# Tracking and Protection work.



## pbody (Aug 2, 2012)

I was wondering how many hours a week do you work with your dogs, as well as how many hours a day do you walk your dogs outside of training?

Thank you 

P


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## boxerlover876 (Dec 31, 2011)

pbody said:


> I was wondering how many hours a week do you work with your dogs, as well as how many hours a day do you walk your dogs outside of training?
> 
> Thank you
> 
> P


To me if you're even thinking of protection you need to go to a good, trustworthy trainer that knows what they're doing. It's not something you train yourself.


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## pbody (Aug 2, 2012)

Well of course, I am actually about to join a schutzhund club. I know they would be able to answer my questions! I am trying to become well versed in the amount of time daily I will need to spend with my pup, as well as how much additional exercise would be required before I begin this commitment so I can make a daily schedule and manage my time, the most efficient and effective way to assure my dog has the best and complete training possible!!

P


But where do you begin if you haven't began with nothing?


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## boxerlover876 (Dec 31, 2011)

pbody said:


> Well of course, I am actually about to join a schutzhund club. I know they would be able to answer my questions! I am trying to become well versed in the amount of time daily I will need to spend with my pup, as well as how much additional exercise would be required before I begin this commitment so I can make a daily schedule and manage my time, the most efficient and effective way to assure my dog has the best and complete training possible!!
> 
> P
> 
> ...


I was thinking of doing it with Duke so I know a bit. 

Ok, just making sure. Some people try to teach protection nd you end up with a mess of a dog. First you need to get your dog evaluated to see if he can even compete and has the mentality to compete. Make sure that the Schutzund club you find trains a way you're comfortable with. Of course they will be hit with the batons during protection, but I wouldn't want someone slapping him all the time. I have heard of absolute horror stories with some Schutzund clubs so choose wisely and read about the trainer. I would work on confidence, endurance, and help unlock more of the drive in your dog. I would teach that just because someone hits it doesn't mean the dog did something wrong. It should almost be something that excited them to keep going. I know a lot of people use tug to help bring out drive and endurance. Some use a fluffy thing being dragged. Most bike for miles a day. I would get on a really good food too and supplement with glucosamine, condroitin, and MSM. It can be a lot of stress on the joints. Some use Vitamin C too. There was a really good article in Raw Instincts magazine about Schtzund.


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## Bear2010 (Aug 21, 2012)

pbody said:


> I was wondering how many hours a week do you work with your dogs, as well as how many hours a day do you walk your dogs outside of training?
> 
> Thank you
> 
> P


I had a titled shutzhund and multi ribboned in obedience trails Doberman back in the late 80s and early 90s...as far as working with him time frame..(not being smart here) he stayed with me constantly..he was worked everyday, in training always.There is alot of responsibility that comes with a dog being taught bite work or protection work..They have to be constantly watched,worked with so to say..not sure how else to put it.We have a dog now in protection work only(no bite work)he gets handled daily,everyday we go over obedience commands..he is with us always when at home..when we are gone he is in a wood/wire fenced farm with wire into the ground another foot and stacked(so he cant dug under or pull up)think about how serious you need this dog worked shutzhund.


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## pbody (Aug 2, 2012)

Bear 2010, I see that you said he was with you all day, the same with my dog Kye, when he was a puppy I started tracking on my own and building up his drive to play tug a war with nap sacks, now he is older not much.

During the days you did train which you specifically said you did everyday how many hours a day did you work on a specified training where did you guys go during the day what did you do?

Thank you P


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## Bear2010 (Aug 21, 2012)

pbody said:


> Bear 2010, I see that you said he was with you all day, the same with my dog Kye, when he was a puppy I started tracking on my own and building up his drive to play tug a war with nap sacks, now he is older not much.
> 
> During the days you did train which you specifically said you did everyday how many hours a day did you work on a specified training where did you guys go during the day what did you do?
> 
> Thank you P


I sent the doberman to a professional trainer for shutzhund,when he was home he was with me constantly unless I was gone and even then sometimes he went.For obedience we started with some puppy kindergarden classes to socialize and basics,after this was mastered we moved to the next with a group class,then we continued at home daily(but I showed him)so we worked everyday..only 20 minutes a day to insure not to burn him out.Dakota that I have now is not shown and we work him 4 days out of 7 for 20 to 30 minutes tops,pretty much anything after that at his age 10 months he looses concentration.We always end on a good note,a good stopping point.


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## juliemule (Dec 10, 2011)

Around 9 hours a week tracking, 10-12 on.detection, 2-3 bitework, and many more just playing, little obedience, and lots of fetch and walking.
Eta- this is for two to four dogs.


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## Bear2010 (Aug 21, 2012)

juliemule said:


> Around 9 hours a week tracking, 10-12 on.detection, 2-3 bitework, and many more just playing, little obedience, and lots of fetch and walking.
> Eta- this is for two to four dogs.


Mastering the obedience is a must and must come before any shutzhund,protection work of any kind.If your dog does bitework and not obedienced trained you are asking for some trouble.
I have to add this 2 cents too,unless you are going to show in shutzhund for trails or have a dyer need for a dog of that caliber I do not recommned shutzhund or any bitework.I showed and also my hubby travled around the world and I was home with small kids and needed protection at home.It was a major libility and alot of work.The dog we are working now is not shutzhund..no bite work..totally different.`


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## Discodobe (Jan 5, 2012)

I train for a few sports including obedience and tracking (no bitework though). We train every day - usually around half an hour all up for obedience, and try to track at least twice a week. When we first started tracking we went every day for 2 weeks, I find once they've "got" it they don't need as much regular work tracking, but you need to put the effort in tracking in as many different weather conditions as you can... No point only tracking when the sun is shining and there's no wind... Chances are you'll trial in 120kmph winds with driving rain! I usually do 3 tracks when we go out... I lay all 3 and track them in a backwards order... So start with the last track I laid... So we end up doing a 5 minute old track to start, and finish with one around half an hour old. I make an effort every few weeks to get out to a forest or something and do something longer/older... As I live in the city we do a lot of tracking in small public parks.


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## Maligator (Aug 31, 2012)

Bear2010 said:


> Mastering the obedience is a must and must come before any shutzhund,protection work of any kind.If your dog does bitework and not obedienced trained you are asking for some trouble.
> I have to add this 2 cents too,unless you are going to show in shutzhund for trails or have a dyer need for a dog of that caliber I do not recommned shutzhund or any bitework.I showed and also my hubby travled around the world and I was home with small kids and needed protection at home.It was a major libility and alot of work.The dog we are working now is not shutzhund..no bite work..totally different.`


I'm new here so maybe I'm out of place but I'm struck by the audacity of a person who feels they can cast judgement on someone training their dog in Schutzhund when they so very clearly know so little about it and have probably never stepped foot on a Sch club's field. 

The "bite work" in Schutzhund is a game, an advanced obedience game and actually has very little to do with "protection". Keep up the good work Juliemule.


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## Bear2010 (Aug 21, 2012)

Maligator said:


> I'm new here so maybe I'm out of place but I'm struck by the audacity of a person who feels they can cast judgement on someone training their dog in Schutzhund when they so very clearly know so little about it and have probably never stepped foot on a Sch club's field.
> 
> The "bite work" in Schutzhund is a game, an advanced obedience game and actually has very little to do with "protection". Keep up the good work Juliemule.


You must not have read all my posts,I had a dobie titled shutzhund..so yes.. I do know and I was talking about 2 different categories..shutzhund and protection and I am not judging,she asked.


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## Bear2010 (Aug 21, 2012)

Maligator said:


> I'm new here so maybe I'm out of place but I'm struck by the audacity of a person who feels they can cast judgement on someone training their dog in Schutzhund when they so very clearly know so little about it and have probably never stepped foot on a Sch club's field.
> 
> The "bite work" in Schutzhund is a game, an advanced obedience game and actually has very little to do with "protection". Keep up the good work Juliemule.


And IMO..its not a "game"


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## Maligator (Aug 31, 2012)

I did read your posts, you sent a dog away to a "trainer" to have him Schutzhund trained. Whereas most folks in the schutzhund crowd put in long hours investing themselves in the training and development of their dogs you sent yours away, which means you likely ended up with a poorly trained dog that has tainted your view of Schutzhund and never gave you a proper education/exposure to what Schutzhund really is.


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## juliemule (Dec 10, 2011)

Bear2010 said:


> You must not have read all my posts,I had a dobie titled shutzhund..so yes.. I do know and I was talking about 2 different categories..shutzhund and protection and I am not judging,she asked.


Actually I didn't ask.... I have trained many protection dogs. Not schutzhund, as it is only a sport, and to honestly think a sport dog will seriously protect, well its really not the same.

Anyway, to your post, of course obedience is important, not sure why you think I stated otherwise??

I often get in problem dogs that had crappy protection training. Usually its a simple obedience problem.


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## juliemule (Dec 10, 2011)

Bear2010 said:


> Mastering the obedience is a must and must come before any shutzhund,protection work of any kind.If your dog does bitework and not obedienced trained you are asking for some trouble.
> I have to add this 2 cents too,unless you are going to show in shutzhund for trails or have a dyer need for a dog of that caliber I do not recommned shutzhund or any bitework.I showed and also my hubby travled around the world and I was home with small kids and needed protection at home.It was a major libility and alot of work.The dog we are working now is not shutzhund..no bite work..totally different.`


Could you explain protection with no bite work? I'm lost on that one.

I don't trial in sports, but criminal apprehension, real world tracking, cadaver dogs, etc. I do agree with the responsibility that comes with owning bite dogs. Good point.


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## Bear2010 (Aug 21, 2012)

Maligator said:


> I did read your posts, you sent a dog away to a "trainer" to have him Schutzhund trained. Whereas most folks in the schutzhund crowd put in long hours investing themselves in the training and development of their dogs you sent yours away, which means you likely ended up with a poorly trained dog that has tainted your view of Schutzhund and never gave you a proper education/exposure to what Schutzhund really is.


Whatever.Not going to be probed to argue.Moving on to next post..


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