> Serious. Definitely serious. They have fun and can be HAPPY, but I've never met a goofy RT. Granted most of the ones I know come from a couple of breeders, but they're definitely not what I'd consider clowns. Dignified happy? I don't even know how to describe that, except that they tend to have an air of restraint most of the time.


Awe. I guess that would be my "dealbreaker". I am much more into goofy/bubbly personalities like Aussies.

Still, they're sooo gorgeous... and so much versatility! I am surprised they're not more popular.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

taquitos said:


> Awe. I guess that would be my "dealbreaker". I am much more into goofy/bubbly personalities like Aussies.
> 
> Still, they're sooo gorgeous... and so much versatility! I am surprised they're not more popular.


They're a pretty new breed. They've been around as 'fiests' in various combinations and permutations for a while, but they've only JUST gotten AKC recognition. And in some areas they're super common - they're free on craigslist here all. the. time. It's sad.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Herding Rattie:


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

Rat terriers are super super common in texas. All my relatives have had at least one, I swear. 

I need to meet a well bred one. The ones I've met... eh. But they were all from who knows where and my relatives' dogs are usually meh.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Laurelin said:


> Rat terriers are super super common in texas. All my relatives have had at least one, I swear.
> 
> I need to meet a well bred one. The ones I've met... eh. But they were all from who knows where and my relatives' dogs are usually meh.


To be honest? I'd imagine you would find most of them, including well bred ones, pretty bland. That's not to say they are, but I can't see there being much there that you would latch onto - they're awesome dogs with great personalities, but they don't have STRONG personalities, and they're kind of a... jack of all trades, master of none type dogs. Which doesn't sound much like your thing, either.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

I imagine they'd be a world of difference from my grandma's that never got exercise ever. I did find a photo of Lulu though. Yikes she was fat.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Laurelin said:


> I imagine they'd be a world of difference from my grandma's that never got exercise ever. I did find a photo of Lulu though. Yikes she was fat.
> 
> http://i235.photobucket.com/albums/ee307/Rabastan259/May[/QUOTE]
> 
> ...


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Yeah... From what I've heard, lil' terriers go one of two ways. Skinny Minnie or fat fattie. I think being intact helps keep the weight off.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

Oh she could move. She was... hyper. She also liked to eat. A lot.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Laurelin said:


> Oh she could move. She was... hyper. She also liked to eat. A lot.


...I do not recognize a single thing there. Like, not even trying to be snarky at all but.

Jack and Frost are the opposite of hyper -though they're beautiful when they run and obviously are good at moving - and don't eat for crap because food is a chore. Lines, probably happening htere or just individual differences.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

She's probably about as badly bred as they come so totally wouldn't expect any other rattie to be like her. She was JRT-like in temperament. A little less scrappy but very similar in energy level.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

CptJack said:


> ...I do not recognize a single thing there. Like, not even trying to be snarky at all but.
> 
> Jack and Frost are the opposite of hyper -though they're beautiful when they run and obviously are good at moving - and don't eat for crap because food is a chore. Lines, probably happening htere or just individual differences.


Merlin likes to eat. But he burns it all off over the course of the day. He can eat like three cups of kibble a day without getting overly pudgy. 

His energy is more deliberate than hyper. He doesn't do spiny circles or hop into your face or act like a spazz. He is too serious to be hyper if that makes sense.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

RabbleFox said:


> Merlin likes to eat. But he burns it all off over the course of the day. He can eat like three cups of kibble a day without getting overly pudgy.
> 
> His energy is more deliberate than hyper. He doesn't do spiny circles or hop into your face or act like a spazz. He is too serious to be hyper if that makes sense.


Jack hates food. He's got a couple of treats he gets excited about but mostly food is very 'meh' for him. Frost eats well enough but he's not overly food motivated. 

Energy - I dunno, my guys are a lot like sighthounds. When they go, they GO. When they stop, they stop and it's over. Jack's over 7 now, but Frost is not quite 5. Frost is CRAZY STUPID FAST and will do a lot of running but he's not a spinning, bouncing, unfocused guy either. When he runs, he runs. When he hunts, he hunts, when he plays, he plays hard, but yeah. Deliberate and focused. Not just moving for movement's sake.


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## RabbleFox (Jan 23, 2013)

Merlin has been caught eating fish food and trying to eat little rocks as they fall off the counter. Dope. Food motivated doesn't begin to describe him. When he goes off his food, you know he is sick. Very sick. Poor bby has gastroenteritis right now and I know he getting better because his appetite is finally back. He usually eats out of his buster cube to keep him from inhaling his breakfast. 

I dunno about ball of tug drive yet. We've mostly been training with noms for right now. He doesn't play much when we are home because he is so freaking pooped from work/daycare. He's quick as anything and can jump out of the big dog's melee if he thinks they are being too pushy. He out runs many of them. He also bosses a lot of the bigger dogs around and keeps them from jumping up on me. XD Mer's nickname is "Little Boss".


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## LaneyKate (Feb 7, 2014)

I think RTs are beautiful. One of my favorite smaller dogs. That being said, I grew up with one of these magnificent beauties:









Yes, I know they are extremely different breeds, but golly I think they look alike, in a passing glance sort of way.

But I'd rather have an RT than a Basenji. Not that there's any comparison...

I would love to get to know some RTs and get to know the breed better. Might have to take up dog coat sewing up here, though! 

Thanks for the info.


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## Damon'sMom (Aug 2, 2011)

LaneyKate said:


> I think RTs are beautiful. One of my favorite smaller dogs. That being said, I grew up with one of these magnificent beauties:
> 
> View attachment 140537
> 
> ...


Basenji's are unlike any other dog breed. They are truly amazing to own and I love our little lady.


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## Little Wise Owl (Nov 12, 2011)

Wow, thanks for all the replies. I've realized this:









I really, really would love a RT now... I definitely am in love with the larger, blockier standards/deckers. Like. Oh my god.

Why did I do this to myself?

























I'm actually attracted to the idea that they're very serious and almost.. bland in comparison to what I'm typically interested in (Boston Terriers lol). I feel like it would be a good balance.

OH MY GOODNESS MAKE IT STOP. CptJack, why would you provide me with such a link? lmao


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Little Wise Owl said:


> CptJack, why would you provide me with such a link?


Because I wanted to share the misery.

And yes. They're a good combination, IMO. Bug's the life of the party, and the RT are the level heads.


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## dagwall (Mar 17, 2011)

taquitos said:


> Awe. I guess that would be my "dealbreaker". I am much more into goofy/bubbly personalities like Aussies.
> 
> Still, they're sooo gorgeous... and so much versatility! I am surprised they're not more popular.


Same with me. If they were a bit more goofy and outgoing in general I could really see enjoying a decker. They are such good looking dogs for sure but I need a decent dose of silly in my dogs.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

I must admit that if I were looking for a smaller dog (small-er, I know Deckers aren't really 'small'), RT's would probably be my go-to.


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## Jadesy (Mar 13, 2014)

That is a (not terribly good) pic of my rattie. She's 15.5 inches at the withers, currently 16#. She was maybe 13# there.

I'll get more pics up when I can find my phone. /sigh

Anywho. She's a great dog. She leaves the cats alone, is dog-friendly but not solicitous, people-friendly, but again, when out of the house, not solicitous.
She enjoys working, learning, and me, in that order. :biggrin1: 

She also enjoys stuffed toys, dog puzzles, meeting up with other Ratties at meetups, etc.


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## Kyllobernese (Feb 5, 2008)

I find with a lot of the pictures that they have a similarity to a Basenji in looks. Probably because of the short coats, colors, etc. as I would never think one was the other, but they have that same alert look to them.


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