# Cat Chasing- Feeling Overwhelmed :(



## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

We love Luna, she's a great fit for us. The only problem is that she chases the cats. She doesn't mean them any harm, it's obvious that she just think's it's a game, except they don't find it fun. 

I have a gate for the living room with a cat door... except we've discovered that when she wants to, Luna can fit through the cat door. She's 70lbs. I wouldn't have believed it if I didn't see it happen myself. So we closed the cat door... and then we discovered she can and will jump over the gate if the thing on the other side is motivating enough. Day-to-day the gate works as a visual barrier to her, she won't try to pass it unless there's motivation. Like a cat on the other side. So at this point, it's not really serving any physical purpose. She hasn't tried to pass the gate seriously since the other night when she did the cat door/jumping over.

Currently the cats are living upstairs by their own choice. The stairway is central to our house, and the gate to the living room is next to it. They won't come within sight of the gate currently. Which I guess is good because then Luna doesn't have motivation to bust it down. Shiloh has been hiding all the time, even upstairs. I can barely get them to eat upstairs within sight of the stairway. 

Luna doesn't know any commands currently. We're working on it, but she certainly doesn't know anything solidly enough yet to try with them as a distraction. Other than with the cats, she's as calm as you could expect a dog to be. She's even somewhat -difficult- to motivate to get excited about normal play. She gets the most excited I've seen her about anything when she sees the cats. Luna is also still on restricted activity due to the complications with her spay. So no rough play or extended exercise until next Friday. 

I know it'll take time on both sides of things and we've only had her home a few days, but I'm just feeling so overwhelmed and upset. I feel like there are so many things I need to teach her and I feel the pressure of the clock every day that the cats are still living in fear in their own house. My heart is breaking for them and I feel like I've done this horrible thing to them.

We love her, and giving her up isn't an option. I know in reality this is a very fixable and manageable problem, but the cats are family too and I love them. It's just hard for me to see them like this.


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## jade5280 (Feb 20, 2013)

I feel your pain. Ryker was obsessed with our cat. She hid upstairs for the first few months that we brought him home. She would run and he would chase her all around the house. I ended up having to spray him with a spray bottle of water and telling him to leave it when he tried to chase the cat. It was my cats home too and he needed to respect and leave her alone. NOW they can stay in the same room together. It took about 9 months. He will still bother her and chase her when she runs, but it's not nearly as much where I'm worried about the cats well being. The cat is more comfortable with the dog now as well which helps. She will come downstairs now and hangout.


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## fourdogs (Feb 3, 2014)

I would put her on leash and correct her immediately for trying to chase the cats. No off leash privileges until she gets the idea. 
Too much freedom, too many wrong choices.


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## kadylady (Sep 23, 2010)

Zoey wanted to chase the cats when she first came as well. We utilized the crate, baby gate and leash until she stopped or could be stopped. She always had a leash on in the house so that it could be grabbed or stepped on to immediately stop the behavior, or she was tethered to something, or she was in her crate. We used a gate so that the cats had access to a room of their own and also a getaway, plus all of their stuff (litter boxes and food) is in the basement and we put a cat door on the basement door, so they had 2 easy escapes. The crate helped because while she was crated the cats would come out and she could get used to being around the cats without having the ability to chase them, and also they could get used to her and have time to interact with the family.

You could do some counter conditioning type stuff where someone has the dog on a leash and someone has the cat, look at the cat, look at me, here's a treat for being calm around the cat. Or give her a yummy chew/kong while she's in her crate or on a leash and bring the cats down to interact with them, so she gets a chance to see them without chasing. I think for Zoey it was important for her to see them without them always running away to learn that no, they are not always running. 

We have one cat that is more dog savvy and not opposed to popping her a good one every now and then. The other cat though was a darter and it was always harder for Zoey to leave her alone (she's gone now RIP). I personally am not opposed to using corrections when it comes to cat chasing (ie a collar pop, "no") because it is a safety issue and the cats shouldn't have to deal with that. 

When you leave is she contained in a way that she absolutely can not get to the cats? (Crated or behind a door) That's important too.

It's definitely a manageable issue and a common one at that, so don't feel too awful about it. Just manage it, whatever that means for your situation. I think it is important to just not let is happen (whatever works) because it can be a self rewarding behavior and therefore harder to fix the more it happens.

The cats will gradually get use to her as well, cats don't like change of any type so it would probably take them a little while to adjust even if she wasn't chasing them. Luke was never a chaser and our one darty cat took awhile to adjust to him too.


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## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

I take the opportunity away, and work on respecting that gate, "that just because you can, doesn't mean you shouldn't lol" something as simple as starting to teach her to wait outside a room (that doesn't have a gate) while you walk in and do something and come right back out where she is waiting for you.. if they walk through just bring them back out the door and work on it again keeping your time short in the room so you can pop right back out and praise... little short stop and stays around the house while your doing other things through out the day every day... just to get the one thing that will help about staying on the outside of that gate.. When it's kitty time ,, it's not DOG time... My guys first learned to respect the gate when the kitten was out, then they learned to lay down in the same room while it was kitty time... That was the foundation I wanted,, cats are not for the dog... once they got that, the kitten and the dogs developed their own relationships which included playing that was two sided play and not just dog annihilation on the cat lol ... took my two new pups 3 months sticking to learning routine to get the basics


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## superdi99 (Jul 23, 2014)

I am definitely feeling you. We are dealing with the same issue with Arya. We brought her home on June 10th and are still daily working on getting her used to our cats. We have daily "cat sessions" where we will bring one of our cats out to sit on his tree in the living room in full view of Arya, who is gated in the dining room. Then we run through her obedience commands. She gets a treat for anything she does correctly, plus anytime she looks at me instead of the cat. The first few times it was all barking and whining and jumping at the gate. Now it is a lot of whining, less urgently as we progress and she loses interest in the cat after 2-3 minutes and can focus more on me, though not totally yet. Our trainer says we need to keep doing this until Arya is totally relaxed when the cat comes out. Based on her progress, I'm expecting it to be months. In the meantime, she is ALWAYS on a leash in the house, except in the dining room, which has it's own entrance and is gated. I keep her next to me in the kitchen and living room and she is not allowed in the back of the house where the bedrooms are and the cats live. If she won't leave the back gate alone, she goes to time out in the dining room. One of the cats is indoor/outdoor and we are always on shuffle. When he wants to go out, we put Arya out, let Sweetpea out, let Arya back in. When she is out, he is in. Anyway, it's a process, and a definite brain drain, but we are committed to a happy, relaxed household and are willing to do the work with Arya and the cats. Good luck. Share your progress on this...I'll do the same.


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## Amaryllis (Dec 28, 2011)

fourdogs said:


> I would put her on leash and correct her immediately for trying to chase the cats. No off leash privileges until she gets the idea.
> Too much freedom, too many wrong choices.


If she likes the cats now, she won't after a few days of that.

Take a deep breath, OP, new dogs, purebred puppies to elderly rescues, always come with some behavior that makes you want to cry. And the change of having a dog is tough, too. It's tough on you, tough on the cats and tough on Luna, as well. Keep a leash on her and remove chasing as an option. Counter condition to the cats and work on recall, down, and stay, all of which will help eventually. With time, you'll all settle in together, you just have to survive until that happens is all.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Thanks everyone.



kadylady said:


> You could do some counter conditioning type stuff where someone has the dog on a leash and someone has the cat, look at the cat, look at me, here's a treat for being calm around the cat.


I had SDRRanger come over today to help me with doing exactly this. She worked with Luna while I kept the cats relatively calm so they didn't run, and we used some cheese slices. Luna did really well! She was about 10 feet away from Kallie and she would still be interested in the cheese.

I felt a lot better after that session that this is something I can work with and improve. I was worried that Luna was just going to bolt for them as soon as she saw them and she didn't. I was worried that as soon as she saw them it wouldn't be possible to break her focus with treats, and it was. I was worried that after a taste of seeing them she would be barging through the gate again to get back to them, and she wasn't.

I was so scared to even try to do anything after the chasing incidents for fear of making it worse, but now I feel confident that in time we can work with this and improve things.


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## BernerMax (Mar 15, 2013)

Also just to be on the safe side, do they have a special room upstairs with their kitty gym in it? You can put a couple tiny cat doors on the doors, just so kitties have a safe zone.
Alot of this is time, it takes time, not all dogs are cured of that instinct to want to pounce on small animals (ie giant schnauzer over here) but it can be mediated. I know my girl wont Kill the cats, and they are used to her- for one, they know not to run, which triggers the chase, and know to stay up on the back of the couch/ counters if they want to avoid her- one used to lay under the couch and claw her when she walked by!


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## BernerMax (Mar 15, 2013)

Just wanted to add- its all relative- am sitting on sofa next to a sleeping kitty and a bunny (they are both solid black so at first glance it looks like 2 kitties, bunny keeps escaping so I am trying to figure out how to proof his pen)-- but we had to work up to this level of comfort!


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## elrohwen (Nov 10, 2011)

In a way bunnies are much easier because I can easily confine them to a room, and they don't need the whole house. But I know how you are feeling and it is frustrating and overwhelming. Just relax a bit and give it time - the cats will live, and it will just require a lot of supervision when Luna might be in a position to bust through the gate. Can you get something higher, like an xpen?

I resorted to the spray bottle with Watson. He would charge the gate if the bunnies were right on the other side. He wanted to sniff noses, but he was way too aggressive about it (mouth opening a bit, sometimes sticking toe nails through the gate). It worked very well to knock him out of that crazed state. 

We also did a lot of work with the rabbits. If they are calm and friendly, he is much more likely to be calm and friendly. When we first brought him home they thumped and ran, but a couple weeks with a clicker and treats (one of us inside the room with them, one outside with the dog) and they aren't afraid of him at all (though they are still afraid of strange dogs who visit). They are much more calm and it's much less exciting for him when they don't react.


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## hanksimon (Mar 18, 2009)

While you're doing the training, after you've proofed the current stage, then 're-train' with the cats moving and running.... A running cat is much more fun that a standing cat ;-)


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Thanks for the support everyone. I'm really feeling a lot better about the whole situation now.



hanksimon said:


> While you're doing the training, after you've proofed the current stage, then 're-train' with the cats moving and running.... A running cat is much more fun that a standing cat ;-)


Yea, at this point I'm just hoping they DON'T run while we're training. 

I'm going to try to do one session a day for now treating her for not paying attention, and gradually decrease the distance, backing up if we go too far. Also, I'm moving all the cats' stuff upstairs so they don't have a reason to come down when I'm not prepared for an interaction. I'm also working on gradually moving their food closer to the stairs. My end goal is to have them eating on one side of the gate and Luna taking treats on the other, but I'm sure that's at least a few months off yet. Right now they still are suspicious as heck, and rightfully so really. If I was being chased around my house all of a sudden by some strange creature easily 5-6 times my size, I'd be a little jittery too.

We're also going to try to exchange our gate for a taller version, so hopefully that'll be able to keep her contained when we can't stay with her.

Edit: We're also working on 'leave it' and stay and she's progressing fairly well. We haven't worked up to distractions yet, but all in time.


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## Hambonez (Mar 17, 2012)

I'm sure you'll be able to manage the situation and Luna will get used to them. It might just be a novelty now. We have three cats. We started out with Hamilton being afraid of them, then wanting to play with them, and now he's settled into mostly indifference... unless they're going near his food or something he's decided he wants (this is just bark/brief chase), or are on the counters. We try to keep his food toys picked up, and honestly I don't mind him chasing off the counters, and there are plenty of opportunities for the cats to get away from him. They have a big tower and a cat door to the basement and if we are going out, Hamilton is either crated or gated into the living room (extra tall gate - even my stub legged friend can climb a standard baby gate) so that he can't pester the cats when we can't intervene. They still choose to hang out in the living room sometimes, but they can get out if they want to. He definitely doesn't see them as prey, even when he's being a jerk. When we first brought the dog home I felt horrible, and it literally took my oldest cat a YEAR to feel comfortable in the house again and stop hiding upstairs, and while they're not cuddle buddies, we don't live in chaos and the cats don't live in fear.


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## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

ireth0 said:


> Thanks for the support everyone. I'm really feeling a lot better about the whole situation now.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I have to put the cat up while I'm feeding the dogs, the cat is too aggressive at the dogs (no fear in him) to threaten a too the death match lol know just making the effort you'll make good progress..


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## Greater Swiss (Jun 7, 2011)

kadylady said:


> You could do some counter conditioning type stuff where someone has the dog on a leash and someone has the cat, look at the cat, look at me, here's a treat for being calm around the cat.


THIS


hanksimon said:


> While you're doing the training, after you've proofed the current stage, then 're-train' with the cats moving and running.... A running cat is much more fun that a standing cat ;-)


And this!

I'd also add, any time the dog looks at the cat, and is calm (doesn't show any interest in chasing) I'd give treats. Also work on the cat a bit....if the cat is timid around the dog, if it is being calm around the dog, treat the cat! No matter what, when they are allowed to be in the same room together, make sure the room has LOTS of escape routes, just in case!


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Our session today with the cats went great. They were only about 7 feet apart by the end, and we were able to encourage Kallie to take treats to come closer, which was also great to see. We're only working with her right now, as Shiloh is too timid and will run too easily, whereas Kallie will still hold her ground. Right now I'm just ending things when we finish the allotted treats, rather than trying to reach a certain goal. I don't want to push things too far too quickly and have a setback. 

Last night Shiloh was also out and about upstairs which was a big relief to see. Up until that point, even upstairs she'd been hiding all day. I've blocked off her hiding places now and made sure to close all the closets, so she doesn't have places to hole up in.


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## ForTheLoveOfDogs (Jun 3, 2007)

It takes a lot of time for dogs and cats to get on sometimes. When my family adopted our first dog, our cats attacked her! Like.. ATTACKED. I cried and wanted to take the dog back, because I felt bad about the whole situation. After a couple months they did start to get along, even play! Don't worry, just continue with your training.. there is hope.


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## d_ray (Nov 5, 2013)

I think you will see a big difference once you are able to exercise Luna more. Jewel only chases our cats when she's fiesty. Once she gets rid of her pent up energy, she is indifferent to them. I wouldn't worry, it's still very early.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

I think I'm going to use this thread as sort of a log for out progress.

Today went great again, I was so proud of them. We had them maybe 5-6 feet apart and Luna was taking cheese from me while Kallie was taking treats from my bf. Cheese, apparently, is more exciting than kitties. (Well, non-running kitties, anyway)


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## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

great update !!!!!


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## d_ray (Nov 5, 2013)

Great progress!


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## SoccerSora (Jul 28, 2014)

The most simple/clear way to deal with cat chasing is to show the dog you don't like that behavior, of course the longer the dog does this behavior the harder it is to fix. Because the cats are family you need to treat it as if your dog was chasing a baby it is not allowed and needs to be dealt with. Now im not saying choke the dog till they pass out or anything extreme, message me and I can help you out since it will be faster to talk


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

SoccerSora said:


> The most simple/clear way to deal with cat chasing is to show the dog you don't like that behavior, of course the longer the dog does this behavior the harder it is to fix. Because the cats are family you need to treat it as if your dog was chasing a baby it is not allowed and needs to be dealt with. Now im not saying choke the dog till they pass out or anything extreme, message me and I can help you out since it will be faster to talk


That's alright. I certainly don't want to create aggression toward the cats, which corrections definitely have the potential to do. Right now we're preventing her from practicing the behaviour and encouraging calm interaction.


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## SoccerSora (Jul 28, 2014)

Correcting with e collar and prong collar creates aggression, using a choke chain or dominant dog collar and lifting up so the dogs 2 front paws are off the floor for a couple seconds does work, since it takes the air away from the dog the dog's drive decreases and he learns that if he tries to chase the cat he loses air.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

SoccerSora said:


> Correcting with e collar and prong collar creates aggression, using a choke chain or dominant dog collar and lifting up so the dogs 2 front paws are off the floor for a couple seconds does work, since it takes the air away from the dog the dog's drive decreases and he learns that if he tries to chase the cat he loses air.


And that sounds downright abusive, not to mention dangerous to recommend to a stranger on the internet for a dog you've never met.


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## SoccerSora (Jul 28, 2014)

Its the basics to dog aggression, it sounds abusive but with aggressive dogs "standard +R" doesnt work because that is for TEACHING things, we are trying to REMOVE at bad behavior. You will end up trying things that are bandaids but when the bandaid falls and a cat dies, you will be back on here begging for help.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

SoccerSora said:


> Its the basics to dog aggression, it sounds abusive but with aggressive dogs "standard +R" doesnt work because that is for TEACHING things, we are trying to REMOVE at bad behavior. You will end up trying things that are bandaids but when the bandaid falls and a cat dies, you will be back on here begging for help.


First, she isn't aggressive toward the cats. Never has been. Second, I am teaching. I am teaching that she must be calm around the cats. She can't chase them when she's calm.

Edit: and she's CERTAINLY not an 'aggressive dog'. Good grief.


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## SoccerSora (Jul 28, 2014)

All it takes is the 1 time when you arent around for her to chase, she may associate your training to "being calm when im around", yes my approach is a little more aggressive approach but doing that for a couple times or a week and being able to live in harmony with all your pets is worth it to me. Or you can try your approach for a couple months and hope it works, if it does please let me know, I love being able to take away more aggressive approaches with more positive approaches when experience and results back it up.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

SoccerSora said:


> All it takes is the 1 time when you arent around for her to chase, she may associate your training to "being calm when im around", yes my approach is a little more aggressive approach but doing that for a couple times or a week and being able to live in harmony with all your pets is worth it to me. Or you can try your approach for a couple months and hope it works, if it does please let me know, I love being able to take away more aggressive approaches with more positive approaches when experience and results back it up.


She is kenneled when we are asleep/not home. So no. Lots of people do behaviour modification with +R, so I'm not sure why you'd presume it wouldn't work. Again because you seem to not have read, she is NOT aggressive toward the cats.

It's kind of insulting for you to basically threaten me that my cats will be dead if I don't choke my dog with a chain.


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## SoccerSora (Jul 28, 2014)

Didn't threaten just warned. behavior modification for certain things, however if you prefer to spend months on a +R method that might not work opposed to a little more aggressive approach for a very short period then thats your choice. The basics of psychology is that a positive punisher or escape/avoidance training has been proven to work, the military and police use this when training dogs to make sure that they understand clearly what is and isn't allowed, and yes obviously their intentions and reasons are different, but incase your +R method doesn't work keep in mind other ways. You can't train any dog purely with +R unless they are extremely low energy. If you believe you can you haven't worked with enough dogs.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

SoccerSora said:


> Didn't threaten just warned. behavior modification for certain things, however if you prefer to spend months on a +R method that might not work opposed to a little more aggressive approach for a very short period then thats your choice. The basics of psychology is that a positive punisher or escape/avoidance training has been proven to work, the military and police use this when training dogs to make sure that they understand clearly what is and isn't allowed, and yes obviously their intentions and reasons are different, but incase your +R method doesn't work keep in mind other ways. You can't train any dog purely with +R unless they are extremely low energy. If you believe you can you haven't worked with enough dogs.


Behaviour modification using +R has been shown to work on MANY different species, including those that you physically couldn't use +P on.

Sure it doesn't yield the immediate gratification results of +P, but fortunately I'm not restricted by a timeline (like those who train police dogs are).


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## SoccerSora (Jul 28, 2014)

Which is why I said if you have the time to spend months on it go ahead, I am talking from a trainers point of view where clients can't spend money hiring trainers to spend months on their pet doing things like that. I prefer to use positive reinforcement over anything because I treat my pups as my babies, (sorry about the entire aggressive approach, I am used to working with aggressive dogs so sometimes I speak from the wrong perspective, i apologize) I just saw the title saying "Feeling Overwhelmed" so I wanted to say the quickest way since that makes it seem like you've been at it for a long time and getting no results


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

SoccerSora said:


> Which is why I said if you have the time to spend months on it go ahead, I am talking from a trainers point of view where clients can't spend money hiring trainers to spend months on their pet doing things like that. I prefer to use positive reinforcement over anything because I treat my pups as my babies, (sorry about the entire aggressive approach, I am used to working with aggressive dogs so sometimes I speak from the wrong perspective, i apologize) I just saw the title saying "Feeling Overwhelmed" so I wanted to say the quickest way since that makes it seem like you've been at it for a long time and getting no results


We haven't even had her a week yet. If you work with aggressive dogs you should know the dangers of using those kinds of techniques improperly and know better than to recommend them to people you don't know for dogs you don't know.


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## SoccerSora (Jul 28, 2014)

I was under the assumption you had the dog for a while, sorry, I dont know every aspect of your situation. Feeling OVerwhelmed doesnt imply having the dog for less then a week, it implies a problem thats been going on for a while with no success


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Anyway. Back to our updates.

We just did Luna's session for today and again, she did a great job. They were maybe 2 feet apart at one point and Luna didn't care she was there. Kallie was going back and forth with being okay with Luna so the distance wasn't consistent throughout the session, but overall they were generally 3 feet apart. Very pleased with both, hopefully this trend continues!


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## SoccerSora (Jul 28, 2014)

What happens when Luna gets to them? Does she paw at them or just scare them?


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

SoccerSora said:


> What happens when Luna gets to them? Does she paw at them or just scare them?


I haven't let them interact directly since the initial chasing incidents where Luna got overstimulated. At that time she just sniffed them, but when the cats freaked out and ran she thought that was a fun game and went after them, perpetuating their fear and so on. So now they're less inclined to get close in the first place, which isn't helping our case but I can't blame them.

When she sees them outside of training (she can't get to them because the living room is gated off) she just wants to interact with them. This would be easier if they were more willing to fight and let her know what was appropriate, but unfortunately they're more likely to flee than fight.


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## SoccerSora (Jul 28, 2014)

Have you tried to put the cat(s) on a leash to avoid them from running away to work on Luna to not chase. That way you can control how far they are from each other without the other running away.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

SoccerSora said:


> Have you tried to put the cat(s) on a leash to avoid them from running away to work on Luna to not chase. That way you can control how far they are from each other without the other running away.


I haven't tried that yet, but maybe in the future. I want to wait until they're a bit more comfortable before I try to force them to interact/be near her. Kallie is the more confident of the two, but Shiloh still hides when I bring Luna upstairs. She'll take longer, I know.


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## SoccerSora (Jul 28, 2014)

Sounds like a plan, you can also have the cats in a crate (dog crate or cat crate) so it cant run and that way Luna wont be able to get to the cat no matter what. Just becareful and think of how the cat might get scared too. Cant only work on Lunas problem at the risk of the cat getting scared too


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Yesterday went great!

Luna and Kallie were less than a foot apart at one point. My bf was tossing treats for Kallie and one got too close to Luna, so she gobbled it up. Kallie hissed and whacked at Luna like "Hey! That was mine!" then skittered away, and I was able to get Luna's attention back! I was even able to ask Luna for a sit at one point which she did, good girl!

I think the next phase will be staying at that level, but waiting longer between treats, and then once the cats are more comfortable, spending time upstairs with them just all of us hanging out, rewarding Luna for good, calm, behaviour. Kallie still isn't comfortable staying close for long periods, she kind of ping-pongs between being really close and then moving away again. Shiloh still doesn't want anything to do with it. She hides as soon as she hears Luna coming upstairs.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

We've been continuing to see great improvements! The cats now will come downstairs when Luna is home (although they still prefer upstairs) and are eating their meals on the first flight of stairs, as opposed to where we started; upstairs halfway down the hall.

Today Shiloh came down to the kitchen for a bit, and Luna saw her when she was starting to go back upstairs. After a few seconds of staring at each other, Shiloh made a break for it upstairs- and Luna just looked away and walked away from the gate!


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## gingerkid (Jul 11, 2012)

ireth0 said:


> We've been continuing to see great improvements! The cats now will come downstairs when Luna is home (although they still prefer upstairs) and are eating their meals on the first flight of stairs, as opposed to where we started; upstairs halfway down the hall.
> 
> Today Shiloh came down to the kitchen for a bit, and Luna saw her when she was starting to go back upstairs. After a few seconds of staring at each other, Shiloh made a break for it upstairs- and Luna just looked away and walked away from the gate!


That's so great! I'm so glad they're starting to relax around each other. Sounds like they'll be able to live in (relative) peace after all.


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## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

always love the great news for the progress your helping them with.... Don't freak out later on after you pass this phase and they do a (half heartily type of chase) "stalking chasing but not really trying to catch"   seems to be the next phase my dogs have gone into where they learning to play for playing and not trying to dominate... I reel them in if it gets too much of not stop ,, but a little mess with each other here and there I feel they just fine...


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## OwnedbyACDs (Jun 22, 2013)

fourdogs said:


> I would put her on leash and correct her immediately for trying to chase the cats. No off leash privileges until she gets the idea.
> Too much freedom, too many wrong choices.


I agree, she can drag it around if you don't want to hold it all the time, and if she goes for the cat you could just step on the leash she tell her "no!" Then show her what you want instead


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

We had some more great passive success yesterday!

I was in the kitchen getting a snack and I saw Kallie was frozen- staring at the gate to the living room. I presumed Luna was also staring her down, so I gathered my things and prepared to have to break her attention when I went around the corner. To my pleasant surprise, I turned the corner to see Luna busy sniffing at her kong, paying no attention to Kallie at all. (who was maybe 2-3 feet from the gate)

Then later on, I was letting Luna in from outside, and Shiloh froze by the kitchen doorway. They made eye contact, then Shiloh scampered upstairs and Luna just turned away!

This is especially surprising to me because we didn't do her regular cat training sessions the past couple of days due to scheduling issues. 

We've also had multiple occasions where a cat will be near the gate/just gone by the gate and we open it to go through, and Luna doesn't try to bust through when the gate is open to chase after them.

She does really well with stay, so I think once the cats are more reliably confident, we'll practice stay with the gate open, and then graduate to it being open with a cat nearby, then eventually staying with no gate at all.


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## Greater Swiss (Jun 7, 2011)

YAY!!! Sounds like you are making fantastic progress! I'm so happy for you, and I'm so glad you are doing updates 

I do agree, dragging a leash is a great idea, especially when you start testing the waters of allowing the gate open and not actively holding the lead. 

Great work! Keep it up!!


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## CalliePup (May 19, 2014)

I'm a little late since you seem to have gotten everything under control, but just wanted to share my experience with Callie. I have a small parrot named Pickle, and Callie has a pretty high prey drive. She loves to chase toys, loves to fetch, and any small animal that moves gets her attention and she fixates on it. Pickle would definitely put up a fight but I didn't want to give Callie the chance, so I used the command "leave it" or I use the sound "eh!" (like a sharp "stop that!") which I use when she is doing something I don't like, and she generally backs away. After a few encounters, she's mostly given up trying to play with him and leaves him alone. He can walk around the house without her bothering him. It's probably slightly different since I nipped it in the butt from the start, and also because he can't run as fast as a cat (and he doesn't fly).


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Fantastic news today!

I am at work but my bf is at home. Apparently Luna and Shiloh almost touched noses through the gate! This is huge because Shioh has always been the more timid one! He said they were less than 3 inches apart.

Apparently Luna then pawed the gate and Shiloh went "nope!" and scampered away, but still! I'm thinking maybe in a week or so we'll open the cat door and be prepared with treats and leash to reward Luna for good behaviour.


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## Pricac24 (Aug 11, 2014)

So glad I found this post--my puppy wants to play with my kitty sooo bad and the kitty is just not having it. She doesn't hide, however, so even though she acts completely angry with the dog she can't really think he's too terrible if she keeps coming back, right? She is alright with him when he is calm, it's only when he's in full on play mode that she gets mean. She hisses and bats at him but it doesn't phase him at all, he just keeps on trying to play. Hopefully we'll reach peace someday!


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Pricac24 said:


> So glad I found this post--my puppy wants to play with my kitty sooo bad and the kitty is just not having it. She doesn't hide, however, so even though she acts completely angry with the dog she can't really think he's too terrible if she keeps coming back, right? She is alright with him when he is calm, it's only when he's in full on play mode that she gets mean. She hisses and bats at him but it doesn't phase him at all, he just keeps on trying to play. Hopefully we'll reach peace someday!


That's great that she's willing to stand up for herself! One of our biggest problems is that our cats will run, which is why I've put a lot of effort into making them more comfortable and getting their confidence up. I've found that one of the biggest things is that if they act like prey, Luna gets interested in the way I don't like, but if they're just out and about, she doesn't think they're that big of a deal.

We also have the advantage of Luna being a generally pretty chilled out dog, as opposed to a puppy or a dog with lots of energy.

I'm sure things will settle more in time!


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## Pricac24 (Aug 11, 2014)

Hopefully! She only tries to run from him if he corners her or runs at her. But a lot of the time she's on top of the recliner or in the window and then she just takes a swing at him. She hisses at him from the other side of the baby gate too though which I don't like, he's a timid boy so I'm kind of afraid that by her doing that he's going to become afraid to go by that area. She's just a meanie, he can't get her if she's on the other side so I don't know why she's gotta be so cranky lol!


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Tonight I did some sits and stays with Luna in the kitchen (new area) and the cats. One was on the table and the other on the floor next to the table. Luna did excellently! At one point her head was right next to Kallie on the table and she didn't care about her at all. We were also using regular kibble as opposed to cheese and she was still focused on me instead of them. Yay!

We also did some stays with the gate open and she does stellar with that. 

Feeling very hopeful today!


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

More updates;

The past couple days the cats have been hanging out around the gate more often. Once each of them approached Luna on their own, and almost touched noses! Then today, this happened;


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## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

lol nice picture .. MOM the gates open that is so not the way it's suppose to be... (it's a trick right) lol lol lol ... glad everything is moving along well...


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

PatriciafromCO said:


> lol nice picture .. MOM the gates open that is so not the way it's suppose to be... (it's a trick right) lol lol lol ... glad everything is moving along well...


Thank you!

Last night we did practice with the gate open and the cats playing with a string toy. She did very well with paying attention to me instead of them or the flailing string. We tried to get the cats to come into the living room, but it doesn't seem like they're ready for that yet.

At one point Luna tried to go toward them and I was able to call her off with just my voice (didn't touch her and she didn't have a leash on) which felt fantastic. 

We're going to keep working on getting the cats to come into the living room. Luna's used to seeing them in the other parts of the house now, but a cat in the living room is still new and interesting so we'll try to make it more mundane, lol.

Edit: I forgot to say that we also did dinner last night with the gate open and them maybe 5' apart. Luna finished her bowl food and just turned to look for her kong, paid no attention to the cats who were still eating.


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## SDRRanger (May 2, 2013)

sounds like it's all coming together great


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## Greater Swiss (Jun 7, 2011)

This is SUCH a great thread!!!! Thank you for sharing your progress, I'm sure people in the future with the same problems will see this and get a LOT out of it. Advice is one thing, but the way you've tracked and explained your progress, fantastic! 
:clap2::rockon::whoo:


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Greater Swiss said:


> This is SUCH a great thread!!!! Thank you for sharing your progress, I'm sure people in the future with the same problems will see this and get a LOT out of it. Advice is one thing, but the way you've tracked and explained your progress, fantastic!
> :clap2::rockon::whoo:


Thank you very much! I know it helps me when I get frustrated that things don't go exactly as I'd like to remember where we started compared to where we are now. I think the biggest thing is to have PATIENCE and not try to push things faster than they need to go. We have YEARS for them to live together, taking a few months to make everyone co-exist peacefully really isn't that long in the grand scheme of things. 

Something interesting that's happened; a few days ago, Kallie came into the living room (we've been trying leaving the cat door open at times when we're ready to supervise), Luna was laying on the couch. Kallie came over to her, sniffed her nose and then left, and Luna didn't move from the couch. 

In another instance when Kallie came in she was being more cautious. When she saw Luna on the couch she started shrinking back and Luna was dialed in right away and chased her from the room. My fault, obviously. I didn't say anything or deter Luna when I should have because I wanted to see what she'd do.

I did find it interesting though to see the difference in how she behaved based on how Kallie behaved. Seeing that, I really believe more than 50% of the battle is getting the cats confident at this point. It seems like when they just walk around like normal cats Luna couldn't care less about them, but if they start acting like prey it triggers her instinct to chase. 

The cats seem more willing to come into the living room at night after they have their dinner, so I think we'll try to wait to feed Luna and see if we can do some sessions with them coming in the room while we hand feed her or something. 

Although that's on hold right now because Luna has kennel cough. Poor girl obviously doesn't feel well so I don't want to try to work her too much.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

I took Luna in the bathroom with me tonight while I showered to try to help her cough. Afterward, I took her in the bedroom on leash so I could get dressed, which is where both cats were. Kallie was in the window sill and Shiloh was on the bed. Luna halfheartedly sniffed at Shiloh but other than that she totally didn't care that the cats were there.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

I know I've been updating a lot recently but this is too funny...

My bf is home today with the animals. Apparently Shiloh was at one side of the gate and Luna was at the other, so he opened it to see how they'd react. Shiloh approached Luna... and Luna walked right over Shiloh to clean out the cat food bowls. :doh:


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

The other day I had an epiphany about Luna's interaction with the cats. 

I always describe her interactions with other dogs as depending on the dog; if the dog is friendly/calm she will be as well, if the dog is stiff/aggressive she isn't afraid to defend herself. 

I realized that this is the same way she is with the cats. If they're acting calm/normal, she doesn't even care if they're there. If they get uppity with her, she chases/harasses. I don't know why this wasn't more obvious to me before, but the inconsistency of her reacting was making it difficult for me to advance her training.

In light of that, I'm re-framing my approach to the situation a bit. I'm focusing less on training Luna and more on getting the cats to be comfortable with her. We're doing all meals now within 5' of each other with the gate open. Also, I've started letting the cats into the living room at night before bed after Luna is crated (this is when they're interested in coming in). Hopefully in time the area will become less suspicious to them and they'll be more bold and less hesitant. I've just been letting them explore for however long they feel comfortable.


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## d_ray (Nov 5, 2013)

Dog and cats dynamics are so interesting to me. We have 2 cats: Ernie and Little. Little isn't as curious as Ernie and really couldn't care less about Jewel. The odd time he will head butt Jewel, but otherwise, he barely notices her. He will jump over her in bed to get to me and is really confident around her. Jewel has absolutely no issues with him. She knows not to mess with him. She has tried and she gets a swat. Ernie on the other hand, is way too interested in Jewel. He is always in her dog bed, sniffing her toys, into anything new we bring into the house. If she is sleeping, he wants to sniff her and check her out. Jewel and him compete for attention, space, and food. She knows that if she wants something, all she has to do is get into his personal space and he will move. She is really gentle with him and will just lay right next to him if he's in her bed and he will be uncomfortable and leave. Most of the time she leaves him alone, unless she sees him counter surfing and then she barks at him. I wish he would stand up to her like Little does. I really think having confident cats is what makes the biggest difference.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

d_ray said:


> Dog and cats dynamics are so interesting to me. We have 2 cats: Ernie and Little. Little isn't as curious as Ernie and really couldn't care less about Jewel. The odd time he will head butt Jewel, but otherwise, he barely notices her. He will jump over her in bed to get to me and is really confident around her. Jewel has absolutely no issues with him. She knows not to mess with him. She has tried and she gets a swat. Ernie on the other hand, is way too interested in Jewel. He is always in her dog bed, sniffing her toys, into anything new we bring into the house. If she is sleeping, he wants to sniff her and check her out. Jewel and him compete for attention, space, and food. She knows that if she wants something, all she has to do is get into his personal space and he will move. She is really gentle with him and will just lay right next to him if he's in her bed and he will be uncomfortable and leave. Most of the time she leaves him alone, unless she sees him counter surfing and then she barks at him. I wish he would stand up to her like Little does. I really think having confident cats is what makes the biggest difference.


Unfortunately Luna doesn't back off from swats, it just gets her more excited. "Oooh! An INTERACTIVE toy!"

Just wanted to post a quick update.

We are still doing mutual meals with the gate open. I have walked away briefly (to get a drink or grab something) and there have been no issues. Last night I even walked away long enough for Luna to finish her bowl food and came back to her at her kong, didn't bother with the cats at all. Cats are also closer now, about 4 feet away. I'm hesitant to move them any closer for fear that Luna will try to steal their food. Everyone seems very comfortable with the eating situation. 

I am going to start crate time with Luna having a chew after dinner. This seems to be the time of day when the cats get interested in coming in the living room. Without a chew she just watches the cats which they find uncomfortable, haha. We did a first attempt at this and Shiloh just lingered at the doorway, but hey, baby steps!


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Last night during crate time Shiloh came into the living room and sat on one of the cat trees! Luna was successfully distracted with the pb kong. Once she finished it, she did watch Shiloh but she wasn't 'on' like I've seen her in the past when she was about to chase; she was relaxed and laying down in her crate.


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## Kyllobernese (Feb 5, 2008)

My sister has an outdoor cat that loves the dogs. He never runs from them so even my dogs who are not around cats, leave him alone. They will run at him when they first see him but because he just sits there, they stop. I know it does help that they are small dogs and do not have a great prey drive but her own dogs, like her Rat Terrier, climb all over him and has since she was a puppy. The only down side to that is he is more likely to get killed by a strange dog. I don't know what his reaction would be to Kris or hers to him so have never had her off leash when he was around. As I do not have a cat it is pretty hard to see what she would do without putting the cat in peril as she would meet him outside.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

I was so proud of Luna today!

We got a kong wobbler for her that she has been eating meals from. We are at a point now where I can leave the gate open while the cats are eating about 2 feet from the gate and Luna doesn't care about them at all, just goes about her wobblin, even if I walk away to do something other than supervise (get a drink, etc. I always stay within sight of the gate just in case).

Today, I fed the cats and then let Luna out of her crate, leaving the gate open. Got her wobbler and went to the kitchen to fill it... and Luna stayed in the living room on the other side of the gate, with the cats eating right there. :rockon:

Also, last night was the first night Kallie came into the living room during crate time. :rockon:


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

We had a moment tonight. 

I was sitting on the couch with Luna watching videos on my phone. I heard the gate rattle and looked over, and there was Kallie perched on the top, on her way over. She has been attempting to scale the gate the past couple days, but normally we catch her before she makes it all the way over. 

This time, however, she was over the gate before I could blink, and Luna jerks forward so I grab her collar. Kallie realizes what she has done (apparently scaling the gate doesn't work both ways in her mind) and now can't get back out. I realize that I'm the only person there, Luna's collar in one hand and a cat that is stuck.

My mind went; "Oh jeeze. Oh jeeze oh jeeze."

I looked at both of them. I can't get close enough to Kallie to open the gate or grab her with Luna in hand. Took a breath. Told Luna to stay and hesitantly let her go... *and she stayed!* I quick grabbed Kallie and put her on the other side of the gate again. 

Since Kallie has been pretty persistent in this, I'm going to leave the cat door of the gate open now so she can get out if she pulls this again. Luna is dragging a leash and I have treats at the ready just in case.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Tonight we just had another great moment. My mind was blown.

I went to get Luna's kong out of the freezer for crate time. I left the gate open with Shiloh standing right there. Then Luna followed me out into the kitchen with Shiloh RIGHT THERE and NOTHING HAPPENED. At all. She was just standing there wagging her tail waiting for me, with Shiloh standing right beside her. I just...

Kallie was on the counter and I was afraid if Luna stayed too long Kallie would try to run so I went back into the living room with Luna right away (kong in hand of course) but man... That was like... a moment I've been dreaming of seeing since we brought her home. They were just -there-. Existing in the same space together peacefully. Looking at me like "Wtf are you staring at?"

I can't even express how happy I am right now.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Last night we may have had a breakthrough and I could not have been more pleased. 

During dinner time, Kallie came in and sat on one of our cat trees as she does while Luna is getting her dinner from the treat ball. Eventually the food was done and Luna went to checking out the cat, which is normal. However, normally she gets to a point that she's too interested and we have to hold her so the cat can make a break for it. 

Not this time! She was keeping a respectful distance for a couple mins (even like she was hiding behind me? I'm not complaining). Then it was about her bedtime, so I asked if she needed to go pee and she happily went to the door to be let out, leaving Kallie sitting there. Then when she came back in, we went and sat on the couch for a couple mins and she did that without paying attention to Kallie, who was still there. I have NEVER seen her not pay attention to a cat in the room unless she didn't know it was there. After a bit, I got up and asked her to go in her crate, which again she did normally, with Kallie still sitting there. 

This is the first time ever that an interaction without food present has ended in anything other than the cat running out of the room. Holy smokes. So happy with our progress!


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

It's been quite a while since I updated this thread... but the other night Luna was playbowing at Kallie. 

Yep. We've come quite a long way.


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## hanksimon (Mar 18, 2009)

So Cool! Pls bottle that!


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## jade5280 (Feb 20, 2013)

I'm so glad everything is going well for you! We haven't made as much progress with Gypsy as I would like. Every time she hears the cat she just goes into prey drive mode. Now our poor cat is getting bladder infections because she is stressed out. Ugh. I'm hoping when we move we will be able to give Chestnut a better space. I think when we put in the outdoor pen for her it will help a lot in relieving her stress.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

hanksimon said:


> So Cool! Pls bottle that!


Hahaha, thank you!

We have decided this weekend we will be expanding Luna's area to include the kitchen, with our house layout that means she will have the entire main floor.

It's a holiday weekend here so we'll both be home able to supervise, and we're prepared to go back again if needed.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

jade5280 said:


> I'm so glad everything is going well for you! We haven't made as much progress with Gypsy as I would like. Every time she hears the cat she just goes into prey drive mode. Now our poor cat is getting bladder infections because she is stressed out. Ugh. I'm hoping when we move we will be able to give Chestnut a better space. I think when we put in the outdoor pen for her it will help a lot in relieving her stress.


Keep in mind, this is now almost 6 months after we brought Luna home.

Initially I moved the cats' food and litterbox upstairs to dog-free area so they could still feel comfortable and safe with those. Eventually as they started showing they were more comfortable I gradually moved them back to their normal locations. (and I do mean gradually, initially I was moving the food bowls like, a couple of inches/day, sometimes not at all)

When we expand Luna's area this weekend it will be the first time they will have to travel through her area to get to food/litterbox (previously she was gated in the living room, but they just didn't even want to pass by the gate), so we may have to move them again for a bit until they get re-accustomed to each other in the additional space. Litterbox will always be gated off so they are never bothered while in the act, though.


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## jade5280 (Feb 20, 2013)

We have the upstairs gated off and that's where her litter box and food are, but she still wants to come downstairs and whenever she does she is chased off. Hopefully with time Gypsy will get better.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Additional update, I have found out that I have one cat that will defend herself and one that will not.

Kallie is not afraid to give Luna a few good bapbapbap's to tell her to back the heck on up, and Luna will respect the bapping.

Shiloh, however, will make a lot of noise but that's about it. She has been cornered with Luna's head literally within inches of her and all she does is a lot of hissing until we come call Luna away. Don't worry, Luna has never tried to hurt her, she just stands there looking.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

jade5280 said:


> We have the upstairs gated off and that's where her litter box and food are, but she still wants to come downstairs and whenever she does she is chased off. Hopefully with time Gypsy will get better.


One of the things I found I had to do with our cats was to show them the places to run -up- as opposed to running -away-. When I could tell they were getting freaked out by Luna I tapped on the places on the cat trees they could go, and I try to encourage them to go up instead of running away as much as I can.

This was after we were at the point where they could come in the room at all without Luna instantly trying to chase, of course.

I don't remember if I posted about this, but for a while we did supervised time at dinner where Luna was distracted by food (first a pb kong, then a food toy) and left the gate open with one of us closely supervising at the ready to grab Luna if we needed to. That way they got used to existing in the same space, but Luna was distracted enough that she was aware of them but didn't try to approach. When she finished her food we had the cats exit before she got too interested, and gradually increased that time period until they were existing with no distractions until we went to bed.

Luna still sometimes will try to chase or engage them in play if she needs to burn off energy or is overstimulated (coming inside after seeing a fox or deer, for example) but we've had lots of times where she will see them and go back to what she was doing, which is huge.


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## d_ray (Nov 5, 2013)

Jazzy has started chasing the cats. Jewel is now immune to them. Jazz will chase them maybe 50% of the time when she is super excited. I don't think it's a prey thing. I think she is genuinely in love with them. Apparently lived with a cat before us. I need to start managing it better because I realize it's getting worse. She has become ultra fascinated with them. It's starting to effect the cats as they don't come out of the bedroom as often as they used to.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Update from yesterday!

We had our first ever moment where I was on the couch with both Luna and with a cat on my lap for an extended period of time with no issues. I think it was about 40mins. A couple times Luna sort of leaned over and sniffed the cat, the cat didn't move, and Luna just laid back down again!

It ended only because the cat decided to get up and go somewhere else, and Luna totally didn't care! Barely looked up at the leaving cat.


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## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

awesome !!!!!


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Wow, so it's been a while since I updated this.

This year on new years day we took down the cat gates (except for the one on the litterbox room).

Luna and Kallie now get along fairly well. Kallie will nuzzle and rub her, which Luna is still figuring out how to respond to without getting herself bapped. But they mostly coexist well at this point.

Shiloh is still shy/skittish and doesn't try to interact, but a few times I've seen Luna try to sniff her and Shiloh hasn't run away, so that's major progress for her. I was also concerned when we took down the gates that Shiloh would just never leave the safety of the litterbox room, but she has! I haven't noticed any decrease in her being in other rooms of the house, which was a big relief to me. 

So far we have come...


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## Canyx (Jul 1, 2011)

That's so wonderful! A huge congratulations! And good on you for sticking it through.


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## PatriciafromCO (Oct 7, 2012)

:clap2::rockon((( Thumbs UP !!! ))))


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## Captain_Russia (Nov 18, 2015)

My puppy likes chasing our cats as well, I usually have to keep her on a leash when the cats are inside because she'll chase them up the stairs. Mainly I just hold her when she sees one and make her sit until the cat decides to leave, making her calm around them instead of excited. It seems to be helping.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

So I figured this deserved another update. I'll let the pictures tell the story...











We've had a lot of recent big successes, and I credit most of it to our move. Our new house has a much better layout, all main rooms have multiple exits, plus high places to jump to. So the cats always have an out if they feel like they need one.


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## Canyx (Jul 1, 2011)

That video is the cutest thing ever.


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## Canyx (Jul 1, 2011)

Also, reading your first post and seeing how far you have both come is truly inspiring! Thanks for sharing your journey!


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Good Luna! 

Love how she was triggered at :22 and both stayed calm. She really wanted kitty to start to 'play' and kitty did a great job of staying put rather than reacting to Luna's change of mood.


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## ireth0 (Feb 11, 2013)

Canyx said:


> Also, reading your first post and seeing how far you have both come is truly inspiring! Thanks for sharing your journey!


Wow thank you so much! You got me to go back and read the first post as well and man... how far we have come! I had totally forgotten the time she busted the gate down (hasn't done it since... now she just wriggles through the cat door). I'm really hopeful that this will help others in similar situations who are also feeling overwhelmed to know there can be light at the end of the tunnel!



Kathyy said:


> Good Luna!
> 
> Love how she was triggered at :22 and both stayed calm. She really wanted kitty to start to 'play' and kitty did a great job of staying put rather than reacting to Luna's change of mood.


Yes! They're doing such a great job of learning to understand each other's language. Luna especially does a fantastic job of redirecting her excitement about a cat to a toy rather than chasing.


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