# Barking and uncontrollable every morning



## jatoo (Dec 8, 2009)

Hi,

I have a female Finnish Lapphund which is now I think about 5 months old.

My problem is that every morning between about 6am and 7:30, she gets into a high energy mode. At this time of day the rest of my family is usually either asleep, or out of the house, and the dog will be locked outside. So she starts barking, and doesn't stop. It wakes me up every morning, and we must be terrible neighbours, so I think it's behaviour which needs to change. 

The problem is, when I hear her barking in the mornings, I get up to tell her off, but she doesn't seem to be learning. As well as this, she's often has so much energy that when I let her into the house she just runs around as fast as she can, climbing all over the furniture. What makes the problem worse, is she doesn't seem to respond to being told off. My other dog, a poodle, will become timid and shy at even the slightest reproach, but this dog, the lapphund, doesn't seem to respond at all. When I tell her off the most she will do is stop what she is doing and go off to do something else, but sometimes it has no effect at all, and she just keeps wagging her tail and misbehaving. 

Is this just a problem of her having too much energy? Is the only solution taking her for a walk at this time of day? Or can she be trained not to bark?

Thanks for any help,
Alex


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## spotted nikes (Feb 7, 2008)

How much exercise is she getting? As in long, brisk walks...

When does she get fed?

Are you keeping her outside at night?


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## jesirose (Mar 27, 2008)

jatoo said:


> The problem is, when I hear her barking in the mornings, I get up to tell her off, but she doesn't seem to be learning. As well as this, she's often has so much energy that when I let her into the house she just runs around as fast as she can, climbing all over the furniture. What makes the problem worse, is she doesn't seem to respond to being told off. My other dog, a poodle, will become timid and shy at even the slightest reproach, but this dog, the lapphund, doesn't seem to respond at all. When I tell her off the most she will do is stop what she is doing and go off to do something else, but sometimes it has no effect at all, and she just keeps wagging her tail and misbehaving.


The dog has you trained well. The second she makes noise, you come a-running. See the problem there?


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## qingcong (Oct 26, 2009)

Not sure what you mean by "tell her off" but dogs don't understand what we're saying. They read our body language and energy, and the high energy anger that you're likely emitting when you're telling her off probably feeds her chaotic way of being. 

Is there a trigger that sets her off or is it just when the sun comes up?

Are you opposed to letting her sleep inside with the family? 

Does the other dog sleep outside with the dog?


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## jatoo (Dec 8, 2009)

Hi everyone, thanks for your replies!




> How much exercise is she getting? As in long, brisk walks...
> 
> When does she get fed?
> 
> Are you keeping her outside at night?


I think a typical day would be two walks, 20-30 minutes each, sometimes a third one as well which can be almost an hour. I've been told that it's very bad to over exercise young dogs, as it will make them need something like five hours of exercise every day when they are older.

This morning as an example, she had been on an hour long walk at about 4am, but still had her energy boost at 6:30am. 

She gets feed in the evenings, but is given some dry food and a bone in the mornings. 

At night she sleeps indoors, with access to the back yard. The problem is often when she's locked out because everyone has either left the house or is still asleep, and she can be destructive if left alone indoors. 




> The dog has you trained well. The second she makes noise, you come a-running. See the problem there?


I'm not sure that's quite the case here actually. With me asleep at 6:30, it takes a little while between her starting barking and me going out to where she is. I wouldn't think it would be an immediate enough response, probably about 10 or 15 minutes. But maybe she's patient and persistent? 



> Not sure what you mean by "tell her off" but dogs don't understand what we're saying. They read our body language and energy, and the high energy anger that you're likely emitting when you're telling her off probably feeds her chaotic way of being.
> 
> Is there a trigger that sets her off or is it just when the sun comes up?
> 
> ...


When I say "tell her off" I mean tell her in the appropriate tone of voice she's a bad dog or whatever - the tone is the main thing, a low, aggressive tone which I have been told works, and has worked with other dogs. My poodle for example becomes extremely timid if I ever speak to her like that. I would never hurt the dog, but I do hold her still so she doesn't run away from me, and grab the scruff of her neck. I stress though that I don't hurt her, and I make sure of that. Just trying to make her understand that she has been bad, so I keep her still while I tell her off. 

I don't think there is a trigger, I think it's just that she's by herself and has energy. I found her barking at a spider in it's web up a tree the other day, and this morning she seemed to just be running around barking at whatever, maybe birds if she sees them or just general barking. 

Both sleep inside, but in the mornings the other dog, who is a lot older and tamer sleeps inside, and the Lapphund goes outside.

Thanks for your help, any advice would be greatly appreciated. I need to get her to stop!


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## Cracker (May 25, 2009)

What sort of training sessions do you do with her? She's most likely caught between puppy zoomies and being bored. She is also a herding breed and they BARK..so being outside alone is going to encourage barking, simple as that. It doesn't matter that she's been barking for ten minutes before you go out, you still reward the barking by arriving at all...she's a social breed AND a puppy, being alone is stressful and no fun.

Does she get social time with other puppies at all? How old again is your other dog? Do they play together at all? If not, a regular puppy class to get some training and some proper playtime can help get rid of some of the zoomies. You may also want to look into herding classes or agility at one time or another, herding dogs are NOT low energy dogs and exercising them more doesn't "create" a higher need for exercise, it's built in.

Here's what I would tell a client in your situation:
Crate the puppy and don't let her outdoors to do nothing but bark first thing in the morning (aside from doing her business). The crate is since you said she is destructive when bored. 
Feed her some kibble and treats in a treat/puzzle ball to keep her occupied while crated.
Increase her walk time to include training time AND playtime...maybe a flirt pole. 
Be sure that everyday she gets mental AND physical exercise. Dogs are most active in the morning and in the early evening, this is a natural circadian rhythm for them.

Oh, and stop telling your dog's off..they don't know what it means and it is NOT the equivalent of training your dogs. You've created timidity (ie fear) in your first dog and the second one doesn't care...time to change your tactics.


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## jatoo (Dec 8, 2009)

Cracker said:


> What sort of training sessions do you do with her? She's most likely caught between puppy zoomies and being bored. She is also a herding breed and they BARK..so being outside alone is going to encourage barking, simple as that. It doesn't matter that she's been barking for ten minutes before you go out, you still reward the barking by arriving at all...she's a social breed AND a puppy, being alone is stressful and no fun.
> 
> Does she get social time with other puppies at all? How old again is your other dog? Do they play together at all? If not, a regular puppy class to get some training and some proper playtime can help get rid of some of the zoomies. You may also want to look into herding classes or agility at one time or another, herding dogs are NOT low energy dogs and exercising them more doesn't "create" a higher need for exercise, it's built in.
> 
> ...


The other dog is 9 years old, but she's small, and when the lapphund tries to play she just gets upset.

The person who told us that you can overexercise a puppy was an expert, and I trust them. They say it is a common problem. I don't think I used the word "create," but it makes perfect sense to me that exercising a dog a lot when it is young would mean it needs a lot more when it's older. I understand the need for exercise is built in, but the question is how much is best for the dog. 

And I'd like to point out that I haven't "created timidity" or "fear" in my dog, she was timid from the day we got her as a puppy, afraid of people and dogs, and I've very rarely told her off. She is a very happy dog. Is telling a dog off always inappropriate? When you catch it peeing inside and you need to take it out? When it's chewing on the furniture? 

The dog with the problem is not actually my dog, but one of my family members. They seem to be opposed to the idea of crate.


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## Cracker (May 25, 2009)

jatoo said:


> I think a typical day would be two walks, 20-30 minutes each, sometimes a third one as well which can be almost an hour. I've been told that it's very bad to over exercise young dogs, as it will make them need something like five hours of exercise every day when they are older.


It can condition them to need exercise when they are older, but not always. Most limiting of exercise in young dogs is due to not wanting to overuse growing bones and ligaments when they are ready. Same with human kids, no EXCESSIVE pounding (like long distance running on roads) or weight lifting
until they are older.



> When I say "tell her off" I mean tell her in the appropriate tone of voice she's a bad dog or whatever - the tone is the main thing, a low, aggressive tone which I have been told works, and has worked with other dogs. *My poodle for example becomes extremely timid if I ever speak to her like that. I would never hurt the dog, but I do hold her still so she doesn't run away from me, and grab the scruff of her neck. I stress though that I don't hurt her, and I make sure of that. Just trying to make her understand that she has been bad, so I keep her still while I tell her off. *


This quote is where I meant that telling your dog off is inappropriate. Taking a dog that is fearful or timid, holding it firmly by the scruff and aggressively speaking at length to the dog creates more fear, whether she was timid in the first place or not. If you want to use an aversive to stop a dog from doing something in the moment a FIRM NO or hand clap or even shaking a penny can to startle them out of the behaviour and then teaching them something else to do or removing them from the situation is appropriate...grabbing them and growling a bunch of words they don't understand is overkill. I'm sorry I assumed she was "created" into being fearful, but the point is the same.


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## jatoo (Dec 8, 2009)

Sorry, I guess I didn't make it very clear. That grabbing the scruff of the neck is with the other dog, and that is purely because she isn't responding to the normal "NO" which is all I've ever needed to use with the poodle.

Of course I wouldn't do that with a timid dog.


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## Cracker (May 25, 2009)

Thanks for clarifying it, it's hard to be clear sometimes on a forum like this and misinterpretations happen. 
Good luck with the dogs.


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