# Schnauzer Stripping update; found new groomer (loong)



## NRB (Sep 19, 2009)

Hi All, I posted about my dog ages ago and just wanted to update. She's a Standard Schnauzer that I have had one year now. So she is 15mo. Ever since her puppy coat was done and she was ready I'd been taking her to a groomer(lets call her Betty) to get stripped. This is my first schnauzer and I didn't know much about the coat. (The breeder lives 2 hrs away and we only talk by phone or email, so she wasn't able to see the dog and tell me her opinion on the groomer's work.) I was learning as we went along so to speak. But I knew that I wanted the coat to be stripped and never clipped. As time went by and I learned more about schnauzer coats I was not happy w/ Betty's work. I suspected that Betty was stripping the dog with a sharp stripping knife b/c I was seeing blunt end hairs in clusters... But Betty was insistent that she'd never cut a schnauzers coat, only strip it. As a matter of fact she told me that Had I walked into her shop and told her to clipper my dog's coat she would NOT have taken me on as a client. She seems very old school and a bit bullish. i was a little intimidated by her I have to admit and besides what did I know? This was my first schnauzer.

i finally bit the bullet and went to meet and talk with a new groomer(lets call her Jill). We had a consult over the dog and Jill seemed to be on the same page as me. She also felt that the coat was too soft to have been stripped. So Made an apt for today for the dog to be stripped.

Anyway I just picked the dog up from the shop after Jill worked on the dog for 3hrs. The shop owner was there, Jill was out . I was told that yes, indeed it appears as if the hairs had bee cut not stripped as I had suspected all along. Bummer. Shop owner thinks that in a few months the coat will look like it should. Wirey and corse. Wonder what Jill thinks......

Anyway Jill uses clippers for the cheek/under the neck area and rear end whereas my previous groomer handstripped that area. Betty had told me that she would never use clippers on my dog... And folks here (mini owners) were telling me that yes, clippers are perfectly appropriate to use in the areas mentioned..... 

So long story short I think I like my new groomer loads more, and I wish that I had listened to my gut ages ago and switched sooner. Hopefully the coat will come back... But I love the dog to pieces either way. Just bummed that I spent all this time and $$ going to a groomer who wasn't stripping her properly.

edit for clarity; I do think that Betty was hand stripping the dog but with a sharp knife or maybe with thinning shears. I know that she never used clippers on the coat, I would have spotted that a mile away. I clipper my horse and my previous dogs so I know what a clipped dog looks like. She must have been hand pulling the coat out with something sharp.


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## Pai (Apr 23, 2008)

Good for you for going with your gut. Even if the first groomer was using the right tools, she may not have been doing a very good job with them.

Now, I don't know much about Schnauzers, but are there sometimes dogs that are born with an incorrect-textured/softer coat? If a groomer had gotten most of their experience with 'wrong coated' dogs, perhaps that's why she wasn't able to get a good result from a properly wire-coated dog.


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## NRB (Sep 19, 2009)

Yes Pai, there are differences in the coat types. Some Standard Schnauzers have great coats, others not so good, and still others very poor quality. It could be that the groomer has no experience on the right coat, but it could also be that my dog doesn't have the right coat. Only time with the new groomer will tell. 

I also noticed that the new groomer trimmed the beard under the chin area. Which I like. It keeps the head in the "brick" looking silhouette that I hear about. The previous groomer trimmed the beard from the top of the muzzle nearest the eyes. Gave the dog the oddest hourglass looking silhouette with freakishly large eyes. But I also hated it b/c I thought that the beard hair that flows from the top of the muzzle should always be left long.... Am hoping that some schnauzer folks see this thread and give me ideas.... or I could dog out the grooming tips from a SS webpage...


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## hachna (Jul 31, 2010)

Hi NRB,

I am happy to see that you found a good groomer. I've heard that a groomer for stripping is very hard to find. With my search and what i heard, those areas she used a clipper sound quite right. And a schnauzer should have balanced square look on its head. 
A person who comes to off leash dog park has ss and shows his dog (he is a beginner though). He uses those stripping tools with handles such as Mars Coat King. He said it is quite easy. I have minis and he has very rough coat like ss. I have clipped him but thinking of changing to stripping to preserve his good quality coat and the stripped coat will go along his personality. Anyway, have you ever used Coat King or heard anything about it? also do you know about this website (it is very good info imo)
http://britmorschnauzers.com/handstrip.html


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## Graco22 (Jul 16, 2007)

Do NOT use a coat king or any of the knock offs of those on a hand stripped coat. They cut hair, and will in time, ruin the coat. Its fine for a pet, that you want to retain a little color and texture by stripping, but you will have to pull alot of hair a few weeks after using the coat kings...to pull the hairs it cut...


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## hachna (Jul 31, 2010)

Thanks Graco a s breeder was also very against it. I am little confused as I understand stripping takes a few weeks then NRB mentioned 3 hours......BTW what is your opinion about clipping vs stripping for a pet minis?


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## Graco22 (Jul 16, 2007)

hachna said:


> Thanks Graco a s breeder was also very against it. I am little confused as I understand stripping takes a few weeks then NRB mentioned 3 hours......BTW what is your opinion about clipping vs stripping for a pet minis?




The 3 hours was the initial visit. In order to keep a coat "properly" maintained, you must start with an initial strip out..basically taking out all the dead coat..this can take one visit of 3 hours, or many visits of many hours, depending on the coat and how long it has been unstripped, or worse, clipped. Ideally, the coat can be taken out bald to the skin. Then, on a weekly to bi-weekly basis, the longest layer is stripped out each time. This usually takes an hour or two, and is more tedious than just pulling all to the skin, as you have to find the layers, and pull accordingly. Stripped coats on pets can be maintained with less frequency, but they won't be super nice show coat all the time..they will be shaggy, then bald, etc. In order to keep the dog looking "kept" and in proper pattern, weekly, hour long sessions are the norm. 

This is the same for mini's. However, minis are much harder to keep in nice coat, as they generally don't have good coats to begin with. I have seen many, many mini's whose coats were not good from the beginning, and once clipped even one time, are almost impossible to get back to harsh coat with stripping. If it is a pet mini, I recommend clipping. I refuse to strip mini's, because of the above. Its not worth the time and work, as I have never seen one that had a decent coat to begin with...but most dogs around here are from pet stores, mills, etc. Very few nice mini's. You can clip and still retain some color and texture, by pulling just some that you can, and my carding out the coat after clipping. Also, you don't want to clip super short...no shorter than a 7F because once you go as short as a 10 blade on the body, the coat on a mini is pretty much lost forever. I don't think the difference in color/texture on minis is enough to make the work worth while. Its nothing compared to the coat difference in say, an Airedale or Wire haired Fox terrier...Stripping is an ongoing thing..its not a few weeks and done..its weekly/biweekly, year round, every year...there is no lull, and if you skip a few weeks, the layers are lost, and all the coat is dead, and must be stripped bald again and started over. Lots of work!


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## hachna (Jul 31, 2010)

Thank you Graco, my partner has insisted on clipping minis. I must admit that my minis has really lovely rough double coat even those who strip their minis think it has been stripped. I used to #10 clipping which is very popular no in Sydney atm but I realise by clipping longer even #5 can achieve stripped look and seems better for minis' coat (it protects from the harsh sun and cold weather). If I can ask you one more question, do you think the head and behind areas can be done with #10 and would you recommend it?


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## Graco22 (Jul 16, 2007)

hachna said:


> Thank you Graco, my partner has insisted on clipping minis. I must admit that my minis has really lovely rough double coat even those who strip their minis think it has been stripped. I used to #10 clipping which is very popular no in Sydney atm but I realise by clipping longer even #5 can achieve stripped look and seems better for minis' coat (it protects from the harsh sun and cold weather). If I can ask you one more question, do you think the head and behind areas can be done with #10 and would you recommend it?


Yes, private/potty trails can be done with a 10. I usually shave out the whole inside groin area on males, and in front of the pee pee some too, as well as the bum. Its very hard to get a nice crisp face without going short, like a 10. I prefer a 7F backwards, as it is easier to get it smoother and without clipper lines. 7F backwards is same length as 10 with the grain. 

NRB, thats awesome that you found a new groomer. Sounds like she will get your pup in shape. Yes, clippering the cheeks/throat is fine, and usually done. And there is no reason to strip the tender areas about genitals, etc..I think you may have found a good groomer that knows what they are doing. Don't be afraid to ask her questions if you have them..and keep us posted! Can't wait to see photos!!! You should photo document this transition!


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## NRB (Sep 19, 2009)

re; the 3 hours. 

Grayco is correct (of course, lol) You would keep working the coat for the proper show look. I do not. Only b/c I don't know how. And b/c I really don't need a show coat. I have the dog stripped b/c I love the color of the coat. My understanding was that would disappear if I had it clippered. And I like a harsher texture. And love the way the head and everything else looks on a stripped dog. 

So anyways, I'm not a good enough photographer to show the dog's coat well. In the past I'd sent images of the first groomers work to the breeder and she was right in saying that you just couldn't tell by the pictures if the hair was being cut as the first groomer stripped it. 

I've never had the dog stripped to the jacket. She appears to get stripped to the undercoat...... She goes into the groomers looking salt and peppery and comes out looking dark dark steely gray. (except for the light colored hair on her face, legs, butt and etc) She is a very dark coated SS, FWIW. But the groomer takes out the longer lighter grey colored hairs-that are tipped in black. The darker, softer hairs are left behind. Then the light grey, thicker, wirey hairs grow back in and the dog looks lighter in color. 

But she is unusually dark, the whole litter was. The normal SS is a lighter grey.


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## LazyGRanch713 (Jul 22, 2009)

hachna said:


> Hi NRB,
> 
> I am happy to see that you found a good groomer. I've heard that a groomer for stripping is very hard to find. With my search and what i heard, those areas she used a clipper sound quite right. And a schnauzer should have balanced square look on its head.
> A person who comes to off leash dog park has ss and shows his dog (he is a beginner though). He uses those stripping tools with handles such as Mars Coat King. He said it is quite easy. I have minis and he has very rough coat like ss. I have clipped him but thinking of changing to stripping to preserve his good quality coat and the stripped coat will go along his personality. Anyway, have you ever used Coat King or heard anything about it? also do you know about this website (it is very good info imo)
> http://britmorschnauzers.com/handstrip.html











WOW. I love the finished product. 
I've never handstripped a dog before. I've always wanted to learn how, but it's not something people want anymore (do you know how many people think a schnauzers fringe done with a #3 is "too long"? Oy..)


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## hachna (Jul 31, 2010)

Yes, well groomed schnauzers are very pleasing to your eyes. My minis hair and colour is quite similar to the photo (of course with a full tail and the minis on the photo is much better groomed than I can ever do..lol) The only reason I want stripping is for the better quality coat as my minis is incredibly active and loves being out there. See if i can put on some photos over this weekend. Watch this thread!!!!


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## LazyGRanch713 (Jul 22, 2009)

Graco22 said:


> The 3 hours was the initial visit. In order to keep a coat "properly" maintained, you must start with an initial strip out..basically taking out all the dead coat..this can take one visit of 3 hours, or many visits of many hours, depending on the coat and how long it has been unstripped, or worse, clipped. Ideally, the coat can be taken out bald to the skin. Then, on a weekly to bi-weekly basis, the longest layer is stripped out each time. This usually takes an hour or two, and is more tedious than just pulling all to the skin, as you have to find the layers, and pull accordingly. Stripped coats on pets can be maintained with less frequency, but they won't be super nice show coat all the time..they will be shaggy, then bald, etc. In order to keep the dog looking "kept" and in proper pattern, weekly, hour long sessions are the norm.
> 
> This is the same for mini's. However, minis are much harder to keep in nice coat, as they generally don't have good coats to begin with. I have seen many, many mini's whose coats were not good from the beginning, and once clipped even one time, are almost impossible to get back to harsh coat with stripping. If it is a pet mini, I recommend clipping. I refuse to strip mini's, because of the above. Its not worth the time and work, as I have never seen one that had a decent coat to begin with...but most dogs around here are from pet stores, mills, etc. Very few nice mini's. You can clip and still retain some color and texture, by pulling just some that you can, and my carding out the coat after clipping. Also, you don't want to clip super short...no shorter than a 7F because once you go as short as a 10 blade on the body, the coat on a mini is pretty much lost forever. I don't think the difference in color/texture on minis is enough to make the work worth while. Its nothing compared to the coat difference in say, an Airedale or Wire haired Fox terrier...Stripping is an ongoing thing..its not a few weeks and done..its weekly/biweekly, year round, every year...there is no lull, and if you skip a few weeks, the layers are lost, and all the coat is dead, and must be stripped bald again and started over. Lots of work!


OK, no one in our area ever requests hand stripped dogs. We had one lady who visited the kennel (she had an Irish Terrier) who was handstripped, even though he wasn't a show dog, but the breeder showed her how to do it and (from what I could tell) she did a fantastic job. In rural Ohio, a "hand strip" is a #10 shave on the farmers farm dog, lol. Great post Graco, I'm learning a lot on this thread


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## Graco22 (Jul 16, 2007)

LazyGRanch713 said:


> OK, no one in our area ever requests hand stripped dogs. We had one lady who visited the kennel (she had an Irish Terrier) who was handstripped, even though he wasn't a show dog, but the breeder showed her how to do it and (from what I could tell) she did a fantastic job. In rural Ohio, a "hand strip" is a #10 shave on the farmers farm dog, lol. Great post Graco, I'm learning a lot on this thread


I live in farm country, IL and used to think the same thing..you would be surprised how word gets around that you hand strip. I have people drive a couple hours from Chicago out to me for handstripping now, and I turn down Dale handstrips all the time, since I am a member of the club, and word gets around..Dales are just too time consuming to strip, can't pay me enough to block half my day off..;-) I strip a couple Irish (SUPER easy and great to start learning on) a WHFT, couple mixes with coarse hair, etc. Charge by the hour, because its going to be different each time. I also don't see the dogs weekly..They still come in every 6 weeks or more, and I just take out whatever is dead, and tidy the pattern (if there is one) with thinners, and sometimes attachments..The next time that coat will be pulled anyway, and they are pets, not show dogs. The owners still get the color and texture, without the seriousness of weekly grooming sessions. If you are serious about learning how, join a local dog club..any you can find close to you..Westies, scotties, irish, dales, whft, etc. The breeders and club member are mostly more than willing to help you, and most clubs put on grooming seminars for the members and newbies yearly. I have done our local Dale club's grooming seminar for the last two years at my salon, and its always a hit for pet owners, breeders, and groomers alike.


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