# GSD Color lesson!



## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

AKA I want to show you a pretty bitch xD

I mean, I'm sure you look at this girl and think "Oh, look at that head! Gorgeous! Maybe a little heavy, but still gorgeous!"









"Lovely expression and ear set! Nice and dark!"









"Strong underjaw and good proportions! She's a lovely black!"









But you would be WRONG!

Because she's a.......
















MELANISTIC BI-COLOR!!!! whoo!!


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## marsha=whitie (Dec 29, 2008)

Someone is excited! lol


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## Keechak (Aug 10, 2008)

I don't normally like the bitches very much but this girl is pretty!


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

I don't see many melanistic bi-colors, Marsha. Especially not ones as nice as Traya 

She's a finished champion, AND has her CD ^_^


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## Rowdy (Sep 2, 2007)

I've never heard of that. Will she have any particular color pups? Or is there a color that she couldn't have (like all black)?


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

Melanistic is just a way of describing the depth of the pigment.

People are still debating on whether bi-color is in fact a color, or if it is a pattern. I believe it to be a pattern, but Chris Wild has some compelling arguments as to why it may be a color.

She'll have the normal range of color production. If she carries for black (I think she might, but I'd have to see her pedigree), and she's bred to a black or another carrier, she'll produce black puppies. She should also produce more bi colors as well as "normal" black and tans blanket/black and tans.

For all the recessive genes in GSDs, things can get quite complicated xD


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## winniec777 (Apr 20, 2008)

Oh my - that is one beautiful girl! I've never seen a shepherd with that coloring before. I am sold.


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

This boy is also a melanistic bi color to a lesser degree (notice that his legs aren't "dirtied" like there's mud specks everywhere).

Ketlyn's Surfer Dude "Cody"









And this is a bi-color bitch I was offered a couple years ago, BISS Ch Candia's Toil 'n Trouble "Sadie"


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## Elana55 (Jan 7, 2008)

Very pretty. In horses the Melanism is expressed in a blue black horse with no other colors and the black does NOT fade in the sun. Very rare. 

In Green Frogs Melanism is expressed as Blue.. so the Frog is blue (had one in my Dad's Pond when I was a kid). 

Melanism as a genetic term (explained to me) is the opposite of Albinism. 

How this is manifested in the German Shepherd as BI color is interesting, assuming it is true melanism and a recessive gene as opposed to a dominant mutant gene (as it is in the Panther).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melanism (it is pretty good, even tho it is Wikipedia)


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

Nobody knows Elana! LOL!

I can show pictures of "rich" bi colors and "blanketed" dogs as well if anybody is interested


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## marsha=whitie (Dec 29, 2008)

I had to google Melanistic, and this pretty picture popped up.








I know... it has nothing to do with doggies, but I thought that it was purtyful.


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

Wow! What a funky white tail!


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## Pepper (Jan 27, 2008)

I went to my first dog show last week and saw a gorgeous male black and tan shepherd...but he had this huge white patch in the middle of his chest, are they allowed to have that?

I went to my first dog show last week, and saw a gorgeous male black and tan shepherd showing, but he had this huge white patch on his chest, is that allowed?


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

It's actually not supposed to be any larger than a quarter, and it's getting out of hand >.<


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## marsha=whitie (Dec 29, 2008)

Xeph said:


> Wow! What a funky white tail!


I know! We have a stuffed albino (full body) at the resturant that I work at... it makes me  to see it, but its pretty pretty, or it was, atleast.


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

Xeph said:


> I can show pictures of "rich" bi colors and "blanketed" dogs as well if anybody is interested


YES, please. =) I'm interested in this colour discussion. <3


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

Blanketed dog, Hawk v Eichenluft. Notice how he doesn't have black bars extended doing the majority of his front legs. He also lacks pencilling (blanketed dogs CAN have pencilling however)









Melanistic black and tan, Domara's Gordito. You can see that he has more than a saddle, but the black on his thighs and shoulders is not dark enough to qualify him as a blanketed dog.









Blanketed dog, E-Z Gogh's Rodney Dangerfield. Note how dark he is through the shoulders, back, and thighs, but lacks tarheels and foreleg bars.









Rich bicolor Otus v HausReid notice the tan markings through the face, as opposed to the solid black face of the melanistic bicolor.


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## MissMutt (Aug 8, 2008)

Xeph said:


> Blanketed dog, Hawk v Eichenluft. Notice how he doesn't have black bars extended doing the majority of his front legs. He also lacks pencilling (blanketed dogs CAN have pencilling however)


Had to go find this smiley elsewhere as none here would suffice..


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## Spicy1_VV (Jun 1, 2007)

Xeph said:


> I don't see many melanistic bi-colors, Marsha. Especially not ones as nice as Traya
> 
> She's a finished champion, AND has her CD ^_^


Nah I saw that coming with the visible brown tones around her mouth. You can't fool me you trixster!

She looks and sounds awesome!!! Great pics.


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

*Xeph*, can you explain "pencilling" to me? =) Oh, and "tarheels" and "foreleg bars".

And thank for you showing the other pics. I'm really enjoying this. XD


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## BellaPup (Jul 7, 2007)

Katzyn said:


> *Xeph*, can you explain "pencilling" to me? =) Oh, and "tarheels" and "foreleg bars".
> 
> And thank for you showing the other pics. I'm really enjoying this. XD


I was going to ask the same thing - I'm a huge GSD fan but I never knew there were so many marking descriptions....this is very interesting! Need more GSD pics!!


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

If you can't see it, "pencilling" looks like little pencil marks were drawn vertically down the dogs toes...Eagle Eichenluft shows a good example of pencilling

Cody:


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

Ohh, okay.


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

Here's a rather famous bi color, Am CH GV MarHaven's Color Guard "Boss"

Strauss' great great maternal grandfather


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## MissMutt (Aug 8, 2008)

Xeph I was just blog hopping, and weirdly enough just saw a GSD that looks very much like the bitch at the beginning of this thread:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_yws6I0twlWM/SeTUSKP55yI/AAAAAAAABYM/DSqBgl8dels/s1600-h/100_9770.jpg

LOL! Apparently the pic was taken at a show a couple weeks back. The markings look exactly the same.. are THEY the same?

ETA oh nevermind, the front legs look a little bit more "dirtied" on the one you originally posted. Just funny that I came across a very similar dog though


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

Now, what makes it a "bi-colour"?


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

> Apparently the pic was taken at a show a couple weeks back. The markings look exactly the same.. are THEY the same?


I dare say that does look like Ms Traya! Don't know for sure, but it would be a darn good twin if it's not!


> Now, what makes it a "bi-colour"?


Bi color dogs like Boss, Cody, and Traya, will exhibit foreleg bars and tarheels. Some expression of tan through the face is normal. Those are "Rich" bi colors, where as Boss, Cody, and Traya are "melanistic" bi colors.

Dogs like Hawk are considered blanketed. They lack foreleg bars and tarheels. A blanketed dog can also express a solid black face, though tan "bleed through" or prounouced tan is much more common.


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## MissMutt (Aug 8, 2008)

Xeph said:


> I dare say that does look like Ms Traya! Don't know for sure, but it would be a darn good twin if it's not!


Ha! Wow. What are the odds? She's a very good looking girl.


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

Okay. I think I understand now. =)

Thank you!


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## GSDGAL (May 27, 2009)

this picture was taken when callie was just on 5 months old....it gives a good view of the pencilling on the toes...I think??? and some kind of striping on her back legs, which is still there. I asked the breeder about it and he said that her uncle threw a brindle shepherd female pup in 2006....do you think that could be what it is? Does she have the brindle gene?.....sorry to hijack thread..

I can't breed from her because she's spayed due to obvious lack of breeding quality. but i'd like to know.








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it looks even darker now, not so much watery orange but brown


includes link for people with computer issues* http://i39.tinypic.com/v7f31x.jpg


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

GSDGAL said:


> this picture was taken when callie was just on 5 months old....it gives a good view of the pencilling on the toes...I think??? and some kind of striping on her back legs, which is still there. I asked the breeder about it and he said that her uncle threw a brindle shepherd female pup in 2006....do you think that could be what it is? Does she have the brindle gene?.....sorry to hijack thread..
> 
> I can't breed from her because she's spayed due to obvious lack of breeding quality. but i'd like to know.


I can't sees it, I can't sees it~


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## GSDGAL (May 27, 2009)

but i sees it


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

Aww. I can't. =<


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

Actually, it just looks like she was a little wet. Doubtful that she's brindle factored. That photo does show the pencilling I meant! Thank you!

Perhaps you could get some more pictures of that rear foot with the odd marking?


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## GSDGAL (May 27, 2009)

Xeph said:


> Actually, it just looks like she was a little wet. Doubtful that she's brindle factored. That photo does show the pencilling I meant! Thank you!
> 
> Perhaps you could get some more pictures of that rear foot with the odd marking?


she was a little wet but the stripes are still there i will go and take some pics of them this afternoon and post them then..


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## BellaPup (Jul 7, 2007)

Xeph said:


> Actually, it just looks like she was a little wet. Doubtful that she's brindle factored. That photo does show the pencilling I meant! Thank you!
> QUOTE]
> 
> Wow! I had no idea such small details in a GSD's markings would classify them as one "type" or another - or make them undesirable for breeding (for show quality I assume?) They are awesome dogs regardless of what pattern their coats are - but very interesting nonetheless! The only other dog I personally have heard of having strict coat markings is the Dalmation - their spots are not supposed to touch except around their head/ears or something...? Jeeze - no wonder some people dedicate their whole lives to breeding the "perfect" dog - guess there's a lot more to it than body type and health!!


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

Yay, I can see the pic now. Okay, so now I really understand what pencilling looks like...


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## HersheyPup (May 22, 2008)

*This is my Black Sable GSD, Toffee. She has pretty heavy pencilling. This link shows the different coat patterns and according to that site my dog is considered a Melanistic Black Sable. Not sure if that is the actuall meaning of Melanistic?*



















This is an interesting article ....

http://www.shawlein.com/The_Standard/07_Colour_&_Pigment/Colour_&_Pigment.html


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

There are actually several breeds that have marking restrictions. Such as Newfoundlands. There are very strict criteria they have to make in terms of ratios of black to white.

In GSDs, no marking is a penalty with the exception of an overly large white spot on the chest (and even that is minor).

Blues and Livers aren't DQ, but their color is a serious fault, so there's no point in showing them because they're a technical DQ. Solid white IS a disqualification.


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

Ooh, thank you for that link, *HersheyPup*.

That last one, the brindle GSD...wow, I want to see one. Are they really as rare as the article said, "seems to be extinct"?


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## Dogstar (May 11, 2007)

Brindle is a dominant gene, so with no known dogs being brindle currently, the color is essentially extinct. A spontaneous mutation or crossbreeding would be needed to reintroduce it.


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## GSDGAL (May 27, 2009)

apparently brindle also carries genes that make the dog weak, like the pup that was bred in 2006 died a week and half after being born


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## HersheyPup (May 22, 2008)

Katzyn said:


> Ooh, thank you for that link, *HersheyPup*.
> 
> That last one, the brindle GSD...wow, I want to see one. Are they really as rare as the article said, "seems to be extinct"?



If you are truly in love with the Brindle color, but really want a Shepherd...why not look into the *Dutch Shepherd*? Have you heard of them? They seen similar to the Belgian Malinois, though a bit heavier in build. They are always brindle and can even come in long coats, 

Personally, I'd go with a GSD that comes from good healthy, sound, mentally stable bloodlines that have at least some kind of titles on the parents. As they say in the horse world..."You can't ride a color!" Likewise, who cares what color your dog is if it is crippled or lacks the correct temperament? After all, you have to live with him/her for over a decade!


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## Xeph (May 7, 2007)

Dutchies aren't anything like the Germans though....they're like slightly less crazy Mali's.


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## Dogstar (May 11, 2007)

GSDGAL said:


> apparently brindle also carries genes that make the dog weak, like the pup that was bred in 2006 died a week and half after being born


I don't know. It's not linked with health problems in other breeds. *shrug*


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## Katzyn (Mar 22, 2007)

HersheyPup said:


> If you are truly in love with the Brindle color, but really want a Shepherd...why not look into the *Dutch Shepherd*? Have you heard of them? They seen similar to the Belgian Malinois, though a bit heavier in build. They are always brindle and can even come in long coats,
> 
> Personally, I'd go with a GSD that comes from good healthy, sound, mentally stable bloodlines that have at least some kind of titles on the parents. As they say in the horse world..."You can't ride a color!" Likewise, who cares what color your dog is if it is crippled or lacks the correct temperament? After all, you have to live with him/her for over a decade!


I...don't want to own a shepherd, I just want to SEE a brindle GSD. =P


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## HersheyPup (May 22, 2008)

Katzyn said:


> I...don't want to own a shepherd, I just want to SEE a brindle GSD. =P



Oh..lol..well, in that case...I'd sure like to see one, too!


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## Foyerhawk (May 7, 2009)

Xeph said:


> If you can't see it, "pencilling" looks like little pencil marks were drawn vertically down the dogs toes...Eagle Eichenluft shows a good example of pencilling
> 
> Cody:


This is how my dog is marked. No head here, since I was taking the photo AND holding him (I just wanted a record of his 11 week conformation, and didn't have anyone handy to help), but this shows my puppy's markings:










Tarheels:










Front paws:










He has no tan at all on his face, at least as of now. But, he does have some in his ears... and some on the sides of his neck rough, though it's very slight.


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## Ludo the Monster (Jul 1, 2009)

So I think GSDs are beautiful and amazing dogs but I don't know jack about them. So! Questions: what is with that stance they do in all the pictures? Where their back leg is stretched back behind them? Why? I have never seen that in another picture. Are they just showing off their awesomeness?


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## anonymusneo (Apr 28, 2009)

found a black n whit5e brindle gsd pic


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## ACampbell (Oct 7, 2007)

HersheyPup said:


> If you are truly in love with the Brindle color, but really want a Shepherd...why not look into the *Dutch Shepherd*? Have you heard of them? They seen similar to the Belgian Malinois, though a bit heavier in build. They are always brindle and can even come in long coats,
> 
> Personally, I'd go with a GSD that comes from good healthy, sound, mentally stable bloodlines that have at least some kind of titles on the parents. As they say in the horse world..."You can't ride a color!" Likewise, who cares what color your dog is if it is crippled or lacks the correct temperament? After all, you have to live with him/her for over a decade!


We have a Dutchie at my SCH club...he's quite the character! Not totally insane but not like a GSD, much smaller than Lacey height wise and a dark black brindle. I like him.


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## HersheyPup (May 22, 2008)

How cool! I love the pic of the brindle gsd...he really looks like a gsd, too.
I would LOVE to be able to get to know a Dutch Shepherd...I have never even seen one in person or on TV..only pictures. They seem like a breed that is somewhere between a GSD and a Malinois in temperament. I'll have to make it a mission to get to see one!


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