# Susan Garrett's Recallers online course



## DaySleepers (Apr 9, 2011)

I'm considering trying this course out when it opens in the spring. I've seen a lot of positive feedback floating around, and was wondering if anyone here has done it/plans to do it? For me, a lot will depend on the price levels she's offering, since it doesn't look like I'll know that until the course opens. And on what my tax rebate is this year, haha.

I do need to work on recall, but I also love that this course seems to work a lot on impulse control and focus. And I tend to need more structure to really be motivated to work regularly on training, at least for the time being, so I hope it'll be a good fit for me. Not a lot of trainers I'm terribly impressed with, in this area.


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## trainingjunkie (Feb 10, 2010)

I took it. Send me a private message if you want specific details!

Overall: It was a really good class. But it was REALLY expensive. Most of the people I know who have taken he class didn't really keep up. And all of them talk about how expensive it was.

Really cool progression of exercises though. And if you do the work, you will reap the rewards.


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## DaySleepers (Apr 9, 2011)

PMed you!

I'm hoping the cost will be comparable to an in-person lesson, especially given that I'd likely have to travel an hour or so to find someone running a comparable class. Seems like every trainer I've found online focuses on dominance theory, correction collars, or only does private sessions to work on specific issues, when I really want a nice foundations course.

The timing's also going to play a part. I'll hypothetically be getting an update on my visa application at the end of May, so if the course starts too late in the spring we may have to put it off in case I need to focus on packing and moving.


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## lil_fuzzy (Aug 16, 2010)

I've been through it twice. It's so worth it, it completely changed how I train my dogs and my dogs are amazing now. It's not just about training a great recall, but about a whole new framework for training dogs which you can apply to all of your training.

Also, the cost isn't that high when you think about it. I've attended 2 day dog training seminars and ended up paying more than the price of Recallers, with travel and hotel etc. Recallers isn't just like any 8 week class where you attend for an hour per week. It's 5 lessons per week, plus bonus ebooks on various topics such as distraction work, access to experienced staff, coaching calls, the chat/forum where you can ask questions and get an answer any time of day, etc. 

Going through Recallers was probably the best decision I ever made for me and my dogs.


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## trainingjunkie (Feb 10, 2010)

The crucial thing that determines if the class is worth it is a person's willingness to consistently do the work. If you keep up and you do the work, you will LOVE the class. If you watch the videos and fall behind, you will not get everything out of the class that you ought to.

The class really is brilliant. The people that do the work ADORE the results.

Even though I say it was expensive (it was!) it really was a great class and I have looked at taking it again with my new dog. The class gives you a framework and a motivation that is hard to maintain when training alone.

I sent a PM too. I don't disagree with lil-fuzzy at all. On anything. But I was from the "fell behind and needed more discipline" camp. And that's on me, not Recallers.


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## jade5280 (Feb 20, 2013)

The course looks interesting. Do you think it would work on dogs with no toy drive?


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## trainingjunkie (Feb 10, 2010)

Yes. As long as you have food drive. Or "something" drive.

She will help you with drive and toy drive too. As a bonus.


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## Nissa M (Nov 3, 2014)

Hi all. DaySleepers, I've signed up (?) and am on the waiting list for the next session as well. Not sure when it starts, sometime this spring I think? Thanks for putting this to the forum, these responses have been great. Maybe we'll see you in there! I am somewhat concerned about the cost, though. training junkie + lil_fuzzy, what exactly is really expensive? Are you allowed to say?


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Really expensive = around a grand. Not sure why people are dancing around saying that. Also the price MAY be higher now. I looked at it a while back and then just didn't. Way too much for me, frankly, given that my dogs have reliable recalls already. I don't care how many lessons in a day that is. I could hire an in person trainer, in my area, to work with me personally and privately, for something like 20 hours for that price.

40 actually, for dogs without serious issues.


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## jade5280 (Feb 20, 2013)

CptJack said:


> Really expensive = around a grand. Not sure why people are dancing around saying that.


 OMG. What. Geez Louise....


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

jade5280 said:


> OMG. What. Geez Louise....


Yeah, I was editing. I'm absolutely sure it's worth it for some people but for me? LOL, NO. It is a great program. People love it. But as I edited in, I can get 40 hours of private, in person, training help for that here. Or 20 if it's a complicated issue/temperamental issue instead of just training behavior. Or, um. 14 group classes (at 7 classes per session each, so 98 individual group classes). Or rent an agility field for 30 hours. 

So again: Lol, no. Not for any online course.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

ETA: I'm coming back to say that the price I am remembering is not exactly universal. Apparently there are lower levels from somewhere in the neighborhood of 300+

But again, for no support/interaction at that level I'm still firmly in the no camp. It's better than the grand plus, though. Just still WAY out of line with other online courses who offer various levels.


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## jade5280 (Feb 20, 2013)

I'm going to a 2 day all day training clinic that provides food for $200. I'm not sure I would want to pay any more than that for an online training class. A leash costs me around $10 so I guess I'll stick with that for now lol.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

jade5280 said:


> I'm going to a 2 day all day training clinic that provides food for $200. I'm not sure I would want to pay any more than that for an online training class. A leash costs me around $10 so I guess I'll stick with that for now lol.


Yeah. I mean like I said, to each their own. There are definitely people who are all over it and I can understand that the course has great results but I am firmly in the camp of "no." I can just do a lot more stuff with more personal presence and support for that money. I don't do well with online courses though, so that is also a factor.

Just um, not the only one. The big one is 'wtf no'. For me. And my money. 

(And yes, we did an all day training workshop with food for 75.00. So yeah.)


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## Nissa M (Nov 3, 2014)

No kidding! That is expensive, alright. Going to sleep on this one.


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## lil_fuzzy (Aug 16, 2010)

The starting level was $200 last time I did it, then another 2 levels of membership which were $400 and $1500 (?). The latter included a membership in the Inner Circle I believe. I think these days it starts at $397.

There is plenty of support. You can comment on each lesson and people who have been through it before or the experienced staff will answer. You can also go to the General Questions area to ask questions. I always got multiple great replies whenever I asked questions, and Susan Garrett also gets on there to answer a lot of questions.

And there's the coaching calls with Susan Garret and Lynda Orton-Hill where you can submit questions and they will answer them and do dog demos live (recorded version available for people who don't make it to the live version).


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## DaySleepers (Apr 9, 2011)

Haha, yeah, no, I never had any intention of buying in at the $1k+ level. That's at least 2/3 of my monthly income. But I'm considering it if she has a level <$500, I think. To put it in perspective, in my area I've found ONE class that's anything close to what I'm interested in (basic obedience). It starts at $300, for six lessons. And I'd have to be comfortable working with trainers who focus a lot on leash corrections. Either I just don't live in an area with a lot of options for dog sports, or I'm not 'in the know' when it comes to finding classes. I could drive into Boston, but that comes with its own issues. Mainly that Sam still does poorly on long car trips, and I'm just not convinced he'll learn much if each lesson is preceded by a 45 min/hour drive.

I tooootally get why it wouldn't be a great option for other people, though. And I'm super jealous of everyone who has awesome classes and facilities available locally. I like that Recallers would give me a chance to really work on foundation skills like focus and impulse control in a structured environment. And if I'm going to do it, now's probably the time, while I still have an income and the advantage of low cost of living expenses. As much as I wish I didn't have to live with my parents, it does give me more flexibility for the time being. Once I move, my fiancee will be supporting us on one income for months, if not years, depending on how things go.

At least she's found some awesome local dog clubs for once we do get there, so I'll have local options again!

Sorry if I'm rambling, just trying to make a decision on this. In the end, I'm just going to have to wait for enrollment to open and see what the offers are, I think.


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## Silly Dog (Mar 3, 2015)

Just curious, what is the course content? Anything that is unique and original and couldn't be learned from tthe many other sources of info about recall training?

ETA: Best of luck with the course, and I'm curious to hear about it if you take it.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

Honestly I know people rave about it and such. I've had friends take the course. I can't pony up that much for an online course and the price tag just makes me think it is kind of hokey.

The people I know that have done it have liked it. But for that much I can take like 3 Fenzi courses so.....

The $1500 level is like two years of agility classes here and that's assuming no breaks at all and meeting every single week.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

DaySleepers said:


> Haha, yeah, no, I never had any intention of buying in at the $1k+ level. That's at least 2/3 of my monthly income. But I'm considering it if she has a level <$500, I think. To put it in perspective, in my area I've found ONE class that's anything close to what I'm interested in (basic obedience). It starts at $300, for six lessons. And I'd have to be comfortable working with trainers who focus a lot on leash corrections. Either I just don't live in an area with a lot of options for dog sports, or I'm not 'in the know' when it comes to finding classes. I could drive into Boston, but that comes with its own issues. Mainly that Sam still does poorly on long car trips, and I'm just not convinced he'll learn much if each lesson is preceded by a 45 min/hour drive.
> 
> I tooootally get why it wouldn't be a great option for other people, though. And I'm super jealous of everyone who has awesome classes and facilities available locally. I like that Recallers would give me a chance to really work on foundation skills like focus and impulse control in a structured environment. And if I'm going to do it, now's probably the time, while I still have an income and the advantage of low cost of living expenses. As much as I wish I didn't have to live with my parents, it does give me more flexibility for the time being. Once I move, my fiancee will be supporting us on one income for months, if not years, depending on how things go.
> 
> ...


There are other online classes out there too to look into. Agility U, Fenzi Dog Sport Academy, Silvia Trkman does agility classes too. I think Daisy Peel does as well? I'm sure there's many many more. Don't know all their prices but a bronze (lowest level) Fenzi course is around $65. And they offer courses in scentwork, obedience, rally, agility, IPO, canine fitness and foundation stuff. 

Not saying dont' do the SG one. I know a lot of people that adored it. But just wanted to let you know of other options!


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## trainingjunkie (Feb 10, 2010)

I'm such a dog geek. I have taken countless on-line courses from many different places. Recallers IS unique and different. It is so systematic and it targets only the recall and the pieces that must fall in place to support it.

It's way expensive when compared to other classes, but it IS unique. 

I haven't looked seriously at another S.G. class since Recallers. I have been super happy with the Fenzi Academy. But I want to give Recallers it's due. It was special and different.


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## DaySleepers (Apr 9, 2011)

Thanks, Laurelin! I've had a couple of those on my radar, and I'll definitely keep them in mind when I make my final decision. Just have to wait to see what this year's prices are! In the meantime, I'll add a few more options to my bookmarks, I think.


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## lil_fuzzy (Aug 16, 2010)

trainingjunkie said:


> I'm such a dog geek. I have taken countless on-line courses from many different places. Recallers IS unique and different. It is so systematic and it targets only the recall and the pieces that must fall in place to support it.
> 
> It's way expensive when compared to other classes, but it IS unique.
> 
> I haven't looked seriously at another S.G. class since Recallers. I have been super happy with the Fenzi Academy. But I want to give Recallers it's due. It was special and different.


Agreed, it is unique.

I've done classes at Fenzi Academy and looked at some of Silvia Trkman's stuff too. They are great to get into training, but if you know a bit about training, they kind of seem really basic. I've stopped taking classes at Fenzi because they didn't bring anything to the table.

SG's way of training is like shaping on steroids. It's much faster than the average clicker training videos you find when digging around the internet, and it's all game based.

I must be the only one who doesn't think the price is that bad. I've attended 2 day workshops and seminars with other trainers, and paid $200-250 for two 8 hour days. For $400 on Recallers, you get 5 lessons per week for 8 weeks, plus support, plus ebooks, plus coaching calls, plus the community of like-minded dog owners, and access to the lessons for 6-12 months.

I get that it's too much for some, and not right for others, but to call it hokey is just wrong. It's a great class with unique content.


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## Finkie_Mom (Mar 2, 2010)

Took it and loved it. It has benefitted my own dogs and dogs that I train so much. And though I didn't ask many questions during the course of the 6 months (it's open for 6 months so you can do it at your own pace), the ones I did ask were met with great feedback/answers and it was nice to read some of the questions/comments that may have brought up things I had not thought of. My dogs are not toy motivated so some of it was different for me and it was nice to hear from people who had dogs with tons of toy drive - in turn, I was able to take some of the knowledge gained from those conversations and apply it to the search dogs I worked with (they are all pretty toy crazy!). It was around $400 and I think totally worth it. Not planning on taking it this year or anything (I don't think it changes that much from year to year) but maybe next time I get a puppy I will do it again. I should also mention that I am good at keeping up with online courses - I even printed out the sheets and wrote comments in every day!


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

Personally I think I 'know a bit about training' and still have gotten a lot out of my Fenzi classes. Nothing revolutionary as far as training methods go but a lot of good stuff for the sports I participate in. I have not taken any foundations courses there yet and have only done courses catered to a specific sport. 

Maybe hokey was a bad word choice. I find her marketing style off putting. Is that better? I use some of her other stuff- crate games and 2x2s. I just kind of find her off putting in general even when her stuff is good.

Maybe I will check it out. Everyone I know raves about it.


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## elrohwen (Nov 10, 2011)

I agree with Laurelin that if what you're really looking for is just positive training classes you can do online, there are much cheaper options than recallers. I love Fenzi classes!

I have seen some of the content for recallers and while the games are cool and it seems like a great program, I don't see it being worth the money, at all. Especially if you've never done an online dog training class and don't know that you'll stick with it and really do the work. 

And as far as Fenzi courses being too basic, I disagree. They are basic for agility, but a lot of the obedience stuff goes up to quite a high level as far as heeling and skill building. There are also classes geared towards preparing for trialing. I don't think those are basic skills at all. Yes, there are foundation classes and shaping classes and things, but there are a lot of sport specific classes that work at a higher level. From what I've seen of the Recallers game a lot of those seem quite basic and foundational - not that there's anything wrong with that, I just don't think it's accurate to say that Fenzi classes are basic and Recallers is training at a higher level.

I also have to agree with Laurelin about not liking SG's style. I'll read her blogs or watch videos here and there, but I don't think I could deal with her over the top marketing and catch phrases for 6 months.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

elrohwen said:


> I don't think I could deal with her over the top marketing and catch phrases for 6 months.


This is my really fundamental issue with it. I mean no criticism for the woman - she has had great success and I am sure her methods work - but watching even her available training videos and reading her blog it's like watching an infomercial, every time. I don't need my dog training to come from someone who reminds of me of the ShamWow! guy.

(And yes, I realize she actually is trying to sell me dog classes and her trademarked methods in most of the things I've seen but it just *grates*.)


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## kadylady (Sep 23, 2010)

I have a friend who has taken it and raves about the course and it has worked great for her and her dogs. My agility instructor took in person classes with Susan and a lot of her training style comes from her time spent with Susan. This class is on my "wish list". The stuff of Susan's that I have done (crate games and 2x2's) I have been so impressed by. For me it will really come down to a combination of price, timing and training priorities at that time. Do I think it's a bit pricey? Sure, absolutely. But it's Susan Garrett! Direct access to any highly successful and popular trainer is going to come at a high cost. I see it as a you get what you pay for type situation. That being said, she's not going to be the right person for everyone, which is fine, you should spend your money on the person(s) that work best for you and your dog. And it's great that there are so many options to choose from. I was just kind of eh about her until I watched the crate games dvd. I really wasn't expecting to be impressed by something I originally thought would be "simple exercises" but the DVD really impressed me and I learned a whole lot more from it than I thought I would. I've also gotten about halfway through her Shaping book and am also very impressed by that. I would say if you are thinking about the class but not sure about it, pick up some of her materials and go through them to get an idea of who she is as a trainer and see if you think it's a good fit for you.

I have to agree with Laurelin and elrohwen on the Fenzi courses. I definitely wouldn't label them as a whole as "basic". Sure some of the foundation classes cover "basic" exercises but the in depth on the hows and whys really takes it all to another level, IMO. Then there's the sport specific skills classes and the ring prep and polishing and so on...it goes to such an in depth and high level.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

elrohwen said:


> And as far as Fenzi courses being too basic, I disagree. They are basic for agility, but a lot of the obedience stuff goes up to quite a high level as far as heeling and skill building. There are also classes geared towards preparing for trialing. I don't think those are basic skills at all. Yes, there are foundation classes and shaping classes and things, but there are a lot of sport specific classes that work at a higher level. From what I've seen of the Recallers game a lot of those seem quite basic and foundational - not that there's anything wrong with that, I just don't think it's accurate to say that Fenzi classes are basic and Recallers is training at a higher level.


It is important to note that the Fenzi agility school is still pretty new. I've known a couple of the gold students from my classes and they've been very successful and competitive agility folk (It's always fun when you see a dog you know from RL on there!). And the trainers for agility (that I've seen) are all very highly successful people. 

The advanced nosework also covers a lot of less basic things like doing searches of empty areas, multiple hides, NASCW rules and such for the upper levels of the sport, etc. 

For $65 I feel like they've been very worth it. The agility especially really gives me some set exercises to work with my dogs.



> I also have to agree with Laurelin about not liking SG's style. I'll read her blogs or watch videos here and there, but I don't think I could deal with her over the top marketing and catch phrases for 6 months.


Haha yes. That is all I was trying to say. 

I know my trainers have done a lot of SG and such and we incorporate a lot of her stuff in our every day agility training. It's funny watching the testimonials videos a lot of what I see is games I already knew about and use. I'm sure there's a LOT more to it but it's interesting to me. I didn't realize they were 'recallers games'.


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## lil_fuzzy (Aug 16, 2010)

Back when I first did Recallers (2011 I think), there weren't a whole lot of online dog training classes around, at least not well-known ones. Recallers was the first one I knew of, and everyone loved it, so I decided to try it.

Then later on I did some other classes. I have done various classes at Fenzi, with different trainers. Denise Fenzi herself seems like a really good trainer, and I do like her classes and agree they are not all basic. But some of the classes I did with some of the other trainers on there were just excruciating because they would only appeal to people who had never trained a dog before. And they were classes I took because people I knew recommended them and said they learnt a lot, so I wasn't very happy with those.

With the classes I've taken at Fenzi and Lolabuland, I don't really learn anything. There are some new tricks for teaching stuff that I haven't seen before, but nothing extraordinary. It's stuff that I could have thought of myself if I had had trouble teaching those specific things. But when I do classes with SG and listen to her coaching calls etc, I learn loads of new stuff every single time. New techniques, new ways to troubleshoot, new terminology, old terminology I never knew. Every coaching call and class is an eye-opener. 

I agree with not liking SG's marketing style. It's very intense and salesy. I guess because I already know her stuff is good, it doesn't bother me because I would sign up anyway.


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## elrohwen (Nov 10, 2011)

I do think she's a really innovative trainer and has come up with a lot of great methods and games. I'll admit that I didn't finish crate games because it seemed too basic, but I should go back to it when I get a new puppy. But I have liked and used a lot of her stuff and do read her blog.

But like CptJack said, I think her videos come off as infomercials a lot of the time and it bugs me. There's more talking about catch phrases than actual training demos sometimes. Also in the videos that I've watched, it seems like she always uses her own dogs as demos, and of course they are awesome and perfect and have crazy toy drive, which isn't very helpful to most people without BCs (or people whose dogs aren't already well trained with great foundations). 

I've found it very very helpful to watch Denise work with her two young dogs - one of which is high drive but struggles with the environment, and one is a little terrier with lower drive and and independent streak. Hearing about the things she has tried, what worked and what didn't, etc has been way more helpful than watching someone with perfectly trained dogs demonstrate the finished behavior. That's not necessarily a critique of SG, but of a lot of online training stuff.

ETA: And I do agree that some of the Fenzi classes have been disappointing for what I expected, but most have been really good. I also find that people online tend to say "oh this class was so great a learned a million things!" and then I take it and learn very little, so it's hard to really judge what a class is like. But then I get the same feeling with Recallers, where everybody says it's great, but now that I don't trust most people's reviews I don't know what to believe. Haha. I'm willing to take a chance on a class for $65, but not for $300-400, you know?


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

Crate games worked really really well with Hank. Not so well with the papillons. The dog in the video was so calm and the paps were so wild and bouncy and crazy. I did get pretty frustrated at points because my dogs just were nothing like the demo dog.

2x2s also are pretty hard without toy drive imo. Much much easier with a dog like Hank than the papillons.


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## kadylady (Sep 23, 2010)

Laurelin said:


> Crate games worked really really well with Hank. Not so well with the papillons. The dog in the video was so calm and the paps were so wild and bouncy and crazy. I did get pretty frustrated at points because my dogs just were nothing like the demo dog.


Yes I do remember the very first dog in the video was just like sitting there nice and quiet and calm in the crate and I was like um....how is this going to help my puppy who screams her fool head off in the crate??? But it did. Crate games was fantastic for Skye. And not just the crate thing, but the impulse control thing...huge!


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## elrohwen (Nov 10, 2011)

I guess the reason I didn't get much out of Crate Games is that it's really easy to train Watson to go in his crate, be excited about it, etc etc. But when you leave, he still gets upset. It's the being alone that's upsetting to him, not so much the crate, and it's not designed to help with that. So I got frustrated that all of the stuff I watched were things he could already do, but he was still horrible in the crate when we left. Not a fault of Crate Games though.


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## jade5280 (Feb 20, 2013)

elrohwen said:


> I guess the reason I didn't get much out of Crate Games is that it's really easy to train Watson to go in his crate, be excited about it, etc etc. But when you leave, he still gets upset. It's the being alone that's upsetting to him, not so much the crate, and it's not designed to help with that. So I got frustrated that all of the stuff I watched were things he could already do, but he was still horrible in the crate when we left. Not a fault of Crate Games though.


Ryker was the same. He was fine with the crate and would go in there on his own free will and even slept in the crate when we were gone. I can put him in the crate and close the door when we are home and he won't make a peep. As soon as I would leave all hell would break loose and he would bite, scratch, and chew at the crate so I stopped closing the door when I left, it didn't help but at least he wouldn't hurt himself on the crate. I think that's an entirely different issue because it's SA and it's so much harder to work with that just acclimating the dog to a crate. 

It's hard for me to follow training lessons when my dog doesn't act the same way that the trainer's dog does.


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## Finkie_Mom (Mar 2, 2010)

I guess that's the other thing, then. My dogs are in no way close to like anyone's demo dogs HAHAHA. So I'm used to changing things around to meet my dogs' needs pretty regularly. I also didn't think the whole thing was too "salesy" once you were in it at all - until it came time to have people join the Inner Circle or whatever for like $1500, I didn't hear much of anything on that front. And even then it was a few emails that I just deleted 

I use 2x2 method with my guys and they are in no way toy motivated. I just throw food/a treat pouch 

I've gotten some good stuff out of Fenzi classes, too. I'm more about what I think will make a difference in my dogs/help with clients who have similar issues than one online training thing versus another. No one way is the end all be all for sure (not that I think anyone here is saying that!).


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## lil_fuzzy (Aug 16, 2010)

She does demo a lot of stuff with her own dogs, but I have seen her work with many other dogs too. I went to her workshop here in Brisbane in 2013, where she worked with all kinds of different breeds, and each dog had its own issues and SG instantly came up with an individual fix for each dog. Usually before Recallers starts, there is a video competition for previous participants in which they show with video how Recallers helped them and their dogs. You can easily find them by searching on Youtube, and all different breeds and issues are represented in those videos.

I do Crate Games with every dog who comes to stay with me for boarding and training, and have no yet had a problem with it. I've done it with staffies, terriers, and small fluffies, and a few others. I have also done it with 10 week old puppies.

Leaving them alone in the crate is a whole other thing though, it would be nice if the DVD also covered how to transition to that. But I do think I've heard SG say that if the dog can't stay in the crate with the door open, they shouldn't stay in the crate with the door closed. It's completely different for a dog to choose to stay in the crate vs being made to.

My dogs don't have crazy toy drive. The first time I did Recallers I only trained with food. There is usually an alternative version to play each game with food instead of toys, but going through Recallers actually helped me build more toy drive.


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## hanksimon (Mar 18, 2009)

I've never taken it, but from the other folks and youtube videos, I'm under the impression that the 'old' course, "5 minutes to a brilliant recall" was an incremental course that lead up to a nearly 100% recall in all situations, using a method that dogs (and owners) love. And, that the methods transferred to other training....


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