# Usual puppy problems: pee and crying



## Iamche (Feb 1, 2010)

I need advice!

I have a 14 week old puppy cross (father half berner senna, half freise stabij, mother unknown mix!) We have had him since he was just eight weeks old. We ignore him when he cries or barks and he knows that to get attention he needs to lie/sit quietly. 

He's intelligent, happy, lively and friendly. He is not afraid of anything and is quite independent. 

We live in an apartment on the fifth floor. The dog sleeps in a crate at night and the crate is open all day and he wanders in there during the day to sleep or chew his toys.

We have trained him to pee out side and take him out every 4-5 hours, except at night and he as no issues with peeing outside: it's the first thing he does as soon as he gets onto the street.

He generally does not have accidents in the house unless we've been lax and not taken him out for a very long time (perhaps once a week). He has not pooped in the house for at least a month and can hold this in for an extremely long time (12 hrs plus!). 

However, he is consistently peeing in his cage during the night and almost every time I leave him in the house alone (never more than four hours at a time).

We go to bed late so he's taken outside around 2am, sometimes 4am, and I get up again at 8am when he starts to whine, by which time he has usually already soiled the cage and is covered in pee. 

How can I stop him doing this? He should be able to hold for 6 hours already right? 

I control his water intake after about 8pm. I have been told to take him outside during the night but as I live on the fifth floor and there's no lift and we do take him out late anyway, this is not an option.

I thought about making the cage smaller so it contains only his bed but I think he'll just pee in his bed or squeal so much the neighbors will think I am hurting him.

I am going crazy with all the cleaning and washing of his bedding and toys every day. And the smell too. And because I know he knows that he should pee outside. 

I have even tried the 'odor neutralizer spray' to clean out his cage but this just made him pee even more (and pretty much continuously in his cage). What luck is that that it has the opposite effect!!! 

My second issue is that he is waking us up earlier and earlier in the mornings with his whining (used to be 8:30, now it starts around 7:45) and I am starting to wonder if it's the daylight or if he realises that I get up in the morning and let him out of the cage and is whining so he can get out. The neighbours have complained already so I am desperate to stop this as soon as possible.

Wow, an essay! Please help. I'm running out of ideas!


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## Robrowe (Jan 25, 2010)

14 weeks is still very young and not ready for extended periods of not eliminating. Sound like you have a hectic schedule that is not benificial for the puppy. They need structure of the same feeding times and waking, potty breaks etc. I wouldnt even think he would be ready to go all night for at least another month on a structured schedule. The prescense or absense of a lift and living on the 5th floor has nothing to do with puppy but rather a decision that must be weighed before getting a dog on whether or not you are willing to go up and down the steps multiple times and in the middle of the night if necessary. If they are making it most of the time and only eliminating in the crate in the middle of the night I dont think its a space problem although the space in the crate should only be large enough for the puppy to turn around and lay down. You have to be prepared to flex to the puppies schedule until its several months old and able to exhibit more control. My lab is 7 months old now and I dont need an alarm clock to get up. his schedule is extremely regular. Out like a light at 10PM and waking me up at 6AM. It takes time and is much like having a infant/toddler. If you keep him on a regular schedule he will be solidly on it by 6 months of age but you have to be prepared to take him out when he needs to go regardless of what time it is.


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## Iamche (Feb 1, 2010)

Thanks for your reply. Yes we do have an irregular schedule but the puppy is generally fed and walked around the same times each day. Our schedule is never going to be regular so I thought it would be best to make sure the puppy is used to this from a young age. 

The crate is quite large but he's not only peeing in there at night; he pees in there when left alone too. But, he does not pee in the crate when we are in the house with him. 

Taking the dog out in the middle of the night is hard work but as you say, it has to be done. The problem is that he usually pees THEN whines because he is in a pool of urine. 

If he whines and I get up to let him out, take him downstairs and let him pee, isn't he going to associate the whining with me taking him outside. Of course I would put him straight back in the crate but already the act of getting up and down the stairs is going to mean he'll be out and about for at least 15 mins.

He is happy to go in his crate during the day and does not care if we close the door when he is sleeping. But if we put him in there when, for example, we eat our dinner, he whines and whines and whines. We have *never* let him out of the crate while whining which is why I am hesitant to let him out in the middle of the night...


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## katiemay (Jan 30, 2010)

If he's only whining at night when he needs to go out - there's no problem with taking him out of the crate. If he's whining continuously through out the night you need to start waking up ( by alarm ) to take him out regularly and put him straight back in his crate when done.

Dogs do not like to soil where they eat or sleep, they will hold it for as long as possible to avoid it. The general rule of thumb to take a puppy out - however many months old, plus one hour. So for a 3 month old, you would need to take it out every 4 hours. So every 4 hours throughout the day and you can generally draw it out at night since they are sleeping ( every 5-6 hours ). He will eventually be able to hold it all night, you just have to have patience and be willing to get up at all hours of the night.


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## Robrowe (Jan 25, 2010)

It does take a lot of time and there is nothing wrong with him whining to go out and associate that with going out to eliminate. I actually had to teach my dog that to let me know when he has to go. This is the only time he is allowed to bark or whine.

Reducing his room in the crate should stop him from going in the crate. Leave him just enough room to get in there and trun around and lay down, no more. Its quite common to hear stories of puppys in large crates going to the back of it to eliminate then coming back to the front. As stated if reduction in size doesnt do it then try and estimate when he will need to go and set the alram to get up and take him out before he goes in the crate. The secret to potty training is not waiting for him to go but having him where he needs to be when it is time to go. If tou watch a bit you will figure out his schedule and how long he takes to go after he has eaten etc. Its not easy work in the beginning but if you persist the puppy will become potty trained much faster and before you know it you will b able to sleep all night.
I can also offer that the daylight will trigger them to get up even if you want to sleep in. On the rare occasions when my pup is up past his bed time because of house guests etc he may not get up at the normal 6AM but as soon as the light through yon window breaks he is up! Now granted when he does do this I can usually get up and take him out then return to bed with no issues, but this is only when he went to bed late and didnt get enough beauty sleep. Raising a puppy properly does consume a great deal of your time but when you are done you get it back ten fold with a dog that is a pleasure to be around and unconditional love and the best friend you will ever have. My yellow lab goes with me pretty much everywhere except the places he cant go. Soemtimes I have to be careful when I stop as he is following me so closely Im afrid Ill end up with a chocolate lab LOL.


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## Iamche (Feb 1, 2010)

So, I made some alterations to the crate, took him out at 10pm, 2am and again at 8am as soon as he started to whine. The crate is still dry 

Is covering his crate at night so he does not know it is morning an option? I can deal with getting up at 8am but soon it's going to be light at 4:45 and that's going to kill me . 

Thanks for all your advice!


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## Robrowe (Jan 25, 2010)

Iamche said:


> So, I made some alterations to the crate, took him out at 10pm, 2am and again at 8am as soon as he started to whine. The crate is still dry
> 
> Is covering his crate at night so he does not know it is morning an option? I can deal with getting up at 8am but soon it's going to be light at 4:45 and that's going to kill me .
> 
> Thanks for all your advice!


Covering crate is OK so long as he still gets ventilation and wont get hot. With winter coats coming in or already in overheating can be an issue.

Nice to hear he still has a dry bed!


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## Trixie (Feb 27, 2008)

Even if you cover the crate, they "know" what time it is. Dogs seem to have an internal clock that works no matter how light or dark it is!

Well, at least mine does.


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## Iamche (Feb 1, 2010)

Thanks for all your advice. 

So after two days of not peeing in the crate, the dog started to pee in the mornings again. I don't understand it because if we are around he can easily go 6 hours without peeing, sometimes 8. He never pees in the house (except occasional excitement 'leaks'), and only pees in the crate if he is locked in there.

For example, last night he went out at 10pm, at 4:00am and by 8am he'd peed in the cage. He had not eaten or drunk anything since 8pm!

Is it habit?
Is it attention seeking?
Is it because he associates peeing with getting out of the cage (of course I let him out to clean it).

What am I going to do?!

PS I have tried covering the cage at night: it doesn't work!


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## doggal (Jan 26, 2010)

I highly doubt it's a urination issue. 14 month olds can easily hold it for many hours. I have never had a pup over 10 weeks who couldn't hold it from 11:00 pm to 6:00am. Barring any medical reason, this sounds behavorial to me. That you keep letting him out throughout the night and he still goes, suggests he's got you trained to do what he wants and let him out of the crate. Also he's getting the picture that he can whine and get up earlier and maybe that will spring him free too. And if he's going when you leave him alone, could be separation anxiety as well.
Dogs thrive on regimen and his structure is shot with being let out so often.
You may have to restrict the cage space and bite the bullet for awhile by refusing to let him out overnight.


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## Iamche (Feb 1, 2010)

Doggal, he's 15 *weeks* old now. 

As my boyfriend goes to bed very late and is up in the same room as puppy until he goes to bed, he is not usually locked into the cage until about 4am, after his middle of the night pee break (boyf takes him out before he goes to bed). 

So he only gets let out of the cage when I get up in the morning at 8ish when he whines and therefore he only spends around 4 hours in the crate at night (yeah, I know, our lives are crazy!)

He *sometimes* goes when we leave the house but it's not consistent so I don't know if it's separation anxiety or not. He doesn't howl when we depart (but that's because we distract him with treats in the cage). 

Tonight I'm going to shrink the cage space and see if this works. But I am worried about doing this when I am not in the house as I won't be able to hear his cries and let him out. If I am not here, he will just end up peeing in his bed won't he?

Aye, the life of a new puppy owner


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