# Struvite crystals in urine - need food help!



## risuchan (Jan 17, 2013)

Hi all, new here, I did search the forums but didn't find anything exactly relating to my situation.
I have a 3 pound, 3 year old chihuahua (possibly mixed with papillon) who was my foster dog first (for, like, 1 day of course  ) and was rescued from a puppy mill with 200 others. When I first got her, she had a UTI that would NOT go away. It delayed her being spayed, even. However, she has not had one since, and that was almost 3 years ago. She goes potty both inside and out, inside on puppy pads. Recently I noticed on one of her puppy pads that her urine spots were "sparkly," and immediately knew there were crystals!
Just got back from the vet today, she only had struvite crystals but a LOT of them, no UTI or bacteria or other kinds of crystals, and no stones showed on x-rays. The vet of course put her on Science Diet C/D with a recheck in 2 weeks. However I DO NOT want her to be on this the rest of her life.
Any suggestions for a tiny dog who does not and has not had any bladder/kidney stones, but DOES need her urine pH balanced? Definitely want something that is made in the U.S. and preferably human-grade!! Thank you all so much for any advice!

P.S. here is a picture of Mushi: http://puppy-story.com/?p=212

-Mushi's mom


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## tlm (Jan 17, 2013)

Hi, I had a toy poodle that had crystals as a puppy too. Our vet did the Science Diet C/D and that cleared it up. She was able to eat anything after about six months and she is 11 now and crystals never came back! Do stay away from anything high in sodium though.


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## taquitos (Oct 18, 2012)

Struvite crystals are from pee that is too basic. Usually that happens when they are on a diet that is high in grain.

Science Diet is no good for dogs. It will chemically change the pH balance of their pee so that it is more acidic. What they don't tell you at the vet is that you do not need to do it chemically; their pH balance can be altered by changing their diet to a mostly meat based one. If you are on kibble with grain, switch to a grain free kibble... even better yet, switch him to raw if you are open to it. You also want to make sure he gets lots of moisture; add wet food and mix it with his dry, or if you feed him raw then you don't need to worry so much since meat has lots of moisture.

The last thing you need is a mostly grain based food like Science Diet to combat struvite crystals.

One of my cats had struvite crystals, but he hasn't had a single flare up since he has been switched to raw. Different species, but a very common problem in cats that are on kibble.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Are you sure she hasn't an UTI brewing? Get a sterile sample taken and have it cultured for as long as you can talk the vet and lab into doing. Bacteria are usually on the bladder wall so it isn't easy to find or culture bacteria sometimes.

What is her pH? If it has always been high then maybe these are sterile struvites but I agree with tlm, a meaty diet could help as it should naturally produce a more acidic urine. And taquitos is right too, force fluids as best you can. Those crystals were scary, be less scary if she passed fewer in a greater volume of fluid!

And here is an article with further readings.
http://www.dogaware.com/articles/wdjstruvites.html


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## risuchan (Jan 17, 2013)

Thanks for the replies everyone! Do any of you have experience with Honest Kitchen dog food? That is my top choice for switching her to right now.


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## Bones' Mom (Jan 21, 2013)

I just rescued my American Bulldog/Boxer mix three months ago. He had symtoms of lower urinary disease from day one. We went to the vet two weeks ago and we were given antibiotics for the infection and a liquid medicine I had to inject into his prepuce! I was told his urinalysis did not show crystals but that there was a lot of sediment in it. 

We went back yesterday for his check up and he wasn't any better! This different vet said something about his white blood cells and red blood cells and that the normal level for something was 6 or 7 and Bones' was 100! He also saw one crystal but couldn't tell what kind becaue of all the sediment in his sample. He gave me a stronger antibiotic to give Bones for 2 more weeks and a pain medication. He also prescribed Royal Canin Urinary SO. Up to this point I've been feeding Bones Fromm Gold which is naturally formulated with duck, chicken, lamb, whole eggs & real Wisconsin cheese. In addition, they enhance the Gold recipes with probiotics to aid digestion and salmon oil for a healthy coat.. Here is the list of protein, fat, etc.: Crude Protein 24% Min; Crude Fat 16% Min; Crude Fiber 3.5% Max; Moisture 10% Max; Omega 3 Fatty Acids0.5% Min; Omega 6 Fatty Acids 2.5% Min; Total Microorganisms 220,264 CFU/g Min. I've read here and in other places that Royal Canin is garbage, mostly corn and grain.

My question is... do I listen to the vet and give Bones the Royal Canin even though I believe it's inferior to what I've already been feeding him? The vet said if the RC works he will have to be on it for life. Or do I continue to feed him the Fromm's with minor changes such as using distilled water and cranberry and Vitamin C?


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Arrgh, messed up and went to a thread from this tab and lost my post!

Main thing is to force fluids. I floated meals with the amount of water that comes up on this calculator. http://www.mycockerspaniel.com/h2o.htm More is better of course and you can spike the water with broth or some canned food if the dog doesn't care for plain water. The dog also needs lots of opportunities to void each day as well. I imagine the vet gave you that information too.

The Fromm is a moderate ash food. You could do the work and compare RC to Fromm. If RC is low calorie then the dog might actually take in more calcium and phosphorus from RC than Fromm. What you need to find is how many calories per kg of each and convert cups fed to grams. Once you have that you could multiply the grams fed by the % of calcium, phosphorus in the two foods. I cannot find a detailed analysis of RC to do this, perhaps you can. That would give you some info to show the vet that it isn't the food you are feeding your dog, it really is because it isn't responding to meds. This is the detailed analysis. http://frommfamily.com/pdf/typical-analysis/gold-dog-dry-adult.pdf

I think that UTI is just a really nasty one. Did the vet change antibiotics? The one that should have worked never did with Sassy, had to go to the super duper one that kills appetite - yuck.


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## Pugtown (Aug 9, 2012)

risuchan said:


> Hi all, new here, I did search the forums but didn't find anything exactly relating to my situation.
> I have a 3 pound, 3 year old chihuahua (possibly mixed with papillon) who was my foster dog first (for, like, 1 day of course  ) and was rescued from a puppy mill with 200 others. When I first got her, she had a UTI that would NOT go away. It delayed her being spayed, even. However, she has not had one since, and that was almost 3 years ago. She goes potty both inside and out, inside on puppy pads. Recently I noticed on one of her puppy pads that her urine spots were "sparkly," and immediately knew there were crystals!
> Just got back from the vet today, she only had struvite crystals but a LOT of them, no UTI or bacteria or other kinds of crystals, and no stones showed on x-rays. The vet of course put her on Science Diet C/D with a recheck in 2 weeks. However I DO NOT want her to be on this the rest of her life.
> Any suggestions for a tiny dog who does not and has not had any bladder/kidney stones, but DOES need her urine pH balanced? Definitely want something that is made in the U.S. and preferably human-grade!! Thank you all so much for any advice!
> ...


Feed a diet that will produce a more acidic urine - like grain free and higher protein. You can also give Vit C to help with acidity. I use Garden of Life Raw C. There are supplements with DL-methionine (an amino acid) you can purchase also like "Wysong Biotic pH-" or other. Grains are alkalizing. Feeding a high moisture diet also helps whether you're flooding kibble with water or feeding canned food or raw food. You can also give D-mannose, a bacteria-binding type of sugar like the ingredient in cranberry. Also get some pH strips so you can test the urine periodically.


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## Bones' Mom (Jan 21, 2013)

Kathyy said:


> Arrgh, messed up and went to a thread from this tab and lost my post!
> 
> Main thing is to force fluids. I floated meals with the amount of water that comes up on this calculator. http://www.mycockerspaniel.com/h2o.htm More is better of course and you can spike the water with broth or some canned food if the dog doesn't care for plain water. The dog also needs lots of opportunities to void each day as well. I imagine the vet gave you that information too.
> 
> ...


Thanks Kathyy! Yes, I think his UTI is very bad. Like I said, I've had the poor little guy for about 3 months but he was with a foster and rescue for about 2 months prior to that! So who knows how long he's had it?!! The first vet, at the same vet clinic, gave him antibiotics but I don't think they were that strong. The main vet saw him this weekend and put him on stronger antiobiotics. And like you said, I don't think it's the food I'm feeding him, he had this when I got him! He does drink a lot of water though, thankfully. I think if he didn't his numbers would be worse and he'd probably have crystals, his urine was so bad... I'm hoping that once this round of antibiotics kicks in I can get him off of the RC. I think I'll give it to him just for the month that the vet recommends, and if he's o.k. after that, put him back on better food. What do you think?


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## lucygoose (Feb 11, 2008)

Hi!!
|
I have a female 3, almost 4 year old papillon who had these also....no infections, no stones just the struvite crystals....I have two paps, and both were on grain free good foods.....Anabelle always was a dog that would hold her pee.....and then just go sometimes right in front of you.....now I know why, as the crystals hurt her to go potty.....on and off my vet would treat her with antibiotics for them.....about the 4th time I was like, wait...no more antibiotics.....she has no infection....let me look into this more, there has to be a better way......so I did.......there is a dog food store here (actually we have 3 good ones) that sell raw foods and all the good grain free foods....the one store I go to a lot, I asked the owner to help...she goes to Dr. Karen Becker.....(google her) and for this dog she said to get her on raw....I went the easy way...Primal brand raw foods, I don't have to worry about getting it right..... cranberry power, 1/8 teaspoon a day, and a product called Tinkle Tonic.....in 6 weeks later, I took in a urine and.....NO MORE STRUITE CRYSTALS!! My vet was writing it all down on her records and told me to keep up the good work!! I would take other urine sample in like at 8 weeks apart.....no crystals.....and now she doesn't hold her pee and asks out like a normal dog.....It has been a year this past December they have been on the raw....what a difference in everything!!...she needed moisture...get your dog off that garbage the vet wants you on....Good Luck to you!!

That is our story.....


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Wow, that is terrific!

I have read on dogaware that some owners use pH strips to check the urine regularly. If pH starts to rise then take action as that is when the crystals start to form.


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## lucygoose (Feb 11, 2008)

Thanks!!!!


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## Khembie (Oct 17, 2012)

I, unfortunately, have also done my fair amount of research in this area because I have a Shar Pei mix with recurrent UTIs. I am currently trying to come up with a homemade dog food that addresses all her needs (yeast allergy, UTI, ph balance, food sensitivities). I read somewhere that apple cider vinegar added to their water daily can help balance the ph in their bodies naturally as well.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Meat promotes acidic urine. A raw diet can be the very simplest diet and best for allergies. Zero grains and plants mean yeast growth isn't promoted. Thought about going to raw? I originally did because throwing away the bones from the cooked chicken the dogs were getting annoyed me. On raw Max eats the bones!


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## taquitos (Oct 18, 2012)

Kathyy said:


> Meat promotes acidic urine. A raw diet can be the very simplest diet and best for allergies. Zero grains and plants mean yeast growth isn't promoted. Thought about going to raw? I originally did because throwing away the bones from the cooked chicken the dogs were getting annoyed me. On raw Max eats the bones!


+1 for this. Too many grains in the diet makes their pee basic, so they can't break down the crystals. Also raw meat has a lot of moisture so it helps with that too


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Clarification. Max only ate the raw bones. I was annoyed boning the cooked chicken and not happy boning raw chicken but at least those bones didn't go in the garbage. And Sassy would steal those cooked bones from the garbage right under my nose! 16 years old and she could still outfox me........


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