# **URGENT - New Dachshund owner -- need insight...



## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

Hey guys! I just put a $200.00 deposit down on a 6 month old Dachshund that I'm picking up Thursday -- couldn't be more excited. However, I'm a full-time college student and since the responsiblity is going to be 100% MINE (not my parents, since I paid for him and everything), here is a big concern: my college schedule. 

Here is my schedule:

Monday - class 7 a.m.-2 pm
Tuesday - observing teachers 7:30 am-12 pm BREAK (maybe let dog out?); class 2:30-5:00
Wednesday - class 7 am-2 pm
Thursday - observing 8 am-2 pm (1 hour break, come home, let dog out?)
Friday - class 2:30-5:00 pm (morning free)

Based on this schedule, what would be the best:
-Housebreaking method
-Potty training method
-Time to walk the dogs

I was thinking when I wake up, after my classes are done, and before bed for walking (and having him go to the bathroom).

Is crate training the best option? What about direct method? Wee-wee pads?

Please insight -- I'm a noob and I want to start housebreaking properly lol especially with time constraints

Best,
Andrew


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## briteday (Feb 10, 2007)

I would begin with crate training. But you will be even more successful if you put the puppy on a tight eating and elimination schedule from the start, being flexible enough to change as the puppy grows.

Ask the breeder what kind of schedule the dog has now. And I always assume that any dog (adult or puppy) coming to my house can't hold it longer than 2 hours until they prove to me otherwise.

So this would be my schedule:

*first thing in the AM...outside
*bring the dog into a gated room and feed breakfast while you are getting ready for your day
*potty the dog, and then crate while you are gone
*when you have days that you are home, take the dog out every two hours...or any time the dog is sniffing, circling, squatting
*if the dog is out of the crate it should be completely supervised...both eyes are on the dog or dog is in your lap, if you are doing homework and stuff tether the dog to you with a leash so it can't wander out of your sight to potty in a corner...or crate the dog
*midday...potty if you are home
*afternoons...let the dog out before you leave, every 2 hours if you are home, or as soon as you get home
*5-7 PM feed the dog dinner, whatever time works best for you, potty dog within an hour after dinner and every 2 hours during the evening
*potty before bed, crate the dog for the night
*if the dog wakes up dry in the morning then you will not have to make night time outings. If the dog DOES NOT wake up in a dry crate, then youwill have to set an alarm for every 2-4 hours to figure out his night time abilities...

Remember to food reward the dog as soon as the urine stops flowing (just keep the treats in your pocket or by the back door. Clean up any indoor messes with an enzyme cleaner from the pet store. Anything else will leave residue behind, breeds bacteria only dogs seem to smell, and then they return to the scene of the crime to repeat the offense. 

The biggest problems we see with college-age people and dogs is that life can sometimes get very complicated with friends, socializing, climbing the career ladder, job obligations, and such. If you decide to do this it pretty much eliminates your ability to go out for a beer with friends vs. coming home to take care of the dog. And then there's the issue of finding housing that allows dogs in your future. This is a 10-15 year commitment. Where will you be in 5 years? 10 years? Can you afford major vet bills if the dog has a chronic illness? Do you have a plan to pay for the expenses which are typically highest in the first year? neutering? vaccinations? monthly heartworm preventative? food, bowls, leash, crate, toys, chewies, obedience classes, ...???

I think having a dog is do-able, I just think it takes a whole bunch more effort than you might imagine it being. If you are gone most of the day this dog will need attention and exercise in the time you have free? Do you have enough time to do school work, train a dog, possibly fit in some obedience classes, get the dog outside several times a day to eliminate and exercise (exercise some place other than the yard all the time...needs mental stimiulation)?


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

Brite, thank you SO much for the reply!

To answer you about effort: I'm a senior in college, and I actually don't drink/smoke or go partying - I'm more of a homebody, so I don't think using my spare time to take special care of this dog is too much to ask. I have wanted a dog my entire life, and giving my spare time to him is a small price to pay for a great companion.

Questions based on your response:
1) What is the name of this enzyme cleaner?
2) Do I need a specific type of food for my mini dox?
3) How much are crates usually?
4) Is there a de-sensitization period for the crate training? What do I do from the second I walk into the home with my new dog? Do I expose him to long periods of time immediately (in the crate)?
5) How long do you crate train for?
6) How often do you bathe the dog?

I have a room strictly with hardwood floors that I plan on leaving him in during the day when I cannot be around due to school so if he DOES have an accident, it's easily cleanable (as opposed to carpet!).

I am picking him up Thursday, so I wanted to get these questions out of the way immediately so im prepared! lol


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## briteday (Feb 10, 2007)

1. The one sold in my area is Natures Miracle, just go to the pet store and they will have it

2. You should continue to feed whatever the dog is eating with the breeder, for at least a month, until the dog settles in with you...then do some research in the food forum here to decide for yourself what would be best for you and your dog

3. Plastic or wire? Your choice. I like plastic because they double as a car carrier. Doxie size would be a size 100 VariKennel (brand name that holds up very well over the years...try Petedge.com for pricing...you may want to do a bunch of shopping on that site...they are the wholesaler for Petsmart and you get things WAY cheaper than retail

4. My dogs have all been "de-sensitized" the minute we got in the car to go home from the breeder. I don't let loose dogs in the car while I'm driving, or ever in the car for that matter! My daughter got locked out of her car by her dog the other day when the dog stepped on the door lock while she was out of the car for a minute to scrape her windshield...that sucked when her keys and cell phone were both inside the locked car with the dog! Not to mention that dogs become projectile objects if the vehicle is involved in an accident. So I de-sensitize my dogs by default. And they all sleep in the crate from their first night until their last. I start by smearing a bit of peanut butter on the back wall of the crate to entice them in. But if need be, I pick the dog up and put it in the crate, shut the door, lights out. Most dogs will whine a bit at first but you just have to wait them out. Some dogs do better (especially if YOU have to get up in the night to take them out) next to the bed. Others I've had are way too noisy and end up at the other end of the house.

5. Forever at my house. All of our dogs sleep in their crates, some eat in their crates, they go in crates when we leave the house, and for car trips.

6. When they need it. We've had some wet weather recently and my dogs are a bit dirty and smelly now. I'll bathe them when the weather breaks a bit and we return to more sunny weather. I bathed them last jsut before the Thanksgiving...lots of company coming and I wanted them to smell good!


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## poodleholic (Mar 15, 2007)

> I have a room strictly with hardwood floors that I plan on leaving him in during the day when I cannot be around due to school so if he DOES have an accident, it's easily cleanable (as opposed to carpet!).


Crate the dog when you'e gone. Hardwood floors turn black from urine. I wouldn't leave the dog in that room! But, isn't this dog 6 months old? Should be housetrained by that age.


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

Yes, 6 months, but i'm buying him from a pet store.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that he'll be ok in terms of accidents. I plan on sleeping next to him and the crate the first few nights to see if he needs any taking out. Is this a good idea?


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## Mom2Sadie (Jan 28, 2008)

Seriously...get your deposit back or be out the $200. ALL pet store dogs come from PUPPY MILLS! ALL!

Find a reputable breeder and get an 8-10 week old puppy. The dog that you're going to get, you know nothing about. It's been kept in a cage all it's life. It's missed out on VITAL weeks of socialization and training. You're just asking for trouble. Either find a good breeder or rescue a dog from petfinder or your local humane society.


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## chul3l3ies1126 (Aug 13, 2007)

Gags1892 said:


> Yes, 6 months, but i'm buying him from a pet store.
> 
> I'm keeping my fingers crossed that he'll be ok in terms of accidents. I plan on sleeping next to him and the crate the first few nights to see if he needs any taking out. Is this a good idea?


Oui me......
I know that you already have your hopes set high about this puppy... but I'm going to say what the previous poster stated. All puppies from Pet Stores come from Puppy Mills. It is the saddest money making business around . 
Here is a good link describing *10 Reasons Not to Buy a Puppy from a Pet Store*:
http://hattrick-dals.home.att.net/10Reasons.html

One of the reasons includes information regarding to what you are asking about. Potty Training. 

Trust me... I know first hand where these puppies come from they are not "so called" 'USDA Breeders, Reputable Breeders' It is all bologna... I worked at a PetLand for quite a while (BIGGEST MISTAKE and saddest experience of my life) and during that time I found out the sad and disgusting truth of where these pups come from, how they are treated (like crap with barely any health care at all), and how they are "returned" to the "breeder" after they have been in ShowCase for too long without being purchased. They are returned and most times just used as a Breeding Machine, or culled (killed, PTS). They are transported in a van or U-Haul truck in TINY cramped cages... no clear and fresh air to breath... then when they get to the store... people do a line up and toss them to each other to get them into the showcase room or cage as fast as they can. It's disgusting. These pups go from a cage with its mother and siblings, to a cage in a damned van PITCH BLACK, to a BRIGHT AS HELL cage in front of TONS of people they dont know... and knock on the glass and scare them... pick them up and handle them like if they are handling a basket ball. Sigh... so every dog that is purchased just OPENS another spot up for ANOTHER poor pup.

Here is a good site working towards stopping Puppy Mills for good. Sadly it probably will never happen, but any thing helps. Any person that turns away from a Pet Store puppy is keeping money out of the hands of a Money Hungry Monster that breeds dogs on end.
http://stoppuppymills.org/

It will more than likely be VERY HARD to potty train this puppy. Why? Because it has lived it's WHOLE 6 MONTHS in a cage. Walking over it's own feces and urine... going whenever they please... where ever they please. Getting a crate will not help it much at all... it is just the same as the cage it's living in now... and will go to the bathroom in it just the same.

If you are dead set on getting this puppy mill puppy... then so be it... and good luck... we will attempt to help you through it. But if you want to educate yourself and prevent more money going into a monsters hands... then research a bit more. 

Look on www.petfinder.com for dogs and puppies that NEED homes desperately. Or go to a REPUTABLE BREEDER. For the money you are going to pay at the PetStore for a Puppy Mill pup, un health tested and deprived of proper socialization... you can get a GREAT quality pup from a great breeder.
Nessa


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## Bellasmom (Aug 14, 2008)

I got Bella and Bug both from the Pet Store. The store I got mine from gets their puppies from breeders in the same county. We are a very rural area. I got to meet the breeder. 

I'm sure you are unable to get your deposit back by this time. Only you can make the decision wether or not you will go through with it. Best of luck to you no matter what your decision is.


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## Entwine (Jan 14, 2009)

I'd be careful about getting any puppy from a pet store--especially one as old as six months. But, people have already explained to you the problems that come along with purchasing such a puppy, so I'll leave that alone. ;S

I just wanted to say that I am a 19 year-old college student who also works two part time jobs. Granted, people are home at my house when I am not (usually), but the dog's training, socialization, and feeding falls on me. If you're committed, it's not even a chore. As long as you enjoy taking care of the puppy and realize that the amount of care for one is equivalent to having no free time, you'll be fine. Just remember that once you get the puppy, nothing comes before his or her needs. 

But, you seem willing and dedicated already. I just wanted to relate to a fellow student with a busy schedule and reassure you that it can be done. ​


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

In regards to the "puppy mills" claim -- I've also spoken to the breeder of this dog, and he's an extremely nice guy. No puppy mill for the store I purchased mine at! That's truly disguisting that stores still do that...

Thanks Entwine -- I'm looking forward to it! I'm picking him up Thursday, I'd love to put some pictures up...I just hope I can treat him well and train him and housebreak him effectively.

It's my first dog ever, so I'm just keeping my head high!


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## chul3l3ies1126 (Aug 13, 2007)

Well good luck with your pup then! We'll need pictures
Nessa


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## Bonn1997 (Dec 17, 2008)

Gags1892 said:


> In regards to the "puppy mills" claim -- I've also spoken to the breeder of this dog, and he's an extremely nice guy. No puppy mill for the store I purchased mine at! That's truly disguisting that stores still do that...
> 
> Thanks Entwine -- I'm looking forward to it! I'm picking him up Thursday, I'd love to put some pictures up...I just hope I can treat him well and train him and housebreak him effectively.
> 
> It's my first dog ever, so I'm just keeping my head high!


Spoken, as in talked on the phone? Or have you actually been to the place and met the dog's parents? Anyone can say anything on the phone


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## pamperedpups (Dec 7, 2006)

Gags1892 said:


> In regards to the "puppy mills" claim -- I've also spoken to the breeder of this dog, and he's an extremely nice guy. No puppy mill for the store I purchased mine at! That's truly disguisting that stores still do that...
> 
> Thanks Entwine -- I'm looking forward to it! I'm picking him up Thursday, I'd love to put some pictures up...I just hope I can treat him well and train him and housebreak him effectively.
> 
> It's my first dog ever, so I'm just keeping my head high!


A lot of criminals are "extremely nice" when you talk to them, too. Even if this guy isn't churing out pups for bucks at the rate of a USDA licensed puppy mill, he's still far from being a reputable breeder. NO reputable breeder would sell their pups to a pet store for reasons including their not having any say in where the pups will end up, and the fact that being in a pet store can be very traumatic and risky for developing pups. Treating your pup well and training him may be the least of your worries if health problems that should have been tested for crop up as your puppy matures. I'm curious what your breeder might say if you asked him for proof of vWD testing, or recent CERF results for both the sire and dam of your pup, for example.


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

Are you saying ALL pups in ALL pet stores are from mills?

And they showed me my dog's folders which included stamps of up-to-date shots and vaccines from the vet.

I really don't think my dog is from a puppy mill.

However, what can I do to ensure that I'm getting a healthy, up-to-date pup?

From their site:
Shake A Paw buys our puppies from local hobbyist breeders and USDA inspected and approved kennels only!! No puppy mills or substandard kennels here! Every puppy arrives at Shake A Paw with a health certificate from the breeder or kennel's veterinarian, and is then evaluated for temperament, general conformation to the Breed Standard and overall health. Every puppy is literally hand picked by the store owner and staff, and very often your new puppy is "Pick of the Litter". Only after an additional examination by our store veterinarian to assure you of a healthy puppy is your puppy ready to go home. Another reason why Shake A Paw is Your Best Choice for a Healthy, Happy Puppy!


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## Mom2Sadie (Jan 28, 2008)

That's what they all say. None of them are going to advertise "Hey, come buy our puppy mill dogs"!

As already stated, NO reputable breeder will sell their puppies to a pet store and have NO idea who is taking them home. Real breeders CARE about their dogs, not just $$$.

Why in the world is a 6 month old puppy still not spoken for? What's been going on for the past four months? At what age was he taken from his mother? How many littermates did he have? 

It's not going to be impossible to train this dog, but it's going to be much harder than if you got him as a young puppy.

If you want a 6 month old puppy with a questionable background...rescue one! Don't keep pet stores in business. It just encourages less-than-reputable breeders to keep churning out dogs.


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

Are the vet visits and stamps also fake that are on his file? Signatures from the vet that he's healthy and up to date?

How do I find out for sure? 

So you ARE saying EVERY pet in a pet store is from a puppy mill then?

I still don't buy this ...no signs showed that he is not healthy. Perfectly colored, no scratches or imperfection on his skin, snout, or face, palm pads are solid, no kennel cough or any odd gait.


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## Bonn1997 (Dec 17, 2008)

Mom2Sadie said:


> That's what they all say. None of them are going to advertise "Hey, come buy our puppy mill dogs"!
> 
> As already stated, NO reputable breeder will sell their puppies to a pet store and have NO idea who is taking them home. Real breeders CARE about their dogs, not just $$$.
> 
> ...


I agree 100%. I rescued a dog about 3 weeks ago. Giving a chance at life to a dog that had no chance is SO much more rewarding and meaningful than just picking up a puppy from a store or a breeder IMO. With there being so many homeless dogs, I don't think I'll ever go to a breeder. 
To the OP: I know puppies are incredibly cute but if you want a dog that will do well with your college schedule, you're much better off getting an adult (at least 1 1/2 to 2 years old).


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

So let me get this straight...

Based on what I've told you, you are automatically assuming that the dog I'm going to purchase is from a puppy mill based on the fact that "most" pet stores get dogs from puppy mills? Is that even a fact? What are the statistics?

I'm going to the store tonight to check up on my boy and play with him a bit.

Can someone PLEASE give me some questions to ask the salesperson/owner to ensure that my puppy is not from a mill? Any files to check? Docs to ask about?

Again, I looked at his file and he is up to date with all shots and vaccines, accompanied by a stamp and vet's signature for everything. He is extremely playful, lively, and loving, and shows no signs of sickness, or mishandling. He is smart, well-tempered, and healthy. Why should he be denied? Because he didn't come from the right place? I think this dog was meant to be with me, and I know it sounds corny, but I've been to that store and played a lot of dogs, and something just drew me to him over and over. Everything happens for a reason.I look at it as I'm rescuing him from "petstore hell" -- giving him a home to enjoy a comfortable life 

I understand the nature of the discussion, and I do see some dogs in a pet store and I can just TELL that they haven't been treated right in a prior environment, but I don't think it's appropriate to make generalizations to every dog. Just like the OP who got his dog from a store, and spoke to the breeder.


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## Mom2Sadie (Jan 28, 2008)

Gags1892 said:


> Are the vet visits and stamps also fake that are on his file? Signatures from the vet that he's healthy and up to date?
> 
> How do I find out for sure?
> 
> ...



It's not about his being "unhealthy". It's about irresponsible breeding and him missing out on living in a home during the MOST formative weeks of his life!
I'm sure he has been to a real vet. I'm sure he is healthy (for now). Here's a link for you to consider:

http://dogs.about.com/cs/generalcare/a/pet_stores.htm


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## chul3l3ies1126 (Aug 13, 2007)

No matter what you ask them... they will not tell you that it came from a puppy mill or exactly where it came from. Trust me. I will not believe anything otherwise. I've been there through it, as a worker. I left the store on my own after finding out many thing about the "so called breeders", so before getting fired I left. 

Point is... since everyone thinks the way you do... and do not want to educate yourself a bit more about the whole Pet Store fad of buying pups... then you are another that contributes to another spot being opened for more pups from Back Yard Breeders and or Puppy mills. 

NO REPUTABLE BREEDER GIVES THEIR PUPPIES TO A PET STORE, THAT IS THAT. PLAIN AND SIMPLE.

A reputable breeder needs to get to know the person that will be taking one of their loved puppies. BYBs and Puppy Mill operater can give two craps about where their pups go. 

All the people put together that think the same way as you do "I look at it as I'm rescuing him from "petstore hell"... just make a huge bunch of spots for MORE pups to experiance that Petstore Hell... sad that no one wants to think of it that way. The right way.

Why would you want an Un-Health Tested pup? That you dont know what the parents look like? (Pictures do not count... anyone can lie easily) That you dont know WHERE it came from and yet you are paying a large sum of money for it? I'd rather put down a smaller amount of money to actually "save" a dog from being killed at a shelter. 
Nessa


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## Bonn1997 (Dec 17, 2008)

Gags1892 said:


> So let me get this straight...
> 
> Based on what I've told you, you are automatically assuming that the dog I'm going to purchase is from a puppy mill based on the fact that "most" pet stores get dogs from puppy mills? Is that even a fact? What are the statistics?
> 
> ...


I do not know the legal definition of the term "puppy mill" but I do believe any breeder selling dogs to pet stores is irresponsible and just trying to make money. If you're getting a puppy from a secondary source (the store) for $200, this breeder is probably producing as many dogs as possible and selling them for about 50 bucks to as many stores as possible--without caring about quality (reproducing using only healthy dogs with good temperaments) of the parents or new dog owners.


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## chul3l3ies1126 (Aug 13, 2007)

Bonn1997 said:


> I do not know the legal definition of the term "puppy mill" but I do believe any breeder selling dogs to pet stores is irresponsible and just trying to make money. If you're getting a puppy from a secondary source (the store) for *$200*, this breeder is probably producing as many dogs as possible and selling them for about 50 bucks to as many stores as possible.


That was only the deposit.
The "breeders" sell it to the store for a certain amount... and the store sells it for double if not triple that amount. Again... how do I know? I've been there, "behind the scenes of puppy hell" if you want to call it.


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

Wow...nothing but sadness fills my heart. I really had a bond with this dog, I could feel it. And now, knowing this, I don't know if I can go through with buying him. Part of me doesn't care what has happened in the past, and believes that I can change his life from here on FORWARD -- give him a home to enjoy life in, to be loved, and to be happy. I'm a religious guy, and I believe that God put 2 eyes on our face to look forward, not back.

The other half doesn't want to take part in making puppy mills successful.

One of the reasons I actually went to the store was I had looked at shelters online, nearby, and petfinder.com for a dachshund, and none of them fit the bill in terms of a specific dog I'd want. But they had him at the store, and he was beautiful. Fun-filled, healthy, and so loveable.

I'm so torn guys...


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## Bonn1997 (Dec 17, 2008)

The point is that while you are indeed rescuing one dog from hell, by supporting that hell financially, you're ensuring that multiple additional dogs are put in that hell. If you go to rescue shelters, I'm sure they'll have dachshunds that you'll fall in love with too. It's up to you. It sounds like you've made your mind up, though. If you do get this Doxie, I wish you good luck despite being disappointed that this pet store and breeder are being rewarded and their business is being perpetuated.
Edited: I think you got this point now after I read your most recent post.


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

http://the-pet-haven.blogspot.com/2007/04/whered-you-get-your-dog.html


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## chul3l3ies1126 (Aug 13, 2007)

Gags1892 said:


> Wow...nothing but sadness fills my heart. I really had a bond with this dog, I could feel it. And now, knowing this, I don't know if I can go through with buying him. Part of me doesn't care what has happened in the past, and believes that I can change his life from here on FORWARD -- give him a home to enjoy life in, to be loved, and to be happy. I'm a religious guy, and I believe that God put 2 eyes on our face to look forward, not back.
> 
> The other half doesn't want to take part in making puppy mills successful.
> 
> ...


It is a very sad thing... and I absolutely hate it. 
PetLand recently got busted by the Humane Society of America for selling puppies from a Puppy Mill, (and I'm like uhh... they just now found this out?!)

Sigh... I'm so sorry that you have to go through this... but plain and simple it opens up another space for another dog to suffer and be miserable. 

What city do you live in? There are many Dachshund rescues everywhere... and you can look on www.petfinder.com for your area or around your area for Dachshunds or Dachshund mixes. 
IF you could find a Reputable Breeder that would be even more amazing. I'm sure you could find a good one for the pretty penny you were going to spend at a petstore. 

I would go with either shelter, rescue, or reputable breeder. Why? Because it is what it right and better for you and the pup in the long run. When I was 8 years old... my parents bought a puppy from a Back Yard Breeder, he had papers... was vet checked (vet checked means nothing unless the parents are Health Tested properly, the pup may look healthy to a vet on the outside... but it is what is within that counts) and looked like a happy pup.

Well he turned out to be completely blind, born with Corneal Dystrophy that is common in Dachshunds. That is what you get when you go to a BYB... or even a Petstore. When I worked there, they were trying to sell a Beagle... well they sold it and had it returned, why? because the thing was DEAF... Vet Checked means nothing sadly.

BTW I still have my Dachshund... Bingo he is 13 years old and I love him to death.
Nessa


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## briteday (Feb 10, 2007)

The bottom line is that unless you go to the breeder's facility and see how it's run, you will never know how this dog was bred. As far as the vaccinations, I would take notes from the file and call the vet personally to ask about vaccinations. Now, the "breeder" may know the vet and the vet could speak very highly of the situation. All is not as it appears.


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## chul3l3ies1126 (Aug 13, 2007)

Gags1892 said:


> http://the-pet-haven.blogspot.com/2007/04/whered-you-get-your-dog.html


That is fine... but you are taking a chance when you go and "research" and ask around with pet stores. I assure you... they are not afraid to lie... and they tell their workers to lie as well. 

I just wish that people could understand, plain and simple... No Reputable breeder will give their puppies that they worked so hard to breed and make good examples of the breed, to pet stores. 

You might be getting a happy puppy, one that looks healthy... what not... but it is still not reputably breed and properly health tested.
I cant stress that enough.

Sigh... I'm out of breath... I just hate it, I see it everywhere everyday. I work with my SPCA, I am the Presidents Assistant and rescue perfectly WONDERFUL trainable dogs... and they NEED homes, but are overlooked. Shelter dogs are just waiting to die... they NEED homes, but too are overlooked. Then we have people paying ridiculous amounts of money for dogs that they have no idea where they came from and what not. 
Sigh... anyway... good luck.
Nessa


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## ladyshadowhollyjc (Oct 28, 2008)

Gags1892 said:


> So let me get this straight...
> 
> Based on what I've told you, you are automatically assuming that the dog I'm going to purchase is from a puppy mill based on the fact that "most" pet stores get dogs from puppy mills? Is that even a fact? What are the statistics?
> 
> ...



I know you've been lectured about where pet shop puppies come from, so I won't go there really. 
I just wanted you to know that I also did not think my dog came from mills. For months after getting J.C. I googled the kennel name and "breeders". Just recently something finally came up. Their USDA inspection reports were posted by someone. I learned that the kennel my dogs came from had 98 dogs, and 40 something puppies. They had 4 violations, 3 health concerns and one cage that was too small for a mother and her puppies. A follow up report was put up and it showed all the violations had been cleared up, but it still was the proof I needed to show that my dogs were from mills. They have been incredibly healthy so far, and I've bee extremely lucky. 
A lot of mills also do sales via the internet. You can easily be fooled by a kind matured person claiming to care only about the puppy's well being. They can be hard for people to spot because they have pictures of the dog's parents and pedigrees. So, just because you've talked to someone doesn't exclude them from being a miller. 
Now that I've gotten dogs that I know have come from mills, I'm starting to be a lot pickier about where I get my dogs from. Every "breeder" is questionable in my mind, especially one that sells to pet stores.


Also, I got a paper saying my pups were up to date on vaccinations and wormings. The health certificate I got was for the state of Florida, although they were born in Missouri. I know the store has their own vet they use and puppies are seen by him and shots are given by him, but I doubt that they received anything before they saw him.

Stores are all different, but you really in general cannot trust them. I know it's hard to believe, but just do some research on the breeder/ where your puppy came from. It may take a while (it took me nearly 5 months), but eventually you might uncover something about them. 

But if you already put down a deposit, they might not refund your money. I've heard of places that do not refund deposits. So either way you look at it, money is going to supporting mills. Check your contract and make sure you read every bit of it and understand it.


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

Yes -- the deposit is non-refundable.

Guys honestly, I'm going to the store tonight, I'm going to really prod the owner about all of this.

I'll report back.


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## chul3l3ies1126 (Aug 13, 2007)

briteday said:


> The bottom line is that unless you go to the breeder's facility and see how it's run, you will never know how this dog was bred. As far as the vaccinations, I would take notes from the file and call the vet personally to ask about vaccinations. *Now, the "breeder" may know the vet and the vet could speak very highly of the situation. All is not as it appears*.


EXACTLY Briteday... EXACTLY. Pet Stores use their own vets and the vets get compensated well for it, along with that, Vets will lie about the "breeders" as well. 
Again... I cant stress this enough... I WAS THERE and all of what I have said happened and still does. All of what briteday said is correct as well. It is all very sad and upsetting. Lies corrupt all. All those pups are to them are DOLLAR SIGNS.
Nessa


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## Bonn1997 (Dec 17, 2008)

chul3l3ies1126 said:


> That was only the deposit.
> The "breeders" sell it to the store for a certain amount... and the store sells it for double if not triple that amount. Again... how do I know? I've been there, "behind the scenes of puppy hell" if you want to call it.


ah, the deposit. That makes more sense. The criticism I had about the "breeder" and store are just trying to bring in money applies though, as you obviously know.



Gags1892 said:


> Yes -- the deposit is non-refundable.
> 
> Guys honestly, I'm going to the store tonight, I'm going to really prod the owner about all of this.
> 
> I'll report back.


Good. Take as much time as you need and put a lot of thought into it. I'm sure the owner is a very smooth talker though. You're making a commitment for the next 10 to 15 years. Don't be pushed into anything, including making a quick decision.


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## pamperedpups (Dec 7, 2006)

Please check this out: http://www.prisonersofgreed.org


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## Bonn1997 (Dec 17, 2008)

Just wanted to add that it sucks that you fell in love with this doxie at a pet store. I could totally understand that you'd be frustrated and torn right now.


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## CrazyDog (Oct 16, 2007)

I'm sorry you fell in love with this pup but if I were you I'd would forget about your deposit and run far, far away from this store. All the pet stores LIE to get you to buy an outrageously priced pup.

Just because the puppy is up to date with it's shots, looks healthy now and has a "stamped" vet signature on a piece of paper DOES NOT MEAN THE PUPPY IS HEALTHY. 

1. A responsible breeder will be proud to SHOW you both parents of the pup, why would you want to buy a pup without seeing what it's going to look like in the future anyway?

2. A responsible breeder will health test the parents of the puppy. And health test doesn't mean "getting an annual check up by a vet". A puppy from a pet store will most likely come from parents with poor health and end up with genetic problems down the road.

3. A responsible breeder will NOT be breeding for money but to better the breed. They will only have 1 litter a year or so. They will only breed there bitches a couple of times in their lifetime. Not have them pump out hundreds of puppies every time they go into heat.

4. A responsible breeder will have shown the parents and should have certificates. 

5. A responsible breeder guarantees their puppies for LIFE. 

Questions to ask:
Ask to see the parents of the puppy
Ask to see where the puppies where bred and where they spent most of there time.
Ask for the breeder to explain in details ALL the genetic problems of the breed.
Ask to see proper documentation for health certificates for the parents and grand parents of the pup. Examples maybe OFA certificates with OFA scores.
Ask to provide references of people who have purchased pups from them. 
Other questions to ask and things to look out for, look here:
http://www.hsus.org/pets/pet_adoption_information/how_to_find_a_good_dog_breeder/

I doubt the pet store can provide any of this.............. like i said I would forget about your deposit and run. You can find another puppy from a RESPONSIBLE breeder for much cheaper and one that you would bond with just as well if you do a little research.

Again, I wouldn't trust this store. If you buy this pup, even if you think you are "saving" it you will be lining the pockets of puppy mills and BYBers with yet more money. Please don't go with this pup......

I'm sure one of us on this forum could help you find a good breeder.


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## Bonn1997 (Dec 17, 2008)

CrazyDog said:


> I'm sorry you fell in love with this pup but if I were you I'd would forget about your deposit and run far, far away from this store. All the pet stores LIE to get you to buy an outrageously priced pup.
> 
> Just because the puppy is up to date with it's shots, looks healthy now and has a "stamped" vet signature on a piece of paper DOES NOT MEAN THE PUPPY IS HEALTHY.
> 
> ...


Great post; I'm sure the last sentence is true but I'd still strongly recommend getting an adult dog to any full-time college student. You can likely get one that is already house-trained, or at least can hold it in longer. You'll also be seeing what you're gonna get. You won't have to guess whether the puppy will grow up into an aggressive, destructive or a calm, affectionate dog. You'll get to see for yourself. 
You should be able to find a doxie rescue group near you and tell them exactly what you're looking for. Then they'll match you with the doxie they have that is closest to what you're looking for. And if you tell them that you're a full time college student, I'm sure they won't be recommending a puppy for you.


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## Bellasmom (Aug 14, 2008)

If you have fallen in love with this pup, then get it. There is NO reason he shouldn't have as good of a life as a rescue dog.

As for the reason I got my two pups at the Pet Store. The rescue turned me down. Why? Because I didnt have a fenced in back yard.

My pups had gotten their first shots at the vet that the pet store uses too before they came home. Bella had 2 rounds, Bug 1. I got one pup at 12 weeks and one at 8 weeks of age. They are now 9 and 6 months. They have been checked and proclaimed healthy by my vet. Bringing them into my life has been the best thing ever!


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

Hmm...

I did some searching on breeders in my state, and the prices are pretty much identical in price. But that's not worries me....

I mean I guess i could just not buy the dog, and the store said they'd give me the $200 in store credit. Buy a breeder doxie and use the store credit for supplies?


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## craven.44 (Sep 10, 2008)

I am so sorry you have to go through this. that is exactly why I will not even go into pet stores that sell dogs any more. I have been in your position. I held a puppy that was sick and I so badly wanted to take her home with me to get her treatment. They were asking $1200 for her, so I couldn't have gotten her even if I wanted to, but I know that by buying a dog from these places you open up a space for yet another pup to be abused in this manner. It broke my heart that I could not help the pup, but if we all try to educate everyone we know about rescue or responsible breeders instead of stores, maybe one day people will stop buying these dogs and the people producing them with no thought to the future of the pup or its parents will have to stop breeding. Where are you located? If I had to pick a favorite purebred dog, I would pick a doxie. I can help you find a rescue dachshund or help you find a good, responsible breeder. Good luck, let us know how it goes.

You could do exactly what your last post says. That would be a fantastic solution except you are still supporting the store that supports the irresponsible breeding. But that is a much better idea than buying the pup.


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## Mom2Sadie (Jan 28, 2008)

GREAT IDEA!! Use the store credit (belive me, it'll be gone in a week or so with all of the supplies you'll need), then RUN from that store and NEVER support them financially in ANY way ever again!

Find another place that carries what you'll need, even if it's a little more expensive.

Just do a google search for doxie breeders in your area and in the meantime ask tons of questions here and do research on the breed so you know what to expect.


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## ladyshadowhollyjc (Oct 28, 2008)

Bellasmom said:


> If you have fallen in love with this pup, then get it. There is NO reason he shouldn't have as good of a life as a rescue dog


That's a big problem. People buy these dogs and continue supporting mills because they feel they are "rescuing" the dog. 
THIS DOG IS *NOT* A RESCUE IN ANY SENSE!!

You're right there is no reason this dog shouldn't have a good life, but the dog is NOT a rescue dog.

If you choose to get the dog, that's your choice, but do not think of it as a rescue.Think of it as a learning experience.


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## Gags1892 (Jan 25, 2009)

I've spoken to 4 friends of mine who have gotten dogs from the exact place I plan on getting mine, and their dogs are perfectly healthy, with no problems.

That's enough proof for me.

I'm GETTING HIM


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## Mom2Sadie (Jan 28, 2008)

Wooo-hooo, you can start a CLUB for SUPPORTING PUPPY MILLS! Good for you!


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## MyRescueCrew (May 8, 2008)

USDA dogs are basically coming from "dog farms", that is why they are USDA registered (like USDA beef cattle), and not AKC, UKC, CKC ect. registered.

Breeders sound great on the phone. I have 3 female dachsunds, and 1 male dachshund, sitting in my house right now. Ages, 2, 5, 8 and 12 years. They ALL came from a puppymill (and she sounded wonderful on the phone! But I've dealt with her in person enough years to know what kind of scum she really is), and were rescued after they were no longer wanted. These dogs spent their entire lives, up until they were rescued, churning out puppies (or in my male's case, making puppies). They all lived in cages, and all came to me knowing NOTHING. They came to me cage aggressive and food aggressive. They had to learn manners, socialization, house training, and how to survive in society without being so cage aggressive, because a cage is all they knew.

And I seen their conditions. I have the photo's sitting on my computer that were taken when no one was looking. I've seen the rusted cages that they sat in, and the filth that was their home. They came to me with rotted teeth, urine scald, skin conditions, coccidia, organ issues, you name it. Puppymills don't care about their breeding adults, or their puppies. Once the money is in their hand, they're happy and off to churn out more puppies.

I can assure you, NO (not. a. single. one.) reputable breeder would EVER (ever, ever, ever, ever) sell to a petstore. Only PUPPYMILLS and large-scale backyard breeders sell to pet stores. They breed in mass production, and then get paid a pretty penny by the petstores for their unhealthy and underaged puppies. Then those dogs sit there until someone comes along and pays the pretty price for them. That's why your dog is 6 months old, and not 9-10 weeks.

The puppymill where my guys came from owned, at one time, over 400 dachshunds. You can imagine the scene I've witnessed. All lived in cages, except a few in small man-made mud runs, behind a broken down trailer in the middle of the woods. 

You may be in love with this puppy, but I would urge you to ask for your money back and please find a REPUTABLE (and there are many here that would be more than happy to show you how to find a reputable breeder) or look at local rescues or shelters. There are even dachshund rescues and there may be one near you. I would ask that you do your research on puppymills and petstores (in fact, google "puppymills and petstores") and you will be shocked to discover some unsettling, and downright disturbing, things.

Take a look at this video. Just take a moment to watch it. And please ignore the fact that it's a PETA link. Because the video is actual undercover footage of a real puppymill, one that is KNOWN to sell to petstores. These are the types of conditions puppies come from, and this is what their parents live like. 

http://www.petatv.com/tvpopup/Prefs.asp?video=charlize-theron-pupply-mill


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## ladyshadowhollyjc (Oct 28, 2008)

Mom2Sadie said:


> Wooo-hooo, you can start a CLUB for SUPPORTING PUPPY MILLS! Good for you!


Even after there's people who are passionate about dogs telling hem where petshop puppies come from, people's ignorance astounds me.


First off, since you're getting this dog, take him to the vet immediately. Not just the vet your pet shop suggests, but take him to another for a second opinion. You'd be surprised how shady some vets can be, so a second opinion is always a good idea. Actually, being obsessed over where my dogs came from I've sent them to 3 vets, and they all said the same thing as the store's, so I was confident with him.

How old are your friends' dogs? Some genetic problems due to poor breeding cannot be detected until a dog is a few years old, so keep this in mind.

Second, please make sure you follow your contract. If something just happens to be wrong with the dog, and you must return him or need them to pay for expensive vet fees, you can only do what the contract allows. Like if you don't take him to the vet within 48hours and the contract (like most breeders and pet shops have) says you must, you're S.O.L. and they will not be responsible for any problem that may be found in your dog.


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## craven.44 (Sep 10, 2008)

I am really sorry to hear that you will be getting the puppy. I thought we were getting somewhere. It is not just your puppy's health you should think about. His mama is probably being used as a breeding machine and will be thrown aside when she can no longer produce.

I am sorry you made this decision. Next time, please look elsewhere for a new dog. Hopefully we will be able to help you when problems come up with your new puppy.


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## MyRescueCrew (May 8, 2008)

Well, if your mind is made up, then well...

I'd like you to still research puppymills, so that you can at least see what you have supported. And you're right, your puppy may come home fine and healthy, and live a life of love and pampering. But it's parents will spend the rest of their lives in a metal, wire bottom cage, never to be petted or loved on. They'll sit there, for years, in the wind and the rain and the heat and the cold. This is reality, this is the life of a puppymill breeder. They'll sit there in sickness, and never receive veterinary care. They'll die alone and go unnoticed for days, or even weeks, afterwards. Then they'll be dumped like yesterday's trash, because the truth is, puppymills don't care about their breeding females, and they only care enough about the puppies to worry how much money they'll get for them. But the parents? They're worthless to them, and can always be replaced by a better breeding female.

Two of mine were en route to the pound when I took them in, because they were "useless" to the breeder and were no longer doing a "good job" as a breeder. So they were tossed aside and headed for euthanasia. 

The word "heart" and "conscience" isn't in the vocabulary of a puppymill. I wish you would've stepped back, even for just a moment, and would've actually researched what we told you before becoming so dead-set on your decision.

Enjoy your puppy. I can only pray for its parents.


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## GroovyGroomer777 (Aug 21, 2008)

What a very sad outcome. "Hey, my friends did it, why can't I?"

The blind leading the blind.


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## MyRescueCrew (May 8, 2008)

Oh Dear God...

Let me tell you a little bit about "Shake A Paw". 

_CAPS determined that Penny came from a breeder in Minnesota. We found out that the breeder sold the puppy to a Minnesota broker, Pick of the Litter, who deals with a number of Shake A Paw franchises. Bob Baker, during his investigation of South Dakota puppy mills in 1992, discovered that this broker obtained puppies from the two horrendous facilities featured in the Life magazine article (9/92). He also learned that the broker was selling puppies to a new pet shop chain: Shake A Paw. _

http://caps-web.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=129&Itemid=129

And that "breeder" that Shake A Paw is getting puppies from (Pick Of The Litter kennels)...

http://www.animalarkshelter.org/ani...574F7020B10B1D30862574A10005CDE2?OpenDocument


Also:

http://www.christiangoth.com/shakeapawstories.htm

And:

http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/371/RipOff0371309.htm

http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/141/ripoff0141150.htm

http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/362/RipOff0362331.htm

And:

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/pets/shakeapaw.html

*Sigh* Good job doing your research there. Nice of you to support a great puppymill, I'm sure the lining of their pockets are thrilled.


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## chul3l3ies1126 (Aug 13, 2007)

Hehe yea for once I thought we were getting somewhere as well. I dont know why the hell I even try anymore. The last time I saw a poster with a similar story... I wasted my breath and said I wouldnt do it again. I guess I have too much hope, What a load of bull.

Very Sad Outcome... I agree, you and your friends should definitely start a club. 

Well 1 down... and on rolls in another poor pup!
Woohoo!
You all just do not get it, NO REPUTABLE BREEDER WOULD GIVE THEIR DOGS TO A PETSTORE! No matter what you experienced Bellasmom... it was no reputable breeder that your pups came from. I'm sorry to say.

Nessa

ETA: Oh and Bellasmom, hereditary problems do not start showing until 2 years of age... so you are far from the clear, you have a long wait to know for sure if your babies are free from anything like that.


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## MyRescueCrew (May 8, 2008)

*Sigh* 

Sad, isn't it Nessa? I can only sit here and think of the torture that the breeding dogs are going thru in puppymills, and I'm sickened to know that people knowingly support such cruelty.

I think I'll get up and go hug my ex-puppymill dachshunds now, and thank God that they never have to live that life again.


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## Patt (Feb 12, 2008)

To the OP. I don't know if you are still reading posts, if you are here is my experience...

A huge ditto to what everyone has said about Pet Shops. Believe me they will tell you exactly what you want to hear and even more. 

Thank you MyRescueCrew for posting those links, I think that says it all. 

We have a new shop in town called Puppy Boutique. Their pups are not from Puppy Mills...WRONG... they are *ALL* from puppy mills throughout the country. The pups are delivered at odd times and the vans are NOT air conditioned so when it's around 100 deg it is more in the van and some die. They have their own vet and he'll say anything to sell the pups. My vet has quite a few of the pups as patients and all are not well with one problem or another. One of our clients spent $800 for the purchase of her Chi (she was saving her). So far her bill at the pet hospital is up to 3K and this was for a dog they said was perfectly healthly. Yeah, right. 

Maybe you will be lucky and have no problems. However, think of the parents that are left in cages in freezing or dreadfully hot weather to pump out pups for your pleasure. 

Actually I adopted a puppy mill dog (stud) from AL. Fritz lived in a cage for 4 years (his entire life at that time) and was afraid of everything. Today he is doing well, but still has a few quirks that will never go away b/c of the way he was treated for 4 years. It is a sorry life, some make it out alive others are taken out in body bags or buried in a hole on the breeders grounds. Fritz happened to be one of the lucky ones that made it out alive.

I* have to repeat this.... NO REPUTABLE BREEDER WOULD EVER SELL THEIR PUPS IN A PET STORE. *



chul3l3ies1126 said:


> Hehe yea for once I thought we were getting somewhere as well. I dont know why the hell I even try anymore. The last time I saw a poster with a similar story...* I wasted my breath and said I wouldnt do it again. I guess I have too much hope, What a load of bull.*Very Sad Outcome... I agree, you and your friends should definitely start a club.
> 
> Well 1 down... and on rolls in another poor pup!
> Woohoo!
> ...


I feel the same way. One of these times though someone will listen and a few dogs will be saved. ((fingers crossed))


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## DJsMom (Jun 6, 2008)

Kudos to all of you who tried so hard to sway the OP! I've been silently keeping an eye on this thread, hoping for the best but not able to add anymore than what's been said.
It's just too bad the OP had already had his mind made up & was excited about getting his new pup. 
He & his friends are obviously not educated about puppy mills & pet stores & it really baffles me that people are still so clueless about what goes on behind these adorable little pet store pups 

gags1892, it sounds as tho you will provide well for your little pup &, & hopefully he will live a long, happy & healthy life with you. But I do have a feeling that you will be feeling pangs of guilt down the road when you think about where this little puppy came from & the terrible conditions it's parents & others were kept in & the terrible lives they've endured for the sake of the breeders money. You will HAVE helped these breeders continue such deplorable conditions when you buy from a pet store 
IF indeed you do feel such pangs of guilt in the future, PLEASE, please direct any of your friends that may someday think about purchasing a puppy from this store, or any other pet store, to this particular thread on this forum - let them read the links MyRescueCrew & others have posted so that they can make a more informed decision.


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## MyRescueCrew (May 8, 2008)

Fritz was lucky, it's sad that so many aren't. I received word the other day that one of the dachshunds that I was supposed to take in over a year ago, until the puppy miller changed her mind, died last week. It died from an infection in its blood steam that came from its teeth being rotted. It never seen a vet, and suffered and died. It wasn't found till the next day. I was sickened. 

My Callie was one of the lucky ones too. She lost 10 teeth, and was already missing over half to begin with, at only 4 years old (she's 5 now). She was also pregnant with pups twice the size of what she would've been able to deliver, and they were stillborn inside of her. No one knew this when they turned her over to me. It's not until she became extremely ill with me the next day and had to be spayed immediately. I can barely imagine her fate had she stayed at the mill.

At this point, between all the information and the links, I am hoping that this thread will become something positive in preventing even one person from purchasing a pet store puppy. Maybe they'll click into this thread, read the information, and change their mind.


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## ladyshadowhollyjc (Oct 28, 2008)

MyRescueCrew said:


> At this point, between all the information and the links, I am hoping that this thread will become something positive in preventing even one person from purchasing a pet store puppy. Maybe they'll click into this thread, read the information, and change their mind.


I hope so too. This is a subject that's starting to get very close to my heart. Any time someone says they're thinking about buying a pet shop puppy I tell them the horror stories and where those puppies come from. It makes me angry when people can read all this information and still deny where they pups come from.
I just read the link that was posted.
http://the-pet-haven.blogspot.com/2007/04/whered-you-get-your-dog.html 
The comments people left made me want to puke. One said that all these animal rights' activist just don't want anyone to have any pets.... wow they missed the issue TOTALLY.


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## poodleholic (Mar 15, 2007)

> =Gags1892;465211]Are you saying ALL pups in ALL pet stores are from mills?


YES! No reputable breeder would place her puppies in a pet store. Here's an example of what a reputable, ethical breeder is:

http://www.arispoodles.com/puppies.htm

Aris Standard Poodles are happy, healthy, outgoing beautiful companions. By the time they go to their new homes they are experienced in being around other pets, strangers, children and eager for new adventures. Nothing fazes our puppies. They happily walk on a leash, have begun crate training and been regularly groomed since they were 4 weeks old. Aris poodles love to go for car rides. *They are handled, cuddled and loved from birth 
Since babyhood they have heard CDs and tapes of rain, thunderstorms, lightening, cars, trucks, bells, whistles, gunshots, fire works, and anything else you can imagine.* Noises don't bother them. Once they're old enough outings in the yard with mama and littermates are taken. Additionally, each puppy also gets individual time with us to ensure a confident outgoing puppy. *Watching and guiding the babies to explore and master their new world is very special*. 

*We do Early Neurological Bio-Sensor/Super Dogs exercises*. This program was initially developed by the U.S. Military for training K-9 unit dogs. It was called the Bio-Sensor or Super Dog program. It is a series of simple tactile exercises performed once daily for a few seconds on puppies age 3 days to 16 days. *Studies showed that these exercises increased intelligence and neurological development *in test group puppies. Their eyes opened sooner, their senses were advanced compared to other puppies of that age group that had not had the exercises executed and they were much better able to cope with stress throughout their entire lives. Puppies are sold on spay/neuter contracts except by special agreement.

*When planning a litter I carefully research pedigrees using information available online and drawing on the wealth of information available from my wonderful mentors and other knowledgeable individuals*. I am *careful to look not just at the health record of the specific poodle I'm interested in, but to also research the family of poodles*. *Health, structure and temperament of a puppy isn't just dependent on the sire and dam - anytime you breed you are breeding to the genes of their families. Merely because a breeder says their poodles are clear on tests doesn't cover it all*. They may not be telling you that close relatives have themselves produced various issues or be sick. And, unfortunately, many breeders test their poodles just once and rarely, if ever, update those tests. *My poodles have hip x-rays and are rated by OFA, www.offa.org . Their eyes are checked and regularly updated by a CERF certified veterinary ophthalmologist, Diplomate of ACVO, and are clear by DNA testing or parentage for vonWillebrand's Disease. Skin punch biopsies are done to screen for Sebaceous Adenitis (SA). Bloodwork is done and certified by an OFA approved laboratory to be sure that the thyroid function is normal, that all other blood values are normal.*


*We are extremely careful about choosing homes for our puppies*. We brought these wonderful loving trusting creatures into the world. And we have a commitment and responsibility to them. Every puppy is entitled to a long, happy, safe, and healthy life with a loving family. So please do not be offended when we interview you in depth both orally and in person. We do this because we care so much about our poodles, not because we don't trust you. We assume that because you have come to Aris Poodles, you want a puppy bred and raised by someone who truly cares and isn't simply looking to find a home and take a check. We also assume that because you are looking for a lifelong family member, you will have many questions for us- and you should. Please ask for as much information and as many questions as you can think of. Visits are welcomed and except in very special situations, required before bringing an Aris puppy home. 




> And they showed me my dog's folders which included stamps of up-to-date shots and vaccines from the vet.


I would hope so! The pet store's vet probably does it. This certainly doesn't mean you'll get a healthy puppy; vaccinations can't help, or prevent, genetic diseases, or psychological traumas from JUST BEING in a pet store 24/7, resulting in behavioral issues.


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