# Groomer Or Not?



## busyx3 (Sep 9, 2008)

I've been the owner of Molly, a 2 year old Maltese/Shih-tzu/Lhasa-apso, for 6 weeks. I'm new to dogs that need special hair-care. Anyway, yesterday I took Molly to the vet for itching and she has a yeast & bacterial infection. The vet said not to mix dish-detergent with water for a flea bath (groomer recommended & Molly's on Frontline-plus) and also that the infection "could have" come from the groomer. The vet also told me that Molly's breeds are pre-disposed to this type problem. So am I not supposed to have my dog groomed again, or if the issue is dirty blades how do I know if they're cleaned? I'm not blaming the groomer, and the vet didn't either, I really just don't know what to do now.


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## AnjlGurl (Sep 4, 2008)

We've had several dogs over the years that needed special hair care, and we've never had good luck finding a Great groomer with a great personalty. All of our dogs were abused or neglected before we got them, so they needed special handling, so finally we gave up and learned to do it ourselves. Our Cocker was a little easier than our TC Yorkie/Chi/Pom is, and they never looked quite picture perfect, but half an hour after leaving the groomers, who does anyway?


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## Love's_Sophie (Sep 23, 2007)

AnjlGurl said:


> but half an hour after leaving the groomers, who does anyway?


I'm a professional dog groomer, and I rather take offense to your last remark...a good groom job will still look good, unless you're talking about a dog going and rolling in a muddy pit when he is done being groomed; even then it's just a matter of bathing and toweling the dog off, and then a brushing, and the groom job should still look good.  If it was a good groom job in the first place, that is...



busyx3 said:


> I've been the owner of Molly, a 2 year old Maltese/Shih-tzu/Lhasa-apso, for 6 weeks. I'm new to dogs that need special hair-care. Anyway, yesterday I took Molly to the vet for itching and she has a yeast & bacterial infection. The vet said not to mix dish-detergent with water for a flea bath (groomer recommended & Molly's on Frontline-plus) and also that the infection "could have" come from the groomer. The vet also told me that Molly's breeds are pre-disposed to this type problem. So am I not supposed to have my dog groomed again, or if the issue is dirty blades how do I know if they're cleaned? I'm not blaming the groomer, and the vet didn't either, I really just don't know what to do now.


Your girl is 'composed' of breeds that can tend to have yucky skin...this Does not mean you shouldn't get her groomed regularly. Personally, as a groomer I DO NOT use Dawn on any dog...there are so many products that are much more mild and less irratating to the skin of our pets; IMHO dawn is something of the past, and really is not necessary. It dries out the skin, and coat, strips necessary oils from the coat, and can cause severe eye irratation, and severe allergies in some pets. Dawn also blocks the skin pores, if not rinsed thoroughly, causing the dog to get overly greasy, or yeasty skin...which is probably what happened with your dog; Dawn MUST be rinsed very thoroughly. 

When you get her groomed again, bring in a shampoo like Earthbath (there are several to choose from), or Lambert Kay's Oatmeal and Baking Soda shampoo. Hand it to the groomer and tell her to not use anything else on her, because she has allergy problems. I also love Therapet's line of products, as they are all hypoallergenic and tearless. You have to order the latter, but they are very worth it. You can also find products like Biogroom, and Double K at various large pet supply stores. FurstAid (a DoubleK product)is wonderful for dogs like yours, as is the Oatmella. Use them weekly as necessary. 

Another thing to remember, is that if your vet gave you a shampoo, or recommended one, use it at the rate they recommend, otherwise you won't notice a difference; that is the most common thing I see as a groomer; people bring in a prescribed shampoo, but only use it when the dog gets groomed...every 8 weeks, at most...when it is supposed to be used much more often to see the expected result!!!


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## AnjlGurl (Sep 4, 2008)

Love's_Sophie said:


> I'm a professional dog groomer, and I rather take offense to your last remark...a good groom job will still look good, unless you're talking about a dog going and rolling in a muddy pit when he is done being groomed; even then it's just a matter of bathing and toweling the dog off, and then a brushing, and the groom job should still look good.  If it was a good groom job in the first place, that is...


Didn't mean to offend anyone, especially a groomer, I was being sarcastic, sorta. the first thing all of my dogs have done after the groomers was roll around and get all knotted up or muddy or both  (And half an hour is just long enough for them to still be all messy)


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## pamperedpups (Dec 7, 2006)

Anjl - I'm a groomer, I groom all seven of my dogs monthly and they stay looking good all month.  

busy - If you are concerned about finding a qualified groomer to work with your dog, you might be better off learning to groom your dog yourself. I will say that as a professional groomer, I most certainly would NOT recommend using any sort of dish soap on your pet. I also pride myself on keeping a clean shop. Truth is, yeast live on most normal skin, in hair and glands and only when conditions are right (often due to some sort of allergic flare up or immune deficiency) is there a problem resulting in an infection. You can learn more by visiting this site:

http://www.marvistavet.com/html/body_yeast_infection_of_the_skin.html


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## poodleholic (Mar 15, 2007)

Your vet is correct about not using dish detergent for a flea bath. The fact is, any good dog shampoo will do the same thing, if you leave the dog sudsed up for 5 minutes before rinsing off. Your vet is SO WRONG about not having your dog groomed again! I highly doubt that a "dirty blade" caused your dog's yeast and bacterial infection! (Dirty blades would cost the groomer time, and time is money.) You've got a combo mix of breeds who can have skin problems. Give your dog distilled water for drinking, and add a little unfiltered Apple Cider Vinegar (preferably with the mother in it). Get some fish oil and add to the food. I use EQyss Micro-Tek Shampoo, along with the leave-in spray for itchy dogs. It stops the itching better than anything else I've ever found, and it heals yeast and bacterial infections on the skin. I foster frequently and see all kinds of skin problems, so buy my Micro-Tek by the gallon! Wouldn't be without it. It works on mosquito bites on my poor little grandson, too! (Micro-Tek was used to decontaminate our astronauts in the space program. It's safe and non-toxic, no animal testing.) BTW, I am not affiliated with EQyss in any way. It works, and works very well, so I like to pass that on to benefit others.


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## dawgystylr (Sep 7, 2008)

Hi busy,
Sorry to hear Molly is not doing well. As a professional groomer of 20 years, I would only recommend a flea shampoo for fleas. I still use Dawn but ONLY to remove greasy ear medication residue from ear hair. That's it. I don't agree with the other groomer about it being a thing of the past. It does have it's PROPER uses. (if it were unsafe they wouldn't use it on birds after an oil spill) The key word is used PROPERLY. 
The issue may also be that your dog is having an allergy to her food. Yeast infections are common in dogs that are fed foods with a high grain content. I'm not sure what food you are feeding, but check your bag's ingredients. If there is any corn, wheat, soy, glutens, by-products of any variety, BHA or BHT toss it, it's garbage. Any food you buy at grocery stores or big box chains are no good for your dog. While some dogs may never have a problem, most do. 
As a professional, I can't stress enough to you how important diet palys a role in skin and coat health. I've seen dogs who barely had any hair left that change foods and become much healthier dogs. Never assume that because a dog eats the same food every day that they can't be allergic to it. If there is nothing new introduced to the environment that she could be reacting to, take a look at the constant. If you ate nothing but one food for years, sooner or later your body would react. Just my 2 cents.


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## busyx3 (Sep 9, 2008)

Another thing to remember, is that if your vet gave you a shampoo, or recommended one, use it at the rate they recommend, otherwise you won't notice a difference; that is the most common thing I see as a groomer; people bring in a prescribed shampoo, but only use it when the dog gets groomed...every 8 weeks, at most...when it is supposed to be used much more often to see the expected result!!![/QUOTE]


Thanks so much everyone for your helpful comments! 
The vet didn't tell me what shampoo to use, except that I could occasionally use Selsun Blue or Chlorhexidine(?). I'm going to check into some of the brands recommeded here. I do have some Tea Tree Oil Shampoo that I haven't tried on Molly yet, and now I don't know if I should.



dawgystylr said:


> Hi busy,
> Sorry to hear Molly is not doing well. As a professional groomer of 20 years, I would only recommend a flea shampoo for fleas. I still use Dawn but ONLY to remove greasy ear medication residue from ear hair. That's it. I don't agree with the other groomer about it being a thing of the past. It does have it's PROPER uses. (if it were unsafe they wouldn't use it on birds after an oil spill) The key word is used PROPERLY.
> The issue may also be that your dog is having an allergy to her food. Yeast infections are common in dogs that are fed foods with a high grain content. I'm not sure what food you are feeding, but check your bag's ingredients. If there is any corn, wheat, soy, glutens, by-products of any variety, BHA or BHT toss it, it's garbage. Any food you buy at grocery stores or big box chains are no good for your dog. While some dogs may never have a problem, most do.
> As a professional, I can't stress enough to you how important diet palys a role in skin and coat health. I've seen dogs who barely had any hair left that change foods and become much healthier dogs. Never assume that because a dog eats the same food every day that they can't be allergic to it. If there is nothing new introduced to the environment that she could be reacting to, take a look at the constant. If you ate nothing but one food for years, sooner or later your body would react. Just my 2 cents.



The lady I got Molly from had her on Beneful. I thought about food allergies so I ordered some chicken and brown rice dog food that doesn't have the things you listed. I also put a fish oil capsule on her food and give her brewer's yeast with garlic. I don't know how long it will take to see if that helps. I was told that Molly was an itchy dog, but that she never broke the skin - and she didn't have any sores when I got her. Her previous owner used ordinary dog shampoo and I have been bathing Molly weekly in the detergent mixture but know better now.


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## dawgystylr (Sep 7, 2008)

busyx3 said:


> Another thing to remember, is that if your vet gave you a shampoo, or recommended one, use it at the rate they recommend, otherwise you won't notice a difference; that is the most common thing I see as a groomer; people bring in a prescribed shampoo, but only use it when the dog gets groomed...every 8 weeks, at most...when it is supposed to be used much more often to see the expected result!!!



Thanks so much everyone for your helpful comments! 
The vet didn't tell me what shampoo to use, except that I could occasionally use Selsun Blue or Chlorhexidine(?). I'm going to check into some of the brands recommeded here. I do have some Tea Tree Oil Shampoo that I haven't tried on Molly yet, and now I don't know if I should.




The lady I got Molly from had her on Beneful. I thought about food allergies so I ordered some chicken and brown rice dog food that doesn't have the things you listed. I also put a fish oil capsule on her food and give her brewer's yeast with garlic. I don't know how long it will take to see if that helps. I was told that Molly was an itchy dog, but that she never broke the skin - and she didn't have any sores when I got her. Her previous owner used ordinary dog shampoo and I have been bathing Molly weekly in the detergent mixture but know better now.[/QUOTE]

Thank goodness you took her off Beneful. That is one of the lowest on the lot. If you continue to have trouble, switch to a completely grain free diet and see what happens. It will take about 6-8 weeks to see a difference.


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## pamperedpups (Dec 7, 2006)

The use of Dawn on oil coated wildlife is an exceptional marketing tool (it is donated by Procter & Gamble), but if you think about it, those animals are destined to DIE if something does not get the oil off of them, and many still still die. Just because the product isn't as bad as oil covering fur or feathers doesn't make it safe for the environment, us or our pets.


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## dawgystylr (Sep 7, 2008)

Whether you agree/disagree on the use of Dawn, I can honestly say that in the 20 years that I have used it on occasion, no dog has ever gotten sick, died, nor have I gotten one single complaint from any clients about any problems with skin irritation from the use of it.


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## Love's_Sophie (Sep 23, 2007)

dawgystylr said:


> Hi busy,
> Sorry to hear Molly is not doing well. As a professional groomer of 20 years, I would only recommend a flea shampoo for fleas. I still use Dawn but ONLY to remove greasy ear medication residue from ear hair. That's it. I don't agree with the other groomer about it being a thing of the past. It does have it's PROPER uses. (if it were unsafe they wouldn't use it on birds after an oil spill) The key word is used PROPERLY.
> .



I wasn't saying that Dawn doesn't have any uses; it does, but for those groomers (and I groom with one) who think it has to be used on every greasy dog, because they don't think there are shampoos out there that can get an animal clean? That is where I think it is a 'thing of the past'; there are much better, safer shampoos out there for that...I should have been more specific, and that's my mistake. I do think there are uses for dawn (it does help remove skunk grease very well), but for most everyday dog\cat grooming, I don't think it "has" to be used. I get my dogs\cats cleaner, than one of the other groomers (who uses Dawn on every pet), and I don't use it at all.


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## Puppyquicker (Sep 22, 2008)

Thank God you took her off of Beneful, it makes dogs itch like crazy and they get all yeasty in the ears. Read the ingredients of anything you feed your dog, even treats. You would not believe what they scrape up to put in dog food that dogs should not be eating. Beneful, in my opinion, is the number one cause of itching and skin issues in pets that come into my salon. Please spread the word.


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## Canadian Dog (Nov 3, 2007)

Lots of good advice in this thread. My vet advised I dilute any shampoo with water rather than applying the full strength shampoo to the dogs coat. I use a 2 liter pop bottle filled with diluted shampoo and then pour it over various body parts. I think I use less shampoo this way and it rinses out better as well.


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## Love's_Sophie (Sep 23, 2007)

Canadian Dog said:


> Lots of good advice in this thread. My vet advised I dilute any shampoo with water rather than applying the full strength shampoo to the dogs coat. I use a 2 liter pop bottle filled with diluted shampoo and then pour it over various body parts. I think I use less shampoo this way and it rinses out better as well.


I dilute most shampoos as well...even a bit more than is suggested; it still cleans the dog, but is easier to get into the coat, and easier to rinse


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