# Taking a bone away from your dog



## JustTess (Mar 19, 2008)

When I was a girl, I was told once you give a dog a bone, you let him have it. Do not take it away because it could be dangerous. Perhaps I was a young child I was told this.

Later, a dog had good manners if the owner could take the bone from their dogs without any issues. I was able to do this with my Samoyed quite easily (from what I remember).

Well, today, both of my dogs had a rib bone. Lola was being very fustrated and she did not show any interest in her bone, she wanted Ilya's. I separated her to a different part of the room with her bone.

Ilya was so mezmerized by the bone, he hardly noticed he was off the towel and now eating on the carpet (yuck). I called his name and he looked at me but wouldn't stop chewing. Here is where I made my mistake... I reached for the bone and he growled and snapped. He had his teeth on my hand but he didn't bite at all. I retrieve my hand and call out his name again.... he growls a little bit. 

I do think I need to train him regarding bones. He doesn't have a problem with me taking food away from him in the past. I guess it was his 2nd bone.

Well, I'm thinking I need to break his concentration because he has never reacted this way towards me. I turn on the vacuum cleaner that was near me and quickly turned it off. Ilya's mouth is now off of the bone and I tell him I want him to lay down on the towel. He takes his bone to the towel and continues eating... I tell him he's a good boy and he gives me a smile and 3 tail wags.

Is there a better way to have handled this without confrontation? Lola, did not care if I constantly took her bone away from her.

I have not asked Ilya to "leave it" or "drop it" with food before. What would you use?


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## wizer (Dec 23, 2008)

Here are my thoughts and let me preface it by saying there are those on this board that know a lot more than I do.

This is based on my own experiences and what I read. 

Some breeds of dog and some temperaments (there can be overlap here but they can also be separate and distinct things) will allow their master to remove food from their mouths without even a spec of hostility. Such as my dog. 

Others are less predictable and are downright hostile when you try to take food away and that can be quite dangerous. If you don't know your dog then don't do it and if you think you do know your dog but you never tried it before then proceed with extreme caution if at all.

I find that the "drop it" command can be used for ANYTHING the dog puts in it's mouth, why not?

Consider using the command and offering something else to the dog at the same time.


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## TooneyDogs (Aug 6, 2007)

You are better off using object exchanges where the dog freely gives up the item (drops it) and gets something 'better'. You make what you are holding 'better' by waving it, shaking it....enticing him. This teaches the dog that they do not have to guard resources and is how you start teaching the "Give" or "Drop It" command.


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## JustTess (Mar 19, 2008)

Thanks guys! This sort of caught me off guard because both of the dogs will drop their toys when asked without a trade. 



> what you are holding 'better' by waving it, shaking it....enticing him


I forgot about this. I could have gotten a piece of chicken telling Ilya to drop it.


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## smileypits (Dec 25, 2008)

Hi!

I'm new and unexperienced in this forum, but not to dogs.

Make him chew it in your hand, don't let him tug it away. If he does try - take it away and put it up for 2 minutes. Try again. Make him chew it while you hold on to it and about every 10-15 seconds, pull it away. If he sits patiently for 2-3 seconds - reward him by giving him back the bone to chew on. If he growls or continues to try to jump/grab it - put it up for 2 minutes and start over. Just start with something small like this... then add a command to it like "drop it" as you pull the bone away.

Merry Christmas - Hope it was safe & warm.


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

Isn't taking the bone away entierly going to contribute to the posessiveness? I think that trading is better, so he knows you won't take his things away from him. I dunno.


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## Westhighlander (Sep 28, 2007)

smileypits said:


> Hi!
> 
> I'm new and unexperienced in this forum, but not to dogs.
> 
> ...


This is not training "drop it" as he is suppose to freely give it up not because you pull it away. Your method is teaching him that you take good things away from him."


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## GroovyGroomer777 (Aug 21, 2008)

I agree with the good old "trade off". Works like a charm for me. My dogs are very food motivated, all I have to do is open the treat jar in the kitchen and they drop what they are doing (even a tasty raw bone) and come running. They all get the treats, and I retrieve their bones.


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## Inga (Jun 16, 2007)

I have unfortunately taken in several dogs that were resource guarding types. I found the best way to deal with this is the "trade up" method of training. Just as stated you offer some high value item to the dog. It isn't quite that simple though. I think this training needs to go on for long periods of time and offering a good treat doesn't mean he/she will automatically lose their possession. I mean, while your dog is eating you could toss a few small pieces of chicken into their bowl but do not take their food away. Do this often and your hand coming down to their bowl begins representing something wonderful to the dog. (yummy chicken) Same goes for when they have a special toy or treat. Hand coming down is offering, not taking away. I think in your case, I would also up the training in all parts of his training. Do you use the "Nothing in life is free" method of training? Meaning that your dog needs to work for everything he gets. This makes him see you as the boss without you trying to assert dominance over him. He needs to sit stay for his dinner or do a down before being let out etc... Having a dog that resource guards is dangerous and you should work on it. Do you have any trainers around your area that can help you? I don't want you to get bit and sometimes people trying to train a dog to give items up will inadvertently make it worse. It would be best for you to work with a skilled trainer at least for a little while. The good news is, you can get your dog over that.


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## tirluc (Aug 29, 2006)

i have always taught my dogs that whatever they have is mine.....i can give it to them, but i can also take it away.....they are taught, not only a "drop it" it command...which means i want it dropped and them to leave it alone at that time (used generally w/ playing "chuck-it" or if they pick up something they aren't supposed to have)....but a "give it" command, which means "i want it"....w/ this i actually will use a bone as this is generally a "high stakes" prize for them....as mentioned above, i hold it while they chew it but every now and then i will tell them "give it" and have them release it (i usually use their collar to have them release), tell them how good they were and wait a bit (a few seconds to start) then tell them they can chew it again....the quicker the release, the quicker the return.....after the are releasing well this way then i will let them take it away and lay down to chew on it and every now and then walk over, tell them to "give it" and take it from them.....if they growl or snap it is taken away for awhile (hrs) and tried again later....i had a food aggressive/resource guarding dog that i did this w/ for about a wk and you can take anything from her now just by using the "give it"....even my GD can take things from her.....

i also agree w/ Inga on getting the help of a trainer.....


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## myminpins (Dec 20, 2008)

I totally agree with this. YOU control your dog and if YOU want whatever is in its mouth, NO MATTER WHAT, that dog better give it to you. It could be poison, it could be a pin-filled hot dog, etc. It's not teaching him you take good things away from him, it's teaching him OBEDIENCE because, hopefully never but maybe some day, it could save his life.

Dogs learn quickly that, if they do as they're asked to do, they are never "deprived" but rewarded. If they give it up quickly and easily, they get it back or something better. I've done this for years and it works very well. 

A dog should NEVER growl at YOU if you try to take his bone away. He can growl at another dog but not at YOU.



tirluc said:


> i have always taught my dogs that whatever they have is mine.....i can give it to them, but i can also take it away.....they are taught, not only a "drop it" it command...which means i want it dropped and them to leave it alone at that time (used generally w/ playing "chuck-it" or if they pick up something they aren't supposed to have)....but a "give it" command, which means "i want it"....w/ this i actually will use a bone as this is generally a "high stakes" prize for them....as mentioned above, i hold it while they chew it but every now and then i will tell them "give it" and have them release it (i usually use their collar to have them release), tell them how good they were and wait a bit (a few seconds to start) then tell them they can chew it again....the quicker the release, the quicker the return.....after the are releasing well this way then i will let them take it away and lay down to chew on it and every now and then walk over, tell them to "give it" and take it from them.....if they growl or snap it is taken away for awhile (hrs) and tried again later....i had a food aggressive/resource guarding dog that i did this w/ for about a wk and you can take anything from her now just by using the "give it"....even my GD can take things from her.....
> 
> i also agree w/ Inga on getting the help of a trainer.....


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## JustTess (Mar 19, 2008)

Yup, I have incorporated the NILIF techniques, though, I probably was a little lax about training the past few weeks with this Christmas rush and kinda let him have free run about the house.

I have not see him resource guard with me before. While feeding his regular meals, I don't have problems asking him to sit and taking his bowl up or even moving the dish with my foot because it was in the way. He'll even stop eating his biscut if I told him to drop it and he'll spit out the biscuit. LOL

Perhaps it was the novelty of his 2nd raw bone and the "la-la land" look he had in his eyes. He was definitely extremely excited.

Funny, I just told my son earlier this week to trade something with Ilya because he wouldn't give up my son's favorite stuffed animal he found. When TD mentioned it, I gave myself a "duh" forhead slap. I guess if I'm going to start giving him raw bones, I need to train him to getting used to taking it from him. He's been tossing the rib bones at me this morning wanting me to play with him. (I'm glad he didn't eat the entire bone this time) The next time I give him a raw bone, I'm going to make him work for it a little harder... I also liked your suggestion too Turlac.

I've tried trainers in my area and I wasn't particularly interested in them. I was looking on how to assist Ilya's breathing while re-training him for longer distances and I did not get very good results. Either I didn't buy into their theory or it seemed like they were reading from a book even generallizing all dogs. I was able to find some mushers who gave me some insight about the breathing, temperature, and building up his distance slowly.


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## wizer (Dec 23, 2008)

JustTess said:


> Yup, I have incorporated the NILIF techniques


What is NILIF?

Everytime I see that I think the person spelled MILF wrong.


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## Bearjing (Oct 24, 2008)

Nothing
In 
Life 
Is 
Free

There are some sticky threads in the training section which provide instructions / explanation.


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## melgrj7 (Sep 21, 2007)

I trade my dogs usually. My two will give me something without issue (so far anyway), but I still like to reward it. I also often have them give me something, give them a treat and then give the item right back, so they don't think that me taking something is bad. I actually kind of think that they think I'm just holding it for them so they can eat a treat, lol. I practice drop it and give it and leave it every single day. 

With the lab, she will growl and bite if you try to take anything from her, a ball, a sock, a towel, a bone . . . something she just happens to be laying next to and had no interest in until you went to get it. So I trade with her for everything (unless its an emergency, then I am bad . . . like when she stole my cell phone and started to chew it). Luckily she thinks anything you have is better, so she will trade a big meaty bone for a carrot.


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## smileypits (Dec 25, 2008)

I'm a firm believer in being able to take ANYTHING from my dogs. Anything. I expect them to know their place in our pack and I expect them to act appropriately as the lower members of the pack. A wild dog pack allows the alpha to take food right out of their mouths and they are hungry/havent eaten in awhile. It serves two purposes, 1- the alpha exerts his/her role and 2- the lower pack members are HAPPY to give it up to exert their roles. That said...

We had a puppy rescue this summer that was a One puppy litter - didn't grow up with any littermates and it showed by his resource guarding.... He just didn't get it, what is his is HIS, not ours. Instead of fighting with him about it - I begin a strict training schedule w/ him teathered to me all day. I controled everything he did, including how he ate his food (NILIF). Within 3 weeks, he was a submissive member of our pack and anyone could take anything from him.

Sometimes it has nothing to do with resource guarding - many times there are other symptoms indicating that the dog thinks he is the boss and the alpha of his/her pack. Take that away through NILIF and training and suddeningly - no more resource guarding.

My .02 cents


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## GroovyGroomer777 (Aug 21, 2008)

wizer said:


> What is NILIF?
> 
> Everytime I see that I think the person spelled MILF wrong.


 Tee-hee....<chuckles> men are such pigs!


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## JustTess (Mar 19, 2008)

I liked your post also smileypits. It's very similar to tirlac's and I personally think it is a matter of training Ilya, in the midst of his heightened excitement, how to get used to me handling him with a bone. 

Just this morning, he was tossing bones at my feet. Later, he collected all of them into the dining area and asked me to follow him when I was in the den. When I got to the dining area, he did one of his play bows infront of the bone. When I reached for it, he did a playful growl, so I tried trading it with another bone. LOL, he gave up the first bone for the other. Then I continued this using "leave it" each time. Trading something else.... including an unstuffed animal.

I was caught off guard yesterday mainly because, Ilya had never given me a warning before and I haven't seen him become possessive of anything.


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## myminpins (Dec 20, 2008)

It's probably good that he DOES give a warning, though. I think being sure you can take ANYTHING from your dog AT ANY TIME is very important. I'm glad he's generally fine and that he play bowed to you with the bones - that's adorable!


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## Westhighlander (Sep 28, 2007)

smileypits said:


> I'm a firm believer in being able to take ANYTHING from my dogs. Anything. I expect them to know their place in our pack and I expect them to act appropriately as the lower members of the pack. A wild dog pack allows the alpha to take food right out of their mouths and they are hungry/havent eaten in awhile. It serves two purposes, 1- the alpha exerts his/her role and 2- the lower pack members are HAPPY to give it up to exert their roles. That said...
> 
> We had a puppy rescue this summer that was a One puppy litter - didn't grow up with any littermates and it showed by his resource guarding.... He just didn't get it, what is his is HIS, not ours. Instead of fighting with him about it - I begin a strict training schedule w/ him teathered to me all day. I controled everything he did, including how he ate his food (NILIF). Within 3 weeks, he was a submissive member of our pack and anyone could take anything from him.
> 
> ...


Ability to control resource = Alpha. Ability to guard resource = control of resources. Control of resources = .....


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## Dogstar (May 11, 2007)

Tess, I can't answer the PM you sent me on the other topic, if you'd like me to ,enable PMs or email me? You can find my email from my profile.


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## TooneyDogs (Aug 6, 2007)

smileypits said:


> I'm a firm believer in being able to take ANYTHING from my dogs. Anything. I expect them to know their place in our pack and I expect them to act appropriately as the lower members of the pack.


And the dog learns that when a 3 year old child tries the same thing.. it's OK?? You really trust that training method that much? Or, do you fault the child that he/she wasn't 'Alpha' enough to take it away?


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## Battle Angel (Dec 23, 2008)

TooneyDogs said:


> And the dog learns that when a 3 year old child tries the same thing.. it's OK?? You really trust that training method that much? Or, do you fault the child that he/she wasn't 'Alpha' enough to take it away?


No 3 year olds at my house but if I did happen to have one over, they wouldn't be around my dogs while eating. Why ask for trouble? 

I can take anything out of my dogs mouths, trim their nails by myself, and groom every inch of them. Doesn't mean I'd let a 3 year old do it.


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## TooneyDogs (Aug 6, 2007)

Battle Angel said:


> I can take anything out of my dogs mouths, trim their nails by myself, and groom every inch of them. Doesn't mean I'd let a 3 year old do it.


Point was....the 'training method' of taking things away from a dog by force because we're bigger, stronger and just because we can does nothing to teach the dog the essential life skill of giving things up or dropping them on request/command.....by anyone, no matter how young or old....family member or not.


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## Battle Angel (Dec 23, 2008)

TooneyDogs said:


> Point was....the 'training method' of taking things away from a dog by force because we're bigger, stronger and just because we can does nothing to teach the dog the essential life skill of giving things up or dropping them on request/command.....by anyone, no matter how young or old....family member or not.


I'm not bigger and stronger than my Great Dane was. It has nothing to do with size. It has to do with not letting them be in charge. Dogs aren't people and you can't anthropomorphize your feelings onto them. You can't treat them like children. I've seen way too many obnoxious dogs whose owners treated them like children and couldn't bare to hurt their feelings by expecting them to mind. 

If my dog has plastic wrap in his mouth that tastes like food, I want him to give it to me immediately, not wait for me to find something he might want more while he swallows it. (Yes, I've seen it happen.)


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## Lonewolfblue (Oct 28, 2007)

Well, to share what I do with my dogs, they aren't resource guarders. Nell might occasionally give a small growl, which she just started recently since I hadn't been practicing this lately, but what I do now and then is when I give them a bone with a lot if meat on it, I'll let them have it at first, but then will take it from them to let them know it's my bone and I'm just sharing it, and will hold it for them while they pull the good meat off the bone. If you are feeding raw bones, give this a try. Just sit there with the dog, letting them pick the bone clean with you holding it, then after a little bit, give the bone back to them for a while. It's kind of like feeding their kibble where you sit and hand feed them, you are letting them know that you are the one that controls the food, and everything else.

Now what's really funny is what Betty does. When I take it from her, she gives me the look like, go ahead, try it, it's really, really good, go ahead, try it, youll like it, lol. Same with Chloe but not as cool as how Betty does it. lol.


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## TooneyDogs (Aug 6, 2007)

Battle Angel said:


> If my dog has plastic wrap in his mouth that tastes like food, I want him to give it to me immediately, not wait for me to find something he might want more while he swallows it. (Yes, I've seen it happen.)


Big difference between GIVE and TAKE by force....what this tread is about. Give is trained at an early age in preparation for those moments when plastic wrap is about to be swallowed.....and bribing is not involved in this training.


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## Battle Angel (Dec 23, 2008)

TooneyDogs said:


> Big difference between GIVE and TAKE by force....what this tread is about. Give is trained at an early age in preparation for those moments when plastic wrap is about to be swallowed.....and bribing is not involved in this training.


Semantics. The dog doesn't see a difference. Either way he gave up what he had to you and you now have it. You can't take anything out of his mouth unless he lets you.



TooneyDogs said:


> Big difference between GIVE and TAKE by force....what this tread is about. Give is trained at an early age in preparation for those moments when plastic wrap is about to be swallowed.....and bribing is not involved in this training.


I must have missed the post that mentioned 'taking by force' but I confess I may have skipped one or two. I thought we were discussing whether or not to bribe the dog to give up what's in his mouth or whether to expect him to relinquish it when you 'take' it from him 'just because you said so'.


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## JustTess (Mar 19, 2008)

Battle Angel said:


> I'm not bigger and stronger than my Great Dane was. It has nothing to do with size. It has to do with not letting them be in charge. Dogs aren't people and you can't anthropomorphize your feelings onto them. You can't treat them like children. I've seen way too many obnoxious dogs whose owners treated them like children and couldn't bare to hurt their feelings by expecting them to mind.
> 
> If my dog has plastic wrap in his mouth that tastes like food, I want him to give it to me immediately, not wait for me to find something he might want more while he swallows it. (Yes, I've seen it happen.)


I'm going to kindfully disagree with you Battle Angel. 

Ilya will not touch anything left around my house 95% (est)of the time. He has to wait for me to give him his toys to play with and when he's done, I pick them up.

The time I caught him with a burger wrapper in his mouth (left on the coffee table), I clapped my hands and told him to drop it. He quickly did it and cowered his head.

The dilema I had with the bone was the fact I gave it to him, it was a new exciting experience, and I had not trained him to release something as incredibly mesmerizing as the bone. 

Force doesn't work very well with Ilya on commands I expect him to obey daily. I'll save force for emergencies. My son has been dictating things to Ilya trying to train him with new things and he has been having difficulty getting Ilya to comply.(He has also been reading a lot about being Alpha  ) He will do it for me for praise. 

ehhh... I'm probably going to try another bone later next week since I'm supplementing his diet. This time, I'm going to holding on to it and asking him to "drop it". I don't see Ilya snatching it out of my hand and being aggressive.... he grumbles when he doesn't like what I tell him to do.




> Now what's really funny is what Betty does. When I take it from her, she gives me the look like, go ahead, try it, it's really, really good, go ahead, try it, youll like it, lol. Same with Chloe but not as cool as how Betty does it. lol.


Ha ha ha.... Lola, our terrier-mix, had been eyeing Ilya's bone and I had to put her on the other side of the room because she kept staring at Ilya's. She didn't want to chew on hers. After Ilya picked most of the meat off of the bone, he walked over to Lola and gave her his bone. She was soooooo happy to chew on it. Ilya does some very strange things I haven't seen a dog do before....


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## rosemaryninja (Sep 28, 2007)

Battle Angel said:


> Semantics. The dog doesn't see a difference. Either way he gave up what he had to you and you now have it. You can't take anything out of his mouth unless he lets you.


The difference may seem purely semantical, but if you'll look at the way "give" is trained, you'll realise it's not. If you take something from him, he's tolerating it -- you can call this submission, respect, whatever you want. But if you train "give" or "drop it", he's happy to give it to you because he has been conditioned to believe that dropping the object on cue is more rewarding than keeping it. It's got nothing to do with anthropomorphising and everything to do with basic conditioning.


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## JustTess (Mar 19, 2008)

rosemaryninja said:


> The difference may seem purely semantical, but if you'll look at the way "give" is trained, you'll realise it's not. If you take something from him, he's tolerating it -- you can call this submission, respect, whatever you want. But if you train "give" or "drop it", he's happy to give it to you because he has been conditioned to believe that dropping the object on cue is more rewarding than keeping it. It's got nothing to do with anthropomorphising and everything to do with basic conditioning.


rosemary... I think you helped me realize I have several different paradigms mixed up just as this thread has varying points of view. I must be thinking too hard


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## rosemaryninja (Sep 28, 2007)

JustTess said:


> rosemary... I think you helped me realize I have several different paradigms mixed up just as this thread has varying points of view. I must be thinking too hard


If one of my dogs growls at me when I reach for her bone, I do nothing. Be careful not to discourage the growl. The growl is an indication of discomfort -- a "ummm I'm not sure if I'm really okay with this happening," and reprimanding the growl often results in a dog that bites without warning. 

A lot of people will say this means that I'm submitting to my dog. To be completely honest, I don't completely buy into the submitting/dominating thing. Instead, what I do is I treat it the same way I do when I'm trying to train my dog to do something that I know they might not really want to do. Say, for example, recall. Just as you train recall by making "coming to you" more rewarding than "staying over there", you train a drop it by making "releasing bone" more rewarding than "keeping bone." *Dogs will do what they feel is most rewarding to them.* Just because a growl is involved doesn't mean it automatically has to be an issue with respect.

If I were you, I would start training "drop it" with the bribery method. As with anything else, set your dog up for success, so HIGH-value treats are needed. I would make the reinforcement ratio very, very high. Maybe do a bribe for every single "drop it" at first, and then later a bribe for every 3 of 5 "drop it"s. 

So, does that mean you're going to have to keep a strip of bacon in your pocket all the time in case Ilya picks up something he shouldn't? Well, do you have to keep a strip of bacon in your pocket all the time in case Ilya doesn't come when he's called? No, you don't. You heavily reinforce a good recall the majority of the time so that in the odd chance that you don't have treats on you, the variable reinforcement schedule is high enough for him to come back to you for the _chance_ he might get a treat. Same for the "drop it". You heavily reinforce it, keeping the ratio super high, so that in the off chance that you don't have treats on you and he picks up something he shouldn't, he'll release it for the chance he might get a treat.


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## myminpins (Dec 20, 2008)

> So, does that mean you're going to have to keep a strip of bacon in your pocket all the time in case Ilya picks up something he shouldn't? Well, do you have to keep a strip of bacon in your pocket all the time in case Ilya doesn't come when he's called? No, you don't. You heavily reinforce a good recall the majority of the time so that in the odd chance that you don't have treats on you, the variable reinforcement schedule is high enough for him to come back to you for the chance he might get a treat. Same for the "drop it". You heavily reinforce it, keeping the ratio super high, so that in the off chance that you don't have treats on you and he picks up something he shouldn't, he'll release it for the chance he might get a treat.


Exactly!!! My dogs will give me anything if I want them to - no complaints - because they know they'll either get it back fairly quickly or get something else. If that emergency situation arises, I want them to "drop it" FAST no matter what. And they do


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## Battle Angel (Dec 23, 2008)

JustTess said:


> Force doesn't work very well with Ilya on commands I expect him to obey daily. I'll save force for emergencies. My son has been dictating things to Ilya trying to train him with new things and he has been having difficulty getting Ilya to comply.(He has also been reading a lot about being Alpha  ) He will do it for me for praise.


Again, I didn't know we were talking about 'force'. Not understanding how removing something from a dogs mouth is 'force' when he freely allows it. By that definition, any time you impose your will on a dog at all it is 'force.'

Actually, though, what I initially disagreed with was the comparison of any training method being reliable for a 3 year old child. 

You guys can bribe your dogs all you want and use any training method you like and its wonderful that you care enough to train them. No complaints here. People have to find what works for them. I bribe my dogs with food for tricks, agility, and fun stuff. Necessary stuff just might be 'forced.'


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## Inga (Jun 16, 2007)

This video is a great example of what NOT to do with a resource guarding dog. 
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=CNaGKy2Zvdo&feature=related
Take the time to train them, do not tease them. This can only end badly if it keeps up. This dog might never bite it's owner but it could potentially bite the next unsuspecting person that walks by it's ball.


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## Love's_Sophie (Sep 23, 2007)

My dogs have ALWAYS been taught "out" and "drop it" early on in their training..."out" is reserved for times when I am going to hold the object, and wait for them to release it (I use treats, as a 'distraction\trade' when teaching this one. 

"Drop it" I use for when they have something in their mouths and I simply want them to spit it out on the floor; right where they are at. Again, I use treats to train for this; I give the cue then toss a treat that they highly value. Either of these cues take time to learn, so if it's 'early' in training, and something like what happened with the OP's dog, it's neither dog nor owner's fault...there's just more work to do. 

I never 'force' something out of their mouth, because that DOES teach them to 'guard it'; but by the time I have gotten through with their training, the dogs I have had, and have trained, are very willing to release something; be it a bone, toy, or something totally random.



Inga said:


> This video is a great example of what NOT to do with a resource guarding dog.
> http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=CNaGKy2Zvdo&feature=related
> Take the time to train them, do not tease them. This can only end badly if it keeps up. This dog might never bite it's owner but it could potentially bite the next unsuspecting person that walks by it's ball.


Gee, I wonder why the guy never put his face or hands near that dog??? He's already afraid of what might happen!!! That dog's expression was anything but 'pleasant'!


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## K8IE (Apr 28, 2008)

I have never had an issue with this with my dogs, simply because I have trained and "desensitized" them since day one to having things taken away whenever I see fit. I control the resources, period, and I don't have to offer a trade or anything else when I want to take something away. I can take Coop's raw bones, toys, treats, etc away from him, as could my son or anyone else for that matter. Cooper would let me stick my hand down his throat (which I did many times when he was a pup and had a rock or a stick or something dangerous in his mouth) and he will pretty much hack something up if I tell him to drop it, no matter what it is. If someone doesn't have the luxury of training a puppy up that way because they were a rescue or shelter dog, then I would say it could be more difficult, but it can still be done by carefully restricting access to high value things (toys or bones), teaching the leave and drop commands, and also by hand-feeding a dog and helping them realize that all the goodies belong to their people first and foremost.



Inga said:


> This video is a great example of what NOT to do with a resource guarding dog.
> http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=CNaGKy2Zvdo&feature=related
> Take the time to train them, do not tease them. This can only end badly if it keeps up. This dog might never bite it's owner but it could potentially bite the next unsuspecting person that walks by it's ball.


That is unbelievable. What an idiot.


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## JustTess (Mar 19, 2008)

Inga said:


> This video is a great example of what NOT to do with a resource guarding dog.
> http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=CNaGKy2Zvdo&feature=related
> Take the time to train them, do not tease them. This can only end badly if it keeps up. This dog might never bite it's owner but it could potentially bite the next unsuspecting person that walks by it's ball.


That is the way my EX handles dogs at his place  Well, at least my sons know how differently the dogs behave at mom's and at dad's and this mom won't allow that type of behaviour at her house. My oldest is watching me handle Ilya and noticing better results than shouting and pointing fingers. (Ilya won't heel for him too often or for very long)

Here's my youngest son and the remenents of the bone he's still chewing on. He tossed them at my son and he just gave it back to him when he turned and faced me for the picture.


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## Inga (Jun 16, 2007)

Love's_Sophie said:


> Gee, I wonder why the guy never put his face or hands near that dog??? He's already afraid of what might happen!!! That dog's expression was anything but 'pleasant'!



yeah! In case anyone was wondering, it is those types of people that give this wonderful breed a bad name. How much is a dog supposed to endure? A little teaching might have solved that problem without issue.


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## tippi (Oct 24, 2008)

as puppies, i take food away while eating, toys while playing, put my hands in their mouths, touch their bodies make noises. leave it, when you dont want them to take it in the first place. give it, when he has it and you want it. drop it when you just want him to let it go.


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