# best puppy food



## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

we have a puppy(3-4months old) that is on a scale of 1(too skinny) - 10(too fat), is a 3.... She was a stray that we adopted from a lady...

What is the best puppy food to fatten her up? and currently we have her own puppy chow.... no idea on breed she is as she's a black/white(dominant black - see general - first time dog owners).... 

I have a modest budget so please no expensive brands cause i have a 8 pound bag and i doubt its gunna be big enough to last 2 weeks with her....

i put 2 cups of food in her bowl and it was half gone within 1 1/2 hrs of sitting the bowl on the placemat. I wont do this again in the morn but i didnt know when her last food was(considering the lady worked sunday and got off an hr b4 we met to exchange money for sasha, lol)...... 

Also would Free Feeding(to a point) work best for her since she's soo thin?? or since she is a puppy, do regulated feedings(with times that i know i'll be home at, i work various shifts each day but tends to lean towards evenings at the current moment)?? 

**Been a long time since I had a puppy**


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## Abbylynn (Jul 7, 2011)

www.dogfoodadvisor.com is a good site to look at the dog foods and their ingredients to help you make a choice within your budget. 

I go to Tractor Supply company and I feed 4Health Chicken and Rice which is a 4 star food. It is around $1 per pound. I get a 35 pound bag for $34.99 and the 4Health Lamb and rice is $29.99 for a 35 pound bag. They have a puppy formula and a high performance, small bites also. Tractor Supply Company is a feed store and it is the only one who carries 4Health.

35 pounds lasts my 60 pound dog approximately one month. I feed four dogs. So I must watch my pennies also.  If you buy a cheaper food which may not be a good quality you have to feed more of it. In the long run you end up spending more money because you run out sooner and have to go purchase more.

I also feed Taste Of The Wild grain-free food to my little dogs ... it is a great food ... more expensive ... but my little dogs have allergy issues and this seems to be helping them. 

Just check out the site and see what you like and check some local prices. Grocery store brands are always almost only 1 or 2 star rated foods. I find feed stores to be lower priced compared to pet supply stores also.


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## PatchworkRobot (Aug 24, 2010)

Abbylynn's answer about food is a great one. I'd also suggest a higher quality food than what she's getting. 4Health is great and there is also Costco's Kirkland brand (if you have a membership) - it's a good food for a cheaper price.

All I want to add is how often and how much to feed. I'd suggest feeding the pup two or three times a day (if 3 times a day only until 6 months of age and then go down to two). I wouldn't suggest free feeding. When a dog is sick or if something is wrong a good sign is loss of appetite and that's really hard to tell if a dog is getting free fed. I know that breed is undetermined but I would also consider increasing the amount of food a little bit. My dog at 4 months weighed about 35-40lb and was getting 6 cups a day to stay at a healthy weight. Now that he's older it only takes 2.5 cups to keep him in a good place. Growing puppies need more food :]


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

thanks you 2. i didn't know what brand she fed her 'n her other dogs... I do know Puppy Chow isn't the best... But it seemed the safest as Purina brand tends to be a popular one.... But I will look at the website and do the tips on teh feeding.... my last dog parished 3yrs ago from old age, so yah its been a long time. lol.


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

I would stay away from Purina. You can get much healthier dog food for less money. Purina is popular because of their advertising, *not* because it is the best. The foods already suggested are great, inexpensive foods. I highly suggest you go to dogfoodadvisor.com and see what they recommend.

For example, here is a list of the ingredients in Purina Pro Plan, a food advertisers and Nestle want you to think. (Yes the Nestle company that owns candy and cookies owns a dog food company!):

Ingredients: Chicken, *brewers rice*, *whole grain wheat*, *poultry by-product meal* (natural source of glucosamine), *corn gluten meal*, *animal fat* preserved with mixed-tocopherols (form of vitamin E), *whole grain corn*, *soy flour*, *corn bran*, *soybean meal*, fish meal (natural source of glucosamine), *animal digest*, glycerin, *salt*, dried egg product, calcium carbonate, calcium phosphate, potassium chloride, vitamin E supplement, choline chloride, zinc sulfate, ferrous sulfate, sulfur, l-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate (source of vitamin C), zinc proteinate, manganese sulfate, niacin, manganese proteinate, vitamin A supplement, calcium pantothenate, thiamine mononitrate, copper sulfate, riboflavin supplement, vitamin B-12 supplement, copper proteinate, pyridoxine hydrochloride, garlic oil, folic acid, vitamin D-3 supplement, calcium iodate, biotin, *menadione sodium bisulfite complex (source of vitamin K activity)*, sodium selenite

The ingredients to stay away from have been bolded. The first ingredient may be chicken, but after processing the moisture content leaves reducing the amount of chicken actually present. This puts grains and other fillers and the majority of the ingredients in this food. These grains are hard to digest, cause allergies, and increase the size of poops. Another cause for alarm is the fact that is doesn't tell us what kind of poultry it has or what kind of animal digest. There isn't really any good meat source in this food, besides the chicken, and there is more grain than that in the food. Salt, there is no reason for added salt except to increase the flavor and make it taste good to dogs. Doctors tell humans to minimize salt, why should it be any different for other animals? Lastly, Menadione. Stay away from this at all costs. Menadione has been linked to organ failure, cell damage, hemolytic anemia, etc. 

There are much healthier, even cheaper alternatives to Purina


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## Roloni (Aug 5, 2011)

LilasMom said:


> I highly suggest you go to dogfoodadvisor.com and see what they recommend.


I agree , dogfoodadadvisor.com is an excellent place to get info on dog food.
I thought I was feeding my dogs a good quality food untill I went to that site and found out I was paying too much for an inferior product


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## Goldens&Labs4Me (Jan 18, 2012)

Another dog food option--for little money is the Diamond Naturals brand. It is a 4 star food and you can get a 40 lb bag for around $35--maybe a little less. The pet store carries it here--and a lot of feed stores have Diamond as well. For the price, it's a decent food and I understand being on a budget.  (They have regular Diamond as well, but the ingredients in it are not nearly as good as in the Naturals). 

The Chicken soup line is good food also (4 star) and it's a little bit more--about $40 for 35 lbs. 

You will feed less of these foods verses the Puppy chow--and the dog will get better nutrition from it. Win/win. 

Good luck with your puppy and welcome back! I am so wanting another puppy--but we have 3 dogs and a 2 1/2 year old little human baby--so we are at our limit--but I can still want!


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## mom3tlc (Feb 6, 2012)

LilasMom said:


> I would stay away from Purina. You can get much healthier dog food for less money. Purina is popular because of their advertising, *not* because it is the best. The foods already suggested are great, inexpensive foods. I highly suggest you go to dogfoodadvisor.com and see what they recommend.
> 
> For example, here is a list of the ingredients in Purina Pro Plan, a food advertisers and Nestle want you to think. (Yes the Nestle company that owns candy and cookies owns a dog food company!):
> 
> ...


What about infinia dog food made by Purina??Sandy


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## Goldens&Labs4Me (Jan 18, 2012)

Sandy, the Infinia looks like a good one. And it's rated 5 star on DFA.


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

Personally, I would just avoid anything by Purina. Infinia has canola oil and tomato pomace which I avoid, as well as being primarily vegetable-based. You can do better.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

I got a food savvy vet... She recommended to stay away from Diamond(the generic Diamond not Naturals) as its like Purina and Ol' Roy. Junk food basicaly. She did not pressure or push Science Diet or Iams... Just recommended me to find a Large breed formula for puppy. 

I have found that i can not leave food laying around. lol. she is learning the "down" command and is a stubborn little*not really at 30 pounds* thing. lol. I have a local tractor supply co near me... also have petsmart, petco, 'n 2 others. the 2 others do sell puppies from local breeders. and no i dont buy anything from them, once i found that out. i dont even take her(puppy) to one of those 2's doggy daycare/playgroups. 

but back to the food ............. my vet is a dog owner, so she told me of several brands to think about... but they are expensive but she assured me that their quality is top notch(5star) and they are worth the cost in gold... **she has 3 large breed's and 1 toy breed**. 
I asked about Taste of the Wild and Blue Buffalo, and she said to stay away from those from her personal experience. Did recommend Innova, Evo, ProPlan, 4Health and Chicken Soup. All brands I can get at the local tractor supply store, well i know 4health, gotta check into the others... 

I also found a Crate for 90$ with them thats for dogs up to 160 pounds(metal with pan) that i plan to get when i get paid this week. I am a advocate for petstores like PetsMart and PetCo, but yet, I cant swallow their high prices on some items... I do get grooming supplies there, and the larger boxed Puppy Milk Bone Treats there and of course some toys*but i go to a dollar store for those often, and WalMart carries her favorite Stuffed Squeeky toys. lol*

I sepcifically need puppy food for a large breed as she'll be between 60 and 120 pounds(60-80 on sires weight, 100-120 for bee with itches weight). She's small so we are hoping she's 60pounds at full growth, but she's only 3 to 4 months(maybe 4months now) and she's only 30 pounds.


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## Goldens&Labs4Me (Jan 18, 2012)

wildfire_1982 said:


> I got a food savvy vet... She recommended to stay away from Diamond as its like Purina and Ol' Roy. Junk food basicaly. She did not pressure or push Science Diet or Iams... Just recommended me to find a Large breed formula for puppy.
> 
> I have found that i can not leave food laying around. lol. she is learning the "down" command and is a stubborn little*not really at 30 pounds* thing. lol. I have a local tractor supply co near me... also have petsmart, petco, 'n 2 others. the 2 others do sell puppies from local breeders. and no i dont buy anything from them, once i found that out. i dont even take her(puppy) to one of those 2's doggy daycare/playgroups.
> 
> ...


Funny...she says to stay away from Diamond--but recommends the Chicken Soup; And stay away from Purina, but recommends Pro Plan. 

And if I'm not mistaken, I *believe* 4Health is made by Diamond as well.

Chicken Soup is 4 Star--Pro plan is 3 star--4 health is 4 star...so not all of the foods "she recommends" are 5 star either. Nor are they the most expensive.

Not saying that all of her recommendations are bad ones--but a lot of conflicting info in what she is telling you--or maybe there was a misunderstanding.


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## PatchworkRobot (Aug 24, 2010)

I find it interesting that she says to stay away from TOTW but not 4Health. To my understanding they're both Diamond foods, not to mention that 4Health is lower in quality than TOTW.

I'm with Goldens&Labs, she made some good recommendations but she also did give some conflicting information.


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## trainingjunkie (Feb 10, 2010)

If it's just about weight gain and money is an issue, really low quality hamburger made into meatballs can put on a bunch of weight. Satin Balls recipe. If you google it, you can find the recipe. Freeze and use as needed.

There is no subsitute for good dog food, but if you want to help a thin dog gain, adding this can help. Helps give you a glossy coat too.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

I think there was a mis-understanding on my part, as I called her today to refresh my memory on brands to try and brands to stay away from((Sasha has enough for 2 days of food left, lol))... And she told me to stay away from ProPlan. Diamond and Diamond Natural is best bang for the buck if budget is issue, Doesn't recommend TOTW due to her personal experience with it(but she said to not use her experience against the brand)... She also said i could try 4Health. Just to stay away from Pedigree, Purina Brand, Ol' Roy, Kibbles 'n Bits, 'n such brands... She did say if i could go for these brands, to buy them::: Timberwolf Wild & Natural ; EVO ; Blue Buffalo Wilderness. She did say to go for a brand that offers large breed puppy food IF possible. 

Sasha has excellent coat/skin condition. Thick, Lusterous, Glossy/Shiney, Healthy, No Dander, No Flakes.

Is going, Grain-Free better for a growing puppy? Whats the benefits of going Grain Free?? Is there more meat content if less grains to fill? Reason why I ask is cause my boyfriend's dog has to have a Grain Free Food(due to having a hard time digesting grain's) and we are planning to be moving in together in a few months. He has a older puppy(12-18months old), but of a smaller breed(cairn/yorkie mix --- i believe).


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

I would say grain free is better for just about every dog, puppy or adult. With grain free you get more meat because the protein sources are the meat, not corn or soy. 

BTW Small breeds develop faster than large breeds. At 1-1.5 years old I wouldn't consider that a puppy for a small terrier. He/she should be on an adult or an all life stages food if he/she isn't already.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

oh. he has frappy on a all stages dog food thats grain free. I just call him a puppy cause of his size and he acts like a puppy still. lol. 

I ended up buying this:::

Eukanuba Naturally Wild Venison & Potato Large Breed Adult Dry Dog Food

I was assured by the vet(i called 'n consulted with the vet b4 buying) that even tho it says "adult" that its okay to feed it to her as its for a large breed. 

I paid $55 for a 30 pound bag. and before on the puppy chow, she'd gobble up the 2 cups i'd put out for her within an hr. She hasn't even touched half a cup yet and its been 1 hr since it was put down. and i was away at work for 7 hrs 'n she didn't have access to food/water during that time... i do the no access to both as i dont have a kennel as of yet and i put her into my master bedroom. tried the bathroom and that didn't work out very well after the first week*she out grew that space as it isnt a big room to begin with*.


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

Eukanuba is pretty terrible primarily grain-based food. I just checked the ingredients of it and it has a lot of things in it you want to avoid like mostly grains, beet pulp, unspecified natural flavors, and sodium hexa-something, which is a MAN-MADE polymer used in soap and detergents (definitely do NOT want to feed that to any living being). 

I would find a high-quality food as soon as you can. Have you checked dogfoodadvisor.com? Pick a food at least 4 stars and try to avoid any red flag ingredients. Vets are NOT nutritionists and usually receive little to no training on food. That is why you typically see foods like Science Diet, Hills, or Royal Canin in vets (all not very good foods).

*I would not leave a dog without water for that long.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

OOOppps sorry... its New Zealand Vension and Potato ... Grain Free. I entered in the wrong type. Eukanuba - Naturally Wild .... but it is Grain Free... That was my mistake earlier post...

it may not be 4 or 5 stars. but it is 3 stars and thats pretty good. as i can not afford the 4 or 5 stars in the 20-30 pound bags. I did some checking and those are just over my price point. 

my boyfriends dog, Frappy. he is on this food(but not for large breed) and is doing great on it. Healthy, No dander, Has glossy/shiny fur, epitomie of health. Good Teeth, Clean teeth, "good" doggy breath. Nothing wrong with his insides. We see the same vet. 

She has several dogs herself. both large and small breeds... She has not once pushed Science Diet, Iams, or any other brand like that at us, hasn't pressured us to buy it. Gave us advice, her opinion*her own personal opinion on dog food due to being a dog owner herself*, and told us what types/brands to stay away from*again from her own personal opinion and from nutriental value*. She does read up on dog 'n cat food ingredients and new types of dog/cat foods, and the re-vised older foods... She isn't a common vet. We pay a little extra for her, but in our eyes, her own personal experience with both larger and smaller breeds as a dog owner, is worth it.

And we each have quizzed her to determine if she does know what she talking about on dog foods. and she answered the questions right.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

Nutro? Eukanuba Venison and Potato isn't grain free, it contains sorghum and barley. Both foods are very low in protein for a healthy dog. 

I would contact either company to see what the calcium % is in that food, it isn't listed on either website. Large breed pups need to grow slowly which means the bones need to grow slowly and bones grow faster if they get lots of calcium which means a calcium % of about 1.2 is better than one of 1.5 or more.


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## Goldens&Labs4Me (Jan 18, 2012)

wildfire_1982 said:


> OOOppps sorry... its New Zealand Vension and Potato ... Grain Free. I entered in the wrong type. Eukanuba - Naturally Wild .... but it is Grain Free... That was my mistake earlier post...
> 
> it may not be 4 or 5 stars. but it is 3 stars and thats pretty good. as i can not afford the 4 or 5 stars in the 20-30 pound bags. I did some checking and those are just over my price point.
> 
> ...


If you look a little more--I think you'll find you're paying*more* for the Eukanuba Naturally Wild than you would for a 4 or even 5 star food. And it's not grain free. 

TOTW is around $50 for 30 lbs, 4 Health is around $35 for 30 lbs, Chicken Soup is around $40 for 35 lbs and Diamond Naturals is around $35 for 40 lbs...so there are 4 options that are 4 or 5 stars for less, with a lot less "junk". 

But, hey--if you're happy and your dog is happy, that is what matters. I just hate to see people paying good money for mediocre dog food.  

And I wouldn't leave my dogs without water for 7 hours either....food fine, but I believe in free access to fresh clean water, personally.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

Yes well.. Here is the thing.. My boyfriends dog is on this exact same food. And he is doing just fine, perfectly happy, healthy, nothing wrong with him. He cant have anything to do with grains and he is eating this food. I've done my research and so did he before he put frappy on this food. Its agreeing with Sasha and with Frappy. 

Sasha before was having alot of #2's, and alot of it was runny...... Well since I bought this food yesterday, She has had firmer solid #2s. Not runny and doesn't have a ton for me to pickup. So i'm gunna stick with this unless something medical happens that causes her to have a diet change. 

As yes, those others might be cheaper, but I couldn't find them Grain Free in this larger size packaging that i need, in my area. And I refuse to buy 2 smaller packages and pay well over that quoted price that was posted on here. When you have limited supply to choose from, you cant be choosey. And i may live in the city, but I dont have alot of dog food suppliers to pick from..

WalMart, Shopko, Kmart, Target, PetsMart, Petco, 2 puppy mill sellers, Tractor's Supply Co and some speciality store way up north thats a 45 minute drive 1 way just to get to. I refuse to buy from WalMart, ShopKo, Target and KMart as they dont have a good selection of dog food and over-price them. PetsMart is expensive and so is PetCo, Tractor SupplyCo is okay but again, they dont have a large selection of dog food here to pick from... I have a value card for both PetsMart and PetCo. But they are expensive places. And again, I refuse to buy from pet stores who sell puppy mill puppies. And I cant afford to buy online due to cost of purchase PLUS cost of shipping.


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## PatchworkRobot (Aug 24, 2010)

TOTW is $46ish at the Tractor Supply Company and it is better than Eukanuba. 

Other good foods (4 - 6 stars) that you can get for less than $55...
Blue Wilderness and Innova at Petsmart - 54.99
Wellness at Petsmart for $50.99
Blue Wilderness at Tractor Supply Co for $49.99
4Health at Tractor Supply for $29.99 and $34.99

*prices quoted are for bags ranging from 24lb to 35lb depending on the largest size available

You make the issue known quite often that you don't want to/cannot spend a lot so I don't understand your sticking with something more expensive from a sh*tty company. Your call though.
Unless your dog has a grain intolerance you can feed food with grains. There are grains that are better than corn and wheat such as rice and barley. That being said, some of the foods I mentioned are grain free, if I remember right.


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## marsha=whitie (Dec 29, 2008)

If you can find it at Wal-Mart, or your local grocery store, DON'T BUY IT.

Also, I would try to stay away from corn. Ideally, you want at least the first couple of ingredients to be meat based. TOTW is a pretty good food for the price: I feed it to my cats, and they're doing fantastically (Bryna is raw-fed.)

If you want to feed a decent food on a budget, you should really look in to 4Health, or some of the other brands that PatchworkRobot mentioned. Bryna did pretty well on Blue Buffalo when she was on kibble, and she has some food allergies. Good luck!


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## InkedMarie (Mar 11, 2009)

I need to go get ready for work but i am pretty sure that Eukanuba Venison & potato is NOT grainfree...then you said "My boyfriends dog is on this exact same food. And he is doing just fine, perfectly happy, healthy, nothing wrong with him. He cant have anything to do with grains and he is eating this food.".....If he's eating that, then he CAN have grains apparently. 
For that kind of money, you can buy an actual higher quality food and have money left over, same size bag, too.


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## Goldens&Labs4Me (Jan 18, 2012)

wildfire_1982 said:


> Yes well.. Here is the thing.. My boyfriends dog is on this exact same food. And he is doing just fine, perfectly happy, healthy, nothing wrong with him. He cant have anything to do with grains and he is eating this food. I've done my research and so did he before he put frappy on this food. Its agreeing with Sasha and with Frappy.
> 
> Sasha before was having alot of #2's, and alot of it was runny...... Well since I bought this food yesterday, She has had firmer solid #2s. Not runny and doesn't have a ton for me to pickup. So i'm gunna stick with this unless something medical happens that causes her to have a diet change.
> 
> ...


To each their own. You asked for the *best* puppy food at a reasonable price and we've given you some info to help. 

If the dogs are doing fine on the Eukanuba, then great. But you have stated repeatedly that your BFs dog cannot have grain, yet he is eating a grain inclusive food. If he truly cannot eat grain, you will see the ill affects of the Eukanuba, sooner rather than later.

I don't think anyone has recommended any dog food that you can get at Walmart or Target and I do agree that there is no food worth buying at either of those stores. Nor would I support a puppy mill supporting pet store.


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## InkedMarie (Mar 11, 2009)

Exactly! I don't think they know what grains are, to be honest. She says she can't afford to buy online yet there are places that offer free shipping, with the cost of the food NOT jacked up, such as Pet Flow. Her choice, I feel like she doesn't want to listen.


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## Goldens&Labs4Me (Jan 18, 2012)

InkedMarie said:


> Exactly! I don't think they know what grains are, to be honest. She says she can't afford to buy online yet there are places that offer free shipping, with the cost of the food NOT jacked up, such as Pet Flow. Her choice, I feel like she doesn't want to listen.


I agree. She asked, but it appears she is arguing her point. Her dogs, her choice--but she also has a lot of conflicting information, so I hope she truly understands. And I also understand price being a factor, but she is paying more for mediocre dog food (at best) when she could get much better cheaper and locally, without even worrying about shipping and truly "grain free".


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

I've checked every Tractor Supply I've driven by (LOL, pathetic I know ) and they've all had TOTW, Diamond Naturals, Blue, and 4Health. Even the TSCs in the dinkiest towns (but check the expiration date on the pricier foods. . .sometimes they don't sell as fast). So I think it's a corporate policy to have those foods everywhere. Check out your TSC! I love that store.

Anyway, these are the top ingredients of Eukanuba Naturally Wild New Zealand Venison and Potato formula (right from their website):
Ingredients: Venison, Potato, Ground Whole Grain Sorghum, Brewers Rice, Ground Whole Grain Barley, Chicken Meal, Fish Meal, Dried Egg Product, Chicken Fat 

It's not terrible, but it's not great either. It has a lot of grains---sorghum, rice, and barley are all grains---and not a lot of total meat content. If your dog does well on it, terrific, but that's a pricey food for a large dog, IMO. You could find a lot of great foods for a lower price.


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

Keep in mind that just because a dog seems healthy now doesn't mean he won't suffer the negative effects of bad food later on. I highly suggest you switch dog foods because if Frappy needs grain free he is most likely not going to be very healthy and could get sick. The food you mentioned is not grain free, it says right on their website "includes barley and rice" and their ingredients list says it also has sorghum. Barley, rice, and sorghum are all grains. One thing to think about is that once this food is processed, all the water in the venison goes away. This means that potato is actually the number one ingredient (ingredients are in order from highest weight to lowest, and are weighed before processing. This food has little meat or good protein. I think animals with any kind of sensitivity should especially be on high quality diets like the others have mentioned. Most animals and humans seem fine eating bad food like low quality kibble or fast food, but if you look at the facts you can see you get what you pay for. That is why there has been a rise in peridontal (sp?) disease, diabetes, cancer, etc in cats and dogs in the last 20 years or so because of companies promoting low quality dog food that has grains, unknown meat sources, and a history of recalls. While there are good diets like high quality kibble/canned and raw, those have only really become more "mainstream" in the last few years so most people are still feeding low quality foods like Eukanuba, Iams, Purina, Science Diet, etc. Every person and animal is healthy until they get sick. Seems like a really obvious statement but it is something to think about. 

You brought up not wanting to spend more money, but you don't have to. There are many high quality foods out there that are cheaper than what you are buying right now. Also, like others have said, some online stores have free shipping. Even if you have to pay the shipping cost, you still may end up spending less than what you are spending right now if you find a place that ships for less than 10 dollars. You will also save a lot of money down the road on vet bills. I would rather spend 10-30 extra dollars a month than spend hundreds down the road on vet bills.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

Welp. My boyfriend and i sat down, tried setting up budget 'n all that. and discovered that we dont have alot in common on what we think of as requirements for a place.. then we discovered we are only good friends and nothing more(so we arent together in that aspect but are good friends still. At least we found out now vs later when signed into a 12mo lease). So Yes, I plan to change her food yet again to a less pricey food. I get paid later this week and plan to do the change over then since there will be no need for her to be on teh same food as his dog's on. I plan to sell this food as I still have about 20 to 25 pounds left(30 pound bag). Even tho there is no bag.. which is a pit/downfall. May just put it into a trashbag, and give it to somebody who needs dog food for their dogs but cant afford it so it wont go to waste. Waste Not - Want Not. 
I have made a trip to the local TSC, however, alot of their priceyier(sp? -- lol) foods are close to EXP date and Its taken her awhile to go through even 5 pounds of this food. Looks like i can buy a huge bag and it'll last a month or two. So i can swallow the $$ aspect if i just remember, she wont be going through it as fast as she did Puppy Chow and it'll last longer. 

((Example, If it costs $30 then its $1 a pound on cost wise and if she goes through 5 pounds in about a 2 week period, well you can finish doing the math, lol))... But i have done more research.. and I do want Grain Free, All Natural, Majority Meat Diet with some veggies Diet for her.. Like found in the wild for wolves(and dog stomach's aren't that much evolved from the wolf stomach it appears).


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## Louisexx (Aug 3, 2011)

Don't buy commercial dog food. Your dog is large breed, medium breed, or small breed?
I love blue buffalo, Orijen, Acana, and Wellness.


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

Louisexx said:


> Don't buy commercial dog food. Your dog is large breed, medium breed, or small breed?
> I love blue buffalo, Orijen, Acana, and Wellness.


 Those brands are commercial dog food, too . I suppose you mean foods available in grocery stores?

Anyway, Sasha's going to be a big dog, and will eventually go though a large bag faster. 4 cups of kibble equals a pound (roughly) so if she eats that much (about right for her probable adult size) you can count on using a 30-pound bag every month.


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## Louisexx (Aug 3, 2011)

Willowy said:


> Those brands are commercial dog food, too . I suppose you mean foods available in grocery stores?
> 
> Anyway, Sasha's going to be a big dog, and will eventually go though a large bag faster. 4 cups of kibble equals a pound (roughly) so if she eats that much (about right for her probable adult size) you can count on using a 30-pound bag every month.


These are not commercial dog food, I believe they are natural dog food
I never went to grocery stores, I got all the dog foods from online, or pet boutique
My alaskan malamute's weight is 90 pounds, but he can't finish 30-pounds bag food every month..


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

"Commercial" food means it's sold ready-made as dog food. The opposite of commercial food is homemade food that you buy the ingredients for and make yourself. Like the difference between commercial raw food and prey-model or BARF raw food. But no matter really--just pointing out that might confuse somebody.

Sled breeds tend to be easy keepers and need less food. A Golden/Pyr mix will probably need more than a Malamute of similar size. Of course it is dependent on the individual dog's needs. But for a basic rule of thumb, I estimate a large bag per month for a large dogs.


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## Louisexx (Aug 3, 2011)

Willowy said:


> "Commercial" food means it's sold ready-made as dog food. The opposite of commercial food is homemade food that you buy the ingredients for and make yourself. Like the difference between commercial raw food and prey-model or BARF raw food. But no matter really--just pointing out that might confuse somebody.
> 
> Sled breeds tend to be easy keepers and need less food. A Golden/Pyr mix will probably need more than a Malamute of similar size. Of course it is dependent on the individual dog's needs. But for a basic rule of thumb, I estimate a large bag per month for a large dogs.


Oh...I got what you talk about. I talk about the dry food, and you talk about the homemade dog food.

Thread starter didn't clearify she ask about dry food or homemade dog food. Homemade takes long time, and you have to know how to do well on collocation of ingredient. 
But depends on other people's discussion, I think they talk about the dry dog food, which are commercial.


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

Commercial dog foods can be canned food, dry food, and even raw food. For example the brand Vital Essentials is a healthy and natural raw food but it is still commercial.

All dry kibbles are commercial, but not all commercial foods are dry kibbles.


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

LilasMom said:


> Commercial dog foods can be canned food, dry food, and even raw food. For example the brand Vital Essentials is a healthy and natural raw food but it is still commercial.
> 
> All dry kibbles are commercial, but not all commercial foods are dry kibbles.


 Yes, this is what I meant. I only used the commercial raw as an example. All dry kibbles are "commercial" because they're sold as ready-made dog food. Even natural kibble .


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## Louisexx (Aug 3, 2011)

Sorry I got misunderstand. Because I define the dog foods are commercial or not with their ingredients, not with the way they are.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

I thought of home-made raw diet, but with having an very young toddler (who loves to get into her food dish, lol), i decided against it as an option. I also free feed while HOME. She's gunna be a Large/XL breed depending who she takes after. She see's vet on monday for another checkup, heartguard, and shots then to schedule spay. Vet says 7 to 9 months to allow her time to fully grow... i say sooner as I do NOT want a dog in heat!!!! Once your dog reaches 6mo and not spayed/fixed, your unable to go to the doggy parks until it is fixed. And thats her main course of exercise besides the walks. 

But back to the doogy food debate going on..... I am going to go to the local TSC and write down their brands they have 'n diff types, and go to that website 'n look. But i want grain free, as close to the natural diet of a wild dog/wolf as possible, and to be able to keep her on it for rest of her life. 

wet would be too expensive if i go with it... cause wouldn't she need a big can per meal? and if she eats twice a day, thats 2 big cans, and they can cost up to 5 dollars a can.. thats 10 dollars per day ((high estimate))..... thats around roughly 300$ a month. I can not afford that. 

I want the best for her, so I'm looking for the type of food that will be th closest to what she would eat if she was a wild dog/wolf(since her digestive track is the same)... Any suggestions?? besides raw meat lol.


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## Goldens&Labs4Me (Jan 18, 2012)

Taste of the Wild. Around $50 for a 30 lb bag--grain free.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

You can cook for your pup but that is pretty intimating to do. I would be confident enough to do so but it is a lot of work to figure out a proper diet.

You don't have to feed all canned food, just mix in whatever amount works for your budget into kibble. Or you can ease your way into cooking by cooking a kibble topper of meat, liver, fish, egg and possibly dairy and mix that into the kibble. Just be sure to substitute the topper calories for the kibble calories or your pup will gain too much weight or have an upset digestive tract - one end or the other.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

kathyy: is that a diet that is found in the wild naturally? i want to do that route for sasha. an All natural found in wild diet . she LOVES chicken and ground beef. 

I did see on an OLD OLD OLD episode of Animal Planets show: Its Me OR The Dog .... About a brittish family that was going bankrupt from feeding their Great Dane Mixes.. She had them feed the dogs 1 can of wet with some Pasta(each dog that is, lol). I honestly dont want to do Wet food route. 

Golden: Where can i find that? The Grain Free Taste of the Wild ???????


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## InkedMarie (Mar 11, 2009)

You'd better do alot of research before deciding to home cook. You're free feeding now, which I personally don't like but you can't do that with free feeding. If you're looking at Tractor supply and wnt grain free, TOTW is your best bet there. Might be the only grain free they have, maybe Blue Buffalo.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

im doing free feed right now to put weight on her. once she is at a stable weight 'n past the growing puppy pains, she'll be put onto a regulated timely schedule.((and once i get a regular full time job vs this part time all hours job it'll be much better))


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## Goldens&Labs4Me (Jan 18, 2012)

Taste of the Wild is at Tractor Supply--and not sure if you have one, but I can find it at my local Pet Supplies Plus also. 

You can check out their website and do a dealer search for your area. They have canned food as well--runs around $2.00 a can here. But I only give my guys a big spoonful on top of their kibble, so it doesn't cost me and arm and a leg to do both. The majority of their diet is kibble with a little bit of canned or yogurt on top.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

i'll look online at TSC and see if they have the grain free one.... and she's only 4months so i want an all stages life one.


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## JulieK1967 (May 29, 2011)

wildfire_1982 said:


> I thought of home-made raw diet, but with having an very young toddler (who loves to get into her food dish, lol), i decided against it as an option. I also free feed while HOME. She's gunna be a Large/XL breed depending who she takes after. She see's vet on monday for another checkup, heartguard, and shots then to schedule spay. Vet says 7 to 9 months to allow her time to fully grow... i say sooner as I do NOT want a dog in heat!!!! Once your dog reaches 6mo and not spayed/fixed, your unable to go to the doggy parks until it is fixed. And thats her main course of exercise besides the walks.
> 
> But back to the doogy food debate going on..... I am going to go to the local TSC and write down their brands they have 'n diff types, and go to that website 'n look. But i want grain free, as close to the natural diet of a wild dog/wolf as possible, and to be able to keep her on it for rest of her life.
> 
> ...


Go raw!! It is the absolute best for your dog!! It doesn't have to be more expensive. Do some research in your area for raw feeding groups. Experienced raw feeders are wonderful at suggesting inexpensive sources of meats for your dog. I went raw with my pup about 2 months ago & I'd never feed kibble to her again. She absolutely loves it and she's thriving.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

thats fine. I have a inquisitive young toddler who loves to get into sasha's food bowl(and yes she does get picked up 'n carried away with a firm "NO!", but she ALWAYS heads straight back to it). So that has to be out of the question a "no" for me at the current moment. Trying to find a diet that is like raw without the risk of poisoning my toddler at the same time. ((and yes there have been times when i wasn't fast enough and she actually DID put dry kibble in her mouth*which got removed before any harm could be done but still!))


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## JulieK1967 (May 29, 2011)

wildfire_1982 said:


> thats fine. I have a inquisitive young toddler who loves to get into sasha's food bowl(and yes she does get picked up 'n carried away with a firm "NO!", but she ALWAYS heads straight back to it). So that has to be out of the question a "no" for me at the current moment. Trying to find a diet that is like raw without the risk of poisoning my toddler at the same time. ((and yes there have been times when i wasn't fast enough and she actually DID put dry kibble in her mouth*which got removed before any harm could be done but still!))


Obviously, you want to keep your little one safe but lots and lots of people with toddlers feed raw and keep their kids safe. Raw diets aren't free fed so there won't be a bowl of raw meat sitting around to tempt your baby. My girl eats her portion in about 3-5 minutes and she has been trained to stay on her towel in the kitchen the whole time. Some raw feeders with little ones wipe down their dog's muzzle after eating so that doggie kisses are safe. I've not heard of anyone's child being injured by the fact that the family dog is raw fed and that question comes up a lot in the raw group I'm in. There are a few good stickies in this forum on raw feeding and the Yahoo Raw Feeding group is also awesome.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

thats fine. here's the oher problem. I can not put her on a regulated schedule at the moment. I work odd ball hours. Every day is different hours and no 2 days are the same. Problem with working in fast food where hours arent dependable to stay the same. some days i work lunch, others i work supper, others i work closing, others i work lunch and supper. and no 2 days are the same hours. that is why i need to do the dry kibble, free feeding(when i am home only obiviously due to potty training issues that should be resolved as soon as i get a kennel on thursday from a friend).

Like right now. She cried wolf 5 times on needing to go potty... I dont know if she needs to go or not.. but i'm not letting her leave my eye-sight because of this. I'm getting fed up with this cry wolf bit with her.... She acts like she needs to go potty, so i take her out on the balcony, where she just sits 'n lays down. and this happens repeatedly tonight for the past 5 times. this time, she acts like she needs to go, but she isn't doing the " I NEED TO GO NOW " action so i'm making her wait. To make sure cause once she is out this last time she is done on going out until 7-730am when we wake up. **example, she is laying down infront of the baloncy door right now but yet does the whinning at times, so i dont really believe her on the "i need to potty", thanks to the past 5 times. **

but back to the diet.... Again, I prefere the dry kibble route until I am able to get a regular full time, steady hours, same hours every day each day. This way i dont have to worry about scheduling, or budget on raw feeding(most say its not expensive but when you make minimum wage at roughly 25 hrs a week and are a single parent of 2 special needs kids it makes it hard on the budget). I can afford $50 and that is my high ceiling price and thats only if i take out a few of my own luxery items each month, for dry kibble diet. Unless somebody can specifically tell me how much it will cost per month per type of raw diet, and what to buy exactly, and how much to buy, and how much it costs a month to do that vs the dry kibble... But just saying those things without actually backing them up with showing me facts, isn't going to help sway me from my dry kibble decision. and i dont have the time to go hunting down threads for raw diet feeding then having to wade through all that info...


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## Willowy (Dec 10, 2007)

Well, the prices on raw meat are highly variable depending on your area and the stores you go to, so it's not really possible to make a reliable price estimate. I know a lot of people can do it quite inexpensively but this usually involves knowing hunters and joining a co-op. For a large dog, yes, I think it usually does cost more than a mid-priced kibble. . .maybe cheaper than something like Orijen, though. Seems to take a lot of time and organization, too. That's the main reason it's not an option for me right now.

And kibbles frequently have salmonella on them, too, so babies playing with/eating kibble aren't any safer then if it was raw meat.

I think TOTW is a good food. I don't think any dog should be kept on one food for her entire life; I think rotating brands/proteins is a good idea. If you don't want to do more, rotating between the TOTW flavors would be OK, but I like to get another brand in there because every brand has a different vitamin/mineral mix they use, and I think the variety is healthier. But no kibble is a "natural" diet for dogs and is nothing like what a wolf would eat. If you really want to feed a "wolf diet", you'd have to go raw. I'm not saying that I think kibbles are bad or raw is all that, but that is what wolves eat .

TSC should have all the TOTW flavors. I'm pretty sure it's the only grain-free food they have, except maybe the Nutro grain-free (which is exorbitantly priced and I'm not impressed with the ingredients). And maybe Blue Wilderness at some TSCs. But TOTW is the best you're going to get in that price range. They have puppy food and all-life-stages food. I don't think it would really matter which one you choose. My dogs like High Prairie best. . .it smells like hamburgers .


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## JulieK1967 (May 29, 2011)

wildfire_1982 said:


> thats fine. here's the oher problem. I can not put her on a regulated schedule at the moment. I work odd ball hours. Every day is different hours and no 2 days are the same. Problem with working in fast food where hours arent dependable to stay the same. some days i work lunch, others i work supper, others i work closing, others i work lunch and supper. and no 2 days are the same hours. that is why i need to do the dry kibble, free feeding(when i am home only obiviously due to potty training issues that should be resolved as soon as i get a kennel on thursday from a friend).
> 
> Like right now. She cried wolf 5 times on needing to go potty... I dont know if she needs to go or not.. but i'm not letting her leave my eye-sight because of this. I'm getting fed up with this cry wolf bit with her.... She acts like she needs to go potty, so i take her out on the balcony, where she just sits 'n lays down. and this happens repeatedly tonight for the past 5 times. this time, she acts like she needs to go, but she isn't doing the " I NEED TO GO NOW " action so i'm making her wait. To make sure cause once she is out this last time she is done on going out until 7-730am when we wake up. **example, she is laying down infront of the baloncy door right now but yet does the whinning at times, so i dont really believe her on the "i need to potty", thanks to the past 5 times. **
> 
> but back to the diet.... Again, I prefere the dry kibble route until I am able to get a regular full time, steady hours, same hours every day each day. This way i dont have to worry about scheduling, or budget on raw feeding(most say its not expensive but when you make minimum wage at roughly 25 hrs a week and are a single parent of 2 special needs kids it makes it hard on the budget). I can afford $50 and that is my high ceiling price and thats only if i take out a few of my own luxery items each month, for dry kibble diet. Unless somebody can specifically tell me how much it will cost per month per type of raw diet, and what to buy exactly, and how much to buy, and how much it costs a month to do that vs the dry kibble... But just saying those things without actually backing them up with showing me facts, isn't going to help sway me from my dry kibble decision. and i dont have the time to go hunting down threads for raw diet feeding then having to wade through all that info...


Well, I don't have time to do your research for you nor am I trying to sway you to anything. You asked what the best food was and I told you & I provided suggestions for sources. The rest is up to you.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

first off. i would like to apologize for any irration/attitude i displayed last night on this thread. i was frustrated cause i kept getting told to go to raw but yet nobody would give me any specific's or help on which threads would be the better ones to go to, or even websites to check out for it. I googled "raw diet for dogs" and you wont believe how many search results came back and at least 3/4 of them not even related to what i was looking for. Which is the cause of the frustration, irration(sp?) and attitude.


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## kathylcsw (Jul 4, 2011)

Tractor Supply sells 4Health canned food for about $1 for a large can. I used a tablespoon or so as a topper for my puppy. I would freeze most of the can and just leave a day or so thawed to add to her food. It is a cheap way to stretch kibble and add more protein and moisture to the dogs's diet.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

Willowy. Thank You. I appreciate that. Yah. I dont live in the remote wilderness where I can just go shoot down a moose or elk or deer or any other wild game(with permit of course) or where its plentiful so its cheaper to buy it from companies who do that sort of thing.... I wish i did live in that remote wilderness though. lol. ground round is 4 bucks a pound here to give you an idea ..... and its much more expensive at the meat store near-by(specializes in meat processing, selling, cetra).

TOTW, high prarrie?? okay....


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## Goldens&Labs4Me (Jan 18, 2012)

wildfire_1982 said:


> first off. i would like to apologize for any irration/attitude i displayed last night on this thread. i was frustrated cause i kept getting told to go to raw but yet nobody would give me any specific's or help on which threads would be the better ones to go to, or even websites to check out for it. I googled "raw diet for dogs" and you wont believe how many search results came back and at least 3/4 of them not even related to what i was looking for. Which is the cause of the frustration, irration(sp?) and attitude.


Raw isn't for everyone--it's not for me. I do believe it's an excellent way to feed dogs and don't dispute that, but I do not believe it's always feasible. At this point in our lives, I believe *I* would do more harm than good in trying to go raw. 

With that said, there are a lot of awesome kibbles out there. I do believe that in you wanting grain free--at a reasonable price--the TOTW is the way to go and you're not going to find a more economical priced food that is grain free. 

Honestly, there comes a point where you pick something and go with it. You can drive yourself crazy with all the researching after you've dug in.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

oh. i know its frustrating. I just want the best for her and to have my research done for in case the vet asks me questions about her diet. Raw isnt a viable option for me either as its too costly here for fresh meat. ((in the city)). If i lived out in the remote wildnerness where wild game is more plentiful and where i could just go out and hunt it down myself or buy off a friend/family who did, it'd be better(after research on how to properly feed her of course). I dont really want to do wet/canned diet(even as topper) as that could get expensive*as in she could prefere that over dry and not eat dry*. But i'll go to TSC's website(was way too tired last night after everything else i had to do, i got 5 balls to juggle) now and do some price comparing.


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

wildfire_1982 said:


> oh. i know its frustrating. I just want the best for her and to have my research done for in case the vet asks me questions about her diet. Raw isnt a viable option for me either as its too costly here for fresh meat. ((in the city)). If i lived out in the remote wildnerness where wild game is more plentiful and where i could just go out and hunt it down myself or buy off a friend/family who did, it'd be better(after research on how to properly feed her of course). I dont really want to do wet/canned diet(even as topper) as that could get expensive*as in she could prefere that over dry and not eat dry*. But i'll go to TSC's website(was way too tired last night after everything else i had to do, i got 5 balls to juggle) now and do some price comparing.



If you don't mind me asking, around where do you live? You don't have to say the city, just the general area. I could check and see if there are any groups or coops in your area that have great sources of meat. I just joined a coop where I live where I can get stuff for around 25 cents a lb and everything was under 1 to 3 dollars a pound. There might be something similar where you live. I am actually now paying less then I did on their premium kibbles. 

But like some people said, there are some really great kibbles like TOTW out there and if you can't do raw then just aim for very high quality dry food with canned. Some people believe that because in the wild carnivores get most of their moisture from their food they don't drink as much water as they need on an all dry diet, and can end up being chronically dehydrated. That is 100% about cats, and I don't doubt that in some way it is true about dogs as well, that is why I suggested dry and canned.

BTW, I wouldn't put too much consideration into a vet's nutritional advice. For the most part, their views and information are pretty out dated.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

Dry kibble with wet... okay... i just dont like wet cause it does harden up really fast when set out... and i dont know how much she eats.... so i wonder if i should do quarter can then keep doing that until she stops eating ??????? I've given canned/wet food before to prior pets.. and hated it that it would harden up 'n get crusty after awhile.


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

wildfire_1982 said:


> Dry kibble with wet... okay... i just dont like wet cause it does harden up really fast when set out... and i dont know how much she eats.... so i wonder if i should do quarter can then keep doing that until she stops eating ??????? I've given canned/wet food before to prior pets.. and hated it that it would harden up 'n get crusty after awhile.


Well you aren't really supposed to leave out wet for more than 20 minutes, is there any way you can the wet portion by itself and then leave just the dry out for free feeding?


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

it was 15min when i noticed it getting crusty/hard on top. and o well........


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

I think if it is a little harder on top that is fine. Also, it the wet food is spread put rather than in a single chunk it will dry out faster. I wouldn't worry too much about the hardness, just don't leave it out for a long time.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

yah. She gets weighed at vets on Monday, but last weigh-in she was 38ish on weight. 

How much wet should she be given? I have decided to keep her on the same food she is on, UNTIL it is gone THEN buy new food so i dont waste this, nobody wanted this food since i dont have the original packaging for it.


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

wildfire_1982 said:


> yah. She gets weighed at vets on Monday, but last weigh-in she was 38ish on weight.
> 
> How much wet should she be given? I have decided to keep her on the same food she is on, UNTIL it is gone THEN buy new food so i dont waste this, nobody wanted this food since i dont have the original packaging for it.


You should buy the new food now since you need the old food to transition her over a 7-10 day period. It should say on the can how much wet to give. Some brands even give you the amount needed if you are using it alongside dry food.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

gunna buy 4Health wet/canned .... found a couple that dont contain grain/glutten .... maybe buy it in dry if i can find either of these in dry as well in bigger bags.

4Health beef & vegetable stew
4Health chicken & vegetable stew


they are .99cents for a large can.

She has between 15 and 20 pounds of the eukanbia naturally wild left.


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## marsha=whitie (Dec 29, 2008)

You're probably going to stick with Kibble/canned, but I just wanted to share what works for me.

My dogs are raw fed. Callie (right dog in sig) is currently living with my parents because my apartment only allows 1 dog, so Bryna is with me. I'll tell you about how I do Bryna's meals, 'cause she's a typical eat-anything dog.

Her main meat is chicken, which around here is pretty cheap. I feed her chicken quarters, which I can get a 10lbs bag for $5.90 at Walmart. As far as red meats, I get scraps from a local butcher for $.69/lbs. Chicken liver is incredibly cheap here, too. Also, if something is on sale I make sure to stock up! Sometimes I splurge and buy her some pork ribs, but its usually just he chicken and scraps. 

For ease, I prepackage meals and store them in the freezer. That way, if I'm not home, my SO can just take one of the packages and throw it in her bowl. If you're dog doesn't like frozen meats, you could throw a couple of your prepackaged meals in the fridge and rotate accordingly. That is what my mother does for Callie. She has 3 meals in the fridge at all times. When she pulls one from the fridge, she replaces it with a frozen one. 

My son is a 9 month old crawler, and he gets into everything. Because of this, Bryna is fed when he goes to bed. Since you have a puppy, feed him before your son wakes up, when he naps, and when he goes to bed. If you're not home to do so, just have someone else feed him: that is where the prepackaged meals come in handy.

If you're interested, check out Raw Fed Dogs. It explains Prey Model Raw. If you have anymore questions, feel free to PM me or other members here, and we can direct you to more sources.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

thanks marsha!!! i appreciate it!! yah i can get chicken liver,hearts/gizzards here really cheap, and they are having chicken legs/thighs on sale for under a buck a pound when buying the bigger packages. when its the end of the month, the stew meat 'n other meat that hasn't sold, gets pre-packaged and thrown in the meats' dept clearance area (by the ground round but sep).... and i can find meat that is still good for a day or two(if thawed, or frozen by date).... would that be a good idea?? doing that??? and serve in the morning 'n at bedtime, can do that.. and i'm not always home in afternoon(wacky schedule sometimes)... right now i'm on dry kibble.....

bought a 5 pound bag of Taste of the Wild™ Pacific Stream Canine Formula with Smoked Salmon Dog Food, BLUE™ Wilderness™ Dog Food-Chicken Flavor(4.5lb), and i mixed in the free sample of hills science diet(4.5lb) i got from the vet(she wanted me to have the pamplets/books in it but wasnt allowed to take the food out per head vet's policy on the free sample package.) and i mixed it in with her current food i had bought her. this way, it'll ease her into a different food while not wasting any i already had(bought or given free from clinic).


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## marsha=whitie (Dec 29, 2008)

Be careful with buying chicken, 'cause sometimes they add broth too it. The general rule for sodium allowance is 100gr/4oz (which is a typical serving size). 

Meat is good for a bit after the sell-by date. If you're going to store it in your fridge for a while, make sure that it isn't covered/sealed, and that its not sitting in a lot of juices. Keeping meat sealed in plastic encourages bacteria growth and makes it spoil faster. What I've found to be the easiest is to just buy everything in bulk and prep it all in the same day, and to just rotate the freezer accordingly. Since you have a bit of kibble left, do your research. I'll PM you some links to some incredibly helpful sites.

How big is you pup, and how old? With Prey Model Raw, you want to feed as big as possible, that way it is more mentally stimulating, and there is less of a chance of them choking.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

she's 4months old at current moment. official weigh in is on monday but we got her on scale friday and she didn't want to stay on long enough for it to read accurately. kept bouncing around the 40LB mark. She is difficult for me to pick up now, so i think she's about 40 to 45 pounds as 30 is pushing it on me comfortably lifting anything. ((this i found out due to cole-slaw prep boxes weigh 30 pounds)). i've started a new thread about the raw feed bit. but yes. i do plan to finish up the kibble' and i hope to have enough knowledge 'n enough proper meat to start her on the raw feeding ... i'm guessing end of march.


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## Jordan S (Nov 21, 2009)

_Why must this be so complicated?_ how about you just put your dog on dry TOTW and feed a couple raw meals a week? Thats what I do with Chocolate(only he's eating NV Prairie at the moment instead of TOTW) I usually use cheaper raw meats like pork/turkey necks(with turkey necks I have some boneless meat on the side since those things are boney as hell lol), chicken hearts,liver,and gizzards.


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## PatchworkRobot (Aug 24, 2010)

Jordan S said:


> *Why must this be so complicated?* how about you just put your dog on dry TOTW and feed a couple raw meals a week? Thats what I do with Chocolate(only he's eating NV Prairie at the moment instead of TOTW) I usually use cheaper raw meats like pork/turkey necks(with turkey necks I have some boneless meat on the side since those things are boney as hell lol), chicken hearts,liver,and gizzards.


Amen!
I commend you for trying to do the best you can for your dog. I think most of us do the best we can within reason... However, you make things SO complicated.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

i make them "complicated" because its been several years since i've owned a large breed dog and also, I am one of those that i like to find out more and more information. The type that never settles for some information but must have ALL information concerning whatever topic i am trying to find out on. I wont be sorry if that annoys you, because it just means i'm very thorough and want whats best for her and will not make a decision on anything until i have gathered all the facts that is possible to find.


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## Kathyy (Jun 15, 2008)

I am with you wildfire, quite obsessive about learning all I can about new stuff like this. It isn't like you can go to the library and get a couple books anymore. For most of my hobbies the internet chat groups have the most up to date information and it is really hard to edit all the info so it makes sense to me. It does in the end, just takes a while.


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## Jordan S (Nov 21, 2009)

wildfire_1982 said:


> i make them "complicated" because its been several years since i've owned a large breed dog and also, I am one of those that i like to find out more and more information. The type that never settles for some information but must have ALL information concerning whatever topic i am trying to find out on. I wont be sorry if that annoys you, because it just means i'm very thorough and want whats best for her and will not make a decision on anything until i have gathered all the facts that is possible to find.


Well it is certainly a lot simpler than your making it, lol. At this point what exactly is your aim here? One moment you are looking strictly at canned and dry options, now it seems as though your moving towards raw, do you want to do full raw? partial raw, or just kibble/canned? I saw in one of your previous posts that you bought a bag of TOTW, are you planning to just start him on that?


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

i am learning about all venues for proper diet for her. i do have a new bag of TOTW of food she's adjusting to. however, i do seem to make this a little bit more complicated then it should be, but again, in my defense, i want all the facts before making a decision. tedious i know, annoying i know, but then that is me. lol. tedious and annoying. its what makes me soo good at math and computers and problem solving. I thought of doing raw, gathering information about that before attempting it, but then again, i dont know if itd be cheaper then buying wet or dry dog food for her... that is what is confusing me.. she's 40 pounds and is 4months old. She's a great big lug already. At the withers(shoulders) she stands 20 inches


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

wildfire_1982 said:


> i am learning about all venues for proper diet for her. i do have a new bag of TOTW of food she's adjusting to. however, i do seem to make this a little bit more complicated then it should be, but again, in my defense, i want all the facts before making a decision. tedious i know, annoying i know, but then that is me. lol. tedious and annoying. its what makes me soo good at math and computers and problem solving. I thought of doing raw, gathering information about that before attempting it, but then again, i* dont know if itd be cheaper then buying wet or dry dog food for her...* that is what is confusing me.. she's 40 pounds and is 4months old. She's a great big lug already. At the withers(shoulders) she stands 20 inches



In some cases it can be cheaper, especially if you join a co-op. But even if it isn't cheaper, it is much better for dogs than commercial foods, you know EXACTLY what is going into her body, smaller and less stinky poops because around 90% of the food is absorbed by the body, and most likely less vet bills because of her health on raw too. Also, if you do raw you don't need to brush teeth or worry about teeth cleanings. On kibble or wet you must brush several times a week or supplement with raw meaty bones several times a week, preferably every day. Teeth cleanings are very expensive and require a dog to be put "under" which is very stressful for their body and carries risk, especially for sensitive, young, or old dogs. My yorkie had to have her teeth cleaned before we started raw and it cost over $400. That is definitely a lot of money saved, even with me having to buy her raw food at whole foods and organic grocery stores (haven't joined co-op yet). 

I would suggest that while you research the raw diet, you stick with Taste of the Wild and give a raw meaty bone a few times a week. Then as you get more comfortable and knowledgeable with raw you can gradually cut out the kibble 100%. 

If you don't want to do any raw at all, I suggest doing a mixture of canned and kibble. Some people think that animals that are fed only kibble can end up chronically dehydrated. 


For me personally, the extra cost doesn't bother me because I have piece of mind that I am doing what is the absolute best for my dogs. When on kibble and canned, I was constantly worried about recalls, quality of ingredients, which kibble was best, which canned was best, etc. It is just easier for me. My dogs are my kids so I was just spending too much time worrying. I am like you in that I have to know all the information that is out there or else I am not happy.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

lilasmom. thanks for the info. ya... i have several greenie's, 5 rawhide bones, and a huge ham bone i got from the local meat store. Spent $30 on the ham bone but she's happily knawing away at it now. and it was raw, but he made sure to get all the meat off for me as she isn't on raw as of yet. He told me he would cut me deals if i bought raw chicken and turkey from him and any other when they are close to date where he cant sell them but i can freeze 'em and preserve 'em for "later". and i told him "deal" . This happened today... And even if i decide against raw, I have a friend or 2 who feed their dog's raw(1 friend has a wolf hybrid who's on a raw diet since she was 12weeks old*when my friend got her*, 'n the "breeder" fed all their dogs/puppies raw). So i could always sell 'em to my friends at face value(what i paid). They are a huge help on the raw diet questions i have(believe me there is a ton of 'em and if you think its bad on here, you gotta talk to them about it on how much i ask them. lol.) BUT they haven't had puppies in several years and have forgotten the puppy "formula" for raw diet cause they are hunters and just give their dogs whatever kill is left over before processing(they do this for that reason). They have a processor who doesn't do anything to the meat, just skins it and de-guts it for them and seperates differen types of meat if they request it for their own personal usage. But mostly they hunt for their dogs. Elk, Moose, Deer, Turkey, Hog, Plus 1 of them owns a farm so he has Cows, Pigs, Goats and Chickens that he culls for their(his dogs) personal use. **sighs** ..... I will continue researching for March and April then in May, Will start the transition over from kibble to raw. Cause i'll have the space for a deep chest freezer plus a stand-up freezer to store the meat where i can buy it in huge bulk to save money. Thats another deal the meat man gave me. If i buy in bulk he'll cut me deals. ((helps he's a friends of mine's hubby's best friend, **i just found out** lol))


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## LilasMom (Jan 18, 2012)

That all sounds great! One thing I will mention though is to avoid greenies and rawhides. They are very hard to digest and vets have frequently gone into surgery for bloat, etc only to find a piece of greenie or rawhide blocking the intestines. In my experience greenies and rawhides don't really do anything for their teeth. Before I learned better, my moms dogs ate two greenies a day, and their teeth were still terrible.


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## Goldens&Labs4Me (Jan 18, 2012)

LilasMom said:


> That all sounds great! One thing I will mention though is to avoid greenies and rawhides. They are very hard to digest and vets have frequently gone into surgery for bloat, etc only to find a piece of greenie or rawhide blocking the intestines. In my experience greenies and rawhides don't really do anything for their teeth. Before I learned better, my moms dogs ate two greenies a day, and their teeth were still terrible.


Agree. Never feed rawhides--they are way too dangerous.


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## Jordan S (Nov 21, 2009)

Yeah, rawhides can be pretty dangerous, since they aren't really digestible and can expand in your dog's stomach, greenies, while digestible are pure soy and grain and add excess carbs and fillers to your dog's diet. So you should opt for bully sticks(these are made of pure cow muscle, no fillers), or RMB's of course. Avoid weight-bearing bones like beef knuckles.

As for the pork, why did you have the meat shaved off of it? There wouldn't have been anything wrong with letting him have the meat even though your dog isn't on a full raw diet. It would have been a good starting point.


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## wildfire_1982 (Jan 16, 2012)

She hasn't touched the rawhides or the greenies since she was given the ham bone. I had it shaved off so that i could give it as treats to her. sorry i forgot to mention that fact. She loved the ham treats and the ham bone.

She was given some raw chicken tonight(no bone) and loved it, begging me for more matter of fact. So i'm tossing her the raw shaved ham pieces. They have the sinew on them still. he did leave part of the sinew on the bone(he couldn't get it all off and it was fine if that was the case, so he didnt try that hard to get all the sinew off).... Argh. I hate leaving out crucial facts when posting messages...

She does tend to growl a bit when given the ham bone 'n trying to take it away.. So i started the toss the treat in opposite direction away from the bone and when she goes to retrieve the good bit of treat, i take the bone. She doesn't growl when that happens... So i think its just a minor puppy guarding issue that can be easily resolved with proper positive enforcement training. I got a huge bone for her... Gunna keep her away from the chicken bones. But i got some Turkey drumsticks tonight... So i may give her one on monday morning ... that way if there is an emergency the vet will be open, lol. i hate the vet hospitals as they charge too much but that is the only 1 in my area and so i guess they can monolopize the money bit... well they arent the only ones but they are the only ones open from 5pm to 8am monday through thursday then weekend hours are 5p friday to 8am monday morning. the other 2 are only open until midnight 7 days a week.


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