# Guard dog : Male vs Female?



## Noobcakes (Jul 23, 2010)

Hey, I wanted ya'lls opinion on which gender makes a better guard dog for a house? an intact male or a spayed bitch? 

I don't know if it's a breed thing or a gender trait, but I heard female Dobermans are better protecting the house than males. 

I have a female mutt so that's why I am asking, because if a intact male is better at protecting, I will get her a play mate


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## KaseyT (May 7, 2008)

Any noisy large dog is all you need. No burglar ever chooses the house where the loud bark in coming from.


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## Curbside Prophet (Apr 28, 2006)

I wouldn't go near an angry bitch... I'm just say'n.


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## Papilove (May 20, 2010)

Curbside Prophet said:


> I wouldn't go near an angry bitch... I'm just say'n.


Funny, but also true. Bitches have a tendency to be more territorial. In my past experience, the females make the best home guardians, and the males make the best personal guardians. Of course there is a huge overlap, and that is a very big generalization, but as a jump off point, I'd stand by it.


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## Morrwyn (Aug 13, 2009)

Curbside Prophet said:


> I wouldn't go near an angry bitch... I'm just say'n.


Oh Curb....


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## Noobcakes (Jul 23, 2010)

From my experience, I've had a Great Dane that was massive and everyone was scared of him, but was the BIGGEST baby ever! He literally was "a gentle giant". My uncle also has a Retriever mix that is huge but really just a puppy at heart. This topic came to mind the other day when I was looking at guardian breeds and it said "Doberman (female)". I never heard about the difference. My little girl I have now is at 7 weeks and a half and I can see her mood swings as a puppy. One minute she's being all loving and wants attention, the next one she wants to bite your face off (LITERALLY) lol.


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## Nargle (Oct 1, 2007)

Get an alarm system.


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## JohnnyBandit (Sep 19, 2008)

Noobcakes said:


> Hey, I wanted ya'lls opinion on which gender makes a better guard dog for a house? an intact male or a spayed bitch?
> 
> I don't know if it's a breed thing or a gender trait, but I heard female Dobermans are better protecting the house than males.
> 
> I have a female mutt so that's why I am asking, because if a intact male is better at protecting, I will get her a play mate



The individual dog matters more than sex. You are looking for certain drives and temperament traits. Sex does not play a significant role.



Nargle said:


> Get an alarm system.


You can forget to turn an alarm on... Every little hoodlum learns how to bypass most commercial systems during their first stint in Juvie...... What is the alarm going to do if the bad guy decides to ignore the alarm. Ex spouses/significant others, stalkers, drug addicts, mentally unstable people do not always heed alarms. Those commercials are cool and all but they are not reality. Bad guys do ignore alarms.


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## Noobcakes (Jul 23, 2010)

Nargle said:


> Get an alarm system.


That would actually be worth something if I didn't live in a 3rd world country. Fire department closest to my house is an hour and a half away. The police station here is manned by 5 cops for the whole county. AND there are no alarm companies that service my area. And don't be fooled by those commercials from Brinks or other alarm companies. 

I wouldn't need a protection dog if I were home, I'm studying an hour away and I'm only home on the weekends. My mom stays home alone, so I want a dog for her.



JohnnyBandit said:


> The individual dog matters more than sex. You are looking for certain drives and temperament traits. Sex does not play a significant role.


Thanks. I guess with my current pup I'll have to see her traits as she gets older. I know her mom is very sweet, but has a high prey drive. I don't know who her dad is since she is a stray's puppy.


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## Curbside Prophet (Apr 28, 2006)

Get the neighbors to pitch in for private security. They are easier to train too.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

JohnnyBandit said:


> The individual dog matters more than sex. You are looking for certain drives and temperament traits. Sex does not play a significant role.
> 
> 
> 
> You can forget to turn an alarm on... Every little hoodlum learns how to bypass most commercial systems during their first stint in Juvie...... What is the alarm going to do if the bad guy decides to ignore the alarm. Ex spouses/significant others, stalkers, drug addicts, mentally unstable people do not always heed alarms. Those commercials are cool and all but they are not reality. Bad guys do ignore alarms.


 
Amen to that, I know of too many people who've had break ins despite alarms. I have a dog and a gun and the dog just gives me time to get to the gun LOL. 

Seriously, you need to consider what breed is goingto fit in best with the family and remember that it's going to be a MAJOR investment in time, training and money to ge the dog you want. You'll need to find a REPUTABLE working line breeder just for starters. My personal experiance is that females (spayed or not) make better Home gaurdians and tend to be best with children. I personally like the temperament of Dobes and Rottweilers the best if there are kids involved With GSD coming in a close 3rd. Of course I'm heavily biased as literally learned to walk pulling myself up on a pair of Dobes and my oldest daughters learned to walk pulling themselves up on my mom's Rott (who looked for them until the day he died if he heard their voices on the phone) and I currently have a Dobe girl who's my youngest daughters best friend.


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## Nargle (Oct 1, 2007)

JohnnyBandit said:


> You can forget to turn an alarm on... Every little hoodlum learns how to bypass most commercial systems during their first stint in Juvie...... What is the alarm going to do if the bad guy decides to ignore the alarm. Ex spouses/significant others, stalkers, drug addicts, mentally unstable people do not always heed alarms. Those commercials are cool and all but they are not reality. Bad guys do ignore alarms.


You can bypass any guard dog pretty easily with a single bullet or a poisoned chunk of hamburger.


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## Papilove (May 20, 2010)

In my opinion---you do not need to TRAIN a dog to guard you, especially the guardian breeds. What they do, they do naturally, and with more of a restraint than a trained guard dog. I believe--my opinion again, so that's all--no untrained civilian should own a trained guard dog. It's like giving them a gun with the safety latch broken off. They don't know how to work it right. The gun (dog) itself isn't 'bad', but the owner can't handle it.

A well-bred, stable guardian dog WILL protect its owner, territory... WILL... just naturally, but they will be 'normal' if you will in the realm of what an average person is able to handle.


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## Noobcakes (Jul 23, 2010)

cshellenberger said:


> Amen to that, I know of too many people who've had break ins despite alarms. I have a dog and a gun and the dog just gives me time to get to the gun LOL.
> 
> Seriously, you need to consider what breed is goingto fit in best with the family and remember that it's going to be a MAJOR investment in time, training and money to ge the dog you want. You'll need to find a REPUTABLE working line breeder just for starters. My personal experiance is that females (spayed or not) make better Home gaurdians and tend to be best with children. I personally like the temperament of Dobes and Rottweilers the best if there are kids involved With GSD coming in a close 3rd. Of course I'm heavily biased as literally learned to walk pulling myself up on a pair of Dobes and my oldest daughters learned to walk pulling themselves up on my mom's Rott (who looked for them until the day he died if he heard their voices on the phone) and I currently have a Dobe girl who's my youngest daughters best friend.



A dobe is the breed I've been convincing my mom to get. She said that she would rather have a great dane since she has already owned one and loved it. But danes are more just size then actual trouble. IMO the dobe would be best, but i think if she had to choose it would be great dane or GSD.



Nargle said:


> You can bypass any guard dog pretty easily with a single bullet or a poisoned chunk of hamburger.


You can bypass any security measure with a gun.... Most thieves would think twice about coming into a house they can see has a "fierce" dog in it. Just them knowing that there is a Doberman, or Rottweiler in the house, will deter them.


And let's not forget what the topic was please. My question was if a male or female dog would make a better guard dog, or if it's a trait issue. It's difficult for people who haven't lived in 3rd world countries to understand the difference between them and the US. When I lived in South Florida, police/ambulance/fire truck were all 5 minutes or less away. Here there are 3 police cars for the municipality if you need something and the cars aren't here, you will have to wait.


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## JohnnyBandit (Sep 19, 2008)

Nargle said:


> You can bypass any guard dog pretty easily with a single bullet or a poisoned chunk of hamburger.


Not as easy as you think.... It is easy to poision proof a dog. Besides if the dog is inside it is not likely to be accessible to baiting it with meat. In theory someone could break a window and drop a piece of meat in. But most decent dogs would not be paying attention to some bait being dropped in once the window was broken. In any case, Poision takes time to work, possibly hours. Anyone that goes through that sort of planning is likely to choose another target. It would be easier and quicker to bypass an alarm than poision a dog. The bypass is more reliable. 

On the gun thing...... If the dog is in a yard, maybe... A dog inside is a different matter. It is protected until the bad guy gets inside. Once he is inside he is right there with the dog. No room for error. Dark house that the dog knows, odds favor the dog. 

Bottom line is a dog is a better deterrant than an alarm. A dog offers a chance for real protection if someone gets inside. An alarm does not.


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## wvasko (Dec 15, 2007)

> Amen to that, I know of too many people who've had break ins despite alarms. I have a dog and a gun and the dog just gives me time to get to the gun LOL.


Love it and with some dogs you can even make a pot of coffee before checking whatever's left of burglar.



> You can bypass any guard dog pretty easily with a single bullet or a poisoned chunk of hamburger.


Of course you can but harder to do with dog in home. Nothing is perfect you are just trying to up the odds.



> The individual dog matters more than sex. You are looking for certain drives and temperament traits. Sex does not play a significant role.


A double ditto on this.


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## Noobcakes (Jul 23, 2010)

I can't wait for my puppy to grow, atm she has a schedule of her own. Sometimes it's sleep all night, sometimes its play at 3 am


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## Inga (Jun 16, 2007)

I have had both males and females that were awesome watch dogs and others of both sex that were horrid. Each dog is an individual. One never knows how they will truly react in a situation either. Your fierce watch dog might hide under the bed if threatened. All though Hollywood likes to portray certain breeds as the ultimate watch dog, I know a whole lot of individuals in those breeds that would run for the hills if threatened. One of them is laying at my feet right now.


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## Noobcakes (Jul 23, 2010)

Inga said:


> . All though Hollywood likes to portray certain breeds as the ultimate watch dog, I know a whole lot of individuals in those breeds that would run for the hills if threatened. One of them is laying at my feet right now.


hehehe  I guess you're right. You can't say anything until the situation occurs.


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## Marsh Muppet (Nov 29, 2008)

My male Rott had to be trained to bark at the approach of an intruder, but he would only do it when we were home. Apparently, he didn't want to scare them off before he could get a piece of the interloper. This was tested with a suited-up volunteer. The dog would make no sound or move until the "victim" was halfway in the window. Then, the miscreant was not getting out without leaving something behind.

A serious dog, who will deliver a serious bite, is a serious responsibility. If treated as such, they can be an excellent addition to a home security plan. Don't *Richard* around with any half-fast training schemes. Carefully select a dog of the proper breeding and temperament (mental stability is a must), and start him/her off right.

Regarding the original question, males and females are different, but neither is necessarily better. An intact male may develop other interests if there is a bitch in heat nearby, and a dog is no good for home defense if he's not home. I've not noticed any change in personality or drive in males neutered after completing all the developmental phases. Once the dog has developed his adult personality, you can snip at will.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Papilove said:


> In my opinion---you do not need to TRAIN a dog to guard you, especially the guardian breeds. What they do, they do naturally, and with more of a restraint than a trained guard dog. I believe--my opinion again, so that's all--no untrained civilian should own a trained guard dog. It's like giving them a gun with the safety latch broken off. They don't know how to work it right. The gun (dog) itself isn't 'bad', but the owner can't handle it.
> 
> A well-bred, stable guardian dog WILL protect its owner, territory... WILL... just naturally, but they will be 'normal' if you will in the realm of what an average person is able to handle.


 
Absolutely, positively WRONG. If a dog has a guard intstinct you HAVE to train the dog so that it's under control AT ALL TIMES. A dog with a strong gaurdian instinct that isn't trained is a huge liability. I know of dogs that are trained to the point they can be in the air to grab a persons arm and the handler yell OUT, turn mid-air and not grab the cuff. ANYONE that has a drivey dog has to be sure they train train TRAIN.


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## JohnnyBandit (Sep 19, 2008)

cshellenberger said:


> Absolutely, positively WRONG. If a dog has a guard intstinct you HAVE to train the dog so that it's under control AT ALL TIMES. A dog with a strong gaurdian instinct that isn't trained is a huge liability. I know of dogs that are trained to the point they can be in the air to grab a persons arm and the handler yell OUT, turn mid-air and not grab the cuff. ANYONE that has a drivey dog has to be sure they train train TRAIN.



I take it to the point of teaching my dog to fight and bite. But it all starts with the "out!"


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## wvasko (Dec 15, 2007)

> All though Hollywood likes to portray certain breeds as the ultimate watch dog, I know a whole lot of individuals in those breeds that would run for the hills if threatened. One of them is laying at my feet right now.


Many yrs ago I Had GSP before I was even thinking of becoming a dog trainer that I trained right out of the Koehler guard dog book that was a manstopper when the moment of truth came. I have also had a couple Weimies that were fantastic. As I have repeated a number of times it's not the breed in the dog it's the dog in the breed that does the work. I'm sure many of us have had pure bred dogs of whatever breed that absolutely kicked butt doing another breed's job. That might be an interesting thread to start.

Then just imagine what some mixed breed dogs are capable of, you just never know until you try.


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## Inga (Jun 16, 2007)

wvasko said:


> I'm sure many of us have had pure bred dogs of whatever breed that absolutely kicked butt doing another breeds job. That might be an interesting thread to start.
> 
> Then just imagine what some mixed breed dogs are capable of, you just never know until you try.


My old girl Inga went to a field trial with a friend of mine and her Master Hunt Lab. I was heckled by the good ol' boys the second I got out of the car with my Rottie. The heckled didn't stop until my previously untrained Rottweiler chose to out do most of the Labs at the trial on bird retrievals. It took her watching 2 dogs to figure out what "mark it" meant and then the retrieve was easy. We were actually just there to watch but... The good ol' boys stood there with their jaws dropped and for the most part, shut their mouths. I didn't have to say a word, my dog did the talking for me. There are no limits to what a dog with the right temperament and drive can do. They had always heckeled my friend with her conformation champion Lab as well but her dog flew to the top of his game quickly too. You would think they would learn to not judge a dog by the looks wouln't you?


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## RedyreRottweilers (Dec 17, 2006)

The individual does matter more than the sex, however, in general, male dogs are harder than the bitches. In certain breed the sex matters less. There is very little difference in territoriality and defense drive between male and female Rottweilers. In Dobes and Shepherds, sometimes the bitches are slightly softer.

With a Dobe you will want to make certain you get a dog from working lines if you want a real dog that means business at the fence line. In the US in particular, much of this behavior has been bred out of the dogs, plus they are not of the substance that most of the European dogs are.

IMO if you are serious about having dogs protect your perimeter, you need 2 dogs, M & F. Some people will take their chances with one dog. 2 is a different story, especially if they are serious about their job.

You sound like you have done your research, so I'm sure you understand that early socialization and *training* is very important for a dog who is destined for work such as you describe.

Good luck! I sleep really well, and have for years with multiple Rottweilers running my house and grounds. I call it "the big black dog" deterrant.


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## Papilove (May 20, 2010)

I just wanted to clarify my position on something. I did not mean TRAINING was bad. Control training as in obedience and other bonding type work is essential... training specifically to attack in my opinion is VERY dangerous for anyone not 100% committed to living 'the life' 24 hours a day. Most of the people on here are so dedicated... the average dog owner is NOT. They are not capable of the type of dedication required to have a sharply trained dog... period. I've seen the macho type, and the mashmellow type, both that wanted 'killer' dogs (so to speak) and neither type capable of handling such dog. The average person, if they are in any way a decent dog owner is capable of handling a well-trained obedient dog with protective instincts.

Boy, I do have to shake my head though, Red, if what you say is true, the Dobies here in America have sunk to horrible lows. I've read this over and over on the forum here since joining and it just makes me so sad. There were of course, divisions even back in my day, but it was the exception rather than the absolute rule.

I do think I know how it happened, the origianal dobies that were imported here were so sharp they quickly developed that reputation they still "enjoy" (not) as killers who will turn on anything, so a lot of focus went into softening the edges... apparently way too much focus went into that instead of training, teaching owners, and weeding out inappropriate owners. Still, very sad.


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## Noobcakes (Jul 23, 2010)

Marsh Muppet said:


> My male Rott had to be trained to bark at the approach of an intruder, but he would only do it when we were home. Apparently, he didn't want to scare them off before he could get a piece of the interloper. This was tested with a suited-up volunteer. The dog would make no sound or move until the "victim" was halfway in the window. Then, the miscreant was not getting out without leaving something behind.
> 
> A serious dog, who will deliver a serious bite, is a serious responsibility. If treated as such, they can be an excellent addition to a home security plan. Don't *Richard* around with any half-fast training schemes. Carefully select a dog of the proper breeding and temperament (mental stability is a must), and start him/her off right.
> 
> Regarding the original question, males and females are different, but neither is necessarily better. An intact male may develop other interests if there is a bitch in heat nearby, and a dog is no good for home defense if he's not home. I've not noticed any change in personality or drive in males neutered after completing all the developmental phases. Once the dog has developed his adult personality, you can snip at will.


I LOVE your signature LOL. I think I wouldn't really want a "trained" attack dog really, but just one that will protect my mom if a situation comes up.


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## wvasko (Dec 15, 2007)

> Good luck! I sleep really well, and have for years with multiple Rottweilers running my house and grounds. I call it "the big black dog" deterrant.


Yes but you do realize that would be bad guys getting killed in a Rottie stampede is not the same as a guard dog defending his home.


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## RedyreRottweilers (Dec 17, 2006)

Hey, as long as the threat is neutralized, wvasko, no real difference if they did it with their teeth or their feet, right?


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

> Don't **Richard* *around with any half-fast training schemes


*ROFL!!!!* Fabulous.


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## wvasko (Dec 15, 2007)

RedyreRottweilers said:


> Hey, as long as the threat is neutralized, wvasko, no real difference if they did it with their teeth or their feet, right?


Agreed and then you don't have to fool around with all that dental flossing stuff.


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## Marsh Muppet (Nov 29, 2008)

Marsh Muppet said:


> Don't *Richard* around with any half-fast training schemes.





Xeph said:


> *ROFL!!!!* Fabulous.


Yeah, word is, Curb is on an anti-cursing jihad. I'm dragging out my old box of euphemisms, entendres, and polysemous phrasings.

More to the point, I've seen a few really stupid ways to train "protection" dogs. Like the two brothers who took turns agitating their skittish Rotty pup. What could possibly go wrong with that?


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## Noobcakes (Jul 23, 2010)

RedyreRottweilers said:


> The individual does matter more than the sex, however, in general, male dogs are harder than the bitches. In certain breed the sex matters less. There is very little difference in territoriality and defense drive between male and female Rottweilers. In Dobes and Shepherds, sometimes the bitches are slightly softer.
> 
> With a Dobe you will want to make certain you get a dog from working lines if you want a real dog that means business at the fence line. In the US in particular, much of this behavior has been bred out of the dogs, plus they are not of the substance that most of the European dogs are.
> 
> ...


Would that be a M & F of same breed or just a male or female dog? cause I have a female puppy, so the best thing would be to get a male puppy from a protection/guardian breed? 


Also, after all the posts, I'm going to tell my mom to get a gun, in addition to the dogs


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## Marsh Muppet (Nov 29, 2008)

Noobcakes said:


> I'm going to tell my mom to get a gun, in addition to the dogs


The vast majority of creeps will be deterred by a large barking dog. The vast majority of the remainder will remember a previous appointment when they hear the slide of a 12 gauge pump shotgun being racked. Copper plated 000 buckshot is for the small number of freaks who won't take any hints.


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## Noobcakes (Jul 23, 2010)

Haha so true, Marsh.


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## cshellenberger (Dec 2, 2006)

Papilove said:


> Boy, I do have to shake my head though, Red, if what you say is true, the Dobies here in America have sunk to horrible lows. I've read this over and over on the forum here since joining and it just makes me so sad. There were of course, divisions even back in my day, but it was the exception rather than the absolute rule.
> 
> I do think I know how it happened, the origianal dobies that were imported here were so sharp they quickly developed that reputation they still "enjoy" (not) as killers who will turn on anything, so a lot of focus went into softening the edges... apparently way too much focus went into that instead of training, teaching owners, and weeding out inappropriate owners. Still, very sad.


 
They haven't sunk to lows, they've been bred softer because most American's DON'T want Gaurdians or to have to 'work' their dogs. The Friendlier traits have been bred for and work has been put on the back burner.


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