# Groomer Ethics-When to Comb Out vs. When to Shave



## Pit_Bull_Lady (Feb 4, 2009)

This question is mainly for all the professional groomers here on dogforums, although anyone is welcome to give their opinion on the subject.

I've been grooming for about 21 years, but I still face this problem on a regular basis, as I'm sure many of you also do.

When a dog is very badly matted, and the customer absolutely wants the dog combed out, not shaved, how do you deal with it?

Do you refuse to groom the dog unless the customer agrees to a shave-down, or do you comb it out anyway, even though it's very painful, and hard on the dog?

I've been accused of "not knowing what I'm doing", or being "too lazy" to brush out a dog (LOL) because I have refused to comb out dogs who were severely matted, due to the fact that it would be so painful for the dog.

Your thoughts and opinions on this would be greatly appreciated.


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## lizziedog1 (Oct 21, 2009)

> When a dog is very badly matted, and the customer absolutely wants the dog combed out, not shaved, how do you deal with it?


As a former owner of a grooming shop, we would always push for the shave. If the customer insisted on combing, we would come up with an estimate for the work. If they were willing to pay, and the matting was not super bad, and the dog's temperament was reasonable, we would try to comb. There were cases that we either shaved or they found another shop. We had one dog brought in that was in such poor, poor condition, we called the humane society on them. The poor thing had mats, cuts, skin conditions from A to Z, you name it. If they had told us it was an adopted or found dog, no problem. They said it was there dog for years. They even told us that the dog was currently under a vet's care. No vet that we called had ever seen this dog or heard of the owners' names.

A quick professional question. How many of your badly matted dogs had owners that insisted they took care of the dog's coat all the time?


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## GroovyGroomer777 (Aug 21, 2008)

This is probably the most frustrating part of a groomer's career. 

You are the professional. Make the call on each specific case, and stick by it. If you feel the matting is too severe to remove HUMANELY with the brush/comb/products/hv, then you are doing no wrong by refusing to dematt.

Sometimes there are cases where the matting can be removed, but the dog is so sensitive it simply won't tolerate the process. This is also a case where I will refuse to dematt.

And if someone insults you, calling you "lazy" and what not, they should be politely asked to leave your place of business. That is just incredible. I wonder how one of them would like it if I pulled their hair over and over again for 1, 2, 3 hours..?

"A quick professional question. How many of your badly matted dogs had owners that insisted they took care of the dog's coat all the time?" Lizzie's Q-

I have encountered this and honestly I don't know what to think about it. It is possible with SOME matting, say behind the ears, armpits, tricky spots on the legs, and then I believe the owner just needs some help learning. But for a pelted dog?? They are trying to save face.


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## Pit_Bull_Lady (Feb 4, 2009)

lizziedog1 said:


> A quick professional question. How many of your badly matted dogs had owners that insisted they took care of the dog's coat all the time?


Quite a few...Some were just lying, but many were what I call "top-brushers", that is, they just brushed over the top of the dog's coat without getting down to the skin, and were surprised when I told them the dog was matted.
I have been able to instruct some top-brushers how to properly brush out their dogs, but some still insist on doing it their way, and the dog continually comes in matted.

To sum up, customers who insist that they brush at home, but the dog is still matted, are either top-brushers who just need instruction, or they are outright liars...

Most of the customers I have dealt with, when told that their dog was badly matted, agreed to a shave-down because they don't want the dog to go through the pain of brush-out, however, there is always that minority that have insisted I brush out the dog, no matter what.

In those cases I simply tell the customer that the only way I will groom their dog is if they allow me to do a shave-down.

I have lost some customers that way, but frankly I just don't want customers who value their dog's appearance more than the dog's comfort and well-being.

I recently had a full-coated OES (new customer) that was also OBESE, come in that was totally pelted to the skin, and the customer insisted that under no circumstances did he want the dog shaved.

I told him that it would be cruel to brush the dog out, and any reputable grooming shop would not put the dog through such pain, therefore the only way I would groom his dog would be if he allowed me to do a shave-down.

That's when he told me I was just "too lazy" to brush out his dog...

I did ask him very nicely to leave, although inside I was very p*ssed-off...!!


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## HORSEandHOUND (May 28, 2009)

When I groomed and someone wanted a demat, I'd bring my dematting rake out slide it between the matt and skin, then lift. dogs would either scream or lift right off the ground. Then I'd act upset for the poor dog and tell them the mats were too tight to remove this way. 
Broke those owners hearts and let them see it was for the best for their pet


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## Graco22 (Jul 16, 2007)

I'm with everyone else. You have to make a case by case decision when you take in the dog and examine the matting. Then you have to stick to your guns. I find that SO many people truly have no idea what a matt is, or what it feels like. Get your comb..show them...Show them how they cannot see the skin..how its basically a dread lock on a dog, tight to the skin. Tell them that dematting is just pulling the coat right out of the skin, because that is what it is. Matts/dreads don't just comb out. They can loosen, they can separate some, but they don't just comb out. And once dematted, the coat is thin and sparse, and badly damaged, and will matt up even faster. I show clients blades also...so they understand WHY I have to go short..I show them the thickness of a 3 blade...then a 7 blade..then I show them again how tight to the skin the matts on their dog are..and how I have to get a blade safely between the matts and the skin. I have never had anyone get upset with me after going thru this with them. I find that many are just clueless about matting, and assume they are just knots that can be brushed out. They have no idea, and when someone takes the time to explain it to them, they "get" it. 

On a dog that you feel you can demat safely and humanely dematt (personally, for me thats tails, ears, and a few small matts here and there ONLY) then you tell them your fee for dematting..Mine is $1 a minute, and approx how many minutes you feel it will take you..(always give a leeway..like 10-20 minutes, etc. because you really don't know for sure how long its going to take). Dematting a dog is VERY hard on your hands and body as well as the dog, and time consuming, and you should be paid accordingly. THis is your livelihood and dematting dogs all day will put you out of work with Carpal tunnel very fast. If they don't want to pay it, I send them home and tell them they are welcome to brush out the dog and bring it back matt free, and I will do whatever cut they would like.  THAT works well.  Some try it, fail miserably, and come back in but most just decide to cut short or pay the fees. 

If this is happening on dogs that are getting groomed often, I agree with the above posters..they just aren't brushing and combing correctly. I do take alot of time with my clients like that, and show them how to line brush, and to COMB!!! Brushing won't cut it on most dogs..they have to get out a comb too..I tell them they have to brush and comb EVERY single area on the dog..Under the chin, insides of legs, armpits, under ears, backs of hind legs, around the neck, etc. and so on til they are so sick of me talking they just don't care anymore.  Do it all with a smile on your face, after all, its only dog hair, and it will grow back. 

And yes, if a client called me lazy, they would be out the door so fast their heads would be spinning..


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## Cracker (May 25, 2009)

I am not a groomer and I wouldn't want to be one because I KNOW how hard it is, both physically and mentally. I was the receptionist at a busy AH with a grooming service and did most of the "intake" of the grooming clients (except new clients, the groomer always met with them the first time or if requested by existing clients).
I would do the same as recommended here. If the client's dog was severely matted/pelted I would get the groomer and she would either outright refuse anything but a shave down or would quote a very high cost of dematting. If the client insisted we had the vet "recommend" a shave as well. If they didn't like it, too bad. 
I have also seen the groomer bring up the pelt afterwards to show the owners just how deep and thick the matting was. 
It is your business and your concern for the dogs is paramount. There are lots of clients out there and if you get a reputation for being GOOD, SKILLED AND CARING the good clients will make their way to you.


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