# Dispelling incorrect information about the Caucasian Ovcharka



## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

Hi everyone  , 

I have been in love with this breed since I first saw them in person in the early 90's.
My husband and I own two Caucasian Ovcharka's. I love to talk about this breed and read about them.

Well, I couldn't help but notice how much wrong info there on the internet about this breed in English. 
The most absurd claim I've read is people claiming that the CO's were bred to hunt bears.
So I figured it's about time someone addresses that and other incorrect info.
I wrote some of this on another forum as well, but I wanted to write a more in depth post about this breed on this forum.
And I would like to also write something about the real history of this breed _(warning: this is going to be a very long post_ :redface.
***edit: I will continue to update this post as I come across other misinformations about this bread spread by wannabe experts that in a lot of cases have never even seen a Caucasian Ovcharka in person, let alone owned one.


I will start by answering some of the very common questions I read or I was asked regarding this breed.

*Question # 1.: What is a Caucasian Ovcharka?*

First I need to point out that Ovcharka is merely a Russian word for "shepherd dog" and that I never understood why in some countries you see breeders translate one part of the breed's name, yet only transliterate the other.
This has created a lot of confusion and many people are under the false impression that the word "Ovcharka" is somehow a breed/breed type by itself.
Of course that is not true, the same way that the term "Shepherd Dog" is not a breed by itself, but rather a suffix found in the names of many different dog breeds in the English language.
For example, Anatolian Shepherd Dog and the German Shepherd Dog both have the "shepherd dog" part in their name, but they are two very different type of dogs.
So in Russian a CO is called "Kavkazskaya Ovcharka" and a GSD is called "Nemetskaya Ovcharka".
If you tell someone from Russia that you are looking for an Ovcharka, they won't know what breed you are referring to exactly.
The same way an English speaking person wouldn't know which breed you are looking for exactly if you just say that you want a "Shepherd Dog".

I also need to point out that here is no "T" in the Russian word Ovcharka (Oвчарка). I prefer to call this breed the Caucasian shepherd dog (which is the accurate translation of the breed's name as recognized by the FCI), but Caucasian Ovcharka or Caucasian Mountain dog is fine too.
When abbreviating the breed's name, I will use the term "CO". As this is the most common abbreviation used for this breed in the English language.

Caucasian shepherds are a livestock/property guardian breed from the former Soviet Union and the aboriginal strains of this breed can still be found throughout Caucasus.

*Question # 2.: What are the Caucasian shepherds bred for?*

The Caucasian shepherd dogs as a breed have a very long history.
Originally they were landrace livestock guardian dogs from the Caucasus Mountains, where they have been used to guard livestock from large predators for probably 2-3000 years.
The evolution of the breed was not only a result of natural selection but it was also influenced by nations that inhabited the Caucasus Region.
Which basically means that the breed would slightly vary from one country in the Caucasus Region to another.

Around 1920 the Soviets started selecting them for military purposes as guard dogs.
The Soviet military decided that this breed would make the perfect guardian dogs to guard borders and prison camps.
So they imported LGD's from Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan etc (back then these countries were all apart of the Soviet Union) and started selecting them for their guarding abilities.
They standardized the breed, made them look more uniform and only what in their opinion were the best examples of LGD's from Caucasus were bred to each other.
The name "Caucasian Shepherd Dog" was given and in 1931 the very first breed standard was published.
In the then East Germany, it is said that around 7000 Caucasian shepherds were at one point used to guard the Berlin Wall.

The CO started out as a landrace, but later on they were further refined and standardized through selective breeding towards a written breed standard.
And even though the FCI Caucasian shepherd dogs were no longer a landrace breed, but instead man-made, the breed non the less kept its phenotypic diversity.

After the fall of the Soviet Union, the Caucasian shepherd dogs kept being used for guarding of prisons, factories, properties, homes etc but they also became more and more popular with the dog show fanciers.
Today we see that most modern Caucasian shepherds (meaning they are no longer those aboriginal dogs straight from Caucasus) are used as property guardians and no longer as LGD's.

*Question # 3: How are Caucasian Shepherds as LGD's (livestock guardian dogs)?*

Using CO's as LGD's is best suited for people who have to worry about *both * the two legged and four legged predators, people who do have a well fenced property.
Please do not waste your time or money on a CO until the property is properly fenced.
Owning a CO on a property that's not fenced properly is a huge liability and is just asking for trouble.
If you have a lot of visitors coming to your farm every day and if your only problem are just animal predators preying on your livestock/poultry, then this probably wouldn't be the right breed for you.
You should instead look into other LGD breeds that aren't as protective towards strangers.

Nowadays unfortunately in many countries the agriculture is in the decline, so there are not as many people who still use CO's as LGD's.
And during the Soviet era this breed was used more as a border/prison camp guardian dog.
However, there are still plenty of modern CO's (and by modern I mean CO's from cultivated breeding with a FCI/RKF pedigree) out there who successfully work as (full time) LGD's, in North America as well.

For people looking to get a CO as LGD, there are a few things they need to keep in mind.
If possible, look for a breeder that uses his/her CO's as LGD's and raises the puppies around livestock/poultry.
And thus selects his/her breeding stock for LGD traits. Someone who wants to preserve the working ability in this breed.

Even if your future CO puppy doesn't comes from working parents, it can still make a good LGD.
The LGD instincts are still very much present in this breed.
But either way, you have to make sure you are getting a well bred puppy. From a breeder that puts correct temperament and structure first, someone who breeds for functionality.
If that CO isn't structurally sound and/or has joint issues, it will be completely useless to you. The same thing goes for incorrect temperament.

While LGD breeds have been selected and bred for centuries for desired traits around livestock, you can't expect them to just automatically know what to do and what not to do around livestock and/or poultry.
LGD's have the right predisposition, but they're not robots.
Most important is to prevent bad habits from developing. Playing with livestock/poultry mustn't be allowed; a puppy trying to play with its charges can quickly turn into the animals being harassed, hurt or even worse by the puppy.
The key is to catch any unwanted behavior early and correct the puppy.
But also, you must set the puppy up for success.
In other words: supervise, supervise, supervise.
Puppies should never be left alone with livestock/poultry unsupervised until they're at least about 18 months old and have shown that they can be trusted unsupervised.
Until then, whenever you can't be there to directly oversee the puppy, the puppy must be separated from the stock.
And if the puppy is supposed to be a full time LGD, then it's best to retire it in a pen in/or directly next to the livestock/poultry at night or when not supervised.
It also greatly helps if there's already an older LGD present, from whom the puppy can learn the ropes.

For more great tips on how to raise an LGD, please visit: http://www.lgd.org/library/Myths about using LGDs.html

CO's are very, very protective and a well bred Caucasian shepherd will not allow anything or anyone near whatever they are supposed to guard.
I noticed (and I've heard the same thing from other CO fanciers as well) that this breed bonds firstly and fore mostly to their humans and their territory (which is also true for some other LGD breeds as well).
CO's don't do well in settings with limited human interaction.
They seem to do much, much better if they are on a farm guarding animals where they also get to see and interact with their humans on a daily basis.

CO's typically have a somewhat higher prey drive than a number of other LGD breeds (this also goes for some other LGD breeds, so it's not something unique to just CO's).
On one hand that does means that it makes it even more difficult to teach them not to chase poultry (which is the most difficult thing to teach an LGD in general anyway), but on the other hand it also means they make excellent vermin control.

Last, but certainly not least, here is a really interesting video on CO's being used as LGD's in Georgia (Caucasus).
The CO's in this video are from modern lines, imported into Georgia from Russian kennels. Thanks to the right selection by the shepherds and the Georgian Kennel Club, these CO's are successfully performing the job of their ancestors:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3acrPzOGNjM&feature=youtu.be


*Question # 4: Who is this breed suited for? *

I have to start by saying that anyone interested in a CO needs to make sure they really want a large, powerful, protective and independent dog.
CO's like to "think", they are not the type of breed that will follow every command blindly and often can be quite dominant in character.
A Caucasian shepherd needs experienced owners.
They should only be owned by knowledgeable, responsible people that have a lot of space and are looking for a great property/livestock guardian.
I wouldn't recommend this breed to someone who does not have at the very least a large backyard (1/4 acre is a minimum in my opinion) fenced with a sturdy 6ft or higher fence.
Well fenced property is a must for this breed, I can not stress that one enough.
A well bred Caucasian shepherd is very agile and active. Which is why having a 6ft fence or higher, is so important.

They are one of the most naturally protective breeds out there (in other words: you don't have to train them to protect their property from strangers).
Typically when a well bred Caucasian shepherd sees strangers or other canines near their property, they go into a full protection mode.
As I mentioned above, do not waste your time or money on a CO until the property is properly fenced.
Owning a CO on a property that's not fenced properly is a huge liability and is just asking for trouble.
No breeder should sell a CO to anyone without proper fencing and if a breeder tells you CO's will stay without fencing or that an invisible fence is ok, run the other way

CO's will react to a real or perceived threat. Owning these dogs is a tremendous responsibility; to both the public and to the dog. 
Successful owners of CO's are knowledgeable, prepared, and good handlers of their dogs and the situations they place them in.


*Question # 5: I have been told they are a very healthy breed with no/very few health issues, is this true? *

No, not really. Caucasian shepherds continue to become more and more popular.
A lot of really bad breeders that are involved in this breed for all the wrong reasons are slowly but surely ruining Caucasian shepherd dogs.
So if you want to avoid heartache only get a CO from breeders that health & temperament tests (more on how to locate an ethical CO breeder click here).
Look for breeders whose main goal is to breed stable, healthy dogs, with a correct temperament as according to the breed standard.
And avoid breeders who claim that CO's are a very healthy breed with no/very few health issues.

Several health problems occur in this breed.
The most common ones are: Hip/Elbow Dysplasia, Hypothyroidism, Heart diseases, Skin issues, Ectropion & Entropion, Bloating etc.
To any potential buyers I will say this: this breed is quite expensive, avoid breeders who breed mainly for looks (unfortunately there are way too many Caucasian shepherd breeders out there who breed for the massive size, which leads to even more health problems).

A note on hip dysplasia, HD is a polygenic disease, but there are environmental (i.e. non-genetic) influences as well.
Recent studies have shown that by keeping your growing large puppy lean and by providing daily exercise out in gently undulating terrain, it can dramatically lower incidence of hip dysplasia.
Whereas the daily use of steps while puppies are growing up increased the risk of HD.

Also, avoid breeders that are purposely breeding giant CO's. This breed is not supposed to be giant even though there is no maximum height or weight set in their breed standard.
So look for a breeder that really pays attention to correct structure and functionality.
Most males in this breed tend to be between 29 and 32 inches tall at withers and most females around 26-28 inches.
Their weight should be in proportion to the height, giving a balanced, imposing appearance. This breed is supposed to be agile and long living.

Studies show there is more of a chance that your puppy will be healthy if it doesn't comes from inbred parents.
It is generally agreed that any dog whose COI (Coefficient of Inbreeding) is over 6 % is inbred.
A COI of 12.5% is equivalent to a half brother/half sister mating. And a COI of 25% is equivalent to a parent/child or brother/sister mating.
People new to the breed won't be able to tell much by just looking at the names in the pedigree, but at the very least the future buyer should try to avoid litters from parents that have a lot of ancestors in common.
And nowadays there are free COI calculators out there (like this one for example: http://www.czerwonytrop.com/inb/ ). All you have to do is fill in the names from your future puppy's pedigree, and this program calculates your future puppy's COI for you.
You don't have to inbreed to get dogs to look alike, you don't have to inbreed to get the type and traits you desire.
If you breed like to like in looks with dogs that are relatively unrelated, you will be able to maintain type without damaging the gene pool.
Too much inbreeding can be a catastrophe to the gene-pool and the health of the dogs.



*Question # 6: What to look for in a good breeder?*

Look for breeders whose main goal is to breed stable, healthy dogs, with a correct temperament as according to the breed standard.
Don't just go by the breeder's word though, if the breeder claims to health test his/her breeding stock, ask for proof.
If the breeder for example claims that all their breeding stock is HD free, ask to see xray results. And ask them to give you the name of the veterinary clinic that performed these xrays, so you can call and verify what their CO's were rated.
Or if they've been xrayed at all. You won't believe how much most CO breeders in U.S. lie.
A number of these breeders will actually put on their website in writing that they health test, when in reality they don't.
Basically any claim these breeders make, get them to show you a proof of such claim. If they can't/won't, run.

Preferably I would look for a breeder that on top of HD/ED screening, also tests for heart, eye and thyroid problems, but in this breed the puppy buyers are lucky if they can find a breeder that xrays for HD & ED.
Ask the breeder about any health issues in their lines and ask them if they can give you references from previous puppy buyers and their veterinarian.
Look for a breeder that is honest, forthcoming and doesn't minds answering many questions. But at the same time make sure the breeder asks many question him/herself!
You should steer clear of breeders that do not ask a lot of questions but are all too eager to sell.
Meet the breeder and his/her breeding stock in person at least once before you buy the puppy.
Ask them what are they trying to achieve with their breeding program.
Observe the character, the structure & the movement of the parents and observe the living conditions of all dogs (make sure at least the mother of the puppies is on premises).
How is the breeder socializing and raising the puppies?
A good breeder will work with you to give you a puppy that you want, a puppy that will best fit in your family, as not all puppies will have the same temperament.

How many litters a year do they have? A good breeder in my opinion doesn't breed more than 4 litters a year (preferably 1-2 litters).
Does the breeder work with contracts and are there any restrictions?
Health issues can occur even in the most well bred litters, there are a lot of (unknown) factors a breeder can have no control over.
So look for a responsible breeder that discusses all this and will be there for you if such unfortunate event occurs, and not turn their backs on you once the money is exchanged.

*Question # 7: What is the life expectancy of a Caucasian shepherd?*

Well bred Caucasian shepherd dogs generally live around 12 years.


*Question # 8: Should I get a male or a female?*

Let's say you have done your homework and found an ethical breeder.
And now you are wondering if you should get a male or a female..
Naturally a good breeder will be able to help you with that decision, and for first time CO owners, I always say get the opposite gender of your current dog (if you have one).
That way there will be a much bigger chance that the two of them will get along well.
Other than a difference in size, females tend to bark more and are usually the more dominant one in multi-dog household (please note, the level of dominance is not an indication on how well your CO will guard).
Females also often have a slightly higher prey drive.
As the puppy is growing, a female will often remain longer friendly towards strangers than a male. But a well bred CO should guard equally, regardless of their gender.

*Question # 9: How do you raise a Caucasian Ovcharka?*

Your CO puppy will require adequate socialization from early on, so it can develop into a mature dog with a good judgment.
Socialization will help your CO differentiate between real threats and something that is simply new or unusual.
Away from their property well bred, well socialized CO's are very aloof with strangers.
Socialization has to be done correctly.

It's not about every stranger laying hands on your dog, it's about giving your CO puppy positive experiences in different situations to build their confidence and show them what is normal for their living situation and what is to be accepted.
Socialization is also about teaching them good manners, teaching them to behave in public.
Be careful not to overstimulate your young CO puppy, that too can cause a bad reaction.
When it comes to socializing your CO, remember: quality, not quantity. And try to have every new experience end in a positive way.
It is also really important to teach your CO to accept guests, once properly introduced. With a protective and prmitive breed like the CO, this is something that needs to be worked on early on.
CO's will by nature remain aloof and reserved with new people until familiarity is achieved.

Like all LGD breeds CO's are stubborn and independent. CO's were bred for centuries to work independently from their owner.
Even the Soviet military realized that the CO's are not a very biddable breed (which is why they also created breeds such as the Moscow Watchdog).
Some CO's will try and push the boundary more often than others.
But they are trainable.
Some CO's are more dominant than others. They will challenge you several times as they're growing up.
The firmer you are as an owner, the less they will challenge you. And if you raised them right, at around 18 months they will settle down.
You have to be a firm, patient, consistent owner to avoid any issues with your CO.
For example, if you don't want your CO on furniture, you have to teach them this right away.
No means no and every member in the household should apply the same command system.
Besides being firm, you must be a fair owner as well. Don't use physical techniques to punish your CO.
It is very important that you create a bond of trust and love with your CO.

While CO's are not a very biddable and trainable breed, they are highly intelligent and simple commands such as: sit, down, leave it, stay and walking nicely on a leash, is something every CO should know.
CO's also need to tolerate and accept trips to the vet and riding in a vehicle.
They need to have dinner time manners, they need to accept being handled all over by their owner; brushing your CO, cleaning its ears, teeth etc, should never be a problem.
So these are all things you need to work on with your CO from day one.

CO's are not a hyper breed, but they do like to run and play, and they need plenty of room, a property they can patrol.
If they don't have enough room and activities, then they can be quite destructive as puppies; they will chew on furniture, walls, shoes...you name it, if they are bored
Some CO's tend to bark a lot, for example every time they see someone passing closely by the fence.
That is another thing to consider for people living in urban areas before getting a CO.

CO's are very, very affectionate dogs with their own people. And normally they are good with their own children, but young dogs can be quite clumsy and accidentally run them over.
With the children they don't know, always use caution.
And never leave them alone with small kids. But the last can be said about all dogs.


*Question # 10: What should I feed my Caucasian shepherd?*

CO's are a slow maturing breed, they reach full maturity at 3-5 years (females mature quickly than males).
In order to avoid future problems with joints and ligaments, it's best not to overfeed your growing CO, keep it lean and avoid foods that are high in fat and protein.

You want to grow your CO puppy slow and evenly, which can help prevent many of the orthopedic problems.
Don't free choice feed (i.e. leave food out at all times). At the bottom of this page, I will place two body condition charts, that can help you determine if your CO is in a good shape.

As explained on: http://www.greatdanelady.com/articles/do_i_need_to_use_a_puppy_food.htm
some of the large/giant puppy breed formulas on the market are very problematic in the sense that they often have too high levels of fat, protein and calcium/or sometimes too low levels of calcium.
All of which can cause uneven growth patterns.

If you are going to feed commercial dog food, I personally always recommend the grain free foods where it says that they are "suitable for all life stages". 
One can start their puppy on it right away and skip the puppy dog food all together. 
Look for foods that have calcium to phosphorus ratio between 1.1 : 1.4 -1. 
Protein levels should be between 23-26%, Fat between 12%-16% and Calcium between 1.2% - 1.5% 
Calories per cup should be moderate: 350 - 400 cal
Avoid foods containing wheat, corn, soy, preservatives and by-products.

If you chose to feed raw or home cooked, you have to make sure these diets are balanced and that all of your dog’s nutritional needs are met.
Here are two articles with great tips on on how to correctly feed your dog either raw or home cooked meals:

http://dogaware.com/articles/wdjhomemade2.html

http://dogaware.com/articles/wdjhomemade3.html

Food aggression is very common in CO's and just LGD breeds in general. Simple and safe training exercises can prevent this problem from ever developing.
Here is an example of how to safely prevent resource guarding: http://ahimsadogtraining.com/blog/resource-guarding/


*Question # 11: What does temperament testing mean for this breed?*

Ethical Caucasian shepherd breeders will test the character of their breeding stock (through a test as approved by the Russian Kynological Federation)
They will only breed with stable, protective individuals.
Avoid breeders that don't do that and avoid breeders that claim Caucasian shepherds should be trained to protect.


*Question # 12: I read CO's were bred to hunt bears, is this true?*

There is absolutely no truth to this myth.
For LGD breeds it would be very contra-productive to have a high prey drive, so that's why it's so absurd to claim that this breed was ever used to hunt bears with.
The CO's are not built for hunting large game, they are not built like a hunting breed period.
The FCI CO's is a breed that was standardized out of the aboriginal LGD's (a land race) from Caucasus. These dogs were used to protect livestock and were required to have a relatively low prey drive.
CO's job was to deter bears, wolves and other predators. Not hunt them.
In fact the Russians use the much smaller and more nimble Laiki breeds to hunt the bears with and not the CO's.
The behavior and the drive of a hunting breed like a Laika is very different from the CO's temperament and drive.

*Question # 13: I read Caucasian Ovcharka's were bred for dog fights, is this true?*

Most definitely not.
It would be incredibly contra-productive for an LGD breed to be so dog aggressive that they can't even function in a pack.
No matter how strong an individual dog may be, he wouldn't last long trying to deter large predators all on his own.
CO is a breed that was developed to be a property and livestock guardian.

*Question # 14: I read that the CO is recognized by the AKC (American Kennel Club), is that true?*


No it is not.
CO's have not been recognized by either the AKC (American Kennel Club) or the CKC (Canadian Kennel Club).
CO's have been accepted for recording in the AKC Foundation Stock Service, however as it clearly states here: https://www.akc.org/breeds/fss_breeds.cfm
FSS breeds are not eligible for AKC registration.
In U.S. the CO is recognized by the UKC (United Kennel Club) and the ARBA (The American Rare Breed Association).
And this is where CO breeders in U.S. register their CO's.

The CO is recognized by the FCI (Fédération Cynologique Internationale), the largest canine organization of the world.
Only puppies born in FCI countries (U.S. and Canada aren't FCI countries) can actually have FCI pedigrees.


*Question # 15: Are the Caucasian shepherd and Central Asian Ovcharka (shepherd dog) one and the same breed?*

No, although closely related, these are two separate breeds.
There are several differences between these two breeds when it comes to both the temperament and the general appearance.
Central Asian shepherd dog is recognized under FCI-Standard N° 335.


*Question # 16: Are the Caucasian shepherd dog and South Russian Ovcharka (shepherd dog) one and the same breed?*

No, these are two separate breeds with very distinct differences in looks and there are several differences when you compare the temperament of these two breeds.
These two breeds are not closely related.
The South Russian shepherd dog is also an LGD breed, and they are recognized under FCI Standard N° 326.


*Question # 17: Are the Caucasian shepherd dog and the Sarplaninac one and the same breed? And how come they look so similar?*

Most definitely not.
Šarplaninac (pronounced as Shar-pla-ni-natz) is an LGD breed from the former Yugoslavia. They are the descendants of the ancient molosser dogs from Asia accompanying migrating nations to the Balkan Peninsula and guarding their livestock.
So Sarpla's and CO's have the same origins (ancient molosser dogs from Asia, mainly Tibet).
They do have a lot of similarities when it comes to their appearance and their temperament, but there are also a lot of differences (for instance many colors that are allowed in CO's are not allowed in Sarplaninac's breed standard, CO's are generally more massive, their legs and paws are different, Sarplaninac's are often less intense and have an even lower prey drive etc).

I have seen on a few different pages in English people claiming modern CO's were mixed with the Sarplaninac during the Soviet era.
This is absolutely not true.
Sarplaninac dogs were not even known to the Soviets back then. In fact Sar's were extremely rare outside of former Yugoslavia until the 70's.
And Sar's have always been somewhat smaller and lighter in build than the CO's.
Which is why in the early 90's (as CO's did not even appear in former Yugoslavia until mid 80's when they were first imported from Hungary) some unethical Sar breeders in ex-YU decided to secretly add CO's to their Sar breeding programs.
They wanted bigger, more impressive dogs. And due to an already close resemblance between these two breeds, they got away with it.
The ex-YU military did also admix CO's to their Sarpla's, but they did it because they wanted Sar's to be more aggressive guardians.
Some of this has even been mentioned in this recent scientific study about Balkan LGD's: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jbg.12077/full
Luckily ethical Sarplaninac breeders stay away from dogs that are known to have such mixes in their pedigree and they do try to preserve Sarpla's as a working, LGD breed

*Question # 18: What are aboriginal CO's?*

The term aboriginal has unfortunately been misused by the majority of short-haired CO breeders in order to make their dogs more marketable.
The true aboriginal LGD's from Caucasus are:

- Dogs that whelp and raise puppies without assistance of people
- Aboriginal dogs are attuned to environmental changes
- They are fed occasionally, but most often have to take care of their own food by catching marmots and other small animals near the flock/herd they are guarding.
- Their populations are controlled by natural forces such as shortage of food, predators and epidemics causing high mortality among puppies and young dogs.
- People keep useful dogs and abandon or cull worthless ones.
- Genetic exchange is facilitated by nomadic way of life of dog owners and combined with the natural selection for function makes them what they are now.
- They breed freely in the right season, reverting to a feral or semi-feral way of life at least temporarily.

Dogs born and/or raised in kennels can not be considered aboriginal, even if they have recent ancestors that were.
Once the dogs are taken out of their natural environment and artificially selected for certain particularities (such as color, size and type for example) they cease to be aboriginal.


*Question # 19: Are the current aboriginal LGD's on Caucasus the same kind of dogs like the ones the Soviet army imported to Russia all those decades ago?*

According to several breed experts and according to O. Krasnovskaya's book (considered by most CO fanciers as the premier source on the Caucasian Ovcharka), not really. Or at least not entirely.

Even though in some areas the habitats of native Caucasian, Central Asian & Turkish livestock guardian dogs overlap and intermediate types have always existed....
During the time of mass repression in the early 20th century, many people from Caucasus were deported to Central Asia. Some of them took their dogs with them.
When they finally returned to Caucasus, many brought back with them the LGD's from Central Asia.
And these dogs then often crossed with the aboriginal LGD's from Caucasus.
To make matters worse, because of industrialization, less and less people were involved in agriculture and even more good quality aboriginal CO's have been lost since then.


*Question # 20: is CO's studbook closed?*

No, it is not. But there are certain regulations put in place by the FCI.
FCI requirements for this are the same for all FCI dog breeds with an open stud book. It has nothing to do with just CO's in particular.
The FCI regulations basically say that in order to acquire a so called "Conditional Registration Certificate/Pedigree" for aboriginal, paperless dogs you need an expert judge in the breed or you can do it via the parent club, if you have an official FCI parent club in your country.
The dog is then required to be evaluated by 3 different judges
The expert judges then examine the dog and determines if the dog indeed confirms to the breed standard.
After 3 generations of successful breeding and showing, without displaying any disqualifying traits, the 4th generation removed from that initial registration receives a full pedigree.

____________________________________________________________________

So these are the most common questions I answered, but if there's anything else anyone would like to know about this breed and I forgot to mention, do let me know 

Now I'm going to post several random CO pictures to demonstrate the great variation within this breed (I wrote the name of the dogs in front of the picture): 


Deryl DiBoo Něžný obr:









Atlant (f. Elita Krez Gulliver, m. Puma Dezire Salte Prim):










Stariy Gorod Sparta:









Glavar iz Russkogo Riska:









Sherpskiy Vlastelin









Zagorskie Dali Edmon:









Perviy Legion Dato:


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## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

excellent "thanks for sharing"


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## zack (May 27, 2013)

:wave: Hi can I just say what handsome dogs they are and Gurhan looks a little like my Zack. LOL.
View attachment 101130


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## Adjecyca1 (Jul 25, 2010)

Thanks for the information!


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

Thank you all for taking the time to read it 

@zack, yes there are some similarities between some varieties of CO's and Newfoundlanders. Being that both breeds are long haired molossers (even the short haired CO's are not truly short haired). 
But only when it comes to looks of course lol, as when it comes to the temperament & behavior, these two breeds are almost the exact opposites of each other.
And I have to point out that solid black, solid brown or liver brown colors are not allowed in the Caucasian shepherd breed standard.

Your Newfie is very handsome too. 

Btw, Gurhan is the nickname of the Russian photographer who took the pics that day. 
I've put the names of the actual dogs in front of the picture


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## Whistlejacket (Jul 26, 2012)

That was a very interesting read, thank you for sharing your knowledge with us!


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

Whistlejacket said:


> That was a very interesting read, thank you for sharing your knowledge with us!


Thank you! 
I just got tired of finding pages after pages with very wrong info about the CO's on the internet. 
So hopefully this topic will serve as a good source of information for people interested in this breed or for people who simply want to know more about them.


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## zack (May 27, 2013)

MountainDogs said:


> Thank you all for taking the time to read it
> 
> @zack, yes there are some similarities between some varieties of CO's and Newfoundlanders. Being that both breeds are long haired molossers (even the short haired CO's are not truly short haired).
> But only when it comes to looks of course lol, as when it comes to the temperament & behavior, these two breeds are almost the exact opposites of each other.
> ...


 Apologies MountainDogs I didn't realize, but he is gorgeous LOL.


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## Doglover65 (Aug 10, 2013)

Thank you! I own a doberman and ive heard people tell me that their brains outgrow their skull and they turn on their owners. HOW RIDICULOUS RIGHT!? 

I actually knew very little about this breed, so thank you for sharing !


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## Foresthund (Jul 17, 2013)

zack said:


> Apologies MountainDogs I didn't realize, but he is gorgeous LOL.


At a time they bred Ovtcharkas to Newfoundlands to create the Moscow water dog. My Newfie looked very much like one.


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

Cool! I wish everyone had the resource to post such complete info shottheirnbreed as you! What a great read


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

@zack
No worries! And I agree 

@Doglover65
I know right? It never ceases to amaze me how gullible some people are and how easily they'll buy into something that makes no sense.
And in the case with the CO's there are now dozens and dozens of websites, blogs, FB pages etc all claiming CO's were bred to hunt bears and other ridiculous statements.

@Foresthund
At the Red Star kennel the Soviets tried to create several new breeds by mixing native breeds with the western breeds.
I suppose one could say that only the Black Russian Terrier, the Moscow Watchdog and the Eastern European Shepherd turned out to be a (relative) success. 

@ OwnedbyACDs
Thank you, I'm glad you liked it!


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## Foresthund (Jul 17, 2013)

Yep,The Black Russian Terrier has official recognition even,I don't know if the others are seen outside of Russia and Ukraine at all.

I don't know if a couple used them for hunting bear,but that's not enough reason to say its what they where bred for. If that where the case I could say Alaskan Malamutes where bred to hunt bear because some Eskimos did it in the past,and Rottweilers where bred to hunt Boar and retrieve ducks.


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## GrinningDog (Mar 26, 2010)

Thank you for the info! I love learning about uncommon breeds from the people who own them.


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

Foresthund said:


> Yep,The Black Russian Terrier has official recognition even,I don't know if the others are seen outside of Russia and Ukraine at all.
> 
> I don't know if a couple used them for hunting bear,but that's not enough reason to say its what they where bred for. If that where the case I could say Alaskan Malamutes where bred to hunt bear because some Eskimos did it in the past,and Rottweilers where bred to hunt Boar and retrieve ducks.


That's right, BRT is recognized by both the FCI and the AKC.
The other two breeds are not recognized outside Russia. 
I have met a Moscow Watchdog in person, although very rare outside Russia, they can be found here and there in Europe.

As for the Caucasian Ovcharka's, I highly doubt anyone ever used them to hunt bears with. They are not the right dog for that and they are not built for hunting large game.
In Russia they have for centuries used different Laiki breeds (like the West Siberian Laika for example) for such activities.
So in all probability the only reason why there are all those people out there claiming CO's were bred to hunt bears is because: a) they know absolutely nothing about the breed.
B) they just copy info without giving it second thought
And c) someone noticed that CO's look like bears so they came up with that lie and it spread like wildfire all over the internet.

Then there are people who claim CO's weigh 200 lbs or more, are used for dog fights, are uncontrollable aggressive or claim they are gentle giants and other similar nonsense.
Usually such info is spread by people who never even saw a CO in person, let alone owned one. But many people on the internet will believe anything they read unfortunately.

However, the biggest threat towards this breed comes from the bad, unethical breeders.
And sadly the bad CO breeders are outnumbering the good ones, especially here in U.S.
I mean when you look at the number of CO breeders in Northern America (probably about 10-11) and then realize that only a couple can be called ethical breeders.
There's even a CO puppy miller in U.S.
Breeding 7 litters a year (with usually 8-10 puppies in a litter), breeding dogs that have produced puppies with health problems in the past, and selling the puppies to even incompetent owners. 
And of course a lot of them end up being re-homed and sometimes even put down because of that.
Almost none of the CO breeders in U.S. health test all their breeding stock. But they have no problem asking up to $3000 for a pup.
The whole thing is truly tragic. Greed ruins everything. 

@Kirsten&Gypsy, thank you for taking the time to read it 
Same here, I always prefer to read/hear about (relatively) rare breeds from people who actually own(ed) them.


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## Foresthund (Jul 17, 2013)

Okay,I don't think I've seen any of those breeds unfortunately.

Perhaps scaring or fighting off bears from livestock turned into hunting bears? Then likely copied it. It is possible to train different breeds for different tasks,especially if you find a non standard version of a breed. A video of a CAO used for boar hunting: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wdH_YinZKM People like to exaggerate things.

They are used some in dog fighting in different countries,although central asian shepherds are more common then the Caucasian variety,and I would consider them a harder breed but not vicious.


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

Yes, I've seen that video before. 
You don't see the Tobet (the Kazakh native subtype of the Central Asian shepherd breed) hunting in this video. 
He is just holding down the boar, the two smaller dogs in the video are the hunting dogs, not the Tobet.

But my point is not about what you can train or not train a dog to do. I mean, there are even several CO's that were successfully trained to be therapy dogs because they were acting out of standard.
My point is very simple: Caucasian shepherd dogs were never bred or historically used for hunting. Successful LGD's need to have a (relative) low prey drive.
I do think you are right when you say that perhaps someone read they had to fight off/scare off bears (and other large predators) and then changed that into "hunt". 
Whether this was done on purpose or by accident doesn't even matter at this point.


Actually in former Soviet Union & Afghanistan they mainly use Central Asians & the North Caucasian Volkodav for their immoral dog fighting tournaments.
North Caucasian Volkodavs are basically a newly developed fighting breed. They are a mix between Central Asian shepherds, aboriginal CO's and sometimes some other breeds too.
There are no fighting lines within the FCI Caucasian Ovcharka (that's not to say that there is no random sociopath fighting his/hers CO, just that there are no fighting lines within this breed).

With Central Asian shepherds on the other hand, you can now officially speak of fighting lines. 
This is a fairly recent development that happened after the industrialization and became hugely popular over there after the fall of the Soviet Union. 
Even the Central Asian Ovcharka's from non-fighting lines are usually aggressive towards strange dogs (as are most CO's btw), so as you can imagine the CAO's from the fighting lines have a dog aggression that's through the roof. 
There have been reports of males from these lines being so aggressive that they'll even attack females in heat, puppies fighting to the death etc..
It's truly sickening what people will do for money.
This is really important to mention for anyone who genuinely loves dogs and is interested in the Central Asian Shepherd dogs.
Because if a person buys a dog from fighting lines, even if they themselves are not fighting the dog, they are still supporting this animal abuse with their money.
Luckily there are still plenty of CAO (stands for Central Asian Ovcharka) breeders that use them what they were originally bred for: guarding live stock and/or people.


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## Trillian (Jan 17, 2011)

Out of curiosity: How much coat maintenance has to be preformed on one of these dogs? In reality, how probable is it to be able to hire a professional to groom one with out risk?


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

They are pretty low maintenance when it comes to their coat. Or at least to me.
I brush them with a slicker brush couple of times a week just to keep them looking neat and to avoid any matted hair (for CO's with uncropped ears it's important to note that they need to be brushed behind their ears too).
And that's all they need until it's time for them to blow their coats (_usually this happens once a year between early to late spring, but they also have a "mini" shedding right before winter, to prepare for growing in of the winter coat; females will also blow coat after having a litter_).
Blowing their coats often lasts 2-3 weeks and during this time most people will use a rake (I myself just continue to use a slicker brush, that works too). 
As long as the owner does this regularly while they are blowing their coats and puts all the undercoat in a trash bag, the house remains rather neat. 

This is what it looked like after I brushed out the dead undercoat from our male:










And this is what I got when I was brushing our female before summer: 










I got the same amount of undercoat 2-3 more times before she was done blowing her coat.

It's important never to shave these dogs. This article explains why not: http://www.veterinaryinsider.com/public/Thinking-About-Shaving-Your-Dogs-Hair-Coat-For-The-Summer-Think-Again.cfm

So, I don't need to hire a professional to groom our dogs. 
People who show their CO's do, but I don't know if and how hard it is for them to find good ones for this and other breeds with similar coats.


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## Spirit_of_Cotons (Jun 21, 2009)

Very interesting MountainDogs! I can definitely see how the Armenian Gampr Dog came from them. The ones you showed, can their coats really get that fluffy? 
And the cat in the one shot (with your dog's fur) is cute.


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## shannylee (Aug 8, 2013)

Thanks for posting! Always interesting to read about a different breed. Gorgeous dogs! Curious...how much does one weigh? I read that the males are larger but didn't see an average weight. And that's a lot of fur!!! I was talking about my Eskie's (RIP Kodi girl) fur all over the house once and a co-worker asked if I saved it. Um...no, why? She said that I could have it spun into yarn and make a sweater out of it. :O I don't think so. LOL!


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

> Very interesting MountainDogs! I can definitely see how the Armenian Gampr Dog came from them. The ones you showed, can their coats really get that fluffy?
> And the cat in the one shot (with your dog's fur) is cute.


Thanks! She sure is cute, but then I am biased 
Well actually it's the other way around, the CO came from the Armenian Gampr and other aboriginal, landrace LGD's from Caucasus.
Armenian Gampr dogs, Nagazi etc are all names for local ancestors of what is today called the Caucasian shepherd dog.
The Red Army imported what they thought were the best and most functional, most ferocious guardians from Caucasus. 
Then with these dogs they started selectively breeding for the most protective individuals and they came up with the name and the breed standard for them.

CO's with long and intermediate coats all have such fluffy undercoat. Short-haired ones have also shorter undercoat.



> Thanks for posting! Always interesting to read about a different breed. Gorgeous dogs! Curious...how much does one weigh? I read that the males are larger but didn't see an average weight. And that's a lot of fur!!! I was talking about my Eskie's (RIP Kodi girl) fur all over the house once and a co-worker asked if I saved it. Um...no, why? She said that I could have it spun into yarn and make a sweater out of it. :O I don't think so. LOL!


Thanks! 
For males minimum weight is 110lbs and for females it's 99lbs.
There is no maximum weight set for this breed, but since this is a working breed, functionality is the key. And CO's that weigh over 160-170lbs can hardly be called functional.

It's so interesting to see what people can do with dog's fur.
Speaking of spinning dog's fur, a lady here in U.S. that's not breeding CO's at the moment made this with their fur:


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## Foresthund (Jul 17, 2013)

MountainDogs said:


> Yes, I've seen that video before.
> You don't see the Tobet (the Kazakh native subtype of the Central Asian shepherd breed) hunting in this video.
> He is just holding down the boar, the two smaller dogs in the video are the hunting dogs, not the Tobet.
> 
> ...



Okay,yeah thats why I mentioned the off standard ones. I know live stock guardians generally have lower prey drive so they wouldn't harm or kill the live stock they need to protect.
The fighting line Central asian shepherd would be a nightmare for most people anyways. A very powerful dog that's highly DA needs the right person,and if you want a guard dog then those are likely not the best choice for most people either. I like the Central asian Ovtcharka's,perhaps because I like medium fur dogs but I don't see myself owning one.


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

I agree, I too would never want to own a 100+ lbs dog with such severe DA (well I would never want to own any dog with a severe DA, whether it's small or big, but especially not such large ones).
And you are right, CAO's from fighting lines don't make good guard dogs. Most of them are very friendly towards strangers. 
I find it tragic how much these dog fighters have managed to damage the CAO in such short time frame and I just wish humans would stop fighting animals


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## shannylee (Aug 8, 2013)

MountainDogs said:


> Thanks!
> For males minimum weight is 110lbs and for females it's 99lbs.
> There is no maximum weight set for this breed, but since this is a working breed, functionality is the key. And CO's that weigh over 160-170lbs can hardly be called functional.
> 
> ...


LOL! That's great! I live in FL so we don't wear much of anything made of fur from any kind of critter. Struck me as funny when someone (albeit she was from the frozen north...Colorado...lol!) suggested that I make clothing from dog hair. We don't wear shoes if we don't have to much less socks  I used to wash Kodi's fur and put it in the yard for the birds and squirrels to line their nests.


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

Putting their fur out for birds and squirrels is a great idea. I never thought of that one, I'm sure birds and other critters in your backyard really appreciated the gesture 
Too bad my cat has chased off all birds and squirrels from our back yard; they never even visit us anymore *sigh*


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## Spirit_of_Cotons (Jun 21, 2009)

Mt.Dogs--first hope you don't mind me shortening your sn. Secondly, you probably told me the CO came from the AGD (shortening the Gampr's name), but I forgot, oops. Sorry. 

Armenian Gampr dogs, Nagazi etc are all local varieties of what is today called the Caucasian shepherd dog.
^This is probably self explanatory, but I have to ask. Just like with any dog there are different names that comes with the breed. But just to clarify, the CO, CAO, and AGD are all separate right? 

shanneylee--when we'd do sheep shearing at the nature center, there'd always people there asking if they could buy the wool to make clothing. Never felt dog fur clothes before, although I have heard of people doing this. My last employer made jewelry (like bracelets) with horse hair. That was a new one to me, but she said it never rubbed or was harsh on one's skin.


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

Spirit_of_Cotons said:


> Mt.Dogs--first hope you don't mind me shortening your sn. Secondly, you probably told me the CO came from the AGD (shortening the Gampr's name), but I forgot, oops. Sorry.
> 
> Armenian Gampr dogs, Nagazi etc are all local varieties of what is today called the Caucasian shepherd dog.
> ^This is probably self explanatory, but I have to ask. Just like with any dog there are different names that comes with the breed. But just to clarify, the CO, CAO, and AGD are all separate right?


No I don't mind at all 
CO (stands for Caucasian Ovcharka) and CAO (stands for Central Asian Ovcharka) are indeed two separate breeds.
CO is recognized under the FCI-Standard N° 328 and the CAO is recognized under FCI-Standard N° 335.
(_FCI is an international federation of kennel clubs and stands for Fédération Cynologique Internationale_)

AGD on the other hand is not a recognized breed. Nor do I think they'll become recognized any time soon.
They are seen as the local Armenian variety of landrace LGD's found on Caucasus. So with that in mind I wouldn't consider them as truly separate from CO. 
Neither CO's or CAO's have a closed stud book. 
So basically this means that breeders could if they wanted to, bring in aboriginal dogs from countries of origin if they confirm to the breed standards. 
Those aboriginal dogs can then get a conditional registration certificate/pedigree from RKF (known as B pedigree in some countries) and be used in breeding programs. RKF stands for "Russian Kynological Federation".
Unfortunately most CO breeders don't want to do any of that. Not many of them care about the genetic diversity.
Most of them will only breed with already established lines and then heavily inbreed on champion dogs. 

Because that way they can more easily predict what the puppies will end up looking when they mature, which is very important to them as exterior is a number one priority for such breeders.
And also they can sell more puppies if they can say they are the descendant of this champion dog or that champion dog.

But it seems such is the fate for most other breeds that originated as a landrace: 
1 type becomes popular, champion dogs go on to sire many, many litters; most other types within the breed are neglected, heavily inbred dogs go on to win more dog shows and you can kiss the genetic diversity good bye.
People involved stop breeding for functionality (including the correct temperament and good health) and instead they mainly breed for looks that sell.
So then what once was a healthy, sturdy breed.. slowly but surely becomes more and more plagued by health issues. 
And you end up seeing more and more dogs within that breed not having the right temperament, not being build correctly to even being able to do what the breed was originally intended for.


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## Spirit_of_Cotons (Jun 21, 2009)

You should seriously write all this info on wikipedia or next time I use a dog I'm unsure in my story, I'm coming straight to you and here! 

Not to get off your beautiful CO's, but I heard the Malak is a variation of the Anatolian. I also heard they look and act differently, so basically that's the same as the CO and AGD? 

Sorry I'm only asking because years ago I used so many of the same breeds in my stories and I'm really trying not to do that now. I already used the CO and that's why I went with the AGD b/c I thought they were a different breed. I still love both of them in my stories and would keep them too. Aleksander (the CO) looks and acts a heck of a lot different than Argos (AGD--this story). So would that be okay? Or should I rewrite both breeds (I do research them and everything I need before writing my story)?


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

Most LGD breeds have started out as a landrace and then later on they were further refined and standardized through selective breeding towards a written breed standard.

History of LGD breeds originating from around the border of Europe & Asia and in Central Asia has always been confusing to westerners due to (among other things) the lack of written records, wars and the natives not being involved in cynology until very recently. 
On top of that, people are very, very nationalistic over there. So they will often change and romanticize the history of their dog breeds to make their own country look better.
Ego and nationalistic pride is more important than anything else to such people. 
This is due to their history with Russia and for non-natives involved with these breeds, it's due to monetary reasons for the most part, being able to say they are breeding a "unique" breed etc.
Vast majority of Armenians will also never admit that there are LGD's in their country that look and behave exactly like Turkish LGD breeds. Because of their history with Turkey.
They won't admit that their LGD's resemble the LGD's from any surrounding nations, nor will they ever admit that AGD's are part of a landrace. They will instead say that these are all AGD's, stolen by the Turks and that AGD's are unique dogs unlike any other breed out there *insert sarcasm here*

So this is just one example of how a country's history over there clouds their view on which breeds are separate and which are not.
Speaking of which, I have realized that unfortunately in the dog world to most breeders it is all about ego's, politics and money. The ones that truly care about the dogs are in a small minority...

As for Malak's, it all depends on who you talk to.
ASD breeders will say they are a variation of the Anatolian, Malak breeders will claim they are a unique ancient molosser breed and that Anatolians are just mutts (which I don't believe btw). 
And then there is a third group that says Makalakli are a recent mix of Kangals and English Mastiffs.

Hard to say who is right.
I personally always prefer for landrace breeds to be preserved in that form and not make them too homogeneous/uniform because a large genetic diversity is better for a breed (and I just love the fact that there is so much variety within the breed CO for example). 

As for the characters in your story, all dogs are individuals, so I think your characters could act somewhat differently from each other but they would also have a lot in common (because of how closely related they are).
If one of them was long haired and the other short haired they could look somewhat different, but they would have a lot of similar features. 

And yes, sadly wiki has tons of wrong info about the CO.


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## Spirit_of_Cotons (Jun 21, 2009)

Okay so they're basically like cousins. Same family, different breeding...sort of. My dog characters are different, Aleksander (the CO) is very wary of strangers and has a darker, longer coat. Whereas Argos (the AGD) has to get used to all types of strangers and has a lighter, shorter coat with more white in it. 

Thank you for helping again! Btw, how'd you get into the CO breed; what drew you to them? Were your dogs expensive (cause Luke was!)?


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

You're most welcome 

I have always loved LGD breeds, they are such majestic, noble and protective dogs.
Most people don't like stubborn, independent thinkers. But I on the other hand love a dog with a mind of its own and I love the fact that they are not "velcro" dogs and yet they are plenty affectionate when their owner interacts with them.
On top of that I really love the fact that a well bred LGD will so easily and so well guard other domestic animals that you'll entrust them with (of course the owner has to supervise their interaction the first 2 years, to prevent any bad habits from developing).

What sets CO's apart from other LGD breeds is how naturally protective they are against 2 legged intruders as well, not just the 4 legged ones. More so than other LGD breeds (with some lines in Sarplaninac, Tibetan Mastiffs, South Russian shepherds and Kuvasz coming pretty close).
So I think that's what attracted me to this breed the most. 
The fact that they are to me the most beautiful breed in the world is an added bonus lol

Ours were relatively expensive, we payed $800 for our male and $1550 for our female. 
Most CO breeders in U.S. charge about $2500 - $3000 for their puppies though.


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## Spirit_of_Cotons (Jun 21, 2009)

I saw a Kuvasz once at a dog walk. If I think back on it now, he was wary of me but still allowed me to pet him and sniffed Luke before turning away. --yes CO's are a very nice looking breed!! 

My parents at the time asked (before we got Luke) if he was way too much. I told them, a rare breed is going to be expensive. But after seeing what you paid for your rare breeds, now I'm wondering. We paid $2,000 for Luke plus something else for whatever...oh a down payment.


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## Spirit_of_Cotons (Jun 21, 2009)

I know what you mean. I searched shelters before going to a breeder. There aren't many Cotons in shelters, but a few were in rescues that an ex-friend showed me. But I wanted a puppy, so that meant going to a breeder. I'm not against breeders (I'm not saying you aren't either), but I would first tell people to look at all options. I don't think they're bad that they got the dog from a breeder and it annoys me when people look at me (or not me, but anyone) and you can see it on their face, "Oh you got your dog from a breeder instead of rescuing." 

Well look at it this way, in a way you did rescue your dog.


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

Same here! I am not against breeders, I'm only against unethical ones.
And I also don't think it's right how some people look down upon every dog owner that gets a puppy from a breeder. 
I used to do some volunteer work at our local animal shelter, back at my old place. The same shelter I adopted my cat from.
But I see absolutely nothing wrong with buying a dog from a good breeder.
As responsible owners and responsible breeders are not to blame for overcrowded animal shelters.

Recognizing a bad breeder can sometimes be tricky though. 
However, I feel like I have learned so much from this experience and I won't be making the same mistake again. 

Like for example, if a breeder is the member or even the president of a breed club that doesn't have to mean a thing. 
What matters in this breed is that the breeder health tests, temperament tests, performs psychical tests and can show you all the results. And make sure the breeder doesn't breeds too often (breeding more than 3-4 litters a year is a red flag for me).
Visiting the breeder in person at least once prior to committing to buy is a must. 
Research, research, research...you'd be surprised how good some unethical breeders are at hiding the skeletons in their closet.
That's what I would advice to anyone reading this thread.


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

There have been persistent accusations done by certain individuals on the internet about modern (and by modern I mean CO's from cultivated breeding with a FCI/RKF pedigree) Caucasian shepherd dogs being nothing more than mutts.
These people don't have any kind of solid proof for their accusations, but that doesn't stops them from continuing with spreading their erroneous claims all over the internet because it fits their agenda.
So these people point to the fact that the Soviet military tried to create different dog breeds for their military purposes in the famous "Red Star" kennel, as some kind of evidence that CO's were allegedly created through crossing of aboriginal LGD's from Caucasus with St. Bernards, Newfoundland dogs, Mastiffs and so on.

I'm going to try and explain why this simply isn't true.

The Soviet military saw a lot of working potential in several western breeds (breeds like for example the GSD, St. Bernard, the Newfoundland dog and a few others).
However, in their pursuit of developing working breeds suited for their needs, they weren't happy with how some of these western breeds would tolerate the harsh Russian winters and they felt that some of those breeds were "too soft".
So they "threw in" native breeds into these western breeds to "correct" that. And then they started with breeding programs that would eventually result in the development of the Black Russian Terrier (recognized by the FCI and the AKC), Moscow Watchdog (not yet recognized by the FCI) and the East-European shepherd (not yet recognized by the FCI).
Basically what I'm trying to say is: the Soviets have thrown in native breeds into western breeds of their choice in order to "improve" those western breeds. Not the other way around.

The Soviet military had several separate breeding programs going at the same time in their "Red Star" kennel.
One of their goals was to make the LGD's from Caucasus more uniform in appearance and to select only for the most protective dogs.
All of their efforts have been well documented in Russian literature (like for example in O. Krasnovksaya's book), pictures included.
Only what in their opinion were the best, most protective LGD's from Caucasus were bred to each other.

As I said before, these breeding programs were all kept separated.
The Soviets were expert breeders.
One of the many breeds that were used to develop the BRT were the Schnauzers.
Can I now claim that because the Schnauzer was used to develop a new breed all Schnauzers in Russia are crossbreds?
No of course not.
Or if we are to follow the logic of people claiming CO's are crossbred, can we now claim that because the Labradoodle was created by crossing the Labrador Retriever and the Standard, Miniature or Toy Poodle, the Labs and Poodles aren't purebred anymore?
No.

Of all the breeds supposedly the Soviets crossbred LGD's from Caucasus with, the one that makes sense the least is the Sarplaninac.
Sarplaninac is an LGD breed from former Yugoslavia, and they are the descendants of the ancient molosser dogs from Asia accompanying migrating nations to the Balkan Peninsula and guarding their livestock.
Sar's were not even known to the Soviets back then. In fact Sar's were extremely rare outside of former Yugoslavia until the 70's.
And Sar's have always been somewhat smaller and lighter in build than CO's.
Which is why in the early 90's (as CO's did not even appear in former Yugoslavia until mid 80's when they were first imported from Hungary) some unethical Sar breeders in ex-YU decided to secretly add CO's to their Sar breeding programs.
The ex-YU military did that as well, but they did it because they wanted Sar's to be more aggressive.
Because of the already striking similarity between the two breeds they got away with it.
Luckily ethical Sarplaninac breeders stay away from dogs that are known to have such mixes in their pedigree and they do try to preserve Sarpla's as a working, LGD breed.

Some of this has even been mentioned in this recent scientific study about Balkan LGD's: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/jbg.12077/full
That says (and I quote): "_.....Using neighbour-joining, STRUCTURE or DAPC methods, Sarplaninac and Caucasian Shepherd breeds could not be separated and additionally showed close proximity in the NeighborNet tree.....
.....Although Sarplaninac dog became a rare breed after both world wars as well, and it presumably admixed Caucasian Shepherd dogs and possibly other breeds into its gene pool, it also managed to keep its native population of pastoral dogs until present time......
......Overlap of all discovered Caucasian Shepherd mtDNA haplotypes with Sarplaninac mtDNA sequences suggests that connection between Balkan breeds and Caucasian LGDs existed at least periodically through the history. However, these results could also be a product of a recent admixture. In fact, there are reports of admixture between Sarplaninac and Caucasian Shepherd after the Second World War._"



Also, the Vavilov Institute of General Genetics, Russian Academy of Sciences in Moscow, studied Mitochondrial DNA Variation in several LGD breeds native to countries in between Europe & Asia.
CO's included.
They came to conclusion that out of all the breeds they tested (which were: Central Asian shepherd dog, North-Caucasian Volkodav's, Caucasian shepherd dogs, Turkish Kangal and Akbash), the number of haplotypes, gene diversity, and nucleotide diversity were the lowest in Caucasian Shepherd Dogs.
Genetic diversity in CO's was the lowest, because of the inbreeding & selective breeding the CO breeders have implemented on the breed in order to obtain a more uniform, more desired type.
More importantly, the researchers also came to the conclusion that (and I quote): "*The results of the analysis allow the Caucasian Shepherd Dog, Northern Caucasian Volkodav, Central Asian Shepherd Dog, and the Turkish breeds Akbash and Kangal to be combined into a single group with an extremely low degree of differentiation*".
You'd think that if CO's were mixes of so many different dog breeds, they'd have a larger genetic variety and they wouldn't be so genetically similar to other LGD breeds in that region.


But also as O. Krasnovskaya best summarizes in her book: "_*It is well known that any landrace breed, that is then selectively bred undergoes inevitable changes.
The then developed dogs may differ significantly from the initial specimen. Planned, selective breeding of the Caucasian Shepherd dog has lasted on the average over half a century.
And there are now obvious differences between the original form of aboriginal dogs, dogs currently existing on Caucasus and those that are created as a result of cultural/cultivated breeding.*_"


People who like to claim modern CO's are mixes, will put up pictures of aboriginal LGD's from Caucasus and compare them to CO's from the modern, cultivated breeding and say that this proves these modern CO's are mixed with St. Bernards, Newfoundland dogs & Mastiffs because they are much bigger and more massive.
When they do that, they conveniently "forget" to mention that modern CO's have been selectively bred since 1920's and they also forget to mention they are showing one of the many varieties of aboriginal LGD's in Caucasus. 
These people like to often focus on native, aboriginal CO's from Ossetia. 
This subtype is lighter in build and more lupoid when compared to other subtype's within the Caucasus region.
On Caucasus there have always existed both heavier and lighter types (heavier types were often in literature referred to as mountain types and the lighter as steppe types).
And as I wrote earlier in this topic, it is really important to remember that during the time of mass repression in the early 20th century, many people from Caucasus were deported to Central Asia. Some of them took their dogs with them.
When they finally returned to Caucasus, many brought back with them the LGD's from Central Asia.
And these dogs then often crossbred with the aboriginal LGD's from Caucasus.
To make matters worse, because of industrialization, less and less people were involved in agriculture and even more good quality aboriginal CO's have been lost since then.


Some examples of large, more molossoid in type native CO's:





















(this is Sherhan, imported from Georgia in 1993):







































(this is Chingiz Han Pirat, born in Georgia in 1985):











So they are deliberately ignoring the more massive, aboriginal CO's found in other regions in Caucasus.
But why?

Well there are 3 reasons why this is happening.

1. Most people who claim modern CO's are mixes are doing this because they are breeding what they incorrectly like to call aboriginal CO's (I explain in more detail in question # 17 what are the true aboriginal CO's).
And unfortunately some breeders feel the need put down any competition as they think this will somehow help them sell more puppies or help them become more well known.
What they also fail to realize is that you can not call dogs that are bred in kennels aboriginals, especially when their selection is no longer influenced by Mother Nature. Once the dogs are taken out of their natural environment and artificially selected for certain particularities (such as color, size and type for example) they cease to be aboriginal.
At the most they can claim they are breeding CO's that are more lupoid in type.

2. Another group who also likes to put down the modern CO's by calling them useless mixes are some breeders who are breeding other LGD breeds.
They also feel the need to put down other breeds in order to make the dogs they breed look better. And thus sell more puppies.

3. The third group of people who spread such misinformation are what I like to call wannabe internet experts. Most of these people have never even met a CO in person, let alone owned one.
But they like to be seen as experts when it comes to dogs so they will pretend like their ridiculous and unchecked claims are facts because it sounds like they know what they are talking about.
Sadly, many readers online are not capable of critical thinking and they'll buy into it.


Now people who read this topic might think: why would you even bother with what bunch of random people say about the breed you love?
The title of this article to me explains perfectly why: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2064658/Kate-Hancock-savaged-Anatolian-Shepherd-lion-hunter-dogs-woodland-attack.html

As you can read in the link, the news paper calls Anatolians lion hunter dogs and claim Anatolian Shepherd dogs have the strength to take down wolves, horses, and lions.
No dog out there can take down a lion. This nonsense was spread all over the internet by mostly Turkish breeders and owners of Turkish LGD breeds. 
They did this because of their ego's and in order to sell more dogs.
To me this article perfectly illustrates how lies about a breed can damage the reputation of a breed.
When people who know nothing about a particular dog breed read something like this in the news paper they think such information is true, they will get frightened and the first thing you'll hear them say is: ban this breed!

With most CO breeders in Northern America being so unethical, and with numerous unethical CO breeders from Europe also being willing to sell their puppies to anyone with money, I have to wonder how long before we see an article like that in American newspapers about the CO's?

So this is why I started this thread: to address all the nonsense that has been spread about the Caucasian shepherd dog and remind anyone who is researching them that this guardian breed is only suited for very experienced, responsible owners that have plenty of room, secure fencing (that is at least 6ft high) and are looking for a guardian dog.


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## Spirit_of_Cotons (Jun 21, 2009)

They want to make the Sarplaninac more aggressive? Are they insane? I read that breed is aggressive enough. How do you pronounce their breed, by the way? 

Those CO's are huge! Your #3 annoys me too; I hate it when people talk about any dog breed as if they know them by just reading the books or internet. If you don't have experience with them or haven't met one, who are they to talk? 

why would you even bother with what bunch of random people say about the breed you love?
^Easy. You want to make sure they're telling facts about your breed and not saying anything bad about it. All people should care. 

That poor woman and her dog. 

I was looking through my dog book yesterday and thought "Hm, are they right on the CO?" Do you mind if I put them up here? 

Book #1:
*History*: Like all herd defenders, this dog is accustomed to watching over its flock and protecting it all by itself. As a defense against wolves, while it is working it wears a wide collar with projecting spikes; its ears are cropped back to the base.

*Character*: Its pronounced self-confidence makes it partially independent of humans, and its independent behavior often can be dangerous for strangers. Within its own family, it is calm and undemanding. It resists oral commands.

*Living Conditions*: This dog prefers to be outdoors. It needs plenty of room and peace; otherwise it's always on guard. The yard must be very secure. This dog needs an experienced and resolute trainer. 

*Health*: HD, ectropion, entropion.

*Appropriate For*: Advanced specialists.

*Quick Info*: FIC Group 2/No. 328: Pinchers and Schnauzers, Molossians, Swiss Mountain Dogs.
Country of Orgin: Russia
Size: 24-26in (62-65cm)
Weight: approximately 99-110lbs (45-50kg)
Fur: long, thick with undercoat; also shorthaired
Color: white, earthy, speckled or motted 
Life Expectancy: approximately 10yrs
Training: 5 stars
City: No
Family: 3 stars
Activity Level: 3 stars
------------------------------------------------------
Book #2 (I go by this book the most): 
*Caucasian Ovtcharka*
Aka: Caucasian Sheepdog, Kawkasky Owtscharka, Kauasische Schaferhund

*Portrait*: Although opinions vary about its ideal type, this very Russian canine is quite a large dog, usually standing between 25-28in (63 1/2--71cm) tall. Weight: 105-145lbs (46-65 1/2kg). Contributing to its massive appearance is the profuse medium-long coat. There is heavy feathering and a bushy tail on these dogs as well. The weather resistant coat is especially effective at keeping out the cold. In its native country, the Ovtcharka's ears are cropped short, which gives the dog a soberingly wolf-like appearance. Never bred specifically for color, the breed varies in gray, fawn, tan, pied, brindle, and white. The FCI prohibits brown dogs.

*Development*: The lack of organized kennel clubs and written standards partly explain why the Caucasian varies in type from country to country and even from locale to locale. Ovtcharkas are found primarily as working dogs throughout the Soviet Union, Turkey, and Iran. The most uniform specimens exist in the Georgian Republic of the U.S.S.R. Although exportation of the Soviet-bred dogs is prohibited, quality specimens have crossed the closed curtain into the aisles of both East and West Germany.

*Recognition*: FCI

*Character*: The typical Ovtcharka is assertive, strong-willed, and intrepid. Unless properly socialized and trained, the Ovtcharka may exhibit ferocious and unmanageable tendencies. Some German fanciers employ the dogs as foremost guardians and deterrents.


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## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

Thanks for Sharing "Spirit" I especially agree with this "It needs plenty of room and peace; otherwise it's always on guard"


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

@ Spirit_of_Cotons
this mixing happened back when the army & police in former Yugoslavia started using them and wanted more protective dogs. 
And it also happened due to unethical breeders wanting to breed more massive Sarplaninac (which is pronounced as Sharplaninatz).
To my knowledge this mixing was not done on a large scale.

Sarplaninac is not an aggressive breed, well bred Sarpla's are calm, confident, protective dogs.
In fact I would say CO's are generally more protective towards strangers than Sarpla's (I avoid using the word aggressive as a lot of people view this word in a very negative manner).

Well in Book #1 the dimensions they listed are the minimum height and weight for males and females of this breed according to the breed standard. The book didn't point this out so it makes it look like this is what all CO's are supposed to weigh and measure.
And the book is not correct about the colors that are allowed in this breed.
According to the breed standard any solid color, piebald or spotted color is allowed. Except for solid black, solid brown or genetic blue or liver brown color. 
The undercoat always has to be lighter of color than the upper coat (well except if the dog is completely white of course lol).

Minor mistakes in the book: well bred CO's live up to around 12 years, so generally longer than 10 years. And other prominent genetic issues that can also be found in this breed are: heart problems, skin issues and elbow dysplasia.

Book #2 has more accurate info, except for what they write about their usual dimensions. Females stand usually between 26 & 28 inches and males are most often somewhere between 28 & 32 inches.
They are not complete correct about which colors FCI prohibits, as I wrote above other than the solid brown, solid black, or genetic blue or liver brown color are also prohibited. 
Also, there is no letter "t" in the Russian word Ovcharka.


Yes it also always annoys me when some people will present controversial, unchecked, wrongful information about certain breeds as facts even though they themselves have no or very little experience with the breed.
And unfortunately for some reason most ridiculous claims about a breed get accepted quickly and spreads like wildfire on the internet. 
As proven by that article about the Anatolians where news-reporters didn't even bother to check their facts and just run with bunch of lies about they found on the internet because I suppose sensationalism sells.. 

@PatriciafromCO
you are so right about that, they do require plenty of room and a place where they can have some peace.
Your boy Arka sure has a magnificent place to live in


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## Spirit_of_Cotons (Jun 21, 2009)

Sarplaninac is not an aggressive breed
^What kind of dog was I thinking of then? Huh, I'll have to check my dog book. Thank you for clearing that up. 

I avoid using the word aggressive as a lot of people view this word in a very negative manner
^That's good of you to do. I know when I hear the word aggressive, I think "well I don't want anyone to go near that dog". Maybe people don't think, the dog could be aggressive in some things, but not in others. We just think (me included) that it goes towards the whole package with the dog.

Thank you for pointing out the mistakes in the books; after I walk my dog I'm going to correct them. Now I wonder what else they got wrong.


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

You are most welcome 

You know, you are so right about a dog being aggressive in certain situation but not in others (like CO's for example when they are protecting their property but not when they are around their owners, dogs/animals they grew up with or dealing with familiar guests etc). 
That's why I had no problem saying this guardian breed or that guardian breed will aggressively guard its property, its owners, its livestock etc you name it. 
But then several people from another forum that I also frequently visit told me I shouldn't use the word aggressive unless I'm talking about unstable dogs, cause they claim the word aggressive makes people think that dog is dangerous and unstable.
So rather than to have a semantic dispute lol I started using different words to describe how some guardian breeds act when its owner, property or whatever that dog has to guard is under a threat.


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## MountainDogs (Sep 25, 2012)

So I came across this article in the Belfast Telegraph about CO's and the article made my blood boil: http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/caucasian-shepherd-dogs-bred-for-hunting-russian-bears-go-on-sale-in-northern-ireland-for-first-time-30469300.html
Just as I feared (something I mentioned in post #37 in this topic last year) now even news papers are copying the made up nonsense about CO's being bred to hunt bears.

I mentioned this last year but I'll quickly repeat it again, CO's were *never* bred to hunt bears.
The FCI CO's is a breed that was standardized out of the aboriginal LGD's (a land race) from Caucasus. These dogs were used to protect livestock and were required to have a relatively *low* prey drive.
In fact the Russians use completely different breeds for (bear) hunting. They use the much smaller Laika breeds: http://www.laikabreeds.com/content/

This poorly written, poorly researched article seems to be nothing more but a payed ad for a backyard breeder who seems to be desperate to sell his pups. The so called breeder quoted in this article goes on and on about the size of these dogs.
Apparently he's claiming CO's reach 14 stones in weight (an equivalent of about 200 lbs) and that they get to be bigger than St. Bernard dogs.
When in reality on average the St. Bernard *is quite heavier* than a CO. In height they are on average about the same.
To further demonstrate what I mean here are two recent video's of all breed shows with CO's and St. Bernard's standing pretty close to each other:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mhJHOEobaQ

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5siLESAK20

While yes, there have been instances where CO males reached 200 lbs, no ethical breeder would strive for this.
CO's that weigh over 160 lbs in general have (amongst other things) a horrible movement and a shorter life span.
This is supposed to be an agile, working breed.

The pictures one can find on the internet about CO's looking humongous are due to people taking photo's of them from funny angles.
In photography this technique is known as "forced perspective". It is simply an optical illusion that makes an object appear farther away, closer, larger or smaller than it actually is. 
I'll show you what I mean. For example this is a great-grand father to our female CO. His registered name was Remeny Domby Bruno.
And you'll find this picture of his all over the internet: 









Looks huge, huh? And this is what Remeny Domby Bruno looked like when his picture was taken from a normal angle:










Another example: Flex z Woli (a more distant relative to our female)









A giant dog? Nope, just a regular sized CO male (30-31 inches at withers):










This article didn't bother to talk about health screening for genetic issues or about the fact that not many people should own this breed (especially not the BYB'er they kept quoting).
It seems nowadays copying made up nonsense from sites like Reddit and Tumblr (where these lies about them being Russian bear hunting dogs first surfaced on the internet) & quoting a BYB'er equals to doing journalistic research.
You would think the least these so called journalists could do is take the time to read the official FCI breed standard for CO's (which can be found here for example: http://www.canadasguidetodogs.com/workingdogs/caucasian_fci.htm ).
If they don't know what this breed was originally bred for, then why not just go with the verified, official information found in the FCI breed standard!?
But I guess that would make too much sense to "journalists" nowadays.

And this is not even the first time a magazine/news paper from Great Britain includes fabricated lies about CO's in their articles while they are promoting an unscrupulous breeder.
The very same thing happened earlier this year as well: http://www.thelondonmagazine.co.uk/people-places/london-life/super-dogs.html

End rant...
As someone who genuinely loves this breed, it sadness me to see greedy, ignorant folks doing so much damage to the breed.
I suppose I'm at least glad that for the most part the random people who left comments under this Belfast Telegraph article seem to be a lot better informed about CO's (there was even someone who took the time to point out CO's were never bred to hunt bears).


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