# Bear meat/bones (raw)



## Mirzam (Jan 17, 2011)

I know it sounds gross, but is this an acceptable meat? By acceptable, I mean are there any credible, known risks in serving it. I have found a supplier and thought I might give it a go.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Sorry, there are risks. Bear carries Trichinella and since bears live in cold climates it can be a freeze resistant species/strain. Buy the meat and cook it but don't feed it raw.


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## Mirzam (Jan 17, 2011)

Thanks for your opinion.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

While overall it is a rare illness with about 12 cases per year in the US, vast majority of US cases of trichinosis come from eating undercooked wild game, mainly from bear meat. Cases from commercial pork are now very very rare.

The CDC notes:
Freeze pork less than 6 inches thick for 20 days at 5°F (-15°C) to kill any worms.
Freezing wild game meats, unlike freezing pork products, may not effectively kill all worms because some worm species that infect wild game animals are freeze-resistant.

Cooking to 160 F all the way through will kill the worms. 

Mayo Clinic notes that:

Have wild-animal meat frozen or irradiated. Irradiation will kill parasites in wild-animal meat, and deep-freezing for three weeks kills trichinella in some meats. However, trichinella in bear meat does not die by freezing, even over a long period. Neither irradiation nor freezing is necessary if you ensure that the meat is thoroughly cooked.


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## Mirzam (Jan 17, 2011)

Thanks. I knew about pork, but didn't know it about bear meat.


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## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

If I recall, there haven't been any cases of trichinosis caused by pork in quite a while. Most commercially raised pigs are kept in pretty clean environments, as they're very susceptible to disease.


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## Mirzam (Jan 17, 2011)

Thanks for replies, after mulling over this, I have decided that bear meat is probably not an ideal protein for a dog. I get the trichinosis issue, but also, a bear is a predator and definitely not a natural prey for a wolf unless they came upon a dead one. I like to keep things natural, so for my dog, a giant breed dog, I will stick to large prey animals as opposed to large predators.


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## Mesonoxian (Oct 16, 2014)

Mirzam said:


> Thanks for replies, after mulling over this, I have decided that bear meat is probably not an ideal protein for a dog. I get the trichinosis issue, but also, a bear is a predator and definitely not a natural prey for a wolf unless they came upon a dead one. I like to keep things natural, so for my dog, a giant breed dog, I will stick to large prey animals as opposed to large predators.


Good choice! Not only is the risk of trichinosis there, it is actually not a good idea to ever feed carnivore to a dog. Some people do, and their dogs do alright, but as you said, it's really not a natural prey option.


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## Luxorien (Jun 11, 2014)

Mirzam said:


> Thanks for replies, after mulling over this, I have decided that bear meat is probably not an ideal protein for a dog. I get the trichinosis issue, but also, a bear is a predator and definitely not a natural prey for a wolf unless they came upon a dead one. I like to keep things natural, so for my dog, a giant breed dog, I will stick to large prey animals as opposed to large predators.


What exactly is it about "natural" protein that makes it chemically different from any other kind?


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## Mirzam (Jan 17, 2011)

Luxorien said:


> What exactly is it about "natural" protein that makes it chemically different from any other kind?


Blech. Strawman.


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## Luxorien (Jun 11, 2014)

Mirzam said:


> Luxorien said:
> 
> 
> > What exactly is it about "natural" protein that makes it chemically different from any other kind?
> ...


I'm honestly curious what the thinking is here. It seems to me that bears would contain many of the same amino acids as other animals. What are the biochemical details behind only choosing food that a wolf would eat under wild conditions?

I hear this argument a lot, and I'm just curious about the reasoning.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

As for not eating carnivores, wild canines will readily eat carnivores but it isn't as healthy. Top level consumers have concentrated levels of pollutants compared to herbivores - such as the trich that has been discussed. Nobody mentioned bear proteins being different from wolf prey proteins!

The copying of a wolf diet is like the reasoning behind paleo diets and that sort of thing. It ends up being a really good way to eat but is worded in an emotional way rather than a 'scientific' way. I don't pretend that feeding my dogs chicken feet, ground up assorted organs and chunks of beef and pork is anything like what a wolf eats but it makes some people feel good. I put the nutrients in those raw foods into a nutrition data base and compare to what my dogs need and am satisfied with the results.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

Kathyy said:


> As for not eating carnivores, wild canines will readily eat carnivores but it isn't as healthy. Top level consumers have concentrated levels of pollutants compared to herbivores - such as the trich that has been discussed. Nobody mentioned bear proteins being different from wolf prey proteins!


That was my understanding of the main reasoning behind not feeding carnivores raw to dogs. Different (and riskier) parasites than herbivores/poultry and accumulation of contaminants. Similar to how fish higher up the food chain should be eaten less often by humans as they accumulate a lot more mercury than fish low on the food chain (i.e. fish like anchovies, sardines and chub mackerel have minimal mercury but fish like marlin, shark and swordfish are very high in mercury)

Raccoon for example can carry a non-treatable and deadly parasitical worm (which isn't just a risk from being fed as a meat to dogs but from the raccoon feces too)


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## Luxorien (Jun 11, 2014)

I see. I thought the issue was with their nutritional value, but it sounds like what you are saying is that those types of organisms are just more likely to carry toxins or diseases. Makes a lot more sense. Thanks for the info.


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## KuroSaya (Jun 3, 2011)

One thing about feeding bear is to avoid the liver as it is too high in vitamin A or something like that.. I know people who feed coyote, fox, raccoons.. I don't think I could do that.


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## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

KuroSaya said:


> One thing about feeding bear is to avoid the liver as it is too high in vitamin A or something like that.. I know people who feed coyote, fox, raccoons.. I don't think I could do that.


All liver is high in Vitamin A.


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## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

KuroSaya said:


> One thing about feeding bear is to avoid the liver as it is too high in vitamin A or something like that.. I know people who feed coyote, fox, raccoons.. I don't think I could do that.


All liver is high in Vitamin A.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

gingerkid said:


> All liver is high in Vitamin A.


But some is higher than others. Polar bear and seals particularly. An ounce of polar bear liver is 100,000 IU of Vit A (or about 5 times the toxic human dose) while an ounce of beef liver is 7,400 IU and an ounce of chicken liver is only 1,420 IU Vitamin A.

I couldn't find a reference to black bear liver since my source was USDA nutrient database


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Oddly turkey liver is also extremely high in vitamin A at over 20,000IU per ounce. Why? I bought a lot of ostrich liver, sure hope it isn't like turkey liver!

The liver of polar carnivores has enough vitamin A to outright kill. Eating such stuff is considered to be one of the reasons some polar expeditions failed.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

Kathyy said:


> Oddly turkey liver is also extremely high in vitamin A at over 20,000IU per ounce. Why? I bought a lot of ostrich liver, sure hope it isn't like turkey liver!
> 
> The liver of polar carnivores has enough vitamin A to outright kill. Eating such stuff is considered to be one of the reasons some polar expeditions failed.


Oddly, the only nutritional reference for raw ostrich liver that I could find show NO Vitamin A. Which doesn't make much sense.

http://skipthepie.org/poultry-products/ostrich-oyster-raw/compared-to/chicken-liver-all-classes-raw/

Polar bear liver is so high in A at least in part because seal liver is very high in A and they eat so much seal so it just accumulates; my understanding is that carnivore livers are for the most part higher in Vit A than herbivore livers because of the accumulation factor.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

And seals eat fish and fish eat other fish and so on. Takes a while to get down to the herbivores in the arctic!

I was hoping you had found something with better info on ostrich cuts but the oyster isn't the liver. If it is analogous to chickens the oyster is the oval muscle on the outside of the pelvis.


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## Shell (Oct 19, 2009)

Kathyy said:


> And seals eat fish and fish eat other fish and so on. Takes a while to get down to the herbivores in the arctic!
> 
> I was hoping you had found something with better info on ostrich cuts but the oyster isn't the liver. If it is analogous to chickens the oyster is the oval muscle on the outside of the pelvis.


You're right, I had overlooked that it wasn't comparing liver to liver.

I did find this interesting quote from the World Ostrich Association 
"Many, if not all, slaughter plants that have slaughtered ostrich will be able to report extremely variable liver conditions - more variable than is commonly seen in mainstream livestock specie. "


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## JohnnyBandit (Sep 19, 2008)

Bears aside from Polar bears are not so much carnivores as opportunistic omnivores.. ...


I have readily fed bear meat and will again if the opportunity arises 

I also feed a LOT of wild/feral pork.....

Only thing I do with wild pork and bear when I have had it, is to freeze it for at least 3 months.....


That being said, when I was running hogs with dogs my dogs ate wild pork as I was cleaning the animal...


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