# New Kikopup-pup- Holy Smart Puppy!



## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

So because I don't know anybody irl who would care about this whatsoever... have any of you seen the videos of kikopup's new pup? (I think it's actually her partner's pup technically)

Specifically the one posted recently... holy smart puppy already at 10 weeks!






And the video of when they got him, for extra puppy cute; 






What do you think? How much of their success so far is do to training skill of the trainer? Breed/ing of puppy? Age?


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## SDRRanger (May 2, 2013)

I love their videos...the dogs always look so happy to be doing everything


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## ForTheLoveOfDogs (Jun 3, 2007)

Aww. Such cute! I think that most people always recommend you teach your pup the basics and that's it until they get a bit older. I think this kind of makes me feel like I should just start right away with most things with the next pup. Obviously kikopup thinks it's alright. Guess she also favors socialization over worry about parvo?


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## Chichan (Apr 1, 2014)

I think that Kikopup is a very skilled trainer,
I also think they have A LOT of time to spend practicing these tricks several times a day.
Also, Lumos is a Border Collie. Which are known for being by far the most intelligent breed of dog.
All helpful factors.


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## Chichan (Apr 1, 2014)

ForTheLoveOfDogs said:


> Guess she also favors socialization over worry about parvo?


I will too with my next puppy.
My vet told me not to let Chico meet any other dogs or go outside until he got his second booster at 12 weeks.
Now he plays shy and timid with every dog he meets on our walks that come up to him.
Puppy class and play dates with our friend's Pom are helping, but I can't help but wonder if this wouldn't have been the case if we had taken him out earlier.


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## troglodytezzz (Oct 19, 2010)

Emily did get some negative feedback from people who thought that she was doing too much too soon as far as repetitive training is concerned. Here is her response to that from her facebook page:



Emily Larlham said:


> In the latest video... (the one posted below). WE DID NOT have the puppy weave, spin, fetch, back up, touch, do recalls, back around, jump in the arms, look up in the heel position REPETITIVELY. REPETITIVE MOVEMENTS ARE SO BAD FOR PUPPIES!!! I am going to make a video on setting up a training plan so that every day your puppy's movement is different. For example, three weeks went by, all the footage is from different days, we did NOT film it all in the same day. Each day he learned a new trick. So in three weeks he backed up in ONE TRAINING SESSION, and then we filmed him doing it ONE TIME at the park, he learned to back around both ways in ONE TRAINING SESSION, we then filmed it the next day in the mall where he repeated it ONE time, for the fetch he was NOT playing fetch every day!!! He did 3 sessions of learning to drop and get it. Then 4 sessions of being given an object to hold of different materials and walking towards Martina with it while holding it without chewing and then dropping it on cue. Then 1 session of running out fetching it -THREE REPETITIONS. A week and a half later, after reverting to taking the object from the hand and follow Martina with it for a couple of training sessions, we did do FOUR running out retrieves with drops - which we filmed. The point of the video is to make people understand how smart a puppy is, yes, that puppy that they are hitting on the head, choking and shouting at. We have never said NO to our puppy one time. And we never will. Tricks get people motivated to want to change their way of training. I will make a video on how to set up training sessions to prevent repetition- which is not only physically bad but in my opinion MENTALLY damaging, and also makes dogs stressed and frustrated when increasing criteria later. It was NOT because of REPETITION that Lumos can do so many tricks, it is that he learned complex luring, which means that you can get a trick on one lesson with very little repetition. The cop-cop trick he did immediately- that footage IS the first time he did it, then we repeated it a second time.. and he did the same thing for 30 seconds. Seriously, you can train a puppy 101 things without it being about drills and repetition! Martina trains him from 1-5 mins a training session. Some days he might just get a 30 sec training session, a 2 min, then a 8 min. OR just one 10 min a day. BUT what you are not seeing is the large quantity of time he is just spending the whole day sleeping and going on calm walks. Because we do not want him to play and run around with the bigger dogs (which is the no 1 thing causing injury in puppies, over-excited play with bigger dogs) - he has got to move to build his muscles to PREVENT injury. That is why we are building his body awareness and control in short and varied training sessions. Of course he also gets to just be a puppy.


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## CptJack (Jun 3, 2012)

Kylie had enough tricks with basics to have a couple of trick dog titles somewhere around 6 months (though not that kind of stuff, at all!). I'm a big fan of 'turning the dog's brain on' when they're young, letting them figure out that learning is fun. I think learning how to learn and think of it as a game is the important part, and the earlier the better. 

The parvo thing - In my area with what I know of the prevalence and particular strain (up to dead in 24 hours for some, 80+ percent mortality rate), no way will I prioritize socialization over parvo risk, especially not as I OWN other dogs I know are vaccinated and safe, and can compensate to some degree by carrying the dog around with me in my arms and taking it to safe (non-dog) locations. If I lived in a different area, with different risks and/or socialization opportunities then I would reassess. That one's a call everyone has to make for themselves with help from their vet (ie: KNOW your area).


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

I think puppies (and kittens and small human children and. . .) are capable of a lot of things, way more than we understand. The thing is that it needs to be kept low-pressure and super fun and positive, which are not things a lot of people are good at. If someone IS good at that, more power to 'em .


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## SydTheSpaniel (Feb 12, 2011)

I thought that was a very impressive video and I love watching kikopup's training video.


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## XenaWarrior (Apr 22, 2014)

Amazing! Her dog is gorgeous and I love how excited he seems to work with her.


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## goodgirl (Jan 14, 2013)

I thought it was brilliant as well, nice to read Emily's explanation, thanks for posting that. The video of where he came from was pretty cool, too; talk about a nice set up. Bet that environment helped Smart Puppy from day 1, plus probably thoughtful breeding.

I have wondered about how early learning starts too...out of 3 sets of foster puppies it seems they ALL respond really early to sensory input, you can see their little noses twitch at different scents when DAYS old, so they're taking information in. And I would assume learning goes along with that. Two of the litters were born at my place, one litter was 2 weeks old when they came. At 4 1/2 to 5 weeks old they consistently came when called from another room and sit with eye contact as a default behavior, encouraged by giving attention and hand feeding from the time they can physically do so. They accidently learned a hand signal to sit at the same time. If they're never allowed to chew on hands or your clothes, encouraged to play with toys instead, nipping is a non-issue. Well at least until teething period, but I didn't get to see any of them at that age since they all found homes at 8-9 weeks.

Unfortunately I live in a high risk parvo area, which sucks. I couldn't even let them out in my yard, rules of the shelter; I had to take them out in my arms, altho I suppose you could set up a pen outside.


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## jade5280 (Feb 20, 2013)

Wow! Super impressive and very cute puppy


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## hanksimon (Mar 18, 2009)

I think you should train a puppy as early as possible:
1. Sit teaches that words have meanings, Down teaches that each word is different, from there each new cue (and hand signal) increases vocabulary and the pup's ability to learn. 
2. For simple behaviors, 10 min. a day, twice a day shouldn't be too much. More complex behaviors (stay, Come, loose leash, etc.) and chaining require more practice.
3. Distractions require a little more maturity...

With the Vet's permission, when Shep was an adult, we used him to help socialize puppies that were not up to date. Sometimes you can find a comparatively calm, up to date adult that will help socialize puppies.... Look for a dog that will self-handicap when playing....


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## goodgirl (Jan 14, 2013)

hanksimon said:


> I think you should train a puppy as early as possible:
> 1. Sit teaches that words have meanings, Down teaches that each word is different, from there each new cue (and hand signal) increases vocabulary and the pup's ability to learn.
> 2. For simple behaviors, 10 min. a day, twice a day shouldn't be too much. More complex behaviors (stay, Come, loose leash, etc.) and chaining require more practice.
> 3. Distractions require a little more maturity..."
> ...


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## Chichan (Apr 1, 2014)

hanksimon said:


> I think you should train a puppy as early as possible:
> 1. Sit teaches that words have meanings, Down teaches that each word is different, from there each new cue (and hand signal) increases vocabulary and the pup's ability to learn.
> 2. For simple behaviors, 10 min. a day, twice a day shouldn't be too much. More complex behaviors (stay, Come, loose leash, etc.) and chaining require more practice.
> 3. Distractions require a little more maturity...


We've already mastered Sit and Down over here with Chico (hand and verbal signals)
and now we're working on stay (and since my cat is constantly walking around while we're doing our training and my puppy loves to follow her it's) with mild distractions. 
We've got him to waiting 15 seconds in both his sit and down. I'm adding 5 seconds to his stay everyday.

We started training "yay" means good and "eh" means stop what you're doing.
Then we started sit and down, and then "leave it" and come which are on going.
We've just started stay.


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## Jacksons Mom (Mar 12, 2010)

I love this puppy! Saw the video the other day. I think people need to not be so worried about what others are doing. Obviously these are good dog owners/trainers and I think encouraging a puppy to learn so early on is a GREAT thing.


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## lil_fuzzy (Aug 16, 2010)

I think most training comes down to the skill of the trainer. And I don't believe that Border Collies are that much smarter than any other breed. It comes down to the individual dog. I have met Border Collies that picked up new things at an average pace, and some that picked things up quicker. I have also met many dogs of other breeds that picked up things really quick, and some that picked them up a little slower. I have met poodles and maremmas that are more switched on than some Border Collies.

If you try to improve as a trainer, training will happen quicker and quicker for each new dog you own/train. 

Very cute puppy


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## petpeeve (Jun 10, 2010)

lil_fuzzy said:


> And I don't believe that Border Collies are that much smarter than any other breed.


 I suppose it depends on what constitutes "smarter", but generally speaking I disagree. There's a reason why virtually all of the 'big name' trainers have BCs. Among the MANY there's Emily Larlham, Zak George, Susan Garrett etc. Even the german girl where the puppy came from appears to have numerous astonishingly well-trained what? .. Border Collies. Just for once I'd love to see one of these people put, say, a Bloodhound, Poodle, English Setter, or even a Lab through the ranks of competition. Or train then use one as their own personal demo dog. Never happens, and I think we all know why. 



Chichan said:


> We started training "yay" means good and "eh" means stop what you're doing.


 o/t, but if you're using those words for markers, I'd reconsider one of them anyway. They sound so similar, it could easily cause confusion for the pup.


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## doggiepop (Feb 27, 2014)

excellent trainer and exceptional puppy. she said the pup learned one new trick a day. that's
incredible. the pup didn't seem stressed or pressured. the pup was happy and willing. very
interesting.


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## doggiepop (Feb 27, 2014)

1 >>>> couldn't you say "down" teaches that words have neaning and "Sit" teaches that each word is different?

2 >>>> i like training in short sessions. each session last 5 to 10 minutes. i conduct many sessions during the
course of a day.

3 >>>> i normally teach the command. then i add in distractions.



hanksimon said:


> I think you should train a puppy as early as possible:
> 
> 1. Sit teaches that words have meanings, Down teaches that each word is different,
> 
> ...


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

Biddability is different than intelligence. I don't think BCs are any more intelligent than a lot of breeds (aussies, cattle dogs, etc) but they are less headstrong. I was talking to some aussie and BC owners last weekend and all agreed they felt their aussies were just as smart if not smarter but not as biddable and more of think first then do. 

And I've had a lot of the 'smartest breeds' and individuals vary so much. Trey was an idiot despite people saying shelties are super smart. Summer, bless her, has little common sense and problem solving but she's so biddable that she learns really fast.

Anyways I agree I'd like to see some of the more famous trainers training a breed that is totally different than a BC. I love my trainer for that reason, she's had everything from malamutes to border collies. I think it makes you a better trainer.


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## goodgirl (Jan 14, 2013)

I think it helps to teach sit from a lying down position AND from a standing position- helps them to figure out the word's meaning too. Also, not just to follow the cue when you're right in front of them, facing the dog. Have you ever noticed how some dogs will only lie down to a cue if they sit first? If they will lie down from a standing position they probably understand the word. Hmm, that makes me wonder if my dog can jump up from a lying down position...she will from a sit or stand. It would be awkward for her. Mixing up cues seems to make her think more, otherwise she would just run thru a bunch of tricks without waiting for the cues I'm sure!


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## lil_fuzzy (Aug 16, 2010)

petpeeve said:


> I suppose it depends on what constitutes "smarter", but generally speaking I disagree. There's a reason why virtually all of the 'big name' trainers have BCs. Among the MANY there's Emily Larlham, Zak George, Susan Garrett etc. Even the german girl where the puppy came from appears to have numerous astonishingly well-trained what? .. Border Collies. Just for once I'd love to see one of these people put, say, a Bloodhound, Poodle, English Setter, or even a Lab through the ranks of competition. Or train then use one as their own personal demo dog. Never happens, and I think we all know why.
> 
> o/t, but if you're using those words for markers, I'd reconsider one of them anyway. They sound so similar, it could easily cause confusion for the pup.


There could be other reasons for this, such as BC's being the perfect size, flexibility and speed for sports. There are few dogs who can compete with them in terms of flexibility and speed on the agility course. 

And there are plenty of other breeds competing at a high level in obedience and agility, but when it comes to competing at the top, BC's are just faster. It's not an intelligence thing, it's a structure thing.

Susan Garrett has reached the top with several Jack Russells, Silvia Trkman has reached the top with Pyrenean Shepherds. So "never happens" is not exactly accurate. 

And I was speaking from personal experience. I have personally trained "independent", "stubborn" breeds that were smarter than some BC's I have trained. When people can't make them work, it's a motivation issue, not an intelligence issue. I have trained over 60 different dog breeds, not counting mixed breeds, and I haven't noticed a difference in intelligence between the different breeds. Only in individual dogs.


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## Laurelin (Nov 2, 2006)

Have you seen all the videos of Le's puppy tricks? Super super cute. <3


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