# Small Dogs, Do you get that dog satisfaction



## Canada1990 (Jul 29, 2009)

Hello

My girlfriend and I have decided to get a dog. We live in a Duplex and a large breed is just out of the question. My girlfriend`s parents in another city have a german shepherd and a lab, very fun. My question is can you get the same enjoyment out of smaller breeds? We are thinking about getting a Miniature Schnauzer/ Miniature Pincher / Boston terrier/ Boxer x Boston terrier. I would like to go hiking and play fetch just the traditional things you associate with dogs. Usually when I see smaller dogs, they just seem very pampered and not fun in that sense.


Thanks


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## pugmom (Sep 10, 2008)

Bostons are awesome....big dog in a small body 

I would only suggest getting a bostonxboxer if you can find one in a shelter....more then likely no responsible breeder is going to put those breeds together ......just look at the size difference....its on a good day at least 30lbs


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

Yes of course they're just as fun as big dogs. There are lots of active small breeds that can keep up. I even do agility with a dog under 8 lbs (and she rocks too)


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## Entwine (Jan 14, 2009)

My Chihuahua is absolutely fun... We're always playing and interacting in a happy and fun way. Soccer, hide and seek, fetch, walking together, etc. She works for her meals through obedience and is very well behaved. 

The only difference in terms of size is just that.. size. It's all in how you treat/raise your dog. Of course, breed traits do come into play to a certain extent... But if you don't spoil or "pamper" your dog, you dog won't expect it.


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## sizzledog (Nov 23, 2008)

Dogs of any size are what you make of them. 

I'll admit, I enjoy my large dogs a bit more than I enjoy my corgi, but the corgi is a blast in her own way - and if I didn't have two large dogs, she'd be all the dog I'd need.


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## HayleyMarie (Dec 22, 2008)

All I can say is "HECK YES!!" I have a WestHighland White Terrier and she is very, very outgoing. We take her camping and hiking during the summer and she loves it. I do get full enjoyment out of her even though she is smaller. I own a Bouve as and I have so much more fun with my Westie. Teagan loves being outside and going for adventures.I find a smaller dog makes more sense if you do alot of traveling and whats not because they are easier to haul around. I know it is much easier to pack a truck or car full of camping stuff with a smaller dog than with a big dog. If you are looking for a smaller dog I would also reccomment a Westie they are just amazing fiesty, scrappy little things that will keep your life exciting. I know it sure has with mine! And Terriers do not mesh well if you are going to attemt to pamper and fru fru them. It just does not fly with them!


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## LittleFr0g (Jun 11, 2007)

I used to be a die-hard large dog person, until I met my first Pug.  I've never looked back. Big dog personality in a small body, and so much easier to look after. I'll never be without a Pug in my life now.


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## TxRider (Apr 22, 2009)

30-40lb dogs are probably the best size in my opinion.

Not too small, not too large, not too hard to travel with.. great size for sports. Lots of active breeds in that range from terriers to herders to retrievers to hunting dogs and lots of good mixed to adopt.

I am a bit afraid of owning really little dogs, I'm rather big and and not so graceful and I fear stepping on a foot or leg or hurting a really little dog.


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## RonE (Feb 3, 2007)

Do not underestimate the comfort of having a small dog fall asleep in your lap.

My mother has a shi-tzu and my daughter has a miniature schnauzer. Either one will lower your blood pressure, but the schnauzer will run all day with the big dogs.


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## Canada1990 (Jul 29, 2009)

What are some nice 30-40LB dogs that have short hair and are easy to train?


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## sassykzt (Oct 25, 2009)

I also have Westies. They love the outdoors-- took them on a 8 mile walk yesterday. They play Frisbee, chase after any ball,swim in the ocean and love romping through the snow when we go skiing. They are intelligent, hardy and spirited ( and everything Haley Marie said). We know a few Boston Terriers & Min. Pins.-- great dogs too! Unfortunately there are some small dogs who develop small dog syndrome-- they are allowed behaviors that one would not allow a large breed to have. I think you may be pleasantly surprised what comes in smaller packages. Just do your research on diff. breeds.


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## Canada1990 (Jul 29, 2009)

My issue with Boston terriers is that all the sites claim that they can overheat easily and are extremely sensitive to the cold. How big of obstacles are these. Are these websites exaggerating?


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## pugmom (Sep 10, 2008)

Canada1990 said:


> My issue with Boston terriers is that all the sites claim that they can overheat easily and are extremely sensitive to the cold. How big of obstacles are these. Are these websites exaggerating?


each individual dog is going to be different....my guy does pretty good in the heat up until about the mid 90's then he will need to slow down ....the only issue with the cold is that he is very short haired so he can get cold fast but if your willing to put a sweater or coat on him he will go go go

If you live in an area that has extreme temps and you love to be outside more then inside then you might be able to find a better breed ....I think some site do over exagerate...but I have to agree they are not huskies


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## FaithFurMom09 (Oct 24, 2009)

I have a rotti/beagle dog and shes pretty awesome if i dont say so  I think she has plenty of energy for a medium dog.


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## HayleyMarie (Dec 22, 2008)

-airdale Terrier

http://www.pgaa.com/CANINE/GENERAL/size.html#upto50
Here is a great site with dog breeds and their weigth, height ect..


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## TxRider (Apr 22, 2009)

Canada1990 said:


> What are some nice 30-40LB dogs that have short hair and are easy to train?


Depends on what you want, it can be anything from an australian cattle dog, a tough little dog that will go forever, to a corgi, to a whippet, to a beagle to a basenji, to a half dozen different terrier types.

Or you could go to a good rescue and talk to them and get a mix that's already grown, or a pup that looks like it'll hit that size range. My best dog ever was a 40lb lab/border collie mix.

Punch your desires into this breed finder...

http://animal.discovery.com/breedselector/dogselector.do


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## pugmom (Sep 10, 2008)

TxRider said:


> http://animal.discovery.com/breedselector/dogselector.do



LOL...I don't like that breed selector...#5 is a silly question...and it gave me some crazy breeds....I said I wanted little to no grooming and I got a 99% match for Keeshond and 98% English cocker spaniel...they don't seem like little to no grooming to me hahahah


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## FilleBelle (Aug 1, 2007)

None of the breed selectors are perfect, but if you do a few of them, they at least give you a place to start.


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## pugmom (Sep 10, 2008)

FilleBelle said:


> None of the breed selectors are perfect, but if you do a few of them, they at least give you a place to start.


oh I agree....I just thought it was funny


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## FilleBelle (Aug 1, 2007)

I enjoy when they recommend some completely obscure breed. More than once the Entlebucher Mountain Dog has popped up as a recommendation for me. Now, don't get me wrong, they sound like awesome dogs, but...seriously?


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## mikedavid00 (Oct 15, 2007)

Canada1990 said:


> My question is can you get the same enjoyment out of smaller breeds?
> 
> 
> Thanks


I have a small dog. 

Everyone told me at work through the years 'naaah that's not a real dog'. That's after I claimed I wanted a Bichon/Toy Poodle.

So I dont think you will get the real dog feeling with a smaller dog.

I mean.. I'm happy with MY dog.. but EVERYONE has told me these dogs aren't 'real dogs' so just keep that in mind. They must be saying it for a reason.


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## pugmom (Sep 10, 2008)

mikedavid00 said:


> I have a small dog.
> 
> Everyone told me at work through the years 'naaah that's not a real dog'. That's after I claimed I wanted a Bichon/Toy Poodle.
> 
> ...


mike, can I interest you in some prime real estate at the bottom of the ocean?...everyone tells me its really beautiful ......LOL


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

mikedavid00 said:


> I have a small dog.
> 
> Everyone told me at work through the years 'naaah that's not a real dog'. That's after I claimed I wanted a Bichon/Toy Poodle.
> 
> ...


Because people tell you something, it's true?


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## Kayto Potato (Aug 30, 2009)

I have two small dogs and i loooove them. My one is a border collie, rat terrier mix. only about 20 lbs. But he has a ton of energy and he is a good hunter. Try going to the pound and getting a small mixed breed! good luck!


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## HayleyMarie (Dec 22, 2008)

> Because people tell you something, it's true?


Of course it is Lauralin, didnt you know that. Because I sure did!


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## FilleBelle (Aug 1, 2007)

I want to tell you all something, then...

I'm a millionaire.


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## pugmom (Sep 10, 2008)

FilleBelle said:


> I want to tell you all something, then...
> 
> I'm a millionaire.


ooh..ooh me too..and I have the abs of Gwen Stefani


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## LittleFr0g (Jun 11, 2007)

I'm a dead ringer for Angelina Jolie.


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## HayleyMarie (Dec 22, 2008)

I'm the queen of the world!


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

I would try to come up with something clever but I'm too busy being pestered by my fake dogs.

To the OP, size has little bearing on breed. There are laid back small dogs, there are active ones, there are fluffy ones, there are short haired ones, I could go on and on... The idea that size makes a dog any 'less' is quite frankly stupid and the people who have said that I guess have never met a jack russell, which is more dog than most large breeds. Or a patterdale terrier. Or they've never watched a papillon run an agility course as fast as the border collies, etc...


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## LittleFr0g (Jun 11, 2007)

> To the OP, size has little bearing on breed. There are laid back small dogs, there are active ones, there are fluffy ones, there are short haired ones, I could go on and on... The idea that size makes a dog any 'less' is quite frankly stupid and the people who have said that I guess have never met a jack russell, which is more dog than most large breeds. Or a patterdale terrier. Or they've never watched a papillon run an agility course as fast as the border collies, etc...


Or witnessed the shock and awe of a large dog owner in my obedience class who was holding my Pug, Kuma, for me while I was walking the little obedience course the instructor had set up: "He plays just like a big dog!" Yup, that's my boy, but, of course, he's not a "real dog".


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## HayleyMarie (Dec 22, 2008)

Of course my scrappy rodent killing, dirt digging, ball chasing, farm westie is not a "real" dog. Gesh who ever thinks small dogs are real dogs are crazy people.


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## LittleFr0g (Jun 11, 2007)

> Gesh who ever thinks small dogs are real dogs are crazy people.


LOL, guess I'm totally bat crazy then!


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## mrslloyd09 (Jul 12, 2009)

Mandie is a dachsund/lab and weighs about twenty-five lbs and thinks she's ten feet tall. She loves walking on the trails and loves loves loves rough housing w/ my hubby. She's not so small that I'm afraid she's going to break but not big enough to eat us out of house and home. Plus, she really makes a great foot warmer.


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## RaeganW (Jul 14, 2009)

If it's on the internet, it must be true!

If it walks like a dog, barks like a dog, and poops like a dog, it's a dog.


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## mikedavid00 (Oct 15, 2007)

RaeganW said:


> If it's on the internet, it must be true!
> 
> If it walks like a dog, barks like a dog, and poops like a dog, it's a dog.


If there was no truth to it, why I have I been told that so many times by so many different dog owners, 

And why would the OP even ask the question if there wasn't truth to it.

I know for me a smaller sized dog 15-20 lbs would be best due to my yard size. But I fully realize that the downside to owning a dog like mine is that people don't think it's a 'real dog'. I dont think that way, but I know other people do becuase they've told me themselves.


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## moots (Oct 26, 2009)

Should probably get a small dog, IMO small dogs are best for first time dog owners. At least if you get a geneticly naughty dog it's at least not going to cause you as much grief as a large breed would in the same situation.


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## RaeganW (Jul 14, 2009)

mikedavid00 said:


> If there was no truth to it, why I have I been told that so many times by so many different dog owners,


Because they are misinformed?



> And why would the OP even ask the question if there wasn't truth to it.


Because they heard an opinion, it didn't sit right with them, and went to a source of dog-knowledgable people to get an informed opinion.



> I know for me a smaller sized dog 15-20 lbs would be best due to my yard size. But I fully realize that the downside to owning a dog like mine is that people don't think it's a 'real dog'. I dont think that way, but I know other people do becuase they've told me themselves.


This is a thing to take into consideration. Everyone will think they know more about your dog than you do, even if the extent of their dog experience is watching the Eukanuba Cup after the Macy's Day Parade. If it's going to be truly problematic, for example your father think small dogs are "fox bait" and you'd really rather not put up with the hassle, some small dogs are "sturdier" looking than others. Terriers are the classic example, I've never met one that didn't think he was a Rottwieler. Small, white, fluffy dogs get the worst of the stigma, but tell my dad's childhood miniature poodle that once stopped traffic in downtown Evanston for three hours because he refused to let a woman back into her car after she got out to help him.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

mikedavid00 said:


> If there was no truth to it, why I have I been told that so many times by so many different dog owners,
> 
> And why would the OP even ask the question if there wasn't truth to it.
> 
> I know for me a smaller sized dog 15-20 lbs would be best due to my yard size. But I fully realize that the downside to owning a dog like mine is that people don't think it's a 'real dog'. I dont think that way, but I know other people do becuase they've told me themselves.


The reason idiots say small dogs are not 'real dogs' is because some morons need an ego boost that comes from owning a macho 'real' dog. People don't think they're real dogs because they rely on stupid stereotypes that have nothing to do with the dogs themselves and instead only have to do with that person's ego.

If you're a moron, believe it. There is zero truth to it.

There is no way to qualify what counts as a 'real dog' or not... None whatsoever. There are small dogs that are therapy dogs, working dogs, hunting dogs, service dogs, sports dogs, and most of all companions. You cannot judge the merit of a companion dog by any physical characteristic about them- including size. I've had dogs ranging from a 5 lb papillon to a 75 lb german shepherd... they're all DOGS and they were all darn good ones too. My father grew up with a ton of hunting dogs and herding dogs and his favorite dog ever, the one he thinks is the best dog he's had, is a 6.5 lb girly looking papillon. What does that matter? She's a great DOG. 

Heck you don't think small dogs are real dogs, find that video of the JRT doing schutzhund...


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## the_mighty_khan (Nov 10, 2009)

I've heard papillons referred to as the "border collie of the toy world." Is that description pretty accurate?


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## luvntzus (Mar 16, 2007)

mikedavid00 said:


> I have a small dog.
> 
> So I dont think you will get the real dog feeling with a smaller dog.
> 
> I mean.. I'm happy with MY dog.. but EVERYONE has told me these dogs aren't 'real dogs' so just keep that in mind. They must be saying it for a reason.


WHAT? You seem to have an odd outlook on things.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

the_mighty_khan said:


> I've heard papillons referred to as the "border collie of the toy world." Is that description pretty accurate?


I think so in many ways and you hear that a lot. I mean they're obviously different (one's a companion breed and the other a herding breed) but papillons can be _very_ high energy and very drivey little dogs and they're brilliant too. I have had several breeds, including herding breeds and my paps are by far the smartest dogs I've owned. they are pretty crazy smart. They're also supposedly the most trainable toy breed. So they have a lot of similar qualities that way and both are very human oriented and need/want a lot of time with their owner.

They're my two favorite breeds.  A border collie will be my next dog for sure.

I think the saying though came around mostly because a lot of people see paps as 'oh cute and fluffy! I want one for my purse' and they're just in no way that kind of dog, really. On my papillon listserve there are always people coming on wondering why their papillon won't stop being wild or something like that. Without that caveat people don't realize that what paps are are real dogs (lol) in a little body. If you let that mind go to boredom, you will likely have a terror of a papillon.  They are not a good choice for people wanting a calm, ornamental dog.


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## RaeganW (Jul 14, 2009)

Laurelin, do you remember that "Who's dog would you steal?" thread?

I would steal Mia, then immediately give her back because that six pound dog is too much dog for me!


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## Herrick's Mommy (Nov 5, 2009)

Having a small dog myself, I think you can get the same enjoyment that you would out of a big dog. There may be a small difference in size, but I feel that I get an enormous sense of enjoyment with my miniature schnauzer. I think it really depends on the person. Just because they're small dogs, does not mean that they are pampered or put on a pedestal and not treated and played with in the same way as a big dog. I'm happy with my little pup


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

RaeganW said:


> Laurelin, do you remember that "Who's dog would you steal?" thread?
> 
> I would steal Mia, then immediately give her back because that six pound dog is too much dog for me!


LOL, I'm pretty sure Mia's not papillon, she's some alien life form come to haunt me. She's in a league ALL her own.


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## Canada1990 (Jul 29, 2009)

The Miniature Schnauzer is a breed that I am looking very closely at. I like the fact that they do not really shed and that they can be active. Is there any else you can tell me about this breed?


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## SandyPuppy (Aug 8, 2009)

Out of the breeds you listed I recommend mini schnauzer if you don't mind the grooming. They are definately real dogs. 

I think anywhere between 20 and 35 pounds is ideal. Thats just my preference.


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## yappypappymom (Oct 22, 2009)

Coming from a prior GSD mix owner(& LOVED EVERY darn year that boy gave to me!!), I can HONESTLY admit that I DID kinda "turn my nose" at small doggies. I think perhaps SOME of what made me do that was a few yrs. ago, the "big boom" of little yappy dogs(I think due to ALOT of reality tv-type shows) being paraded all around town like fashion accessories, looking all nervous & always trembling...really made me think so much "less" of sm. dogs...that, & paired w/living w/my previous in-laws who had 2 toy dogs..(they-the dogs-nearly drove me completely INSANE for almost 8 months of my life-they BOTH barked at everything & nothing..CONSTANTLY)..very "unnerving" to say the LEAST!!..

Anyhow, I know that I am in-itself going to sound like the worst hypocrite, because, I now realize something VERY wrong with my prior thinking pattern...I was basing all of my PRIOR experiances & perceptions based on a size, NOT on the bad-training those particular dogs actually received! ie.-those 2 dogs that were my in-laws, well, they were NEVER "taught" to do something else, or how to "alert" properly in the FIRST place..their owners just let them "do their thing", & well, thats just how they lived their lives...&, to me now, well, I now just think those dogs suffered some severe neurotic/anxiety issues that just were ALLOWED to get worse & worse.

I am now under the conclusion that you can have a FANTASTIC dog NO MATTER THE SIZE, & will have a great/fun time with ANY dog you choose, BUT-just make sure to take the proper time to socialize & train the dog so that you can train/redirect/reward any unwanted or desired reactions from your dog.

A few years lapsed since my Max passed on, &, lets just say that I had pleanty of time to really do some thinking on what kind of dog would perhaps be a nice match for me. I always wanted another GSD of course,..(I will FOREVER have MAD, CRAZY LOVE for that breed),but,...realistic life changes had to be factored into my deciscion...I finally picked my next dog breed, &, lo-&-behold...Its a Toy Breed!!

I now have FIRST HAND KNOWLEDGE myself that shatters all of my prior stupid belief system of what a REAL DOG QUALIFIES AS..&, nope, I know now, that size is NOT something you should HAVE to consider only if you are perhaps limited somehow physically, or if your living arraingements just cannot contain a full sized doggies bones..cuz, in all actuality, they are ALL REAL DOGS!! -they bark, they poo, they chew shoes, they love, & put their friends above..= a REAL DOG to me!!

Leif has brought such joy to my life, & our entire family has been quite pleased having him around as well. So, YES, Lg. size dogs ARE nice to have around, but, little dogs have ALOT to offer too!!


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## Herrick's Mommy (Nov 5, 2009)

Like sandypuppy said, mini schnauzers don't really shed, I haven't seen any dog hair in my house at all, and we groom him regularly. Ours is about to be 5 months old and yes, he is full of energy, but we do give him two one hour walks a day, we play with him, and we are currently training him, which honestly, makes it even more fun having him. IMO, its a great breed, but ultimately it will be up to you and there are other great breeds out there in case you decide to go for another one. Herrick is currently teething, which is funny since he has some gaps and he looks like a toothless old man, but that's what makes this breed so unique...they look like old men, lol


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## the_mighty_khan (Nov 10, 2009)

Thanks for the info. My younger sister wants a papillon.


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## mikedavid00 (Oct 15, 2007)

Canada1990 said:


> The Miniature Schnauzer is a breed that I am looking very closely at. I like the fact that they do not really shed and that they can be active. Is there any else you can tell me about this breed?


My old boss has two of them. 

The barking is a *major* problem for him and he said he's tried 'everything'. He said they just 'lose it' when someone comes near the house. The neighbours front door is close to his so whenever the neighbours go in and out of their house, the 2 dogs will 'lose it' and go insance barking and jumping up the window. He said there's nothing you can due to stop it. he said it's ear peircing loud. Like it's CRAZY barking.

He said he can't fix it. I researched and learned about people with the same problem and how barking colars can fix, but with a warning that the dog can redirect it's energy elswhere. Youc an also fix it with surgery being the best method. Supposeldy it's cute to hear the dogs little bark. 

Many of the people here on the forum say you can train the dogs not to bark with training. It didn't work for him though.


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## Herrick's Mommy (Nov 5, 2009)

mikedavid00 said:


> My old boss has two of them.
> 
> The barking is a *major* problem for him and he said he's tried 'everything'. He said they just 'lose it' when someone comes near the house. The neighbours front door is close to his so whenever the neighbours go in and out of their house, the 2 dogs will 'lose it' and go insance barking and jumping up the window. He said there's nothing you can due to stop it. he said it's ear peircing loud. Like it's CRAZY barking.
> 
> ...


The ms breed has a reputation for being yappy, but this does not mean that ALL of them are like that. Herrick doesn't even bark and he found his voice already. You don't necessarily have to resort to using a bark collar or surgery to correct the problem. Training should teach them not to do it if you're consistent with it.


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## the_mighty_khan (Nov 10, 2009)

mikedavid00 said:


> Youc an also fix it with surgery being the best method. Supposeldy it's cute to hear the dogs little bark.



Too bad there's not a surgery to correct your problem of posting absurd and obnoxious comments all over this forum.


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## yappypappymom (Oct 22, 2009)

I KNOW that my "user name" right off indicates that paps are "yappy", but, in all fairness, - they're NOT!! My boy only really goes "yappy" when his BBF Tigger the ferret gets introduced to the mix, &, believe me then,-this little boy has ALOT to "say" to the "ferret"...it is actuallay a complete "riot" to watch IMOP!!...other than the excitement of the ferrets arrival, the pup is kinda "bland & boring" to watch for some good giggles!!!


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## CLF (Feb 26, 2009)

Laurelin said:


> To the OP, size has little bearing on breed. There are laid back small dogs, there are active ones, there are fluffy ones, there are short haired ones, I could go on and on... The idea that size makes a dog any 'less' is quite frankly stupid and the people who have said that I guess have never met a jack russell, which is more dog than most large breeds. Or a patterdale terrier. Or they've never watched a papillon run an agility course as fast as the border collies, etc...



Anyone who thinks that a Jack Russell is less of a dog than larger breeds has obviously never met one! My JRT is a fearless bundle of energy who loves fetching tennis balls, playing tug, and swimming (and of course cuddling) 

I live in an apartment with no yard so we are at the local dog park 4-5 times per week minimum. Ripley relates much better to the large dogs and is usually the little boss man when he is there.


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## TxRider (Apr 22, 2009)

The way I see it a dog under a certain size just cannot do certain things, like jump high and catch a full sized frisbee all day, and dog over a certain size cannot do it well either.

There are a lot of things toys and small dogs can't do or would be in danger doing, as there are a lot of things large dogs can't do well, like fit in a compact car and travel or be carried or do certain sports without hurting themselves.

I guess I'm a medium size dog person at heart. Big enough to do most anything, small enough to do most anything and not be a hassle.

I also notice a trend that people tend to have larger dogs when they are younger, and the dogs tend to get smaller the older people get on average.


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## lizziedog1 (Oct 21, 2009)

Here is a breed you should look up and read about.

It is the *King Charles Spaniel.* It might work for you.


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## RonE (Feb 3, 2007)

Canada1990 said:


> The Miniature Schnauzer is a breed that I am looking very closely at. I like the fact that they do not really shed and that they can be active. Is there any else you can tell me about this breed?


Zeke, my daughter's miniature schnauzer, is with us again for an extended stay. Last week, he took offense with an imagined insult from his best friend - a 55 pound mix who could take off his head in one bite.

Zeke got ahold of Dante's long tail and shook it like it was a rat. I was right there to pick up Dante's back legs and prevent retaliation. Dante is on anitbiotics and pain killers and has one of those collars to force him to leave it alone. The vet, who knows Zeke all too well, recommended my daughter keep the dogs seperated during the recovery because Zeke would view Dante as more vulnerable and torment him.

My point of this story is this: This particular miniature schnauzer, all 18 pounds of him, will take on anyone or anything. Esther has stepped on him a few times, but is remarkably patient with him because they basically grew up together. 

Terriers in general, and schnauzers in particular, care nothing about relative size. That is their greatest strength and their greatest shortcoming.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

TxRider said:


> The way I see it a dog under a certain size just cannot do certain things, like jump high and catch a full sized frisbee all day, and dog over a certain size cannot do it well either.
> 
> There are a lot of things toys and small dogs can't do or would be in danger doing, as there are a lot of things large dogs can't do well, like fit in a compact car and travel or be carried or do certain sports without hurting themselves.
> 
> ...


I think you'd be surprised at what some of the small breeds are capable of doing. I don't think a JRT would have any problem playing frisbee all day (except they might kill the frisbee, they tend to like destroying toys). I have a 6 lb dog that would play fetch all day long. She can catch too though zero interest in the little frisbee I bought her. Of course you have to buy them toys that fit their mouths. To me it doesn't matter if we're playing fetch with a big tennis ball or a little one, I just want a dog that will play fetch. 

Of course there are things they can't do. I would never recommend one for protection work, for example.  Then again there was that JRT that did schutzhund pretty darn well and Summer is about the same size as a JRT.

I think I've really decided a border collie is as big as I'll go again. I've had three large dogs but Roxy is reminding me that I like small to medium best.


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## lovemygreys (Jan 20, 2007)

I prefer large breed dogs, but I think you can have just as much fun and enjoyment out of a small breed dog! Plus, there is just something about having a small dog that you can hold in your lap/arms. As our greyhound pup is gettting too large to do that with, I'm really going to miss it!!


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## TxRider (Apr 22, 2009)

Laurelin said:


> Of course there are things they can't do. I would never recommend one for protection work, for example.  Then again there was that JRT that did schutzhund pretty darn well and Summer is about the same size as a JRT.


Or too large as say my GSD Hope, I won't have her say, leaping for frisbees, she would end up with a hurt back or legs. She's too big and heavy to be twisting in the air and landing from jumps all the time. Or flyball, or agility..



> I think I've really decided a border collie is as big as I'll go again. I've had three large dogs but Roxy is reminding me that I like small to medium best.


I think a border collie is about the best sized dog. Not too big, not to small, can do about anything I might ever want a dog to do at that size. Lots of awesome breeds around that size.


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## mikedavid00 (Oct 15, 2007)

lizziedog1 said:


> Here is a breed you should look up and read about.
> 
> It is the *King Charles Spaniel.* It might work for you.


If I coudn't chose my poodle/maltese/bichon/whippet/greyhound selection, that would by my next choice of dog. 

My wife and I just don't like the way it looks and it's color and coat.


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## Trixie (Feb 27, 2008)

I think OP should probably look at temperament over size for an apartment dog. It does not follow that big dogs are bad in apartments and small dogs are good.

Of course little dogs are "real dogs". They certainly are not "fake dogs". 

Personally, I like big dogs. Mine, at 45 lbs, is a nice size but I could easily live with one that was bigger than that. But some people like their small dogs. I think it is interesting that we ("we" rhetorical) let other people shape our perception of what is a breed worth owning, rather than just going with a dog we like that fits with our lifestyle and has a temperament we can live with.


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## HayleyMarie (Dec 22, 2008)

I have met lots and lots of Miniature Schnauzer and they all seemed to be well behaved smart happy dogs that had loads of energy packed into thier small bodies. They are not shy either. I find they tend to have the same personalities as the terriers. Scrappy, outgoing, fiesty. And with training they can be trained not to be yappy. It can be done. I find them to be fantastic dogs!


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## RonE (Feb 3, 2007)

> I find they tend to have the same personalities as the terriers.


Possibly because they are terriers.


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## Meshkenet (Oct 2, 2009)

I have a small, medium and large dogs (9lbs, 60lbs and 110lbs). I get "dog satisfaction" from all of them, in their own ways.

The Chihuahua is 6yrs old, so she is a bit of a lap dog, but will boss the other two around. She follows us in our weekly hikes (over 2 hours in the woods) and does not even budge when the other two try to steal her toys or goodies. Younger, I think she would have been amazing at agility, and since I am planning to build a small agility track in my future backyard, I'll soon be able to tell you how that goes...

All in all, she is as real a dog as any, and that's coming from someone who never thought about owning a small dog untill a few months ago (I got her 2 months ago and never looked back).

Have you thought about the Shiba Inu? Great dog in cold weather (don't know where in Canada you are, but it gets freezing cold here in Qc!), nice size, energetic, and fiercely good looking.


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## Kayto Potato (Aug 30, 2009)

bgfv vfs fgvs gf fs sf


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## bfoster (Feb 9, 2009)

I have four mini schnauzers and they are neither yappy nor mean. There are bad breeders for every breed of dog and poorly bred purebred dogs seem to have the bad qualities magnified- 
As with any breed- look for good solid breeding and follow-up with consistent positive reinforcement training.
All of mine went through obedience from the time they were puppies. They did not go to a small breed puppy class- they were there with the big dogs. Schnauzers do not know that they are small dogs. 
They are very smart but can be stubborn if they think they can get away with it. I have never had a more loyal dog
The only time mine bark is if someone comes to the door and that is only until I say "its ok".
If you teach them to "speak" (bark on command) when they are puppies it is very easy to teach them "no speak". I have not experienced the uncontrollable barking that some people on this board equate with schnauzers.
I personally like the terrier personality- they are feisty and fun when you want but can also be happy just hanging out with you.
Not every one likes the same kind of dog- lucky for us there are a lot of different choices.


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## CoverTune (Mar 11, 2007)

Boston's are awesome... I own two Chis, but would love to have a Boston. They have incredible personalities, can be super active or totally laid back.. I lived in Toronto for a couple years, where temps can get pretty extreme, and they were VERY popular there, so it makes me think that it's maybe not a huge deal, just something to be aware of.


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## Ayanla (Jun 11, 2009)

Boston heat/cold sensitivity is only a big deal in the sense that you can't just put them out in the yard. They are indoor dogs. You also have to pay a bit more attention to their well being when you're outside, particularly in the heat. They get cold easily because they're small dogs with a super short coat, but the heat is what is really deadly to them due to their shortened palates and inability to pant efficiently. They are not delicate dogs, though. 

I absolutely get full doggy satisfaction from both of my small dogs.


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## shihtzu712 (Nov 12, 2009)

We absolutely love our shih tzu mix. He's not as active as a larger breed would have been but he is as loyal and sweet as you can get. I've found that smaller breeds tend to have a more distinct personality than some of the larger breeds. And it's great to be able to have the dog sit on your lap or sleep at the foot of your bed.


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## Hallie (Nov 9, 2008)

BEAGLES!!! They're awesome. I would consider Hallie a small breed, she's only 25lbs. They're the best little compact dogs ever, of course I may be biased. I play fetch with mine and she showed potential for agility. Hallie is just like a big dog. Beagles are the perfect size. They are by no means fragile and yet they're small enough to keep inside and travel with pretty easy. They're just..._perfect_. Beagles are also super trainable and smart.


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## jesirose (Mar 27, 2008)

TxRider said:


> The way I see it a dog under a certain size just cannot do certain things, like jump high and catch a full sized frisbee all day, and dog over a certain size cannot do it well either.


My 26 lb dog can catch a frisbee like nobody's business....


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## Ayanla (Jun 11, 2009)

Bostons playing Frisbee
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xeq9HWeUVUo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfQm7MebmQE

And on a non frisbee note...if you can watch this video and NOT laugh...there's something wrong with you!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4njtYUPruU0

Bostons are so awesome.


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## Foyerhawk (May 7, 2009)

I confess I wouldn't be satisified with a small dog. I'm into big, muscular, elegant, beautiful dogs that run hard and love to swim and can take all kinds of weather and are meant for working and coursing and hunting. The only small dogs I'd consider are Shelties and Basenjis and maybe Beagles. But I wouldn't live anywhere where I couldn't have big dogs.

I did grow up with a Mini Schnauzer and while I wouldn't have one because I prefer the look of a smooth or feathered coat, and I do like some size, she was a lot of fun!

I couldn't and wouldn't have a smoosh faced or scruffy dog- I simply find them unattractive. (I like Schnauzers show groomed).


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## Michiyo-Fir (Jul 25, 2009)

My Papillon is pretty fun. Just 6 lbs of fun lol. She does hikes and fetch and all the other dog stuff just like a big dog.

I think some breeds do and some breeds not so much.

Our Cavalier doesn't really fetch and doesn't enjoy hiking. She just likes being pampered. Really depends on the breed and the dog.

Mini schnauzers and bostons are great little dogs. They are pretty energetic and can handle a lot!



Laurelin said:


> If you let that mind go to boredom, you will likely have a terror of a papillon.  They are not a good choice for people wanting a calm, ornamental dog.


Hehehe I 2nd this. I have a couple of holes scratched/chewed out of my wall by my Papillon because she didn't get exercise on those days and I was out too long without giving her anything fun to do.


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## GatsbysMom (Jul 20, 2009)

I personally would never want a small dog, and I think you and your girlfriend should compromise on a dog that you BOTH want. It's likely you'll have to do a lot of caretaking of the dog, too, so you'd better fall in love with it!

My fiance and I together got a big dog. A small dog was out of the question for our lifestyle, as we're both very active people. We just took our dog to Lake Tahoe where we hiked with him up mountains, swam in the lakes, etc. 

When I say "small," I mean under 20 pounds. I realize that's not everyone's definition but that's mine. I also understand there are exceptions to my stereotype (Jack Russells, for example, are very active little dogs).

I like big, hardy dogs that don't mind getting dirty and that you can roughhouse with, play on the beach for hours, etc. I love watching him play at the dog park without having to worry about him being trampled by bigger dogs (a lot of small dog owners at my local park should probably just put their small dogs into a big hamster ball since they're so scared all the time). 

If I wanted a small animal, I'd get another cat. I have a cat, and even he's a big guy. 

There are a lot of great 25-40 pound breeds and mutts (go mutts!) that would probably be okay in your duplex. What's the weight limitation? I live in the city so I understand how that is.

I babysat my friend's daschund, and I didn't enjoy a minute of it. I don't like having to carry a dog because it gets tired after walking a few blocks (this is the city, we don't have cars and walk everywhere). 

People are all different, so they have different preferences for dogs. I have a lot of friends who would never dream of owning a big dog. My friend who owns the daschund doesn't like big dogs because they're "too animal-like."


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## Foyerhawk (May 7, 2009)

Actualy, Schnauzers are NOT terriers. Originating in Germany from totally different stock, they are more accurately a untility breed.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

I went on a 3 mile hike yesterday with my under 10 lb dogs and at the end, Mia was still wanting to go! We did offleash hiking, then went to the dog park, then the regular park and they were still not worn out lol. 

I never say never. I swore I'd have no toy dogs but look at us now. There's some give and take with small and large dogs but overall it works pretty much the same

Personally, I hate cats so I really hate it when people tell me I should just get a cat. I don't want a cat, I never want a cat. Give me a dog of any size or type over a cat.


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## Spirit_of_Cotons (Jun 21, 2009)

Oh my gosh, yes you can!! Little dogs act as if they're big dogs, going right up to big dogs and not being afraid of them. Little dogs are great; I always wanted a Golden (can't, have allergies) but I love Luke just the same and he's perfect with us. They still give you the same thing a big dog would, they just come in a smaller package.  

Hope you find that small dog you wanted!


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## chriley58 (Mar 9, 2009)

We have a 22 lb poodle mix. He is actually our first small dog. He is awesome. He can keep up with our 50 lb aussie and 50 lb border collie mix with no problems. He wrestles and plays with both of them, he swims with them, he can hike for miles without tiring, he bikes with my son. My daughter has cerebral palsy and he will help pull her up hills when she is walking him. He's a great little guard dog, without being yappy. And it is nice to be able to have him on your lap or upside down in your arms, snuggling at the end of a long day.


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## misty073 (Mar 31, 2009)

I think it depends more on breed than size. I had a yorkie up until 2 months ago and even I used to joke he wasnt a real dog, obviously he was...he barked, ate and pooped...he was a dog LOL. He would never play fetch (unless our JRT was...then it was more to keep the kong from her LOL). We could take him out walking and on trails and he never got tired but I wouldnt take him hiking (although I dont hike so its ok) He liked going walking but was just as happy sitting on my lap and following me around the house. he was 9lbs. Now our JRT is 12lbs and I consider her a real dog LOL. She will play fetch all day if we let her, she can hike, swim and run circles around us if we take her out for a run. She is not yappy at all (infact we can go days with out hearing her bark at all). Our JRT is technically my husbands dog (although I do all the work LOL) and never once has he or anyone commented that she is not a real dog...she doesnt fit into that small dog stereotype and yes I do believe there is a difference between small dogs and big dogs in respect to being "a real dog" but to me its more of a breed thing than size....some dogs just are not meant to chase frisbees and swim in lakes and some are more fragile and you do have to be more carefull with smaller breeds...But in the end they are all dogs 

To the OP I think the best thing to do is figure out what you are looking for in a dog and pick a breed from there.


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## croll326 (Jul 25, 2009)

I have a Boston/Border Collie mix. He is 6 1/2 months old and 20 lbs. I try to keep him very lean. Im my opinion, a fat dog is a huge vet bill in the making. So feed high quality kibble or raw and have fun. Rock loves playing with the big dogs better....he tends to bully furry froo froo dogs even if they are his same size.


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## harrise (Jan 9, 2008)

I'd be lying if I told you my five pound dog gives the same type of satisfaction that the 100 pound dogs give. No matter how tenacious and tough she thinks she is, I can't throw her around and wrestle the same way. There's something extra fun about picking on someone nearly your own size.


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## Inga (Jun 16, 2007)

Canada1990 said:


> What are some nice 30-40LB dogs that have short hair and are easy to train?


Some of the medium size breeds that I love are...

English Springer Spaniels. They would be good hiking partners and also fun to play fetch with.

Brittany's could fall into that same category

Vizsla's are fun dogs. If you get a female it would probably fall close to your weight range. Is there a limit in your duplex, or just a personal preference?

Any Shelter mix might due as well. There are often dogs in that weight range that would be wonderful hiking/fetching partners.

Edit: Had to add, Mini Schnauzer could also be a great pick. I see that is one you chose. Do plenty of research on any breed you chose and make sure that you are up for the challenge.


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## Foyerhawk (May 7, 2009)

Springers are nuts and long haired though! lol

Whippets are calm, short haired, and beyond easy for manners and housetraining, but they are not interested in jogging or robotic obedience to commands.

I have to actually say the Schnauzer too- they don't shed and the coat can just be shaved down if you like.


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## KBLover (Sep 9, 2008)

Canada1990 said:


> Usually when I see smaller dogs, they just seem very pampered and not fun in that sense.


If I could keep up with HIM, Wally'd be out walking for miles and preferably through "terrain" (up and down hills, paths in the woods, uneven surfaces, and snow come winter)

About the only way I can physically tire him is to make him run at a full sprint in laps around the whole playground (basically, psych him up until he gets zoomies and then watch him run at full speed with this silly grin on his face). 

Then I make him bark (and of course he gets all loud and intense with his play growling then), and make him chase me and jump up and pull on his rope bone, and do more sprints.

Then he's huffing and puffing and laying down asking for a break.

For about two minutes anyway.


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## mrslloyd09 (Jul 12, 2009)

KBLover said:


> If I could keep up with HIM, Wally'd be out walking for miles and preferably through "terrain" (up and down hills, paths in the woods, uneven surfaces, and snow come winter)
> 
> About the only way I can physically tire him is to make him run at a full sprint in laps around the whole playground (basically, psych him up until he gets zoomies and then watch him run at full speed with this silly grin on his face).
> 
> ...


You just described Mandie! Her only limitation is me and my lack of endurance.


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## skelaki (Nov 9, 2006)

Canada1990 said:


> What are some nice 30-40LB dogs that have short hair and are easy to train?


One possibility would be the German Pinscher (needs experienced owner) 
A Smooth Fox Terrier or Standard Manchester Terrier, although smaller than 30 lbs could also be good choices.


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## GatsbysMom (Jul 20, 2009)

KBLover said:


> If I could keep up with HIM, Wally'd be out walking for miles and preferably through "terrain" (up and down hills, paths in the woods, uneven surfaces, and snow come winter)
> 
> About the only way I can physically tire him is to make him run at a full sprint in laps around the whole playground (basically, psych him up until he gets zoomies and then watch him run at full speed with this silly grin on his face).
> 
> ...


I guess it depends a lot of on what the owner considers "active." When I say my fiance and I are "active," I mean he was a runner for his college's track team, we both ran a half marathon this summer to work towards a full marathon, and we clock 10 miles a day in addition to walking around our urban city. Gatsby pretty much goes everywhere with me.

A small dog running full speed could not possibly keep up with us or our lifestyle. 

I like having my medium-large 55 lb. dog keeping up with me (maybe not for 10 miles of running, but at least for a 5-10 mile hike). I want a companion, not a pet I feel like I have to worry about. While I obviously understand the concerns of overheating and dehydration, by and large, my dog is a worry-free friend.

Energy and endurance are two different things. One can translate into being hyper, while the other translates into being a great running partner and outdoor companion. Laps around a playground would in no way tire my dog out.

I'm not an expert on small breeds, but I doubt any breed under 35 pounds could possibly keep up with either my fiance or I. 

I would strongly prefer not to have a dog at all if I could only have a small breed. Perhaps the OP feels the same. I don't know much about him or his lifestyle, as none of us do, but I hope he won't be convinced into getting a dog he can't fully bond with. We ALL know, whether or dogs are big or small, how much joy can come from the right dog.



Inga said:


> Any Shelter mix might due as well. There are often dogs in that weight range that would be wonderful hiking/fetching partners.


Great suggestion. There are those "red shelter dogs" which are very common in my dog park, and they're all such great dogs. Short coats, easy to care for, and sweet temperments. They have a kind of tan-reddish coat -- these dogs are everywhere in shelters. The ones I see are 30-40 pounds mostly. Beautiful animals.

I have a 55 pound mutt from a shelter. He has a medium-length coat, but very, very easy to care for and minimal shedding.


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## KBLover (Sep 9, 2008)

GatsbysMom said:


> Energy and endurance are two different things. One can translate into being hyper, while the other translates into being a great running partner and outdoor companion. Laps around a playground would in no way tire my dog out.


Like I said, it tires Wally out...for a couple minutes. In fact we often go walking after all that. It's enough to make him want to get some rest. It doesn't totally make him drop in borderline exhaustion, no, you'll need more for that.

He could go on a 5 mile hike. He'd love every minute of it. There's just no place to do that here (with the terrain he'd like anyway). When I used to powerwalk down the bike path that goes along the side of the main road where I live, he's right there keeping up with me and it's some miles of distance and then we walk down and back in the neighborhood road - probably another mile or so, or around all the developments in the area.

So while I don't think he could run at full speed for 10 miles, he'd probably could do the 5-10 mile walk. He'll go as much as you are. Heck, Cotons are noted for following their masters on horse back for miles, so they aren't exactly fragile dogs despite being just 10-12 lbs.

http://www.trainpetdog.com/Coton-Tulear/about-coton-tulear.html


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

I think a lot of people get into the problem of lumping all small dogs together which is kind of no offense... well stupid. There's a ton of different breeds with different personalities that are small. They're not all the same and many are very athletic and active- as much as a big dog and some much more than big dogs. As I've mentioned Jacks are one that would have no problem being too much dog for most people. Shelties can also be high energy and Pyrenean shepherds are literally described as being 'as much nervous energy in a small package as possible'. 

If you want a very active, sturdier small dog the terriers and the small herding breeds are good places to start. But I know a guy that runs every day with his dog and it's a chihuahua, so many many small dogs do not fit that stereotype at all. They are very much DOGS.

Beagles are another that would make a good endurance partner.


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## SandyPuppy (Aug 8, 2009)

The pom I'm fostering right now is definately enough of a dog. He is 4.5 years old, weighs 8.5 pounds and has endless energy. He loves going for walks and has a very thick coat so doesn't mind going out in the cold. He would go go go all day if I could keep up with him. I think he would make an excellant hiking companion. At the same time he is totally content to lay beside me or in my lap and just be a baby and be loved on. He also loves to chew on his raw bones and chase toys.

Its funny having him around because now our 20-pound Sandy is considered the "big dog" 

Ohhhh and I totally get the big dog experience by living with Sandy.


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## NRB (Sep 19, 2009)

My Standard Schnauzer is 31.5lbs 16.5 inches tall at 6mo, should get a titch heavier/taller at maturity. She's very tough, very brave, smart and trainable. Is a barker when left alone, but is getting better and better, I hope I can get her to kick the b=habit completely. She can run for an hour at the dog park wrestling with huge Labs, spend an hour in obed class then another 30 min play session with mixed dogs, then run for 2 hours at the barn under my horses feet and in the woods. And still have energy to play play play. Can get stepped on my a horse and be fine, prefers to play rough with the bigger stronger dogs, avoids smaller softer dogs. 

Yes she's very satisfying for my lifestyle.

The Standard Schnauzer used to be called a wire coated German Pincher, so they are related to the GP. But they were originally ratters and guard dogs. So they are not like the UK terriers who are bred to kill things much larger than them and don't have that same sort of Terrier feistiness. But they do work indepedantly of their owners. The Standard Schnauzer is in the Working Group in the US and the Utility Group in the UK. The Miniature Schnauzer was bred down from the Standard and crossed with terriers I believe. They are in the Terrier Group.


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## MyklClark (Nov 15, 2009)

I was always against small dogs until about a year ago. I grew up with large dogs and never saw the point of a small dog. We got a mini schnauzer and she is just an awesome dog. So much energy, so much lovins she fetches, she hikes with me, great at training. Everything I could ask out of a dog. The point of a small dog appears to just complete the family.


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## CLF (Feb 26, 2009)

Foyerhawk said:


> I confess I wouldn't be satisfied with a small dog. I'm into big, muscular, elegant, beautiful dogs that run hard and love to swim and can take all kinds of weather and are meant for working and coursing and hunting. QUOTE]
> 
> My JRT has more "go" than any big dog I have had/met. He LOVES to swim (more so than my parents two Golden's) and is, in general, a tough little guy.
> 
> I am also not really a small dog person. but I don't really consider the JRT a small dog (they certainly don't consider themselves small!!)


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## digits mama (Jun 13, 2007)

this is a silly thread..Just my opinion


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